Portsmouth finances

thebaz

How the hell do portsmouth owe 120 milllion sterling - yes they bought some expensive players but i would guess they should have re-couped most of that back on what they sold on - they also won promotions along with the TV monies and also the FA Cup - they must have been seeking financial advice from Anglo Irish bank

JPA

Super mega dodgy IMO, creditors report.
The Begovic story today is super weird.

Neil3030

They lost a packet betting that muppet he wouldn't ring his bell ALL f**king season.

Reganio 2

Neil3030 wrote: »

They lost a packet betting that muppet he wouldn't ring his bell ALL f**king season.

If Pompey said donate a pound and we will stop that chap ringing the bell they would be nowhere near debt.

Fratton Fred

thebaz wrote: »

How the hell do portsmouth owe 120 milllion sterling - yes they bought some expensive players but i would guess they should have re-couped most of that back on what they sold on - they also won promotions along with the TV monies and also the FA Cup - they must have been seeking financial advice from Anglo Irish bank

JPA wrote: »

Super mega dodgy IMO, creditors report.
The Begovic story today is super weird.

how the hell exactly.

the numbers just do not add up, especially when you consider how much profit was made from selling players.

Begovic is a prime example. He was promised to Tottenham, so they paid over the odds for Kaboul and lent Pompey O'Hara. Begovic would not go to Spurs, so Pompey had to pay £1m effectively in compensation. the belief is that the Money for Kaboul ended up in the owners pocket, whilst the club had to pay the sell on fee to Spurs.

It is believed that this happened time after time so the owners were syphoning off money from transfers, but the sell on element was left for the club to pay.

The Gaydamak family used Pompey as one big money laundering facility, which was fine up until the point that Gaydamak senior had his assets seized in russia.

gimmick

From football365, a small list of some of the more unusual creditors. Qatar airlines must be freaking out

108 Medical Ltd: £1

AON: £154,934.27

British Gas: £473.62

BT: £1,335.68

Canterbury Europe: £1,398,486.86

Carlsberg: £1,039.33

Concorde Club Hotel: £7,558.70 (That's a lot of pay-per-view porn)

Faith and Football: £1,998 (Linvoy Primus had something to do with this)

Fareham Shopping Centre: £310.50

Hampshire Flag Company: £917.81

House of Weddings: £270

Johnston Newspapers South: £20,062.59 (That's The Portsmouth News, so it's no surprise if there are a few sniffy stories about them in the paper)

King Edward VI School: £41,714.01

Kitbag: £129,407.75

Land Ladies Rent Account: £12,066.50 (Interestingly, the address given for this one is 'Portsmouth Football Club')

Ministry Of Defence (financial management): £626.92

nPower: £2,677.16

Pasta King: £1,296.35

Performing Rights Society: £19,438.83

Portsmouth FC Supporters Club: £300

Pukka Pies: £40

Priory Community Sports Centre: £11,000

Qatar Airways: £0.20

Richard Auger: £340,000 (The amount piqued our interest, so we did a quick Google search, and the first result that came up was for a massage therapist)

Ryde School: £318

Scout Association: £697

Southampton FC: £35,000

St John's Ambulance: £2,701.91

St John's College: £6,660

leninbenjamin

Football is a daft sport... more of the above really. David James, Lass Diarra, Distin, Spuds etc. will all receive monies owed to them in full while Ambulance services, schools and Portsmouths own supporters group can expect around 20% of what they are owed.

Compared with those galactic figures for football trading and wages, the list of unsecured "ordinary" creditors, who must take a hit, is a painful litany of the inexcusably unpaid. Here is the South Central ambulance service, owed £19,535.39, Portsmouth city council, £28,690 down in rates, Portsmouth Students' Union, owed £2,955. A number of schools are owed significant sums, apparently for the hire of sports facilities, including Cowplain Community School in Waterlooville, with £14,743.54 outstanding, the Priory Community Sports Centre in Southsea, owed £11,000, and King Edward School in Southampton, who will have to accept a fraction of a £41,714.01 bill the Premier League club ran up with them.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2010/apr/22/portsmouth-football-creditors-money-millionaires

gimmick

If those players had any sort of dignity they would waive some of their paymenst so the "ordinary" types could get paid what they are due.

I somehow doubt the likes of David James and Diarra would miss a few grand, while others depend on it.

ArmaniJeanss

leninbenjamin wrote: »

Football is a daft sport... more of the above really. David James, Lass Diarra, Distin, Spuds etc. will all receive monies owed to them in full while Ambulance services, schools and Portsmouths own supporters group can expect around 20% of what they are owed.

This isn't a football issue specifically though. Like if Portsmouth FC was a factory or a coalmine then the same siutuation would apply - the employees would get all the money due them and the other creditors will get %s of whats left over.
Its a perfectly rational way of doing it which protects the employees.

leninbenjamin

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

This isn't a football issue specifically though. Like if Portsmouth FC was a factory or a coalmine then the same siutuation would apply - the employees would get all the money due them and the other creditors will get %s of whats left over.
Its a perfectly rational way of doing it which protects the employees.

It's not the same. The monies owed to players are partly for image rights from what I can see, to players no longer at the club. Not just wages. And then of course you have the outstanding sums due for transfers. Spurs and other footballing creditors can expect their millions repaid in full. Oh and the agents, I think there are £10 million due in outstanding agents fees. Yet the local community school doesn't get the few thousand owed to them?

Thrill

No European football for Portsmouth

Portsmouth will not be permitted to play in the Europa League next season, the Football Association and Premier League have told the club.

Portsmouth would have qualified to play in Europe next season after reaching the FA Cup final

The decision means that the team who finish seventh in the Premier League - currently Liverpool - would play in the Europa League instead.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/no-european-football-for-portsmouth-454873.html

loyatemu

IMO the FA cup runner-up shouldn't get into Europe anyway. There was a situation a couple years ago where they nearly ended up having a play-off between the beaten semi-finalists for the UEFA spot.

The winners should get the spot, if they've already qualified then it should revert to the league, same as with the League Cup.

MementoMori

Clearly the Football Creditors rule is a shocking rule and should be done away with.

A lot of good stuff on Guardian about this.

I wonder what the chances of Portsmouth still going out of existence are even if they get out of administration?

Portsmouth's debt: questions and answers
Pompey's £122m debt explained and what happens next

Owen Gibson The Guardian, Thursday 22 April 2010 Article history

Q How big is Portsmouth's debt?

A As the administrator said last night, "it depends on the context". Unsecured creditors, who will be party to the CVA, are owed £92.7m, according to the figures. The overall net debt, including the money owed to the secured creditor Balram Chainrai and other liabilities, stands at £108.6m. Then there is an additional £14m in incoming transfer fees that would have been due to the club but have already been taken up-front.

Q What happens next?

A All creditors will receive a copy of the administrator's report and must provide proof of the sums they are believed to be owed, as well as indicating which of the major creditors they want to represent them on the creditors' committee. A vote on the CVA will follow on 6 May, the same day as the rest of the country is at the polls

Q What is a Company Voluntary Arrangement or CVA?

A A CVA allows a company to exit an administration in an orderly fashion but forces unsecured creditors to accept a fraction of their original debt in settlement. It requires 75% of the unsecured creditor base by value to vote in favour to proceed. Pompey's administrator, Andrew Andronikou, is believed to be considering an offer of between 20p and 25p in the pound

Q Who will vote against the CVA?

A Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs habitually votes against football club CVAs. The Revenue is opposed to football's creditor rules which ensure clubs and players are paid first and in full while other unsecured creditors are left to accept a settlement but it will only do so if it believes it has a realistic chance of blocking the arrangement. Some small creditors may also vote against the CVA, but most will take the view that some money is better than none

Q What can Balram Chainrai, the club's fourth owner in a turbulent season, expect to be repaid?

A Because Chainrai's £18.5m loans, later reduced to £14.2m, were secured on the club and the ground, Fratton Park, he will be repaid in full when the club is eventually sold. HMRC had challenged his time in charge but does not appear willing to challenge it further in the courts

Q Who will fund the CVA?

A Andronikou said last night the process could be funded from the club's own cashflow, with the £16m due in parachute payments at the end of the season a key factor. Nor has he yet had to use the £15m facility that Chainrai made available when the club entered administration

Q Will the CVA be voted through?

A Andronikou is understood to be confident that it will, indicating he has received assurances from more than 75% of the creditors
Q What happens if he is wrong?

A The administrators would seek either a winding up order or a voluntary liquidation. Or, as at Leeds United, the club could be bought out of administration but would receive a further heavy points penalty under Football League rules.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/apr/21/portsmouth-tottenham-asmir-begovic-accounts

Neil3030

gimmick wrote: »

If those players had any sort of dignity they would waive some of their paymenst so the "ordinary" types could get paid what they are due.

I somehow doubt the likes of David James and Diarra would miss a few grand, while others depend on it.

You are villainising the wrong party here imo. It doesn't matter who would appreciate the money more, the fact is that Portsmouth F.C. are the ones who contracted the services of the players and the 'ordinary types', and it is the club's responsibility to ensure that all parties receive payment.

It is unfortunate that in this scenario company law is favouring those with a disproportionate appreciation for recovered monies, but in the vast majority of cases, as specified above, the legal structure is there to protect employees, whose wages would typically be far less than a company's unsecured book of creditors.

The fact of the matter is, those in charge at pompey are guilty of wreckless trading at best, flagrant fraud at worst. My heart goes out to those who have lost more money than they can afford, but it is not the fault of James, Diarra etc that schools and the like are out of pocket. All parties were duped into contracts that Pompey either had no intention of honouring, or were naive enough to think their turnover levels could sustain.

Should James and those boys dig into their pockets and reach out to the local businesses and organisations it would be a fantastic gesture. But villainising them for not doing this is completely uncalled for, and distracts attention from the real guilty party here.

Bounty Hunter

iirc James was one of two players who did take a pay cut to help keep on staff at the Club