Excellent Article about Barstoolers.

antomorro-sei

Can't be bothered quoting, but to someones post above, who claims that he was hated because he supported Arsenal whilst going to Shels games.

I can't for one second believe that, all tripe imo. I'd say the vast majority of LOI Regulars support/follow a team from England.

OhNoYouDidn't

Des wrote: »

I can understand it.

I support an Irish team, but fúcking hate the national team.

You hate the FAI. But you accept you are a crank!!

_blank_

antomorro-sei wrote: »

Can't be bothered quoting, but to someones post above, who claims that he was hated because he supported Arsenal whilst going to Shels games.

I can't for one second believe that, all tripe imo. I'd say the vast majority of LOI Regulars support/follow a team from England.

He should have worn his Arsenal gear into Richer, no-one would have noticed

therecklessone

Des wrote: »

Worse though, are people who wear British jerseys to Ireland games, that is absolutely mind boggling to me.

Oh jaysus! Sketch!

antomorro-sei

Des wrote: »

He should have worn his Arsenal gear into Richer, no-one would have noticed

Haha true. Slightly off topic but, a mate of mine went to a Spurs game in WHL wearing a Pats jersey. Nearly got a hiding for it. :pac:

stovelid

antomorro-sei wrote: »

Can't be bothered quoting, but to someones post above, who claims that he was hated because he supported Arsenal whilst going to Shels games.

I can't for one second believe that, all tripe imo. I'd say the vast majority of LOI Regulars support/follow a team from England.

In my experience, it's extremely rare to come across a LOI supporter who doesn't have another club outside Ireland. The three lads I mainly go to Rovers with are pretty serious about their EPL club (s) and go over to see them when they can.

Pro. F

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Ole Ole'ers cherry pick shocker.

If you can't see why following English football in part but not other bits is quite strange, then we can't help you.

iirc there are a good few LOI fans on here who have a strong dislike for the Irish national team. Do you think that is quite strange as well?

I certainly wouldn't defend any Irish people with a nationalistic based dislike of the English NT team while also being supporters of an English club. But surely indifference towards any team is understandable.

PS. I'm not interested in getting into the broader debate as I've discussed it all before. I just couldn't resist questioning OhNoYouDidnt's logic.

stovelid

Pro. F wrote: »

iirc there are a good few LOI fans on here who have a strong dislike for the Irish national team. Do you think that is quite strange as well?

Nope.

A certain organization responsible for prioritizing the national team makes a hames of managing our league. Irish supporters of English clubs wouldn't understand as a competent football association (F.A) is in charge of the league they support.

adox

Christ this thread is depressing for so many reasons.

Gavin "shels"

antomorro-sei wrote: »

Can't be bothered quoting, but to someones post above, who claims that he was hated because he supported Arsenal whilst going to Shels games.

I can't for one second believe that, all tripe imo. I'd say the vast majority of LOI Regulars support/follow a team from England.

Just about to post this myself, I've seen many a British club jersey in Tolka and nothing ever said, sure there's a lad who goes to most matches who has a Liverpool and Celtic tattoo but nothing said to him.

Think someone is telling porkies.

Gavin "shels"

adox wrote: »

Christ this thread is depressing for so many reasons.

Why read it and post in it so!?:rolleyes:

adox

Gavin shels wrote: »

Why read it and post in it so!?:rolleyes:

Free will and free speech.

Ush1

Pro. F wrote: »

iirc there are a good few LOI fans on here who have a strong dislike for the Irish national team. Do you think that is quite strange as well?

I certainly wouldn't defend any Irish people with a nationalistic based dislike of the English NT team while also being supporters of an English club. But surely indifference towards any team is understandable.

PS. I'm not interested in getting into the broader debate as I've discussed it all before. I just couldn't resist questioning OhNoYouDidnt's logic.

Yes, but they have different reasons.

No so much, not for me anyway.

LuckyLloyd

The soccer forum moderators should do the following:

Either:

- bookmark this thread;
- run a forum search to find as many previous threads dealing with this very same area of discussion;

Then:

- merge all of the threads you found if you did the latter of the two previous options;
- in future, anytime someone makes an OP like the one in this thread (these threads do usually start with such a link) and discussion sets off down this well trod pathway, merge those posts in here;

That would mean:

- all of this circular never-ending discussion can be in the one place;

Benefits?

This thread is pointless and irrelevant because the points being trotted out are stale and reused. Now, I am of course aware that the usual suspects with the signposted agenda will cry that they should be allowed to post the same things over and over, that you shouldn't control content on a public forum, FREEDOM!, blah, blah. But I'm actually trying to help them here.

You see, the reality is that these threads don't help their cause. They don't convert people to avid LOI fans because they contain no new lines of argument, no new research, and all of the same old bile and bitterness. IF everyone knew that anytime they try and recycle the same old rubbish it will merely be added on to a threadzilla on the subject it might push them to go away and come back with a genuinely new slant or submission on the matter.

It would be a positive development for the forum if on the end of this irrelevancy, there would be a new post every so often highlighting some form of scheme or initiative to get Irish football fans out to a live game over the summer months, and an explanation for why it is worthwhile for people to give it a shot. You know, add in some real positivity and proper content on a thread that has already provided space for the back and forth mud slinging. Maybe even update it anytime some new comparative research has been done on the percentages of attendance to live games or active participation in grassroots football amongst Irish people predisposed to the sport relative to other countries in Europe / the World at large.

Because harking back to 2007 when I started posting on this forum we've probably had 100+ threads that have fleshed out this same old bull****. And nothing changes in terms of the type or quality of the arguments used by either side. Enough is enough.

gustavo

Rooney10 wrote: »

Hit the nail of the head. They damage their own league and put off supporters with this ridiculous childish drivel.

I'd say a good amount of those that go to the Showgrounds every fortnight also support a British team of some sort so i find it laughable that people would use that reason not to support a LOI team

Jazzy

the fact that the local LoI gestapo has jumped on an absolutely sh1t article with no depth, little grounding in reality and amateur style in order to once again try and bang on about the same thing we have heard from years is pretty desperate. Theres only one man I know that can make the point Im trying to make, take it away Rob

doncarlos

Jazzy wrote: »

the fact that the local LoI gestapo has jumped on an absolutely sh1t article with no depth, little grounding in reality and amateur style in order to once again try and bang on about the same thing we have heard from years is pretty desperate. Theres only one man I know that can make the point Im trying to make, take it away Rob

the fact that the local LoI haters have jumped on an absolutely sh1t article with no depth, little grounding in reality and amateur style in order to once again try and use the same sad excuses why they'd rather follow a foreign team is pretty desperate.

OPENROAD

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Also a point about the '99% of fans wouldn't want England to win the WC' - there is a high number of Liverpool/Man Utd fans from the North of England that don't like England for the way they treat their players and make scapegoats out of them i.e. Carragher, Scholes, Beckham etc. The treatment of England fans towards the likes of Neville (booing him in Wembley because of who he plays for) also shows what they're like. I'd prefer if none of the English contingent from United played for them.
So it's not just because we're from Ireland.

I'd prefer if they scrapped international football completely

Krusader

Why would I pay €15 to watch the LOI, when I can watch the same standard of football in my local team for €2. Madness
When I was growing up, MOTD was always on, then Sky came, you never seen LOI on the TV, so people had no connection with the nearest club. Your local park is the best place to watch Irish soccer

Jazzy

doncarlos wrote: »

LoI haters

you see, isnt this rather presumptuous? did I say I hate the LoI? did anyone here in fact say they hated the LoI?

you were trying to be all clever there as rob has clearly annoyed you but ya just kinda bulldozered in some facts in a vain effort to look smart. the original article made stuff up, you just made stuff up... hmmm, is there a pattern here?
ah but dont worry, you have a level 14 football guy thanking your post even though poor old gav only probably read the bit he liked and didnt think too hard about it, as at the end of the day all this is about looking better and feeling better then other people innit ?

Gavin "shels"

Crosáidí wrote: »

Why would I pay €15 to watch the LOI, when I can watch the same standard of football in my local team for €2.

Whos your local team and whos your local LoI team?

OPENROAD

Iago wrote: »

wait what? You seriously know United fans who hope Rooney breaks his leg while playing for the English team??

I find that very hard to believe tbh

Some years ago England were playing someone, can't remember who, anyway Paul Ince was a utd player at the time, watching the match in a pub I was shocked to see a bloke in a utd jersey hurling racist abuse at Ince :eek: while the racist abuse was an isolated incident the vile directed at the England team in general around that time 90's was enough for me, I stopped going to the pub to watch International football after that for some years.

Finally went back to watch an England match in the pub during the 2002 world cup and was pleasantly surprised to see things had completely changed, people were actually cheering for England and when they scored against Argentina the pub erupted. I think peoples attitudes have changed thankfully

Ush1

Gavin shels wrote: »

Whos your local team and whos your local LoI team?

Was just gonna say, must be some local team in they're as good as LOI.

peabutler

What are people who have no LOI team locally supposed to do, LOI has to be linked with GAA in some ways, I dislike the rival counties around me in GAA so I'm not just going to love their LOI team So am I a barstooler for watching football but not going driving an hour or so to see LOI.

OhNoYouDidn't

Crosáidí wrote: »

Why would I pay €15 to watch the LOI, when I can watch the same standard of football in my local team for €2. Madness
When I was growing up, MOTD was always on, then Sky came, you never seen LOI on the TV, so people had no connection with the nearest club. Your local park is the best place to watch Irish soccer

Inane bullshít.

You have no connection with your local side but do with some English place odds on you have never been? Pull the other one.

Its easier and involves less emotional attachment to watch some Brit side in the pub. Why not just admit it?

Gavin "shels"

Ush1 wrote: »

Was just gonna say, must be some local team in they're as good as LOI.

Yup, did they get a European place is the big question.:D

smackbunnybaby

When I was back in Cork I would never dream of going to See City play. I stuck with my local Munster Senior League Team
When I moved to Dublin the the nearest team would have been St Pats but I couldn't bring myself to follow the over paid prima donnas.
I support St James United U12 and financially support them by buying chips in Papa Mios.

OhNoYouDidn't

peabutler wrote: »

What are people who have no LOI team locally supposed to do, LOI has to be linked with GAA in some ways, I dislike the rival counties around me in GAA so I'm not just going to love their LOI team So am I a barstooler for watching football but not going driving an hour or so to see LOI.

Oh dear.

But you see how inane the arguement is that the team an hour away is too far from me, so I'll pick a side 400 miles away?

Frisbee

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Oh dear.

But you see how inane the arguement is that the team an hour away is too far from me, so I'll pick a side 400 miles away?

Which is also roughly an hours flight away...

OhNoYouDidn't

smackbunnybaby wrote: »

When I was back in Cork I would never dream of going to See City play. I stuck with my local Munster Senior League Team
When I moved to Dublin the the nearest team would have been St Pats but I couldn't bring myself to follow the over paid prima donnas.
I support St James United U12 and financially support them by buying chips in Papa Mios.

Good man, my local chipper.

Do you mind me asking if you have an English side? Because if you do, it somewhat blows any 'overpaid primadonnas' argument in terms of Pats out of the water.

Galvasean

What I said:

Galvasean wrote: »

It's attitudes like that in the article in the OP that put me off LoI. A few years ago I tried to get into LoI. Started supporting Shels, but as soon as people found out I was also an Arsenal fan I started getting chasticised for being a 'barstooler'. I gave up on Shels as it's no fun going to games where your fellow fans hate your guts just because you like an English team aswell. So I defected and started supporting Bohs. Unfortunately the very same thing happened there too so I gave up on LoI since the fans of my two closest LoI teams basically ran me out of it with their prejudice.
If more LoI fans were a bit more open minded to new fans and not so stuck up their own holes about what consitutes a 'real' fan the league would be a heck of a lot more successsful.

Couple of responses:

doncarlos wrote: »

That sounds like a load of crap to me.

Des wrote: »

I don't believe you.

You don't have to believe me if you don't want to but I think it's a case of 'head in the sand' if you think stuff like that doesn't go on. Or maybe the attitude has changed a lot in the last 5/6 years (but from reading crap like the article in the OP I doubt it)? Havent been to a LoI game since. All I know is I had some bad experiences with other fans over this whole 'barstooler' / 'fake fan' business back when I was trying to get into Irish club football. Perhaps I was just extremely unlucky, but it put me off LoI for good.

_blank_

Frisbee wrote: »

Which is also roughly an hours flight away...

From where?

Tell me one football ground on the mainland that it takes an hour travel time to get to (including getting to the airport, security checks, getting out of the airport to the ground)

peabutler

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Oh dear.

But you see how inane the arguement is that the team an hour away is too far from me, so I'll pick a side 400 miles away?

Oh dear what?


You are failing to take into acocunt the larger wealth of information and discussion availible for this side 400 miles away!

OhNoYouDidn't

Frisbee wrote: »

Which is also roughly an hours flight away...

But I assume he has to drive to the airport.

Its a painfully futile argument to suggest that a disconnect with an Irish side on the basis of geography justifies supporting a side in a different bloody country, which you have no connection to.

Just be honest. Its easier to consume English football than support a real team.

OPENROAD

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Inane bullshít.

You have no connection with your local side but do with some English place odds on you have never been? Pull the other one.

Its easier and involves less emotional attachment to watch some Brit side in the pub. Why not just admit it?

You are assuming everyone is the same though, not that gives anyone the right to judge anyone else, I support Arsenal and don't support a LOI team but it has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the football, if Arsenal were to play in the Blue Square premier, I would still support them and continue to go to matches.

If you want to attract more fans, you have to get people when they are young,so it does need better marketing.

OhNoYouDidn't

peabutler wrote: »

Oh dear what?


You are failing to take into acocunt the larger wealth of information and discussion availible for this side 400 miles away!

To be fair, if your criteria for selecting your football team is "the larger wealth of information and discussion", stick to your barstool. Irish football doesn't need you.

_blank_

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But I assume he has to drive to the airport.

To be honest, I wouldn't expect someone from, say, County Clare to support Limerick Franchise, Galway United, Salthill Devon or Mervue United, which would be their nearest clubs geographically.

Would you?

OhNoYouDidn't

OPENROAD wrote: »

You are assuming everyone is the same though, not that gives anyone the right to judge anyone else, I support Arsenal and don't support a LOI team but has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the football, if Arsenal were to play in the Blue Square premier, I would still support them and continue to go to matches.

Why Arsenal? Are you from Islington?

The point is that if they were in the BSP, you wouldn't have heard of them, let alone chosen to invest your fandom in them. You picked an easy option.

Gavin "shels"

Galvasean wrote: »

You don't have to believe me if you don't want to but I think it's a case of 'head in the sand' if you think stuff like that doesn't go on. Or maybe the attitude has changed a lot in the last 5/6 years (but from reading crap like the article in the OP I doubt it)? Havent been to a LoI game since. All I know is I had some bad experiences with other fans over this whole 'barstooler' / 'fake fan' business back when I was trying to get into Irish club football. Perhaps I was just extremely unlucky, but it put me off LoI for good.

Well I've been to Tolka many a time, along with the majority of Stadium in Ireland and never witnessed anything like that. And as I said in a previous post, there's a Shels fan who has a Liverpool and Celtic tattoo and goes to most Shels home and away matches and not a dicky bird said to him.

OhNoYouDidn't

Des wrote: »

To be honest, I wouldn't expect someone from, say, County Clare to support Limerick Franchise, Galway United, Salthill Devon or Mervue United, which would be their nearest clubs geographically.

Would you?

Maybe. Rovers fans come from Wexford, Waterford, Kildare, Westmeath, Meath, Louth etc. Midlands and Wicklow based supporters clubs, and not all of them Dubs who moved. The British/Gah system of county boundaries doesn't really matter to a lot of people.

But to answer your question, I would expect him to follow Ennis Town or whoever and his English side.

peabutler

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

To be fair, if your criteria for selecting your football team is "the larger wealth of information and discussion", stick to your barstool. Irish football doesn't need you.

I'll just tell you I went to LOI week in week out to see KIlkenny City before they went bust but they were always second behind Arsenal for me. Congrats btw when did you get the job of deciding what Irish Football needs.

_blank_

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Maybe. Rovers fans come from Wexford, Waterford, Kildare, Westmeath, Meath, Louth etc. Midlands and Wicklow based supporters clubs, and not all of them Dubs who moved. The British/Gah system of county boundaries doesn't really matter to a lot of people.

But that's like someone from, say, Surrey, supporting Man Utd.

Which they get stick for.

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But to answer your question, I would expect him to follow Ennis Town or whoever and his English side.

Cool

smackbunnybaby

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Good man, my local chipper.

Do you mind me asking if you have an English side? Because if you do, it somewhat blows any 'overpaid primadonnas' argument in terms of Pats out of the water.

Yes I do, Fisher F.C.

OPENROAD

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Why Arsenal? Are you from Islington?

The point is that if they were in the BSP, you wouldn't have heard of them, let alone chosen to invest your fandom in them. You picked an easy option.

Nope not from London, I have already gone into the reason why I support Arsenal and don't really want to again, suffice to say I was always going to end up supporting a London team, and it happened to end up being Arsenal.

Now even pre Premier league days, English football was hugely popular here, LOI have poorly marketed the league over the years imo and only when they address this, will they have a chance to attract new supporters and they need to go after the young, because they have missed out on myself and people of my age.

Jazzy

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

You picked an easy option.

AND THERE IT IS

ya see? you just want to feel better about yourself. i highly doubt that your love of.... hmmm, is it pats you support? think it is.... is due to you actually liking your football club. your love for the LoI and your team is born out of your want to be better then others and lord it over them. If it wasnt the LoI im 100% positive there would be something else you would pick up just to lord over other peons.

on the boards.ie soccer section you can reap the benefits of your sacrifice and, what you have clearly claimed with the above quote as 'hard work'. on this faceless website you can really stick it into those you 'know' yourself to be better then. hate begets hate, but your not interested in that or anything that requires you to really think a bit, what your interested in is taking shots at people that will be easy enough to hit... ironic no? remind me, what are your opinions of liverpool fans again? what did you say about them? oh right, yeah.... you went to the lowest common denominator to try and make yourself feel good and others bad. a recurring theme in your posting?

there is a word for this, a simple one that will sum it all up for you. you won't like it, but you will barely be able to argue against it.



pathetic

Krusader

Gavin shels wrote: »

Whos your local team and whos your local LoI team?

Crumlin Utd
St Pats

OPENROAD

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Why Arsenal? Are you from Islington?

The point is that if they were in the BSP, you wouldn't have heard of them, let alone chosen to invest your fandom in them. You picked an easy option.

Actually I would argue I picked the most difficult option.

3hn2givr7mx1sc

I think OPENROAD hit the nail on the head. tbh. A lot of it is how the LoI is marketed, none of my nephew's friends(aged 8/9) have evr heard of the AL, I was wearing a Rovers jersey when they were all over for his birthday and the same questions every 10 minutes 'Is that Celtic?', 'Who's that?'.

When I was up in Tallaght I saw loads of young lads with Rovers gear on, but it's because the marketing that Rovers have been getting in the past year.

That and the fact that the league is mostly Dublin clubs and the midlands are fairly short when it comes to soccer teams.

Ush1

baz2009 wrote: »

I think OPENROAD hit the nail on the head. tbh. A lot of it is how the LoI is marketed, none of my nephew's friends(aged 8/9) have evr heard of the AL, I was wearing a Rovers jersey when they were all over for his birthday and the same questions every 10 minutes 'Is that Celtic?', 'Who's that?'.

When I was up in Tallaght I saw loads of young lads with Rovers gear on, but it's because the marketing that Rovers have been getting in the past year.

That and the fact that the league is mostly Dublin clubs and the midlands are fairly short when it comes to soccer teams.

Well Tallaght people are just generally brilliant and know football.

Krusader

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Inane bullshít.

You have no connection with your local side but do with some English place odds on you have never been? Pull the other one.

Its easier and involves less emotional attachment to watch some Brit side in the pub. Why not just admit it?

I've been to Villa Park many times also Parkhead 'cause my friend is a Celtic fan