Dublin Bus Network Review

Ham'nd'egger

yellowbelly wrote: »

I am just of the opinion that if passagners of Lucan can air their concerns so can the travelling public of north Kildare......It would make sense if reps from Dublin Bus were there to answer any questions and maybe to take on board suggestions people have re the bus service for the area If i hear back from Dublin bus re meeting for the Kildare North area will have no problem advertising here so people can attend.

You missed the point; it takes somebody or some group (Like you, hint hint ) to call a meeting and to invite Dublin Bus reps, local politicians and local bus users to it. Why not you?

yellowbelly

Hamndegger wrote: »

You missed the point; it takes somebody or some group (Like you, hint hint ) to call a meeting and to invite Dublin Bus reps, local politicians and local bus users to it. Why not you?

Will try to see I can organise anything.....Watch this space will definetly let you know if I can!

yellowbelly

KC61 wrote: »

The meetings so far have been organised by local representatives.

The public meetings being organised by Dublin Bus have yet to happen and I'm quite sure that they will hold meetings in all the areas affected.

I think will have to contact a few of public reps as far as i know these changes will implemented in summer which is not to far away Fair play to the public reps in the lucan area they seem to be on the ball

KC61

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Network-Direct-Phase-1/

Phase One of the Network Direct project will involve the redesign of services in the Blanchardstown, Lucan and Stillorgan areas and is due to take place in the summer. We would like to invite customers in those areas to meet us to discuss these proposed changes on the following dates:


•Stillorgan - Stillorgan Shopping Centre, Wednesday May 12th,
12.00pm - 6.00pm

•Blanchardstown - The Blanchardstown Centre, Thursday May 13th,
2.00pm - 8.00pm

•Lucan - Superquinn Shopping Centre, Lucan, Friday May 14th,
2.00pm - 8.00pm


We will have staff on hand to answer any of your questions and to explain in full detail the benefits the redesigned service will have for your area.

AlekSmart

We would like to invite customers in those areas to meet us to discuss these proposed changes on the following dates:

I must confess to being just a tad confused as to the nature and reasoning behind this "consultation phase".

Perhaps i`m being naieve,but I would have expected the Public Consultation phase to have been the crucible of these changes and thus to have been executed at a far earlier stage in the project.

Already we are seeing and hearing of locally active minor league politicians and other interest groups actively campaigning for aspects of the ND plan to be scrapped.

This is the sort of stuff which really did need to be confronted at the earliest stage and neutralized or satisfied as the case may be.

The situation facing Dublin-Bus and it`s customers is undeniably bleak and the ND proposals do contain the level of sea-change which is the ONLY way for the Bus Service to attract and retain NEW business.

However,if,as now appears the case,the ND plan is open to local tweaking and sectoral adjustments then as a Total-Concept,Network Direct is threatened with failure before it gets started.

I also note that the Shopping Centre presentations are being delivered by Dublin-Bus staff only,with no mention of any of the other usual-suspects in Local Authorities,Gardai or Dept of Transport/NTA being on hand to offer their input.

yellowbelly

AlekSmart wrote: »

I must confess to being just a tad confused as to the nature and reasoning behind this "consultation phase".

Perhaps i`m being naieve,but I would have expected the Public Consultation phase to have been the crucible of these changes and thus to have been executed at a far earlier stage in the project.

Already we are seeing and hearing of locally active minor league politicians and other interest groups actively campaigning for aspects of the ND plan to be scrapped.

This is the sort of stuff which really did need to be confronted at the earliest stage and neutralized or satisfied as the case may be.

The situation facing Dublin-Bus and it`s customers is undeniably bleak and the ND proposals do contain the level of sea-change which is the ONLY way for the Bus Service to attract and retain NEW business.

However,if,as now appears the case,the ND plan is open to local tweaking and sectoral adjustments then as a Total-Concept,Network Direct is threatened with failure before it gets started.

I also note that the Shopping Centre presentations are being delivered by Dublin-Bus staff only,with no mention of any of the other usual-suspects in Local Authorities,Gardai or Dept of Transport/NTA being on hand to offer their input.[/QUOT
I agree with you that maybe the consulation process should have taken place prior to these changes being implemented. I just feel as a commuter that we need information at the moment about the changes that are going to happen in our local area and what impact these changes will have for the commuters in that area. If the Dublin bus need to attract and retain new business they need to have buses that will get commuters in and home from work or school and college at peak hours in the shortest time frame possible.
I feel these changes are going to affect commuters for the next ten years or more. If there is some tweaking of the services in certain areas in the interest of the majority of the travelling public I dont see a problem there.
I think these shopping centre presentations are probably a P.R. exercise by Dublin Bus but at least will get to ask some questions I dont hold out much hope of any changes suggested being implemented I feel this is a done deal maybe I am wrong. I travel at peak and off peak on dublin bus and live fourteen miles from the city the Xpress buses are great but if you travel at off peak times it can take an hour and half to two hours to get into the city.

angel01

yellowbelly wrote: »

I must confess to being just a tad confused as to the nature and reasoning behind this "consultation phase".

Perhaps i`m being naieve,but I would have expected the Public Consultation phase to have been the crucible of these changes and thus to have been executed at a far earlier stage in the project.

Already we are seeing and hearing of locally active minor league politicians and other interest groups actively campaigning for aspects of the ND plan to be scrapped.

This is the sort of stuff which really did need to be confronted at the earliest stage and neutralized or satisfied as the case may be.

The situation facing Dublin-Bus and it`s customers is undeniably bleak and the ND proposals do contain the level of sea-change which is the ONLY way for the Bus Service to attract and retain NEW business.

However,if,as now appears the case,the ND plan is open to local tweaking and sectoral adjustments then as a Total-Concept,Network Direct is threatened with failure before it gets started.

I also note that the Shopping Centre presentations are being delivered by Dublin-Bus staff only,with no mention of any of the other usual-suspects in Local Authorities,Gardai or Dept of Transport/NTA being on hand to offer their input.[/QUOT
I agree with you that maybe the consulation process should have taken place prior to these changes being implemented. I just feel as a commuter that we need information at the moment about the changes that are going to happen in our local area and what impact these changes will have for the commuters in that area. If the Dublin bus need to attract and retain new business they need to have buses that will get commuters in and home from work or school and college at peak hours in the shortest time frame possible.
I feel these changes are going to affect commuters for the next ten years or more. If there is some tweaking of the services in certain areas in the interest of the majority of the travelling public I dont see a problem there.
I think these shopping centre presentations are probably a P.R. exercise by Dublin Bus but at least will get to ask some questions I dont hold out much hope of any changes suggested being implemented I feel this is a done deal maybe I am wrong. I travel at peak and off peak on dublin bus and live fourteen miles from the city the Xpress buses are great but if you travel at off peak times it can take an hour and half to two hours to get into the city.

As I was told on the phone, they have made their decisions and it is just a PR exercise having these meetings, I wouldn't expect (as usual) Dublin Bus to listen to one word that anyone has to say..:rolleyes:

Ham'nd'egger

angel01 wrote: »

As I was told on the phone, they have made their decisions and it is just a PR exercise having these meetings, I wouldn't expect (as usual) Dublin Bus to listen to one word that anyone has to say..:rolleyes:

Good idea. Don't go to the meeting and they definitely won't listen to you thus proving you right.

yellowbelly

I e mailed and phoned dublin bus network direct phone number no reply yet with queries about the changes on kildare north route.........

I e mailed all local representives in North Kildare area one representive contacted me and said would try to set up a public meeting for commuters on the North kildare route ........ Yesterday Dublin Bus posted details of their Shopping Centre Presentations.... I would encourage commuters to attend these prsentations and put across their point of views.... It cant do any harm.......If i get any feedback about public meeting will let you know. I think these meetings would have been more benefical prior to these changes taken place.

Cookie_Monster

yellowbelly wrote: »

I think these meetings would have been more benefical prior to these changes taken place.

but thats one of the problems, everyone wants their say and influence on how DB would operate. Its far quicker, cheaper and simpler to just ignore all these little groups (rightly or wrongly) and get the job done to what will satisfy the majority of travellers.

If this was done before hand there would be months, if not years, of fighting to get routes here there and everywhere. God knows its overdue enough already.

dynamick

I think it's more of a verification than a consultation. People may alert staff to something they've missed resulting in a minor change.

Same kind of thing happens on all infrastructure projects. Also when legislation is going through the dáil, minor amendments are made along the way.

KC61

angel01 wrote: »

As I was told on the phone, they have made their decisions and it is just a PR exercise having these meetings, I wouldn't expect (as usual) Dublin Bus to listen to one word that anyone has to say..:rolleyes:

That is rather unfair.

Look at the manner in which the rail replacement services operated in North County Dublin. Dublin Bus continually fine tuned them , holding meetings with local people, had an inspector on site controlling them until they got the service right.

They have kept them in operation in line with passenger requests.

I do think that they are genuine in their attempts to put forward a better service. However, like anybody they may miss something which might be blindingly obvious to customers - that's where customer feedback comes into play.

I genuinely would say to everyone - go along and put your views forward. If you don't then there are no grounds for complaining when the changes are implemented.

Just because you were told something on the phone does not mean that it is a done deal. Until the services are implemented they are not final.

yellowbelly

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

but thats one of the problems, everyone wants their say and influence on how DB would operate. Its far quicker, cheaper and simpler to just ignore all these little groups (rightly or wrongly) and get the job done to what will satisfy the majority of travellers.

If this was done before hand there would be months, if not years, of fighting to get routes here there and everywhere. God knows its overdue enough already.

I am just looking for information on the changes when they are going to take place and maybe one or two questions answered I dont want to run Dublin Bus. I think Customer feedback is at the core of any successful business it is only a opinion but I do think consulatation with commuters before these changes were implemented would have been benefical to all parties. Will attend the shopping centre presentation and put forward my views.

KC61

yellowbelly wrote: »

I am just looking for information on the changes when they are going to take place and maybe one or two questions answered I dont want to run Dublin Bus. I think Customer feedback is at the core of any successful business it is only a opinion but I do think consulatation with commuters before these changes were implemented would have been benefical to all parties. Will attend the shopping centre presentation and put forward my views.

That is precisely what the company are doing.

The changes are not being implemented until July - surely that is a long enough period to consult with commuters.

KC61

Some more clarification:

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Network-Direct-Phase-1/Lucan/Lucan-FAQs/

Lucan FAQ's
Will Route 25x continue to operate from Dodsboro?
Yes and Route 25x will be extended to UCD, Belfield.

Will Route 25x continue to operate from South Lucan?
Route 25x will be replaced by Route 25a and Route 25b. These routes have been designed to provide a simple, high frequency peak and all day service and will cover all the areas currently served by Route 25x (e.g. Superquinn Lucan, Finnstown, Adamstown, Foxborough, Griffeen Avenue). There will be a 10 minute frequency of service at peak times on each route. The two routes will operate the same route to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace) in the City Centre from The Penny Hill Pub where buses will operate at 5 minute intervals.

Route 25a will operate on the current route to Palmerstown and will operate from Palmerstown via the Chapelizod Bypass to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace).

Route 25b will operate from Adamstown via Lock Road, Esker Drive, Griffeen Avenue and The Outer Ring Road to The Penny Hill Pub. It will then operate the same route as Route 25a via Chapelizod Bypass to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace).

Route 25a and 25b will take advantage of the recent improvements to the Lucan Quality Bus Corridor (QBC) and travel on the Chapelizod Bypass giving faster journey times to the City Centre.

What fares will apply on Route 25a and 25b?
Regular fares will apply on these routes.

Will Route 25 continue to operate?
Yes. Route 25 will remain on its current route from Dodsboro to the City Centre and will be extended to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace). The timetable for this service will be improved with even departure intervals.

Will Route 151 continue to operate from Adamstown?
Route 151 will be replaced in Adamstown by Route 25b which will operate from Adamstown via Lock Road, Esker Drive, Griffeen Avenue, The Outer Ring Road, The Penny Hill Pub, then Chapelizod Bypass to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace). Route 151 will terminate at Kisogue Rail Station when it is opened. In the short term it will terminate at Grange Castle Business Park.

Will Route 26 continue to operate?
Yes. Route 26 will operate from Upper Kennelsfort Road (Palmerstown Cemetery), via Ballyfermot Road, Kylemore Road, Chapelizod, South Circular Road, St. John’s Road, North Quays, D’Olier Street, St. Stephen’s Green to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace).

Will Route 66 continue to operate?
Yes. Route 66 will still operate from Straffan Road Railway Bridge, Maynooth via the Meadowbrook area and Main Street, Maynooth and will be extended to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace).

It is also proposed that Route 66 will no longer serve Kilcock. Alternative services for passengers wishing to travel to and from Kilcock can travel on Bus Éireann’s service from Enfield to the City Centre which serves Kilcock.

Will Route 67 change?
Yes. Route 67 and 67a will operate from Maynooth as Route 67. Route number 67a will no longer be used. The proposed new terminus for Route 67 will be at Moyglare Hall and will operate to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace) via Moyglare Road, Maynooth Village, Straffan Road, Celbridge Road, Celbridge, Lucan Village and Chapelizod to the City Centre

KC61

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Network-Direct-Phase-1/Blanchardstown/Blanchardstown-FAQs/

Blanchardstown FAQ's

Will Route 38 and Route 38a continue to operate?
Yes. Routes 38 and 38a will operate from Damastown to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace). They will travel on the current Route 38a alignment from Damastown to Snugborough Road via Castlecurragh and Corduff.

Route 38a will operate via Blanchardstown Bypass and Route 38 will operate via Castleknock and Auburn Avenue.

Both routes will be extended to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace) providing a more direct service to the City Centre with a high frequency service of 10 minutes at peak times.

Route 38a will operate at peak times only from Monday to Friday.

What service will operate from Tyrrelstown?
Tyrrelstown will continue to be served by Route 40d and local services will be provided by Route 270 and Route 236 to The Blanchardstown Centre. Route 40d’s alignment will be adjusted to offer faster journey times to the City Centre. It will operate via Ballycoolin Road, Mellowes Road to Finglas Village and then direct to Parnell Street. The timetable will be restructured to provide even frequencies between departures.

Will a local service continue to operate in the Blanchardstown area?
Yes. Route 270 will operate from Dunboyne to Tyrrelstown via Littlepace, The Blanchardstown Centre and the Institute of Technology, Blanchardstown.

Route 236 will operate from Tyrrelstown to The Blanchardstown Centre via Blanchardstown Corporate Park and Snugborough Road.

What services will operate to Littlepace?
Route 70 and Route 270 will serve Littlepace on all journeys. A revised timetable will be introduced to deliver more regular departures. Route 270 will operate an hourly frequency of service. These services will operate all day to Littlepace, and all day at the weekend, linking Littlepace and Dunboyne with the Blanchardstown Centre (270) and City Centre (70).

What way will Route 70 operate to the City?
Route 70 will travel from Dunboyne to Littlepace and via the Blanchardstown Bypass and the N3 to the City Centre terminating at Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace). It will have regular fares stopping at all stops en route as required. Route numbers 70x, 70a, 70b will no longer apply.

Will Mulhuddart Village have a bus service?
Yes. Route 270 will operate from Dunboyne to
Tyrrelstown via Littlepace and Mulhuddart, this will provide a connection to more direct, high frequency services offered by Routes 39 and 39a.

What will be the routing of Route 39 and Route 39a?
Route 39 will operate from Ongar via Hazelbury Park, Rosedale, Manorfields, Latchford, Ravenwood and Allendale estates before passing Clonsilla Railway Station. It will then serve the Hartstown/Huntstown loop, The Blanchardstown Centre, Clonsilla Road, Blanchardstwon Village and Navan Road to Leeson Street Bridge (Wilton Terrace).

The redesigned Route 39a will operate from Ongar to UCD Belfield via St. Stephen’s Green but will include Hazelbury Park, Rosedale, Manorfields, Latchford, Ravenwood and Allendale. It will also operate on the new Ongar Link Road operating via Hartstown/Huntstown and The Blanchardstown Centre but will travel on the N3, bypassing Blanchardstown village which will save up to 20 minutes per trip for customers travelling from Ongar/West Blanchardstown into the City Centre. The customers in these areas will now have access to up to 100 trips a day each way with bus departures every 10 minutes at peak times.

Will Route 39x continue to operate?
Route 39x will be combined with Route 39/a outlined above.

What fares will apply on Route 39 and 39a?
Regular fares will apply on these routes.

KC61

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Network-Direct-Phase-1/Stillorgan/Stillorgan-FAQs/

Stillorgan FAQ's

Will Route 10 continue to operate?
Route 10 will be joined together with Route 46a and Route 39a providing improved frequencies and additional cross city connections.

Route 46a will be extended to the Phoenix Park (Infirmary Road) via Phibsboro and North Circular Road along the current Route 10 alignment from St. Stephen’s Green. This will operate with a frequency of 10 minutes or better during the day.

Route 39a will operate from UCD Belfield to Ongar via Waterloo Road and Baggot Street (i.e. the current Route 10 alignment on the south of the city) with a frequency of 10 minutes or better during the day.

Route number 10 will no longer be in use but the route it currently serves will be provided for by Route 46a and Route 39a.

How will Monkstown Farm be served?
Local trips and connections with Luas will be provided by a realigned Route 63 which will travel from Kilternan to Dún Laoghaire operating through Monkstown Farm at Abbey Road, Monkstown Avenue, Monkstown Farm, Oliver Plunkett Road and Mounttown Road Lower.

Customers wishing to travel on Route 46a will have buses operating from Dún Laoghaire to Phoenix Park (Infirmary Road) via Mounttown Road Lower, Kill Avenue and Kill Lane, N11 QBC, City Centre and North Circular Road.

Route 4a will be extended via Monkstown Avenue offering a new connection to Blackrock / Ballsbridge from Monkstown Farm.

Orbital Routes 75 and 175 will also serve the area. These routes are not included in Phase One of the Network Direct project.

What service will link Sandyford, Mount Merrion and the City Centre?
Route 47 will provide this service operating from Belarmine to Sandyford Industrial Estate, Mount Merrion, Angeslea Road and Ballsbridge to the City Centre.

Route 46b will be amalgamated into Route 47.

Will Route 84 operate to the City Centre?
Route 84x will continue to operate on its current routing giving a direct Xpresso service to the City Centre from Newcastle, Kilcoole and Greystones at peak times. The 84x from Newtownmountkennedy will no longer operate. Alternative service options from Bus Éireann are available. Route 84 will operate from Newcastle to the Cherrywood Luas Stop via Bray DART station providing onward connections to other Dublin Bus, Luas and DART services.

Will Route 145 continue to operate?
Route 145 service will continue to operate from Kilmacanogue to the City Centre. This route will be extended to serve Heuston Station. It will no longer divert via Bray Station making the route more direct and will result in improved journey times for passengers with consistent intervals between departures.

What areas will Route 111 serve?
Route 111 will operate from Cherrywood to Dún Laoghaire via Loughlinstown Hospital in both directions.

Cookie_Monster

What areas will Route 111 serve?
Route 111 will operate from Cherrywood to Dún Laoghaire via Loughlinstown Hospital in both directions.

Thats a very indirect and inefficient route. Leaves Loughlinstown without a bus service too as the 7 is partially gone and I'd bet will be enitrely pulled our under the new regime. Seems to indicate a reasonable big terminus in Cherrywood though.

patrickbrophy18

Routes 7, 59, 185 and 8 haven't been mentioned at all in the Network Direct project. Does anyone here have leaked information as to what will happen to these routes? I'm just curious!:D

xOxSinéadxOx

Bit disappointing they haven't done anything to decrease journey times from Maynooth. 67 starting on Moyglare Road will take so long to get into town, the 67a takes ages as it is, if it starts out on Moyglare Rd it'll have to go through 3 sets of traffic lights just in Maynooth.

HydeRoad

I travelled on Bus Éireann from Celbridge to city today. Twenty minutes from Celbridge Main Street to Arran Quay. That is unbeatable service, though a bit pricey at €3.40 each way. I drive Celbridge to city in twenty minutes by car, so there is a definite advantage to using the Bus Éireann service.

There is no excuse under the sun for the Dublin Bus 67 to be taking an hour or more, even allowing that it makes more stops. There are huge margins for Dublin Bus to be more efficient on long routes like these. In ten years of living in Celbridge, I have only ever used the 67 route about four times, I despise it that much. How much extra patronage are Dublin Bus missing out on because their service is so unattractive?

Ham'nd'egger

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

Routes 7, 59, 185 and 8 haven't been mentioned at all in the Network Direct project. Does anyone here have leaked information as to what will happen to these routes? I'm just curious!:D

There are reviews of both the Merrion Road and Dundrum/Churchtown areas to be announced in the coming weeks. The 185 is a route that there may have a significant change made to it; no word on the 7 though it won't be dropped, that much we can trust.

January

So did anyone head to the Stillorgan "meeting" yesterday? Was it just a load of fobbing off or did they actually listen to your concerns?? Heading up to Blanchardstown today.

dynamick

I was there. There were plenty of people asking questions and the staff were very helpful. I think it's worthwhile talking to them because if people raise a concern they haven't thought of that could result in a change to their plans.

Cookie_Monster

dynamick wrote: »

I was there. There were plenty of people asking questions and the staff were very helpful. I think it's worthwhile talking to them because if people raise a concern they haven't thought of that could result in a change to their plans.

Deloitte were paid a lot of money to cover all concerns. If they haven't then they shouldn't be paid, simple as. Fair enough DB holding these meeting, but they should only be to inform and address concerns, not look for potential changes, it defeats the whole purpose of having a long term in depth report done in the first place.

devnull

I would be surprised if they had made their mind up as they are still changing their maps on an almost daily basis on their website, and have removed all information regarding frequencies and have changed a number of the routes, with once again no prior notice unless you access the maps again.

The changes I can see include the 236 now serving Tyrrelstown rather than terminating at Ballycoolin and the 47 is now running to Pearse Street.

It will be interesting to see what happens with the 236 and 270, now all 236 and 270 departures will serve Tyrrelstown. No doubt Urbus will be annoyed at this, seeing as DB frequently used to miss out many of the limited departures on the 236 on a daily basis until urbus started operating a route from Blanch to Swords via Tyrrelstown when strangely the service become more reliable overnight.

There is now an over provision of services between Blanch and Tyrrelstown in the new plans by far which is totally unsustainable and creates the duplication that these plans exactly were set to cut out?

AlekSmart

Deloitte were paid a lot of money to cover all concerns. If they haven't then they shouldn't be paid, simple as. Fair enough DB holding these meeting, but they should only be to inform and address concerns, not look for potential changes, it defeats the whole purpose of having a long term in depth report done in the first place.

Good point Cookie_Monster,however this is no ordinary Deloitte report,this is an ND report......commissioned by and for the Minister for Transport,Noel Dempsey.

Minister Dempsey`s reasons for commissioning the report were quite specific when he announced it on RTE TV....he "suspected" that the CIE Road Passenger companies were not giving full value for the State`s funding.

It needs to be immediately noted that the final Deloitte Report pointedly failed to uncover evidence of any such failure.

In the case of Bus Eireann it even admitted that the company was operating at maximum operational efficiency with minimal opportunities for any further gains.

In Dublin Bus`s case the efficiency losses stemmed mainly from an outdated and overlapping historical route network with excessive duplication.

In both cases,Deloitte found the companies were operating well up to the prevailing EU & UK Industry Standards.

All of this a far cry from what our esteemed Minister would have liked to read.

The current reading of the Deloitte Network Direct plan as innovative or mould breaking is somewhat wide of the mark.

In Dublin Bus`s case we are largely re-visiting old ground,dating back to the early 1980`s when our original Network Review process was instituted.

The main points from that process was the introduction of the branded CitySwift and CityImp services,both of which were successful in themselves but in rather typical Irish fashion both ended up suffering greatly from a lack of ongoing development and the innovative management style required to keep the momentum flowing.

Much of the loss was,again typically,lost due to Political meddling in the Company`s activities which saw the overall Master Plan reduced to a series of locally influenced tinker-fests which in terms of a Capital City Network simply cannot work.

I would share Cookie_Monster`s concerns about the apparent level of indecision now emerging which in terms of a Network Review really needed to be addressed at a far earlier stage in proceedings.

However,the essential thrust remains sound in terms of fast,reliable hi-frequency routes which in turn can be marketed to new users.

However,we really do need to take cogniscence of what is currently developing with Veolia/Luas where a virtually new Transport System is rapidly being devalued by the ongoing failure to recognize and address the serious issues of anti-social behaviour and resultant fall off in customer confidence...This combination,if allowed to develop on the "New" Network Direct will prove fatal.

This is but one area where most of the Consultants Reports and Studies have consistently side-stepped and blindsided,but which remains a very prominent issue for staff and remaining loyal customers.

dynamick

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Deloitte were paid a lot of money to cover all concerns. If they haven't then they shouldn't be paid, simple as.

A consultants report is simply a collection of opinions and judgements from the consultants perspective.

It is never optimal. As with any design process, the proposed approach is usually improved by passing through several design iterations, during which feedback from the participants is sought.

Same thing when you design a house and the architect produces a number of versions that take into account the views of the client and the planners.

The DB document is headed 'proposed'. I think we are at the tweaking stage. Little details can be important all the same.

schemingbohemia

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Deloitte were paid a lot of money to cover all concerns. If they haven't then they shouldn't be paid, simple as. Fair enough DB holding these meeting, but they should only be to inform and address concerns, not look for potential changes, it defeats the whole purpose of having a long term in depth report done in the first place.

Wrong yet again! The deloitte report if you'd bothered to read it was a cost and efficiency review of Dublin Bus, it suggested ways of increasing efficiency including introducing more cross-city routes which has been adopted - it wasn't a network review.

See here
http://www.transport.ie/viewitem.asp?id=11354&lang=ENG&loc=2347

It states:
"In relation to the effectiveness of bus networks, it finds that the Dublin Bus network has not been realigned for a number of years and as a result has become overly complex with a significant amount of service duplication. It concludes that there is an opportunity, through a complete network redesign, to create a simplified network offering improved services with improved cost efficiency.
The consultants undertook a review of one corridor in Dublin and on the basis of a conceptual redesign identified potential operational savings of approximately €2million on that corridor alone. A review of other corridors on the same basis as applied to the case study would be likely to also deliver significant efficiency gains.
In relation to Dublin Bus, the report concludes that the current fleet size is adequate to service current demand and that the need for fleet expansion should be reviewed in the light of changes in demand and improvements in efficiency.
This conclusion reflects the growth in the capacity of the fleet in recent yearsover the period since 2000 the capacity of the fleet seated and standing- has grown by more than 35% yet passenger numbers are falling.
In relation to operational efficiency, the report concludes that in the case of Dublin Bus there is scope to adjust scheduling in the interests of improved customer service, through timetable changes and changes to the practice of "out of service" running, and in the operation of routes to garages without apparent customer demand.
At the risk of over distilling the report, the headline recommendations of the report are that bus services in Dublin can be improved through redesign of the network to provide a similar or better level of service at a lower cost by, principally, simplifying the network, eliminating duplication of services, creating even headways, providing additional direct routes into and out of the city and to key employment centres, improving scheduling effectiveness and improving bus priority."

Riskymove

HydeRoad wrote: »

There is no excuse under the sun for the Dublin Bus 67 to be taking an hour or more, even allowing that it makes more stops. There are huge margins for Dublin Bus to be more efficient on long routes like these. In ten years of living in Celbridge, I have only ever used the 67 route about four times, I despise it that much. How much extra patronage are Dublin Bus missing out on because their service is so unattractive?

I use the 67X which takes 30-40 mins or so from main street celbridge

forcing the 67 through Lucan is what causes the delays - stops, traffic lights etc