Prison - whats it like???

CDfm

There have been a few threads on gender issues and prison has been raised on sentences and punishments for men being longer and prison conditions tougher.This thread is not about that but about that but about prison itself, and the before and after.

You can get jailed for traffic offences, non payment of fines, even unpaid debts, unpaid maintenance is another.Thats without going down the whole list of crimes that you can do to get imprisoned.

For some people it means their careers end. Even someone who is acquitted and has been remanded in custody awaiting trial can loose their home, job etc.

So prison -whats the skinny.

minidazzler

Haven't been in myself, but am closely related to people on both sides of the prison line.

It seems if you are a scumbag you are likely to get "Temporary release" alot faster no matter how many times you have repeated offences.

The conditions aren't too bad apparently. It's 3 hots and a cot like, fairly cushy for alot of the scumbag types around.

A friend of a relation went in someone who part-took in weed and came out smoking heroin regularily.

Overall it seems the conditions aren't too bad. You are not likely to come across a prison officer who hates the prisoners unless they have reason to.

In short, it seems scumbags don't care because it doesn't scare them, a cushy little while.

I would hate to be a regular joe soap who got caught out doing something once. A non scumbag type. But that is speculation.

As I said close to some people who have been in, they were unfazed coming out and haven't even changed at all TBH. Some have gotten worse!

Khannie

CDfm wrote: »

prison

Nothing to do with being a gentleman? (since ladies and men both go to prison like)

minidazzler wrote:

It's 3 hots and a cot like

What in gods name are you banging on about?

edit: good ol' urban dictionary to the rescue.

minidazzler

Khannie wrote: »

Nothing to do with being a gentleman? (since ladies and men both go to prison like)

What in gods name are you banging on about?

edit: good ol' urban dictionary to the rescue.

Urban Dictionary should be the standard dictionary for school!

I think I would rather go to a Male prison than a female. (If I had a choice of course! )

When men are agressive they can be tamed by social norms, especially in an institutionalised enviroment.

When women are agressive I am much more wary because they tend to simply not care what other people think.

CDfm

Its a bit odd that its the ultimate deterent in our society and yet we know so little about it. At least I do.

sam34

minidazzler wrote: »

Urban Dictionary should be the standard dictionary for school!

I think I would rather go to a Male prison than a female. (If I had a choice of course! )

When men are agressive they can be tamed by social norms, especially in an institutionalised enviroment.

When women are agressive I am much more wary because they tend to simply not care what other people think.

emmmmmm, what?

can you expand on that please?

whadabouchasir

minidazzler wrote: »

The conditions aren't too bad apparently. It's 3 hots and a cot like, fairly cushy for alot of the scumbag types around.



In short, it seems scumbags don't care because it doesn't scare them, a cushy little while.

I remeber hearing an interview with an Irish prison warden a while ago and he said that having terrible conditions in prison is no more of a deterant for would be criminals than decent conditions.

krudler

sam34 wrote: »

emmmmmm, what?

can you expand on that please?

womens prisons are fcuked up, have you seen that new Lady Gaga video?

really though, I have very little sympathy for people who are in prison, you're in there as you did something to get yourself put there, simple as. It does seem like the majority of judges are a soft touch (in Limerick especially) and a bit of "ah shur I'm from a poor home and me little ones are on the breadline, thats why i stole that guys Range Rover and burnt it out, heres a tenner for the poorbox your honour, I wont do it again, swear on me ma".

I spent most of my childhood and teenage years in one of the roughest parts of Limerick, my mothers side is from there but before it turned into a complete ****hole, I never really had any problems going there growing up, you couldnt pay me to go there now. And a lot of people in the feud going on are very familiar faces from when I was younger, on both sides. So I dont attribute where you grow up as a surefire sign you're going to wind up being a thief or murderer. It doesnt help but its wheeled out far too often as an excuse.

seanybiker

Anyone who know that went to prison thought it was grand. Obviously if they had a choice they wouldnt go there. I know one fella who wanted to go back so he wouldnt have to see some people around the streets who didnt like him. He is always in and out of prison. Not a bother on him. Havent heard from him in a while actually.

Nevyn

What have you done? :P

silverharp

so then, is there an Irish equivalent of a "bubba"?

Macha

CDfm wrote: »

Its a bit odd that its the ultimate deterent in our society and yet we know so little about it. At least I do.

Ironically, I think the thought of prison works as the best deterrent for those who are least likely to end up there.

The people who generally do end up in there, aren't really bothered by the idea of harsher sentencing, or rather they have other forces compelling them to take the risk regardless.

Hazys

Silverharp2 wrote: »

so then, is there an Irish equivalent of a "bubba"?

bubba?

EDIT:
I urban dictionarieded it....:eek: thats a enough of a deterent for me.

Luckily im now down with prison talk cos otherwise if i got locked up id meet the bubba guy thinking he was called that bcos he was like the sound lad from Forrest Gump...

silverharp

Hazys wrote: »

bubba?

EDIT:
I urban dictionarieded it....:eek: thats a enough of a deterent for me.

Luckily im now down with prison talk cos otherwise if i got locked up id meet the bubba guy thinking he was called that bcos he was like the sound lad from Forrest Gump...

you had to look that up...he he! maybe I watch too much american tv

Stheno

Thaedydal wrote: »

What have you done? :P

I wondered exactly the same :P

taconnol wrote: »

Ironically, I think the thought of prison works as the best deterrent for those who are least likely to end up there.

The people who generally do end up in there, aren't really bothered by the idea of harsher sentencing, or rather they have other forces compelling them to take the risk regardless.

I agree, I grew up across from Portlaoise Prison and worked with a chap who was involved in bombings in London in the seventies (ancient I am :P) and tbh with the right motivation prison was seen as a consequence to be considered but not a deterrent.

On a lighter note I've a cat called Bubba for a reason, he'll do anything for a pound of meat

CDfm

:eek: Ive done nothin.

The only deterent in there so far has been Bubba.

So how much of a deterant is prison ?

force majeure

HI ye chief
So you not due away for a few months yourself on acc off the micra not being taxed.... never being their myself so do'nt know.
A few lads I do know think the free accommodation is handy... I always thought that odd myself.

iptba

CDfm wrote: »

:eek: Ive done nothin.

The only deterent in there so far has been Bubba.

So how much of a deterant is prison ?

Mountjoy (men's) prison is certainly plenty of a deterrent for me (that's what I've grown up with); judging by what minidazzler said, maybe I need to move to Cork before my next crime spree.

CDfm

force majeure wrote: »

HI ye chief
So you not due away for a few months yourself on acc off the micra not being taxed.... never being their myself so do'nt know.

Hiya forcey - no I am not due away for a relaxing spa in the midlands or anything like that.

Its a real deterent for decent folk because the upheaval is massive like employment, housing etc. I saw a thread on PI once about a girl who rang her boyfriends work saying her boyfriend was ill when in fact he was serving a short sentence.

That aside - is it scary - do you have prison gangs or is it kick back, read the new catherine cookson novel or go on the internet.What kinds of courses are there. LIke OU or what. Whats the food like.

Just curious.

amacachi

Can't say I know much about the modern ones down here, but my father was interned for a few days in the early 70s up North. In case anyone is wondering, he had nothing whatsoever to do with anything. :P For him he was beaten a couple of times a day and told to sign a confession despite no interview having taken place. He was in his windowless cell about 5x5 feet most of the day, allowed out during visiting time but wasn't allowed call anyone to get them in. Didn't ask him about food. No-one knew where he was until the 4th or 5th day when a woman visiting her son asked if he had family she could contact and it turned out she lived in the same estate as his brother. He was released the following day I think and moved down here the same day. He also refused to sign a form from a doctor saying he hadn't been mistreated. :pac:

Notorious

minidazzler wrote: »

The conditions aren't too bad apparently. It's 3 hots and a cot like, fairly cushy for alot of the scumbag types around.

Overall it seems the conditions aren't too bad. You are not likely to come across a prison officer who hates the prisoners unless they have reason to.

What prison are you talking about? I've had a full tour of Mountjoy - both the male and female wing. Staying in the male wing would be utter hell. First off, you're locked up most of the day (unless you're a trusted prisoner; in which case you're allowed to do chores around the prison like mopping floors, working in the kitchen, gardening etc.). The cells are tiny. Another point a lot of people don't know about - in the male wing in Mountjoy, you 'slop out' every morning. Nice and cushy, eh?

Going into the womens wing was a completely different affair. Granted it was build recently and is much more modern. They don't stay in cells on a prison wing, instead they have what resembles a small village with multiple buildings serving various purposes. They have small houses where each woman has their own room (some share iirc), but the room resembles a bedroom, not a prison cell. There's multiple jobs/activities to keep the woman occupied during the day (small salon where they can learn hairdressing or get their hair done, sewing machines, woodwork...).

The difference between both wings is really outstanding.

I know of one person who was in the male wing for a few months. He kept his head down and just tried to blend in to avoid any trouble with anyone. I was told that other inmates used to just wander into his cell and take anything he had (posters mainly), and he'd just let them to avoid an argument.

CDfm

A few posters - you could live with that. Food, smokes, books, radio -what more could you want.

iptba

Notorious wrote: »

What prison are you talking about? I've had a full tour of Mountjoy - both the male and female wing. Staying in the male wing would be utter hell. First off, you're locked up most of the day (unless you're a trusted prisoner; in which case you're allowed to do chores around the prison like mopping floors, working in the kitchen, gardening etc.). The cells are tiny. Another point a lot of people don't know about - in the male wing in Mountjoy, you 'slop out' every morning. Nice any cushy, eh?

Going into the womens wing was a completely different affair. <snip>

(A bit gross)
I think I could probably cope with just my own slop. But sleeping in cells with other people’s slop would be tough. (Think your farts versus other people’s farts)

Faith

I've been reading several books recently (by the same author, granted) where male characters are sent to prison for one reason or another. One hurdle they all have to deal with early on is rape. I wonder if that is actually common in [Irish] prisons? Surely that would be the greatest deterrent of all.

pudgeydev

Inside Man is a book about what it's like for a prison officer, it's a worthwhile read from a Prison officer's point of view.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Inside-Man-Philip-Bray/dp/071714481X

Wouldn't fancy prison myself, as an inmate or an officer. Lets hope they dont find out about all my misdeeds.

iptba

I don't know much about prison rape. Can't say I like thinking about it too much. Anyway, this is what it says on the masculism section on Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masculism :

Societal failure to address prison rape, including issues such as prevention (e.g., reducing prison crowding that requires sharing of cells), impunity for prison rapists, and even correctional staff punishing prisoners by confining them with known rapists.[8] Attention has been drawn to portrayals of male rape by women, or implied rape, as humorous.

We have sharing of cells anyway in Ireland. Don't know about the point about being put in with known rapists in Irish prisons.

I don't think we have conjugal visits in Ireland - don't know if that would reduce it or not.

Boston

Faith wrote: »

I've been reading several books recently (by the same author, granted) where male characters are sent to prison for one reason or another. One hurdle they all have to deal with early on is rape. I wonder if that is actually common in [Irish] prisons? Surely that would be the greatest deterrent of all.

There is the same culture of prison rape in Irish and British that there would be in the states. Everyone acknowledges it's an endemic part of the American penal system. I've seen figures which go from 25% to 30% of inmates in maximum security prisons are victims. The yanks just don't care what happens to people in state care. Thats what it is, state care. It's not right to use rape as a deterrent.

Notorious

CDfm wrote: »

A few posters - you could live with that. Food, smokes, books, radio -what more could you want.

I think the posters are used to make your cell more 'homely'. You wouldn't believe the size of the cells, they really are tiny. The myth of the TV in each cell is true, but slightly exaggerated. Inmates get an allowance (not sure if its weekly or monthly), that they can use in the prison tuck shop. If they want a TV they pay for it out of their allowance.

force majeure

CDfm wrote: »

Hiya forcey - no I am not due away for a relaxing spa in the midlands or anything like that.

Its a real deterent for decent folk because the upheaval is massive like employment, housing etc. I saw a thread on PI once about a girl who rang her boyfriends work saying her boyfriend was ill when in fact he was serving a short sentence.

That aside - is it scary - do you have prison gangs or is it kick back, read the new catherine cookson novel or go on the internet.What kinds of courses are there. LIke OU or what. Whats the food like.

Just curious.

Well from what I hear off food it can be bottom off the rug stuff apart from bank holidays and such when the make an attempt.

baalthor

Boston wrote: »

There is the same culture of prison rape in Irish and British that there would be in the states.

I think you meant to say that there isn't ?

CDfm

baalthor wrote: »

I think you meant to say that there isn't ?

Does it exist?

Boston

baalthor wrote: »

I think you meant to say that there isn't ?

yea, that's what I meant.

CDfm wrote: »

Does it exist?

Yes.

CDfm

so thats the first downside

so is their an option not to be part of the general population

do you have max and minimum secure units

segregation what

Boston

No. There will be a wing/area separated for sex offenders. In mouth-joy there are separate cell for those who are in contempt of court but you've no guarantee of being placed in those.

Abrasax

I spent 2 years in prison, not in Ireland, on the continent.
The day consisted of;
- being woken for a shower in the morning (3 days a week).
-going out for an hour in the yard, in the morning
-lunch in your cell around 1
-another hour in the yard in the afternoon
-dinner in your cell around 6
-once to the library on Saturday
-1 hour a week sports (gym, football, whatever)
-church on Sunday if you chose to attend

For most prisoners (those who didn't work), each day consisted of about 22 hours a day, either alone in the single cells or doubled up in the 2 man cells (I chose to be alone).
I didn't qualify for education as a foreigner.
In your cell you could have a TV (rented), a radio, books, you could cook if you could afford the food on little home made cookers, to which the screws turned a blind eye.
The cell also had a toilet, a sink, desk, bed etc.
The cell was seven paces long and 3 paces wide. You spent 22 hours a day in this space, so prison existence is very monotonous for the most part (with the odd event to break up the boredom; fights in the yard, trips to court, prison intrigue etc).
That about sums it up for one post.

Odysseus

Faith wrote: »

I've been reading several books recently (by the same author, granted) where male characters are sent to prison for one reason or another. One hurdle they all have to deal with early on is rape. I wonder if that is actually common in [Irish] prisons? Surely that would be the greatest deterrent of all.

It does happen I have had a few clients raped by other inmates whilst inside.

Odysseus

CDfm wrote: »

so thats the first downside

so is their an option not to be part of the general population

do you have max and minimum secure units

segregation what

Protection has to be the worst. 23hrs locked in a cell with 2-3 other inmates. There was one inmate murdered whilst on protection in m/joy a few ago. I only get a small insight during profession visits, but m/joy really is a kip.

hinault

M/Joy is a terrible place.
A friend of mine is a PO there and he has told me about the conditions in there.

Cons, and those on remand, are locked up for 22 hours per day.
Due to overcrowding, you can have up to four people sharing one cell.
You can have stoners/dopers/clean inmates are sharing a cells size 12x12ft.
Slopping out is a fact of life in the male prison.
Inmates are only allowed one shower per week.
There are no incell sinks as far as I am aware.

Inmates are allowed out of theie cells three times per day.
Breakfast is collected and brought back to the cell to eat.
Dinner is also collected and brought back to the cell to eat.
Tea ditto.

Inmates are allowed one hours free association in the evening and are then locked in to their cells from 8.00pm to 7.00am.

if you need to use the toilet, you need to ask permission.
If you need to do anything, you need to ask permission.


Anyone who suggests that doing time in those condition is easy, are liars.

iptba

It wouldn't have to be this bad to be a deterrent for me.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2010/0426/1224269092789.html

OPINION : As a member of the Mountjoy Visiting Committee I am horrified by the prison

FOR THE past three years I have been a member of the Mountjoy Visiting Committee – a committee appointed by the Minister for Justice to monitor and report on conditions in the country’s oldest prison. My term expires on Friday.

Prisoners in overcrowded cells sleeping on floors infested with cockroaches, mice, ants and other assorted vermin. Others sleeping in shower areas, reception areas and other unsuitable areas;

Prisoners forced to perform daily bodily functions in their cells in front of cell mates, and "slopping out" when cell doors are reopened;

Prisoners having to eat all their meals in the same confined cell area where they sleep and perform their bodily functions;

23-hour lockup for those on protection, with just one hour of possible association/recreation.

dfx-

I've also been on a tour of Mountjoy..padded cell and all. Ugh. If that's what people consider a hotel, I won't be travelling with them anywhere soon.

We went to the Four Courts and Supreme Court the following week when you could take advantage of the open-ness..the state of the District Court would be enough of a deterrent for me.

Worztron

Are all non smoking prisoners subjected to passive smoking inside cells or is smoking only allowed in the outside yard?

Are non violent prisoners (such as those that could not pay a fine or dog license, etc. and shouldn't even be in jail) put amongst dangerous and violent prisoners?

mikemac

I believe there used to put toilets in the cells but the British removed as IRA men were passing messages down the pipes, I'm not sure how it worked exactly

There was a book about Mountjoy out in the last few years
Not being smart but I can't remember who wrote it, I thought it was Paul Kimmage but it seems not
In all good book stores as they say

Anyways......
If you were a troublemaker in Mountjoy they would bundle you into a van and take you to Cork
Cork did the same thing, troublemakers were sent up to Dublin.
And being the outsider a battering by the other prisoners was very possible. So a transfer was something some prisoners feared and the officers knew it

The travelers keep to themselves and while they don't have an official section it's worked where possible to keep them together. Everyone called that area the caravan.

There are people in there with mental issues and realy Mountjoy is not the place for them, Dundrum may get them help but nobody was realy pushing over this and so it's not something realy talked about.
Until an incident happens like they start cutting themselves and then they are taken off to hospital and maybe Dundrum

Now and again there would be a dirty protest and prisoners would use to tissues to grab out of the slop bucket and throw down into the yards.
The officers would get three or four volunteers to clean up the yard in exchange for some privledges. They were known as "the bomb squad"

Educational facilities were very lacking. If you want to do the JC or LC it's not about just signing up, you might never get a place

Just what I remembered from that book

Worztron

These places are exempt from the smoking ban since 29-March-2004.

* Prisons
* Police station detention areas
* St. Patrick's Institution
* Nursing homes
* Hospices
* Religious order homes
* The Central Mental Hospital
* Psychiatric hospitals
* Maternity homes
* Hotel, guesthouse and B& B bedrooms
* Third-level educational residential facilities.

Surely it is illegal to force prison wardens and other workers to suffer from passive smoke by smoking prisoners, etc.?

username123

I knew a guy who did 2 years in a prison in Cork. It was quite a serious crime, he was in with other criminals who had committed serious crimes like murder. He said there wasnt an issue with rape, but there was a major issue with bullying. He took some quite serious beatings (Im talking hospitalised) because he wouldnt arrange for his family to smuggle in drugs for other prisoners. After a few beatings they left him alone as it was clear the family were not and would not cooperate. Actually he did try to get them to bring in the drugs but they wouldnt.

Beyond that he said the boredom was the worst part.

Worztron

There are many people being jailed that should instead get community service. The irony is that the cost of keeping them in jail will more than likely be vastly greater than their fine/unpaid license, etc. Also, sending someone to jail that is not a troublemaker and throwing them in with evil low lifes will be far worse than just being jailed. The people that will suffer the most in jail are those that shouldn't even be there. There are many hardened thugs that see it all as a joke or even a holiday.

CDfm

Family law issues and unpaid fines / debts are areas people were imprissoned for.

Whats the story.

Gandalph

The very first time I layed eyes on Andy Dufresne....

Geekness1234

"I would like to think Andy fought the good fight,but prison is no fairytale world".
*gets bum raped*

Worztron

If someone got jailed for a minor offense such as not being able to pay for a TV license. Then they get locked up with evil thugs and get beaten, raped and subsequently contract HIV/AIDS. Could that person sue the state? Surely the persons sentance was imprisonment. Being beaten and raped would not be part of their punishment and therefore the prison guards must prevent that from happening.

Otis Driftwood

Worztron wrote: »

If someone got jailed for a minor offense such as not being able to pay for a TV license. Then they get locked up with evil thugs and get beaten, raped and subsequently contract HIV/AIDS. Could that person sue the state? Surely the persons sentance was imprisonment. Being beaten and raped would not be part of their punishment and therefore the prison guards must prevent that from happening.

Sure you could be beaten and raped (in theory) any day of the week outside of prison.If it happened could you sue the state for not having a guard patrolling the area you were attacked in?

RandolphEsq

http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/annualreport2007pdf.pdf/Files/annualreport2007pdf.pdf
This was a report by the late Hon. Mr. Justice Kinlen way back in 2007. It is pretty grim reading, and it is no wonder that other reports were blocked from being published to the public for fear, by the government, of embarrassment.