Dublin Bus Network Review

Victor

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

It actually makes me sick that people in my constituency voted for this retard

Can we this type of language?

Cookie_Monster

Victor wrote: »

Can we this type of language?

yes, I can type that kind of language, as you can clearly see :pac:

karlitob

clunked wrote: »

Ah sure, what would 'Rich Boy' know about slumming it with the ordinary mortals on the bus!!

I agree - it is hard to take his brand of socialism when he's from the leafy suburbs of south county dublin - but i guess you cant hold that against him

AlekSmart

I would strongly defend Mr Boyd-Barrett's right to protest at those elements of change which can be proven to be generally unfair.

In this case,that is patently not the case as the 63 is largely satisfying (at some cost in ND terms) the needs of the "Farmers".

It should not escape Mr Boyd-Barretts notice either that,in Traffic Management terms,the road junction at the Mountown Lower end of The Farm has altered significantly with all traffic on Kill Avenue now recieving a high degree of priority over traffic entering and leaving The Farm,which now encounters significant delay at the new Traffic Signals.

In reality this is as it should be.

Monkstown Farm is in now way capable of safely handling the volumes of High Capacity-High Frequency Bus Service which this campaign wishes to reimpose upon it.

I'm uncertain what measures Mr Boyd Barrett would countenance to be used against the significant numbers of Farm residents and users who park their vehicles on the footpaths and the equally significant numbers of commercial vehicles to be found in the same manner as they weliver to commercial premisies along this VERY narrow bi-directional stretch on road.

The reality is that the revised Kill Avenue routing is benefitting the greater number of 46A customers and the operation of the entire route.

When the Kill Avenue QBC works are complete this benefit will be even more noticable I wouild suggest.

Indeed over the past few days MonksTown Farm itself once again fell foul to a significant Road Works site at the TEK end which,although well managed,would have entailed the diversion of the 46A route in any case.

I would suggest that Mr Boyd Barrett does his many deserving protest causes little real good by presenting himself as a representative who is prepared to add his support to any and all causes who show up on his doorstep.

If I were he,I would actually get out on the 46A,75 and even perhaps the 8 a wee bit more and experience the benefits which will ensure a better service for EVERYBODY.

lucernarian

That's a very good post, underlined by how moves that are for the greater good should automatically be welcomed by those who agree with the socialist cause.

qerty

I was travelling on the 79A today through Ballyfermot and was handed a leaflet regarding protests against the removal of the 76 through the area. I was also informed that the 78/78a/40/40a merger was meant to happen this Sunday, but has been delayed due to disagreement regarding timetables/rosters etc. between management and staff at Harristown. How true this is I do not know.

Rabbitt

I can't b eleive people are having a hissy fit about the 46a.
There are over 140 of them each way a day.
People in other areas are loosing critical bus routes and people are up
in arms about that route!
Get a grip.

thomasj

I heard a radio news item yesterday where they interviewed a woman who said their main focus was on the loss of the 48a. i thought the new 14 was meant to cover that route?

Equally, i saw mention on the news yesterday that donnycarney residents were protesting? Donnycarney has one of the best bus services in the city (malahide road) plus they have working next bus displays at their stops?

On a 17a not far from kilbarrack, there were save the bus posters up at bus stops. This despite the fact that the 17a changes were already in place!

I really think maybe in some cases they have cause to protest but in some places dun laoghaire for example they are protesting for the sake of protesting.

Dun laoghaire the other day, i saw a poster from their local save the bus group (rbb was mentioned) their demands were:

- return the 46a to its old state
- return the 4 to its old state
- not to touch and to improve the 7, 8, 59, 111, 114, 63

here is an item from their facebook page:

Cuts in Dun Laoghaire:
*
The new 46A route leaves Monkstown Farm and Abbey Road without a decent service – the 63 is
not an adequate replacement
• The 46N route has been changed so that it no longer comes down from Foxrock church to Dun
Laoghaire
• The 59 service is going to be “reviewed in September” with talk of changing the route which
would inevitably lead to a change in frequency.
• The cuts to the 4/4a means that people are waiting sometimes up to an hour for a bus.
• On Newtown Park and Carysfort Avenues (previously served very well by the 6/6a services) the
cuts to the 114 mean that people have no service at all on a Sunday and only 16 buses Mon - Fri
• The 111 has been cut from a regular feeder service to the Dart to a 4 bus a day route with no
buses at the weekend.
• The 746 & 46x have been axed.
• Dublin Bus needs to increase the frequency of the 7 and route the 7c to serve Loughlinstown
Hospital

Rabbitt

That's it, nothing else to do with their time than give out.
Take 5 mins to look up the 46a timetable, they have over 130 each day.
That's more than a lot of routes put together.

Don't forget, I'm sure that half of them protesting could get the DART to work
or town too .

patrickbrophy18

It looks like the 8 is going to be turned into an hourly service as per the following link:

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Merrion-Road/

I wasn't expecting this at all. BRILLIANT!:D

The 59 route will also be adjusted. What does this mean?

Cookie_Monster

Dublin Bus needs to increase the frequency of the 7 and route the 7c to serve Loughlinstown
Hospital

7 is pretty frequent, 7c SO increase the frequency from 0 basically.

The demands they are making are ridiculous, shoving buses back down totally inappropriate roads, and no improvement of other route.

The 111 has been a uselessly infrequent service for years now, and should be axed totally. it does not operate as an effective feeder any more and simply duplicates the 7. If the are going to actually "network direct" the 7 and put it down Sallyglen road then there's an argument to keep the 111 I suppose, but otherwise it's currently pointless.

qerty

qerty wrote: »

I was travelling on the 79A today through Ballyfermot and was handed a leaflet regarding protests against the removal of the 76 through the area. I was also informed that the 78/78a/40/40a merger was meant to happen this Sunday, but has been delayed due to disagreement regarding timetables/rosters etc. between management and staff at Harristown. How true this is I do not know.

What about the 79/27B merger? Since I live in Fairview and travel to Ballyfermot regularly I seem to be the only one who wants it!

robbie_998

qerty wrote: »

I was travelling on the 79A today through Ballyfermot and was handed a leaflet regarding protests against the removal of the 76 through the area. I was also informed that the 78/78a/40/40a merger was meant to happen this Sunday, but has been delayed due to disagreement regarding timetables/rosters etc. between management and staff at Harristown. How true this is I do not know.

its going to a better place...

and i said it before but i for one am very very happy that the 76 is being taken from ballyfermot and put over to blanch instead

it means a lot more people have better access to a better shopping center !

and if i want to visit my sis in meath its a hop on the 76 and its a 5 min drive to the house from there if i was picked up !

so damn handy...

it also opens up more jobs to the people of tallaght and clondalkin..... never before have i looked for a job in blanch but now i have a solid direct route i can start looking at blanch not a bother !

yes it takes a link from tallaght, clondalkin and neilstown to ballyfermot but it makes brand new ones at the same time.

the fact of it all anyway is that theres just not enough people to support the 76 to ballyfermot .. just a small minority... i get it everyday to liffey valley and is fairly empty when i get on it but packed a lil bit into the journey but then empty before im getting off again...

it just makes sense

coylemj

I agree with the earlier comments about the 46A. Making this service do a loop around the farm added 1.9 kms to the route and with chaotic parking, the delay for the outbound bus waiting to turn right from Monkstown Ave. into the farm, speed bumps and delivery vans, serving the farm was adding a considerable number of minutes to the route for the convenience of a relatively small number of users. Even with the re-route, anybody living in the farm is still less than 1 km from a 46A bus stop, there's an awful lot of people living in Dun Laoghaire who have further to walk to a service offering that level of frequency.

If you look at how other people in the same part of Dun Laoghaire are served (or not) by DB, look at nearby Stradbrook Road and Deansgrange Road, these people have a No. 4 bus which only runs every 30 minutes and the crap 'service' that is the 45 which now only goes to Merrion Sq. whereas anybody living within walking distance of the 46A has an excellent service every 10 minutes which goes right across town to the Phoenix Park.

RBB needs to adopt credible causes, the case for routing the 46A back through Monkstown Farm has no merit whatsoever.

qerty

robbie_998 wrote: »

its going to a better place...

and i said it before but i for one am very very happy that the 76 is being taken from ballyfermot and put over to blanch instead

it means a lot more people have better access to a better shopping center !

and if i want to visit my sis in meath its a hop on the 76 and its a 5 min drive to the house from there if i was picked up !

so damn handy...

it also opens up more jobs to the people of tallaght and clondalkin..... never before have i looked for a job in blanch but now i have a solid direct route i can start looking at blanch not a bother !

yes it takes a link from tallaght, clondalkin and neilstown to ballyfermot but it makes brand new ones at the same time.

the fact of it all anyway is that theres just not enough people to support the 76 to ballyfermot .. just a small minority... i get it everyday to liffey valley and is fairly empty when i get on it but packed a lil bit into the journey but then empty before im getting off again...

it just makes sense

I agree with you that one route operating from Tallaght to Blanchardstown is excellent and that should be welcomed. But, there is actually a high demand for the 76 in Ballyfermot, especially in the mornings. It links Ballyfermot college and surrounding areas to Tallaght It and Blanchardstown It. BCFE has very strong education links with those two colleges. Also, quite a large number of school children travel to clondalkin to the Irish school and vice versa. I would admit that the main demand is in the morning and during term time. You would be surprised by the amount of people that use that route between Tallaght and Ballyfermot.

IMO, The solution that would please everybody would be a direct route between Blanch and Tallaght via Ballyfermot but that's not gonna happen due to the extra 10-15 minutes added to the journey time going through Ballyfermot in the peak. Traffic there does be very heavy.
Instead, maybe there should be a 76 from Tallaght to Blanch and a 76A from Ballyfermot to Tallaght. That's just me however.
Also, I personally don't think many people in the area are too pushed on the idea of the 76 being removed from the area, but the fact that no replacement service is being offered. I work in clondalkin village and no direct link there would be a pain.

lucernarian

They implemented a direct cut in frequency to the 4 at the same time as the amalgamation of the route to Monkstown. Get a bus to or from the Merrion shopping centre/St. Vincent's hospital or the RDS into the city centre and it'll quickly become apparent during peak times that there simply aren't enough buses on that route to meet demand. The protestors do have a point there in that it was a straightforward cut and cost saving measure. (Yes I know the Dart comes close to several parts of the route but not all of those parts, also DART is slightly more costly for the distances that people would usually travel coming from Ballsbridge and not as direct to the city centre as a bus)

The shambles of an idea that is stopping the 45 at Merrion Sq hasn't helped. The "suggestions" around the changes to the 47 showed that people do care about whether they have to walk <10 minutes to several transport hubs in Dublin or if they have to walk 20 or so minutes. The 45 could help with capacity in this area simply by extending it around TCD like the 47. The "bus gate" at college green is an opportunity to grasp for the 45.

Cookie_Monster

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

The shambles of an idea that is stopping the 45 at Merrion Sq hasn't helped. The "suggestions" around the changes to the 47 showed that people do care about whether they have to walk <10 minutes to several transport hubs in Dublin or if they have to walk 20 or so minutes. The 45 could help with capacity in this area simply by extending it around TCD like the 47. The "bus gate" at college green is an opportunity to grasp for the 45.

how busy is the 45 outside the rush though, could it be justified adding more service to it, usually seems empty running though Cabinteely during the day from the buses I've seen. More capacity on the 4 is the obvious solution as many people on here have already attested to. Or even the 7 if the route was tidied up a bit but I don' think the 45 is in that much demand elsewhere on the route to justify it for that section alone

LXFlyer

The increase in frequency and even headways on the 7 will help, but I would tend to agree that the 45 being extended to Pearse Street is the obvious solution to the Ballsbridge problem.

LXFlyer

thomasj wrote: »

I heard a radio news item yesterday where they interviewed a woman who said their main focus was on the loss of the 48a. i thought the new 14 was meant to cover that route?

The 48A shares its route from the city centre to Dundrum with the 44 and the LUAS, and then shares the route from Dundrum to Ballinteer with the 14, 14a and 75.

Quite a lot of the time it operates in tandem with a 44 between the city and Dundrum and there are (off-peak) 6 buses an hour between Dundrum and Ballinteer on the 14/14a and 75.

Frankly other than the main morning peak departures from Ballinteer at 0720 and 0800 (which carry roughly 30 people each) you would be lucky to see more than 10-15 people on any given 48a. I have often got an outbound evening peak departure with no one else on the top deck. I have (in five years of using it) never had to share my seat with another passenger (something most posters on here would dream of).

What is proposed for Ballinteer is:
- An amalgamated 14 service operating at the same (or better) frequency than the existing combined 14/14a.
- A new route 175 that will offer a faster connection to Tallaght or Dun Laoghaire, albeit at a lower frequency than the existing 75 service which will be routed via Nutgrove and Churchtown instead
- A 100% increase in the number of buses on route 16 along Grange Road and Brehon Field Road
- The cancellation of the 48a
- The rerouting of the 161 via Ballyboden

A Nitelink service has been restored by extending the 46n from Sandyford to Dundrum via Ballinteer. Yes it takes a longer routing, but it is every 30 minutes, which is at a higher frequency than before. Again the 48n only ever had around 10-15 people on any departure I was on in 5 years. Frankly at 2am if I can get home for EUR 5 (and every 30 minutes) I would not be complaining be complaining about the route as these guys are.

These guys are complaining for complainings sake. To my mind there really is no justification for retaining the 48a when the 14 will operate every 15 minutes in the peak and every 20 minutes in the off-peak between Ballinteer and Dundrum where people can change to the LUAS if they want to go to Milltown or Dundrum, or they can change to the 44.

These guys need to get real. There are plenty of other areas of Dublin with a far worse bus service, but the reality is that every single stretch of road currently served by the 48a will still have a bus service.

LXFlyer

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

7 is pretty frequent, 7c SO increase the frequency from 0 basically.

The demands they are making are ridiculous, shoving buses back down totally inappropriate roads, and no improvement of other route.

The 111 has been a uselessly infrequent service for years now, and should be axed totally. it does not operate as an effective feeder any more and simply duplicates the 7. If the are going to actually "network direct" the 7 and put it down Sallyglen road then there's an argument to keep the 111 I suppose, but otherwise it's currently pointless.

The 111 is going to serve Loughlinstown Hospital and operate every 45 minutes in the peak and every 60 minutes off-peak.

LXFlyer

coylemj wrote: »

I agree with the earlier comments about the 46A. Making this service do a loop around the farm added 1.9 kms to the route and with chaotic parking, the delay for the outbound bus waiting to turn right from Monkstown Ave. into the farm, speed bumps and delivery vans, serving the farm was adding a considerable number of minutes to the route for the convenience of a relatively small number of users. Even with the re-route, anybody living in the farm is still less than 1 km from a 46A bus stop, there's an awful lot of people living in Dun Laoghaire who have further to walk to a service offering that level of frequency.

If you look at how other people in the same part of Dun Laoghaire are served (or not) by DB, look at nearby Stradbrook Road and Deansgrange Road, these people have a No. 4 bus which only runs every 30 minutes and the crap 'service' that is the 45 which now only goes to Merrion Sq. whereas anybody living within walking distance of the 46A has an excellent service every 10 minutes which goes right across town to the Phoenix Park.

RBB needs to adopt credible causes, the case for routing the 46A back through Monkstown Farm has no merit whatsoever.

They also have the 63 every 30 minutes that offers connections to/from the 46a and DART.

dynamick

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

Get a bus to or from the Merrion shopping centre/St. Vincent's hospital or the RDS into the city centre and it'll quickly become apparent during peak times that there simply aren't enough buses on that route to meet demand.

I haven't noticed this. Here's a quick snapshot of the live times from Nassau Street stop going South:

7 Cherrywood via Ballsbridge 1 Mins
4 Monkstown Avenue via City Centre 4 Mins
7 Loughlinstown via Ballsbridge 11 Mins
7 Loughlinstown via Ballsbridge 16 Mins
7A Mackintosh Park via Ballsbridge 21 Mins
4 Monkstown Avenue via City Centre 22 Mins
7 Loughlinstown via Ballsbridge 26 Mins

7 buses due in the next 25 minutes between the city centre and Ballsbridge/Merrion. How is that insufficient? I am puzzled.

http://www.dublinbuslive.com/index.php?id=405&lastRoute=4

SandyfordGuy

The most amusing idea I saw to fix the Ballsbridge problem was to bring the 47 to closer to the city centre, a few extra 7's, extra 8's and extend the 120 to Ballsbridge on some trip.

Of course, they could just bring the 4 back to the frequency post the cuts, but that would make far too much sense so why use the wheel we already have when we can reinvent it and make it more confusing in the process.

The Ballsbridge corridor has never really recovered from the downgrading of the 4 frequency from every 10 to every 15 minutes in peak, and also the ridiculous 30 minute at the weekend and 60 minute frequency on Sunday.

Coupled with the withdrawl of the artics which were carrying 120+ during the peaks being replaced by vehicles that are carrying 30% less, it's hardly surprising.

Dynamick - it does sound ridicolous but it isn't enough, see:
http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBYQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.boards.ie%2Fvbulletin%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D2056144835&rct=j&q=Overcrowding%20on%20the%204%20%20boards.ie&ei=DNX1Te2UNIPIswaFw729Bg&usg=AFQjCNF7sZ7wWkqIpbwrcE-U-4Qvl08xnA&sig2=p_EUKFrf09dEqEPJpvriEA&cad=rja


By the way, generally the greatest problems on the 4 are heading south in the mornings and North in the evenings. After 9.30 it is not so bad, but between 8am and 9am it is a nightmare.

CIE

qerty wrote: »

Instead, maybe there should be a 76 from Tallaght to Blanch and a 76A from Ballyfermot to Tallaght

Was not the original arrangement that the 76 was Ballyfermot-Tallaght and the 76A Blanchardstown-Tallaght, i.e. the other way around? (My opinion back then was that the Blanchardstown-Tallaght route should not have been a branch of the 76 to begin with, nor operate via Ballyfermot.)

Back on the 61: I'm somewhat amused that this route is coming back, although not operating via Ranelagh and Milltown Road as in the past. I also wonder if the 41A can survive as an Airport-Swords local bus, or if its target ridership would use the 102 instead.

phasers

The 76A was a funny route, it seemed to just go to Blanch whenever the driver felt like it.

qerty

CIE wrote: »

Was not the original arrangement that the 76 was Ballyfermot-Tallaght and the 76A Blanchardstown-Tallaght, i.e. the other way around? (My opinion back then was that the Blanchardstown-Tallaght route should not have been a branch of the 76 to begin with, nor operate via Ballyfermot.)

The 76/a/b operates currently from Tallaght (fettercairn/balrothery or the square) to Ballyfermot. Occasionaly some 76s operate to Blanchardstown via Ballyfermot. Believe it or not, the timetables state that all of the 76s operate to blanchardstown at certain times, not just the 76a. I have personally been on a 76B to blanch.

AlekSmart

SandyfordGuy wrote: »

The most amusing idea I saw to fix the Ballsbridge problem was to bring the 47 to closer to the city centre, a few extra 7's, extra 8's and extend the 120 to Ballsbridge on some trip.

Of course, they could just bring the 4 back to the frequency post the cuts,

The Ballsbridge corridor has never really recovered from the downgrading of the 4 frequency from every 10 to every 15 minutes in peak, and also the ridiculous 30 minute at the weekend and 60 minute frequency on Sunday.

Coupled with the withdrawl of the artics which were carrying 120+ during the peaks being replaced by vehicles that are carrying 30% less, it's hardly surprising.

+100% Sandyford Guy.

By far the simplest way to repair a situation which was self-inflicted by the initial bust of semi-competent Network Directing,which thankfully now appears to be tempered by a little sanity.

I would suggest that a reinstatement and even a robust reinforcement of the 4 Route should be a priority right now.

The 4 represents EVERYTHING which the Deloitte Report found lacking in DB's armoury...and it was an in-house success from day one...why on earth they did what they did is a true mystery.....:o

CIE

qerty wrote: »

The 76/a/b operates currently from Tallaght (fettercairn/balrothery or the square) to Ballyfermot. Occasionaly some 76s operate to Blanchardstown via Ballyfermot. Believe it or not, the timetables state that all of the 76s operate to blanchardstown at certain times, not just the 76a. I have personally been on a 76B to blanch.

Yes, that's the current arrangement; I was speaking of the original one, where the 76A was the sole route to Blanchardstown.

dynamick

AlekSmart wrote: »

I would suggest that a reinstatement and even a robust reinforcement of the 4 Route should be a priority right now.

Which service would you cut to transfer buses to the 4?

markpb

dynamick wrote: »

Which service would you cut to transfer buses to the 4?

Where did the buses go when the service was cut on the 4?