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Reactions to your atheism/defection

2»

Comments

  • #52
    Shenshen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,453 ✭✭✭Shenshen


    jkl wrote: »
    Pascal's Wager holds true, assuming living a life dictated by religious laws / traditions has no downside.

    I would dispute it having no downside.

    Pascal's Wager is based on a choice of two options. Non-religion vs. one religion.
    What about Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Sikhism, etc.? You can't really follow each and every one of them just to be on the safe side, especially since a lot of them make it a mortal sin to follow any of the others....


  • #53
    Exile 1798
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 709 ✭✭✭Exile 1798


    ColmDawson wrote: »
    An American with whom I used to be very good friends (we haven't been in touch as much in recent years) was asking me the other week about my defection and my lack of faith. She used to be an atheist, but as she put it "grew up" and is now very involved with her local Episcopalian church.

    She seems in many ways to be relatively realistic about religion ("not some dude in the sky with gold paved roads and burning bushes") but in other respects not. She said there's nothing wrong with the Bible (this puzzles me, as she is currently in a relationship with another woman).

    When she asked me what I believed in, I said "Nothing" and she called me a liar. She claims vague stuff like "everybody believes in something. some people believe in love, some believe in beauty, some god". This, to me, makes no sense. I don't need to believe in beauty — it's tangible.

    A couple more snippets:
    "you do understand that atheists can not believe in love, by definition? or beauty, or hope"
    "you wear your lack of faith like a badge. that's not something to be proud of."

    I don't mind talking about religion to religious people, but I felt she was rude and condescending. The whole thing was especially dismaying because it was someone to whom I used to be very close.

    Anyone else have any similar experiences with old/current friends or family, where you felt like you couldn't have a reasonable and respectful discussion on the topic anymore?

    I would ask her if she really believes in god then why has she chosen a Church that is secular in all but name?

    The Episcopalian/Anglican church demands virtually nothing of their members. No fasting, don't need to pay much heed to the Bible, pick and choose what you practice, show up to Church if you feel like it, divorce by all means, Gays can be Ministers.

    Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the fact the many Christian Churches have evolved into being nothing much more then benign social groups. However if someone who belonged to one of those Churches attacked me for my lack of belief, I'd challenge them on theirs. If they had any real conviction surely they'd join a fundamentalist, bible believing Church?


  • #54
    mikhail
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,862 ✭✭✭mikhail


    Exile 1798 wrote: »
    The Episcopalian/Anglican church demands virtually nothing of their members. No fasting, don't need to pay much heed to the Bible, pick and choose what you practice, show up to Church if you feel like it, divorce by all means, Gays can be Ministers.

    Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the fact the many Christian Churches have evolved into being nothing much more then benign social groups. However if someone who belonged to one of those Churches attacked me for my lack of belief, I'd challenge them on theirs. If they had any real conviction surely they'd join a fundamentalist, bible believing Church?
    I don't know about you, but I'd call a church that doesn't claim to have all the answers, demand rigid subservience to their doctrine and condemn those who don't has a fairly healthy attitude to their collective belief in a god.

    Granted, the woman referred to above clearly isn't fully comfortable with that, but that's hardly the point.


  • #55
    Exile 1798
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 709 ✭✭✭Exile 1798


    mikhail wrote: »
    I don't know about you, but I'd call a church that doesn't claim to have all the answers, demand rigid subservience to their doctrine and condemn those who don't has a fairly healthy attitude to their collective belief in a god.

    Granted, the woman referred to above clearly isn't fully comfortable with that, but that's hardly the point.

    That is to say, they have a very modern, secular attitude to in belief god.

    I said clearly that I like the fact that many Churches function more as social groups then actual Religious ones.

    My point though was that if someone from those easy, obligation free Churches challenged me on my Atheism I'd challenge them right back on how genuine their belief is.


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