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Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

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    #6302
    danthefan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    I'd say VdM will stay, hopefully he does anyway. And if he doesn't we'll probably have to buy a new foreign LH anyway.


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    #6303
    WeeBushy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,572 ✭✭✭WeeBushy


    Keep VdM, or get a different LH (I'd prefer we keep VdM), and a top class 2nd row is all we need.

    I think that's the perfect balance. 3 big players with the rest of the squad IQ. Better than a few more NIQ squad players (a la Sykes or many other in the past) taking spaces the could be filled with Irish players.

    Edit: On another note I think next season we could see more of the ambipropstrous-ness of McGrath. He could replicate his role at LH this season in the tight next. It would be a big ask but it would get him more game time, make him more attractive to Ireland and would give the likes of Furlong in the academy a bit of time to be introduced.


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    #6304
    PhatPiggins
    Registered Users Posts: 4,881 ✭✭✭PhatPiggins


    WeeBushy wrote: »
    Keep VdM, or get a different LH (I'd prefer we keep VdM), and a top class 2nd row is all we need.

    I think that's the perfect balance. 3 big players with the rest of the squad IQ. Better than a few more NIQ squad players (a la Sykes or many other in the past) taking spaces the could be filled with Irish players.

    Edit: On another note I think next season we could see more of the ambipropstrous-ness of McGrath. He could replicate his role at LH this season in the tight next. It would be a big ask but it would get him more game time, make him more attractive to Ireland and would give the likes of Furlong in the academy a bit of time to be introduced.

    That playing both sides is a blessing and a curse for props. On one hand it makes you a great bench option and you might see a bit more game time at club level. On the other hand I think it genuinely stunts your progress. TH and LH are very different in a lot of ways and I genuinely think a prop is better off playing in one of them exclusively if they want to be a top international.

    From what I've seen of McGrath he's another Healy.


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    #6305
    d-gal
    Registered Users Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭d-gal


    Massive massive signing for Connacht. Do ye reckon any other players will be moving west for next year?


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    #6306
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    PhatPiggins wrote: »
    WeeBushy wrote: »
    Keep VdM, or get a different LH (I'd prefer we keep VdM), and a top class 2nd row is all we need.

    I think that's the perfect balance. 3 big players with the rest of the squad IQ. Better than a few more NIQ squad players (a la Sykes or many other in the past) taking spaces the could be filled with Irish players.

    Edit: On another note I think next season we could see more of the ambipropstrous-ness of McGrath. He could replicate his role at LH this season in the tight next. It would be a big ask but it would get him more game time, make him more attractive to Ireland and would give the likes of Furlong in the academy a bit of time to be introduced.

    That playing both sides is a blessing and a curse for props. On one hand it makes you a great bench option and you might see a bit more game time at club level. On the other hand I think it genuinely stunts your progress. TH and LH are very different in a lot of ways and I genuinely think a prop is better off playing in one of them exclusively if they want to be a top international.

    From what I've seen of McGrath he's another Healy.
    That's how I see it too. 23 man squads will be the death of versatility in the front row.


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    #6307
    fitz
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 8,114 ✭✭✭fitz


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    That's how I see it too. 23 man squads will be the death of versatility in the front row.

    It really makes you wonder how long it will be before 23 man squads are brought into the international game. The sooner the better imo.


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    #6308
    ongarite
    Registered Users Posts: 8,247 ✭✭✭ongarite


    What's the reason for this statement from Leinster Rugby?
    Contrary to a headline in a national newspaper on Tuesday morning, Leinster Rugby wish to clarify that we are continuing to work alongside the other provinces and the IRFU regarding the player succession programme...
    http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/newsroom/9532.php


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    #6309
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    ongarite wrote: »
    What's the reason for this statement from Leinster Rugby?
    Contrary to a headline in a national newspaper on Tuesday morning, Leinster Rugby wish to clarify that we are continuing to work alongside the other provinces and the IRFU regarding the player succession programme...
    http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/newsroom/9532.php
    Independent with some shoddy journalism, basically putting words in their mouths.


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    #6310
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,762 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    ongarite wrote: »
    What's the reason for this statement from Leinster Rugby?
    Contrary to a headline in a national newspaper on Tuesday morning, Leinster Rugby wish to clarify that we are continuing to work alongside the other provinces and the IRFU regarding the player succession programme...
    http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/newsroom/9532.php

    The Indo ran with an article suggesting that Leinster and the IRFU were practically at war over Nacewa, when all that was said was there were discussions on-going. Usual sensationalist headlines...

    http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-vow-to-fight-irfu-in-bid-to-keep-nacewa-3025329.html


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    #6311
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    The indo is getting worse and worse, it's nearly weekly now that someone points out an incorrect article from them. And that's not just sport.

    What did they say exactly.

    Edit: thanks Molloyjh


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    #6312
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,762 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    It's just putting in an eye-catchin headline. When you read the story you see that it is just that. Typical Irish journalism in general.

    I also see its been confirmed that Berquist is heading to Biarritz. Best of luck to the guy. Seriously unfortunate with that injury at the start of the season, but it worked out well for Madigan and Leinster in the end. I hope he has better luck there than he did here...


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    #6313
    d-gal
    Registered Users Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭d-gal


    molloyjh wrote: »
    ongarite wrote: »
    What's the reason for this statement from Leinster Rugby?
    Contrary to a headline in a national newspaper on Tuesday morning, Leinster Rugby wish to clarify that we are continuing to work alongside the other provinces and the IRFU regarding the player succession programme...
    http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/newsroom/9532.php

    The Indo ran with an article suggesting that Leinster and the IRFU were practically at war over Nacewa, when all that was said was there were discussions on-going. Usual sensationalist headlines...

    http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-vow-to-fight-irfu-in-bid-to-keep-nacewa-3025329.html

    Nacewa to Connacht then :D

    Seriously stupid Indo journalism, really annoys me at times.

    Why is Luke taking so long to commit to another contract? Hardly considering a move somewhere else?


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    #6314
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    I'm a fan of VDM but personally I'm not sure I'd like to see him stay another year, McGrath looks ready as is and is far too good to spend another season as 3rd choice. Maybe sign a solid journeyman who'll do a job if needed and doesnt mind not playing much or sign a guy from the AIL. Perhaps even a golden oldie in his final year who'll do a bit of coaching as well and be a guide to the younger players.

    Either way I'm not sure thats even necessary, I figure without VDM Leinsters depth next season looks something like.

    T/H: Ross, Hagan, O'Connell, Moore/Furlong
    L/H: Healy, McGrath, O'Connell, Furlong/Tracy

    O'Connell played a bit at the start of the season and looked decent, he's a year behind McGrath so should be ready to be 3rd choice by next season, we'll be delving a bit into the unknown if we've a bit of an injury crisis but I think the pros outweigh the cons.


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    #6315
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,762 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    d-gal wrote: »
    Why is Luke taking so long to commit to another contract? Hardly considering a move somewhere else?

    He's centrally contracted so negotiations are with the IRFU. I can't see it being an issue for his future at Leinster, just the usual end of contract "so what are you going to do for my client" type stuff. Like the Ruddock to Munster and Ryan to Leinster sort of thing.


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    #6316
    Winters
    Registered Users Posts: 14,761 ✭✭✭✭Winters


    .ak wrote: »
    The indo is getting worse and worse, it's nearly weekly now that someone points out an incorrect article from them. And that's not just sport.

    What did they say exactly.

    Edit: thanks Molloyjh

    The standard in journalism in the Indo is shocking. Its more of a tabloid now than a spreadsheet and we all know how the sport of rugby fares in tabloids.


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    #6317
    DeDoc
    Registered Users Posts: 414 ✭✭DeDoc


    Winters wrote: »
    The standard in journalism in the Indo is shocking. Its more of a tabloid now than a spreadsheet and we all know how the sport of rugby fares in tabloids.

    Indeed. It rarely if ever Excels! :D


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    #6318
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    DeDoc wrote: »
    Winters wrote: »
    The standard in journalism in the Indo is shocking. Its more of a tabloid now than a spreadsheet and we all know how the sport of rugby fares in tabloids.

    Indeed. It rarely if ever Excels! :D
    That is punning gold.


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    #6319
    GerM
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,592 ✭✭✭GerM


    shuffol wrote: »
    I'm a fan of VDM but personally I'm not sure I'd like to see him stay another year, McGrath looks ready as is and is far too good to spend another season as 3rd choice. Maybe sign a solid journeyman who'll do a job if needed and doesnt mind not playing much or sign a guy from the AIL. Perhaps even a golden oldie in his final year who'll do a bit of coaching as well and be a guide to the younger players.

    The question isn't if he's too good to stay as third choice, it's is he good enough to play in a do or die HEC game? He will be called on at some point in a big HEC game if he's going to be second choice. Healy picks up knocks in each game almost without fail. I don't think he's ready to pack down against Clermont, Toulouse, Saracens etc.


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    #6320
    Winters
    Registered Users Posts: 14,761 ✭✭✭✭Winters


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    That is punning gold.

    Damn! Work getting in the way of rugby again!


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    #6321
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    GerM wrote: »
    The question isn't if he's too good to stay as third choice, it's is he good enough to play in a do or die HEC game? He will be called on at some point in a big HEC game if he's going to be second choice. Healy picks up knocks in each game almost without fail. I don't think he's ready to pack down against Clermont, Toulouse, Saracens etc.

    Which is why if they decide to let VDM go they should ensure plenty of gametime for McGrath between now and the seasons end. BTW I do think the question should be is he too good to be 3rd choice rather than is he good enough to pack down against the big sides. The reality is that we'll never know the answer to the latter question unless he's given an opportunity, besides every young player will have a few baptisms of fire.

    I know Leinster are in a position now where they've so much IQ depth in almost every position that they can sign NIQs to cover their arses to the ninth degree in case of injuries but I'd rather they give young guys a chance if they've shown enough to suggest they can handle the step up.


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    #6322
    [Jackass]
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Seeing the amount of game time McGrath and Hagan are getting, plus the exodes of NIE from Leinster being confirmed lately, perhaps Leinster are putting an offer on the table, just let us keep Nacewa and sign a lock for next season, and NO NIE other than that!!! PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, LET US KEEP NACEWA!!!


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    #6323
    totallegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭totallegend


    GerM wrote: »
    The question isn't if he's too good to stay as third choice, it's is he good enough to play in a do or die HEC game? He will be called on at some point in a big HEC game if he's going to be second choice. Healy picks up knocks in each game almost without fail. I don't think he's ready to pack down against Clermont, Toulouse, Saracens etc.

    You're right, he's not. We hype up the young Academy guys far too much on boards.ie and front-row is not a position where you can ease yourself in.

    Prop is a seriously attritional position and when you play at the tempo that Healy does, fatigue and injuries are going to be a fact of life, as is absence for Ireland squad duties.
    Is McGrath up to it? Possibly, and from what we've seen of him so far, probably. Would I like to be depending on him in a crunch match? No, not yet anyway.

    VDM should be kept on for another year at least.


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    #6324
    Tox56
    Registered Users Posts: 11,636 ✭✭✭✭Tox56


    totallegend wrote: »
    You're right, he's not. We hype up the young Academy guys far too much on boards.ie and front-row is not a position where you can ease yourself in.

    Prop is a seriously attritional position and when you play at the tempo that Healy does, fatigue and injuries are going to be a fact of life, as is absence for Ireland squad duties.
    Is McGrath up to it? Possibly, and from what we've seen of him so far, probably. Would I like to be depending on him in a crunch match? No, not yet anyway.

    VDM should be kept on for another year at least.

    I don't think it's so much that young players are hyped up too much, but you have to have at least 3 LH props at this level. Having 2, especially when one of them is so young, would be suicidal when you are competing at the level Leinster are.


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    #6325
    Big Nelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,613 ✭✭✭Big Nelly


    molloyjh wrote: »
    The Indo ran with an article suggesting that Leinster and the IRFU were practically at war over Nacewa, when all that was said was there were discussions on-going. Usual sensationalist headlines...

    http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-vow-to-fight-irfu-in-bid-to-keep-nacewa-3025329.html

    Any links to article?


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    #6326
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Cian Healy played against Toulouse at McGraths age (younger?) And was absolutely fine. And McGrath is a better scrummager than Healy was then. Of course he is ready, it just hasn't been worth the risk until now.


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    #6327
    profitius
    Registered Users Posts: 3,976 ✭✭✭profitius


    Leinster might see VDM as being an insurance player. Let McGrath prove himself first before they offload VDM. I'm all for given youth every chance but when it comes to props things can go pear shaped quickly with injuries and call ups to the Ireland squad.

    McGrath will get more games next season. You also have Moore and Jack O'Connell coming through in the coming years.


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    #6328
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    I imagine if VDM signed on for another year McGrath would have to start looking at his options, couldnt see him being content to start another season as 3rd choice and it'd be a shame for Leinster to lose a player of his quality not to mention unfortunate for Irish rugby if he were to end up moving abroad. He would be a great signing for Munster though.

    If VDM were to leave then Leinster even with a HEC front row of Healy and Ross with Hagan and Mcgrath on the bench would still have the best depth in the front row compared to the other Irish provinces.

    In the few games I've seen Mcgrath in this season he's looked very comfortable in the scrums and in games where both he and VDM have been involved I actually think the scrum has looked more solid with McGrath on the pitch.

    Anyway if McGrath is good enough I'm sure Schmidt will bring him through, its great that Leinster have a coach who's judgment you can trust.


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    #6329
    totallegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭totallegend


    shuffol wrote: »
    I imagine if VDM signed on for another year McGrath would have to start looking at his options, couldnt see him being content to start another season as 3rd choice and it'd be a shame for Leinster to lose a player of his quality not to mention unfortunate for Irish rugby if he were to end up moving abroad. He would be a great signing for Munster though.
    A 22-year old prop with very little senior experience will have few enough options.
    shuffol wrote: »
    If VDM were to leave then Leinster even with a HEC front row of Healy and Ross with Hagan and Mcgrath on the bench would still have the best depth in the front row compared to the other Irish provinces.

    Yes, but Healy and Ross and possibly Hagan will be gone for long periods with Ireland, so that leaves us thin for large chunks of the league and only an injury away from a full-blown crisis.
    shuffol wrote: »
    Anyway if McGrath is good enough I'm sure Schmidt will bring him through, its great that Leinster have a coach who's judgment you can trust.
    Agreed, so we can probably all chill out.


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    #6330
    profitius
    Registered Users Posts: 3,976 ✭✭✭profitius


    totallegend wrote: »
    A 22-year old prop with very little senior experience will have few enough options.

    During a match the other day the commentator said that English and French clubs were looking at him.


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    #6331
    nerd69
    Registered Users Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭nerd69


    if hes determined to leave keep him in ireland munster need props if a position opens up at leinester hes going to want to return and play for his home team its win win


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