Gardai seizing unrestricted bikes

TheDriver

Apparently a bike cop in Cork is doing road blocks and checking for paperwork etc for restrictions and licence compliance. The Bike Shops are currently doing lots of restrictor kits and from what I heard from a reliable source, 15 bikes have been seized already, along with 5points and 1000 euro fine (I could be wrong but source is reliable). So for anyone around Cork city, be careful if your within the 2 year probation or on a permit and your bike is outside the restriction.
P.S. He takes your bike for a "spin" if you don't have the paperwork or he is not convinced about the restrictor

paddy147

A garda cannot leggally take the bike and ride it,as they are not insured to drive the car or ride the bike that they sieze.

Not alot of people know that.

Teddy Daniels

cantdecide wrote: »

...a Garda driving someone's bike to see if it was restricted?

your in cork seems that this is haappening a lot in cork

Jaak

paddy147 wrote: »

A garda cannot leggally take the bike and ride it,as they are not insured to drive the car or ride the bike that they sieze.

Not alot of people know that.

Ive already read about this on another forum and apparently the gaurds can take it for a spin to see it the power is greater that 33bhp,

Wasnt sure of it myself but they were saying that gaurds have got the right

PCPhoto

think about it logically .... can a garda take a spin in a car just 'cos they want to check something .....NO !

same goes for bikes

Jaak

PCPhoto wrote: »

think about it logically .... can a garda take a spin in a car just 'cos they want to check something .....NO !

same goes for bikes

The story I read said the gaurd took it for a spin and then took it off him altogether !

paddy147

Jaak wrote: »

Ive already read about this on another forum and apparently the gaurds can take it for a spin to see it the power is greater that 33bhp,

Wasnt sure of it myself but they were saying that gaurds have got the right

The gardai are NOT LEGALLY insured to drive or ride any car or bike that they sieze.

mig mag

I have a friend who is a gaurd and they are allowed to sieze and drive any car or bike 'under section 41 of the road traffic act' provided that the gaurd has a full driving licence for it.
App if he's not sure he CAN test drive it to check restriction. Who knew

TheDriver

put it like this, if you are riding an unrestricted bike when you shouldn't be, then they can seize it anyways so its a no win situation. Bit worrying for us though all the same down here, apparently its very bad in the last week. Some guys are even afraid to bring their big bikes to the bike shops for the restrictor to be fitted

mig mag

TheDriver wrote: »

put it like this, if you are riding an unrestricted bike when you shouldn't be, then they can seize it anyways so its a no win situation. Bit worrying for us though all the same down here, apparently its very bad in the last week. Some guys are even afraid to bring their big bikes to the bike shops for the restrictor to be fitted

Yeah that's a pain in the whole! Kinda no win situation. Most gaurds prob wouldn't check themselves anyway just the ones who are on bikes themselves and would actually know bike stuff so cant see it happening too regularly

pa990

PCPhoto wrote: »

think about it logically .... can a garda take a spin in a car just 'cos they want to check something .....NO !

same goes for bikes

paddy147 wrote: »

The gardai are NOT LEGALLY insured to drive or ride any car or bike that they sieze.

errr.. yes they can

1961 rta, sec 20 subsection 6

that piece of legislation predates the nct / doe tests, and allows for gardai to drive a vehicle for up to 5miles to determine the road-worthiness of the vehicle, etc..
read the legislation.. its all there.

Also, Gardai are covered to drive all vehicles in the course of their duties

mig mag wrote: »

I have a friend who is a gaurd and they are allowed to sieze and drive any car or bike 'under section 41 of the road traffic act' provided that the gaurd has a full driving licence for it.
App if he's not sure he CAN test drive it to check restriction. Who knew

Sec 41 refers to the power to impound for no tax or insurance.

omerin

i read on the echo a couple of weeks ago that this is happening. the whole bike restriction is bs imo. Cant see how a guard can prove that a bike is retricted by riding it, i would imagine that the restriction cert would be asked to bring to your local gaurda station and that you would get a period of time to provide it. in that time it should be possible to get it restricted.

TheDriver

Apparently its mostly down to one bike cop whose name I won't mention here but he is leading this big time. And Bike Cops are usually sound out to bikers if your keeping it handy. Suppose if you have an R1, he can tell very quickly if its restricted.........

pa990

omerin wrote: »

i read on the echo a couple of weeks ago that this is happening. the whole bike restriction is bs imo. Cant see how a guard can prove that a bike is retricted by riding it, i would imagine that the restriction cert would be asked to bring to your local gaurda station and that you would get a period of time to provide it. in that time it should be possible to get it restricted.

if the garda believes that its not restricted, he can impound it for the purpose of a mechanical examination by a garda mechanic who will issue a written report that can be used in evidence.

pa990

TheDriver wrote: »

Apparently its mostly down to one bike cop whose name I won't mention here but he is leading this big time. And Bike Cops are usually sound out to bikers if your keeping it handy. Suppose if you have an R1, he can tell very quickly if its restricted.........

no need to name names.. but how about some initials

mig mag

pa990 wrote: »

Sec 41 refers to the power to impound for no tax or insurance.

If you are insured to drive up to 125 for example and have a higher power bike than that that isn't restricted then technically you are not insured, hence sec 41
Or at least that would be my understanding?

pa990

mig mag wrote: »

If you are insured to drive up to 125 for example and have a higher power bike than that that isn't restricted then technically you are not insured, hence sec 41
Or at least that would be my understanding?

sec41 is the power to impound the bike for no insurance/tax
sec20 gives the power to inspect /test/drive

mig mag

pa990 wrote: »

sec41 is the power to impound the bike for no insurance/tax
sec20 gives the power to inspect /test/drive

Okey Dokey then. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

omerin

pa990 wrote: »

if the garda believes that its not restricted, he can impound it for the purpose of a mechanical examination by a garda mechanic who will issue a written report that can be used in evidence.

my point is that unless someone is being a muppet and riding the bike hard then they deserve all they get, a restricted bike will still reach the speed limit and beyond, so a law abiding citizen should have nothing to fear. don't know about the laws but it would be grossly unfair to impound a bike based on a hunch from a guard, particularly if there were no speed limits been broken or signs of careless driving leading up to when they pulled the bike over.

Stainless_Steel

I would freak if he wanted to test drive my bike as she's not even broken in properly. Deffo not give him the keys fup that.

cantdecide

This is not a joke, guys, it's a one-man crusade for reasons unknown. See the other thread. He is out there driving bikes. If you're paperwork isn't 100% up to scratch, you'll need to bring walking shoes out on the bike, not boots.

KamiKazi

I'd let him go fvck himself, he's on a crusade now let's see how his Sergeant feels about paying for dyno runs left right and center.

I know some will say burden of proof is on the rider but certificates aren't a legal requirement so the only proof is to stick it up on the dyno.

Oh and be sure to mention you'll be needing the price of a new rear tyre as well :cool:

TheDriver

cantdecide wrote: »

This is not a joke, guys, it's a one-man crusade for reasons unknown. See the other thread. He is out there driving bikes. If you're paperwork isn't 100% up to scratch, you'll need to bring walking shoes out on the bike, not boots.

What thread?

It is a one man crusade but I wouldn't be drawing him on me either, he can impound your bike and get it tested etc, especially if he knows you haven't it restricted by the way you are acting etc.

KamiKazi

TheDriver wrote: »

What thread?

It is a one man crusade but I wouldn't be drawing him on me either, he can impound your bike and get it tested etc, especially if he knows you haven't it restricted by the way you are acting etc.

Tested by who? What qualifications in dyno testing do they have?

When was the dyno last calibrated?

What fuel and air mixture will be used and how does compare to manafactures ratings?

Will they be testing from the wheel, the crank or the gear output shaft?

What will the atmospheric temperature and humidity be when the bike is tested?

Has the tyre manafacture cleared the tyre for dyno use and if not will it be getting replaced afterwards?


There are so many variables that it just becomes unusable as proof, dynos are for back to back testing when tuning a bike, not getting a single definitive power output rating.

Any half decent solicitor would spank the Gardai all round the courtroom on this issue.

bladespin

Teddy Daniels wrote: »

your in cork seems that this is haappening a lot in cork

Probably caused by that idiot there a couple of weeks ago.

Cuddlesworth

KamiKazi wrote: »

Tested by who? What qualifications in dyno testing do they have?

When was the dyno last calibrated?

What fuel and air mixture will be used and how does compare to manafactures ratings?

Will they be testing from the wheel, the crank or the gear output shaft?

What will the atmospheric temperature and humidity be when the bike is tested?

Has the tyre manafacture cleared the tyre for dyno use and if not will it be getting replaced afterwards?


There are so many variables that it just becomes unusable as proof, dynos are for back to back testing when tuning a bike, not getting a single definitive power output rating.

Any half decent solicitor would spank the Gardai all round the courtroom on this issue.

I'm pretty sure the burden of proof is on you to do all this. The same with speed cameras. They changed the law recently where any equipment or means of testing used by the gardai are treated as correct unless 100% proved otherwise.

Its why you can't question when the camera was calibrated etc.. And at a guess why you couldn't question any of the above.

TheDriver

if you roll up in an r1 with no restriction, one km would prove the unrestricted nature right away!
The problem is that who is going to do the court thing and also when you are questioned under oath, are you going to lie about no restriction?

KamiKazi

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the burden of proof is on you to do all this. The same with speed cameras. They changed the law recently where any equipment or means of testing used by the gardai are treated as correct unless 100% proved otherwise.

Its why you can't question when the camera was calibrated etc.. And at a guess why you couldn't question any of the above.

Yes but using your speed camera analogy the device here would be the dyno and there are just so many variables that you could have it invalidated as evidence without a whole lot of hassle.

And as far as I know the new legislation about calibration does not reach out to dynos only speed detection devices.

pa990

@kamikazi

If you are that confidant that they can't provide the relevant proof's in court, or that u can easily dismiss their proofs, then you have nothing to worry about

RosieJoe

Deja vu