Nokia N8 Megathread

Davy

Captain Morgan wrote: »

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I havent had anything yet, no reboot, hard resets etc.

Captain Morgan wrote: »

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Very sturdy and robust. I have managed to mark cover though, got scraped off steel

Captain Morgan wrote: »

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Its an improvement to the 5800 in my eyes. The response to the touchscreen is pretty bang on in my experience so far. Often 4 or 5 things going at the same time, and it doesnt seem to effect it.

ofcork

I find it similar to the 5800 which i loved tbh even if the screen was small,you see the menus and they all look similar,it is sturdy alright i have dropped mine twice still ok.i have used the brothers htc desire and i would have to say it is android is a better system and he also has free music as well.

monty_python

monty_python wrote: »

hi
i cant seem to find the "payment settings" option in the ovi store menu, i have clicked account and looked all over but still cant find it.

could some1 please point me in the right direction

can some1 point out where i should see "payment settings" in the ovi store?

Mimikyu

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Jacky08

dr ro wrote: »

Jackie o can you connect to any other websites.

I can indeed...I just got it this afternoon let the battery run down so I'm leaving it charge overnight ...I'll tackle it again in the morning...some good replies there so I'll check back

Davy

monty_python wrote: »

can some1 point out where i should see "payment settings" in the ovi store?

When you click 'Buy' it should give you the option of paying visa, mastercard, on your phone bill etc.

Captain Morgan wrote: »

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I havent got either on it yet. Im not to worried about the screen, plenty of coins in the pocket with it and it hasnt bothered it the slightest. I just want something for the drops. I the one thing that dissapointed me a little was the camera in low lit pictures.

Jacky08 wrote: »

I can indeed...I just got it this afternoon let the battery run down so I'm leaving it charge overnight ...I'll tackle it again in the morning...some good replies there so I'll check back

You are the same as Sitec, read my post number 347

Maental2000

Davy wrote: »

I havent got either on it yet. Im not to worried about the screen, plenty of coins in the pocket with it and it hasnt bothered it the slightest. I just want something for the drops. I the one thing that dissapointed me a little was the camera in low lit pictures.

I'm torn between the n8 & the Desire HD, but the camera on the n8 was swinging it for me...is the flash not all that good afterall?

dr ro

My n8 has hung a couple of times and resulted in a reset. As a long time nokia user though I've become used to it. Still, very happy with the phone. And the pics it's producing are fantastic, even to my "if it's not a digital camera it's not good enough" girlfriend.

soundsham

http://mashable.com/2010/11/19/n8-power-problems/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Mashable+%28Mashable%29&utm_content=Twitter
n8 problem...may be posted previous
thread to long to check

Ardent

I'm seriously thinking about going for this phone, primarily for the camera. However, I'm not convinced about the HD video recording quality - from the samples I've seen on youtube and elsewhere the video looks quite compressed and laggy. To be honest, they don't look much better than the N95!

Can anyone here put my mind at ease or provide a non-youtube sample of good HD video output from this phone? I don't want to shell out good money on a glorified N95.

Thanks!

Davy

Maental2000 wrote: »

I'm torn between the n8 & the Desire HD, but the camera on the n8 was swinging it for me...is the flash not all that good afterall?

Its not that bad, it was just a few pictures I was taking at party, it was low lit and i was just expecting more from it. They werent close up pictures so wouldnt have helped. I havent changed any of the settings though so tweeks will imporove it.

Ardent wrote: »

Can anyone here put my mind at ease or provide a non-youtube sample of good HD video output from this phone? I don't want to shell out good money on a glorified N95.

Tbh it one of the things I find excellent on it. Watching videos on it is a pleasure, even the audio playback with it quite impressive for a phone.

Ardent

Davy wrote: »

Tbh it one of the things I find excellent on it. Watching videos on it is a pleasure, even the audio playback with it quite impressive for a phone.

Sorry, I wasn't being clear. I was wondering what the video recording is like.

monty_python

any1 have any idea when updated firmware will be realeased for this bad boy??

jeremyr62

O2 seem to have lowered the bill pay upgrade price for the N8. I have a silver (lowest) upgrade and it was euro289 to upgrade, but today it was only euro99 (Galaxy S also reduced to euro99). I pulled the trigger on the N8. Had to change my monthly account thingy too. Hoping it arrives unlocked but for euro99 I wont complain if it is.

jimmynokia

monty_python wrote: »

any1 have any idea when updated firmware will be realeased for this bad boy??

there should be one due soon enough but one problem
if its locked ,highly unlikely from the first batch,you can update straight away as locked models take longer because the networks have to approve the update.

Davy

jeremyr62 wrote: »

Hoping it arrives unlocked but for euro99 I wont complain if it is.

o2 ones so far have been unlocked, so I say you will be happy

All they have on them is o2 tv bookmarks and shut down wallpapers

Mimikyu

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Sitec

Can anyone tell me a program to download HD Videos from Youtube to my computer and then copy them to the N8??

Being trying all day to get something but im not familiar with the formats.

long_b

Sitec wrote: »

Can anyone tell me a program to download HD Videos from Youtube to my computer and then copy them to the N8??

Being trying all day to get something but im not familiar with the formats.

Tried DoubleTwist?
As for HD, you do know that the N8 screen is 640x360?

Sitec

long_b wrote: »

Tried DoubleTwist?
As for HD, you do know that the N8 screen is 640x360?

Didnt try that il give it a go! Thanks for that.

Sorry, im a complete noobie with phones and technology in general. I'm able to record in "HD" apparently so i thought i would be able to view videos in HD too?

jimmynokia

Captain Morgan wrote: »

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rumour has it they are locked i will find out today or tomor on this one
cant see them been locked but you never know

the only thing after that is it would have start up and shut down logos,access points installed these are simple to remove,if your not a voda customer remove all the access points before installing new ones ,you will keep gettings asked to choose between both which is annoying
when you get the new settings select save as default ,im sure you prob know all that anyhow.

Davy

They were unlocked anyway, not sure if they still are. Some should still be around

jimmynokia

Davy wrote: »

They were unlocked anyway, not sure if they still are. Some should still be around

hopefully ,they are 99 euro on 02 now BILL PAY

M007

Sorry if this has been covered in this thread before but just looking for a quick pointer. I have been considering buying an Iphone for the last while - have been a long time Nokia user - anyway over the weekend the more I thought about it I realise that the Nokia N8 probably ticks all the boxes that the iphone does - so what are the pros and cons of the N8 to help me make my mind up - thanks

jeremyr62

I just received my euro99 N8 bill pay upgrade from O2.ie, online purchase. Anyway, it is simlocked (oh well can't have everything), it is silver and it is made in Finland. Came with all the bits. Looks nice enough.

teddy12

jimmynokia wrote: »

rumour has it they are locked i will find out today or tomor on this one
cant see them been locked but you never know

the only thing after that is it would have start up and shut down logos,access points installed these are simple to remove,if your not a voda customer remove all the access points before installing new ones ,you will keep gettings asked to choose between both which is annoying
when you get the new settings select save as default ,im sure you prob know all that anyhow.

Have you found out if they are unlocked?? I really want a lime green one and I done have vodafone coverage in my area!

teddy12

jeremyr62 wrote: »

I just received my euro99 N8 bill pay upgrade from O2.ie, online purchase. Anyway, it is simlocked (oh well can't have everything), it is silver and it is made in Finland. Came with all the bits. Looks nice enough.

Silly Question but
does simlocked mean locked to a certain sim or just to a network??

jimmynokia

sim locked,network locked are same thing in simple terms all the new stock from voda is locked ....

Italia

I got my N8 (silver) on Monday from Liffey Valley vodafone and it is not simlocked.... at least it doesn't seem to be. I inserted an old O2 PAYG simcard I had lying around and it didn't complain when I inserted the pin code.
Gave me an error 'failed to register sim', but that is probably due to the fact that the sim hasn't been used in over 3 years.

How can you tell if it has the standard firmware or a branded / modified version?
If I look at the phone info (settings -> phone -> phone management ->device updates), it makes references to sw version 011.012 and to custom version 011.012.00.01 - both have the same production date -2010-09-18.

Any ideas?

jimmynokia

Italia wrote: »

I got my N8 (silver) on Monday from Liffey Valley vodafone and it is not simlocked.... at least it doesn't seem to be. I inserted an old O2 PAYG simcard I had lying around and it didn't complain when I inserted the pin code.
Gave me an error 'failed to register sim', but that is probably due to the fact that the sim hasn't been used in over 3 years.

How can you tell if it has the standard firmware or a branded / modified version?
If I look at the phone info (settings -> phone -> phone management ->device updates), it makes references to sw version 011.012 and to custom version 011.012.00.01 - both have the same production date -2010-09-18.

Any ideas?

your 02 sim must be inactive thats why you got that message the software has not changed since release ,it needs an update,how you know its branded is it will have the operator start up and shutdown logos and preinstalled bookmarks and most likely an operator shortcut on homescreen,the only way for sure to see if its unlockwd is to use an active sim,also billpay models can come unlocked or as a request at a cost

Italia

Nope, no logo's, branding, shortcuts of any sort, anywhere on the phone. Even the outer box had no VF logo's. So looks like mine is a 'virgin phone'.

My phone is billpay.
I'll see if I can get the sim re-activated and test from there.

jimmynokia wrote: »

your 02 sim must be inactive thats why you got that message the software has not changed since release ,it needs an update,how you know its branded is it will have the operator start up and shutdown logos and preinstalled bookmarks and most likely an operator shortcut on homescreen,the only way for sure to see if its unlockwd is to use an active sim,also billpay models can come unlocked or as a request at a cost

Little Dog

Hi folks has anybody had issues with installing the free sky sports package that is part of the 02 package? Downloaded settings but keep getting error message please try again in a few minutes.Thanks little dog.

Sitec

The back of the phone does be freezing in cold weather!!:pac:

jimmynokia

Sitec wrote: »

The back of the phone does be freezing in cold weather!!:pac:

yeah cause of the material thats used LOL:D

KrisW

First off, anyone who has one of these, go to the Ovi Store NOW and download Swype: it really improves text entry on the phone - I'd go as far to say that it now surpasses iPhone's keyboard (no portrait-QWERTY yet, though).

Any Android users reading this, do the same: you owe it to yourself to try it out.

Slightly annoyed that O2 got their finger out now.. I left them when they were refusing to sell this phone for under €289. Still, got a better plan with e-Mobile, so can't complain too much. (My phone has no SIM carrier-lock, incidentally - it accepted both my e-Mobile SIM, and my wife's O2 SIM without complaint).

My phone has had no power problems. It has needed one or two restarts, but I did go and install the newest Ovi Maps application from Nokia's beta software site, and it does still have a couple of hangy-bugs in there.

From my reading, there are two software updates coming in the next few months: The first, in December, seems to be improving stability of the phone, with very few new features. The second, before February, will have a new browser, keyboard, and the new (v3.06) maps application.

- so what are the pros and cons of the N8 to help me make my mind up - thanks

Pros:

• You don't need to run iTunes or have a credit-card to use it properly.
• A far better phone than iPhone, if you need a voice phone- call quality is excellent, especially hands-free (where iPhone really sucks for the other party);
• Camera
• Maps and sat-nav
• You can pay for applications on by charging to your mobile bill
• battery life
• Full multitasking (you can leave applications to work away in the background on Symbian, iPhone freezes them)
• nicer form factor (taller than iPhone and narrower)
• AMOLED screen has deeper black and better contrast
• better (i.e., uncompromised) antenna
• Lots of technical features (Bluetooth 3.0, USB on-the-go; HDMI output; pentaband radio) - one of these may be a must-have for you.
• You don't tarred with the same brush as those insanely annoying people who think owning an iPhone is some kind of life-enriching event that you have to share in.

Cons:

• Web browser is not good (to be fixed in February update)
• General "User Experience" is not as slick as Apple's (to be improved in February too, but will still fall short of Apple's simplicity, simply because the Nokia phone can do more)
• Screen not as sharp as iPhone 4.
• Ovi Store nowhere near as richly-populated as Apple's iTunes store, although it's got much better in the last three weeks.
• No portrait-orientation QWERTY keyboard (again, February, but I find the T9 pretty good to use, oddly enough)
• Configuration menus can be bewildering sometimes (especially, if, like me you've never used a Series60 phone before).
• Nokia can't give you that smug feeling of owning an iPhone

Stuff that people on the internet seem to care about, but actually doesn't matter:

• Battery capacity is lower. The phone has much better power management than its rivals - I get 2 days between charges.
• CPU is clocked at 680MHz - again, not a problem, as the graphics hardware is very fast, and Symbian is a much leaner operating system than Apple's iOS, so can do more with less. Games are every bit as fluid as on iPhone.

Jesus, that's a long post. I should shut up now.

bd250110

Quick question KrisW, what is it that the N8 can do that the iPhone cant?

fergiesfolly

bd250110 wrote: »

Quick question KrisW, what is it that the N8 can do that the iPhone cant?

Steal your soul.....evil,evil thing

N1one

bd250110 wrote: »

Quick question KrisW, what is it that the N8 can do that the iPhone cant?

It has a far better camera and an FM transmitter....for a start....

KrisW

bd250110 wrote: »

Quick question KrisW, what is it that the N8 can do that the iPhone cant?

Lots of things. The iPhone has never sold on its functional appeal: what you're buying into is simplicity (or Apple's view of it). The N8 is more like the Android handsets in what it offers.

Anyway, off the top of my head, here's a list of things the N8 can do that the iPhone can't:

• Display Adobe Flash content on websites
• Show me useful info on the main screen
• Display a clock permanently on the lock screen, without draining the battery (big advantage of AMOLED displays... only the lit pixels consume power)
• Navigate and use maps without using mobile data (think of when you're most likely to need a sat nav...)
• Connect to an external USB drive and grab files off it/copy files to it (this is "USB-on-the-go" - the phone can act as both a peripheral or a controller)
• Drive a TV/projector over HDMI.
• Work on any GSM or 3G network, anywhere in the world.
• Take excellent pictures (iPhone4 camera is good, but image is way overprocessed, and its colours are much too "John Hinde" for my taste).
• Install applications directly onto the phone, without going through an Application Store (great for corporate IT depts).
• Multitask.
• Edit video clips on-phone without paying again.
• Let you copy stuff to and from it over Bluetooth (even with a Mac!)
• Transmit its audio over FM (handy if you end up in rental cars a lot, I guess..)
• Hold a signal. (sorry...)
• Charge off a standard connector -- either MicroUSB or the Nokia 2mm connector. MicroUSB is now the European standard phone charger connector, by the way.
• Run for two days between charges (my usage, yours will vary)
• Confuse you:some features are extremely non-obvious but "have always been done like that".

What can the iPhone do that the N8 can't?

• Give an impression of solidity - this is Apple's major card. Everything is geared to giving the impression of slick, smooth operation. The OS is actually quite clunky underneath, but hides its pauses and lags with smooth animations.
• Take video at 30fps (N8 framerate is 24fps)
• integrate with iTunes
• Browse the web pretty nicely, as long as you don't ever want Flash.
• Convince the person on the other end of a handsfree call that you've fallen down a well

The Nokia is a really good camera/multimedia phone with internet added on. The iPhone is a really good internet device with a phone and camera tacked on.

bd250110

Those are fair points. As a long time iPhone user (Original, 3G, 3Gs(from work) and iPhone4), I think a lot of those points are fair. I also have an HTC Desire (again from work) and I've been running an E71 on 3 as well (until it got nicked in Heathrow!) So Im not a Nokia hater, or an iPhone lover, by any means.
Apps are not a big thing for me (wouldn't make or break), but e-mails and web browsing are. Some of what you raised are of little interest to me (I don't have a TV with HD, for example)

I would argue with your points on
1) The charger (if you have an iPod, for example)
2) The FM radio (there are some great web radio apps, better quality than FM, granted they do use data).
3) on-board maps with the iPhone, everything from fairly basic maps for free to TomTom, the free Nokia/Ovi maps far outclass anything free on the iPhone though.
4) Apps made available to the general public must be loaded via iTunes store, but corporate apps can be added without going through the store, or the approval process.
5) The iPhone is capable of running on any network. The 4 needs a SIM modification.

I think the N8 has a lot going for it. I would rate Symbian above Android for app stability and it's pretty easy to use for anyone with a Nokia background, battery life kicks arse as well, I used to easily get a week from the E71. iOS is limited in personalisation and some things like turning on BT, WiFi, etc drive me nuts, far too many swipes and taps required.

I (and 90% of those I sold phones to) don't need a HDMI output or a killer e-mail client. Battery life is a deal breaker for some, but the most important thing is a reliable handset, no one wants to bring their phone back and sales people don't want to see them back. Absolute time wasting for all involved, I knew I could send someone away with a HTC, BB or Apple handset with confidence. I couldn't say the same for SE or Nokia, often launch handsets were (and still are) rushed to market lacking features and reliability.

KrisW

bd250110 wrote: »

Those are fair points. As a long time iPhone user (Original, 3G, 3Gs(from work) and iPhone4), I think a lot of those points are fair. I also have an HTC Desire (again from work) and I've been running an E71 on 3 as well (until it got nicked in Heathrow!) So Im not a Nokia hater, or an iPhone lover, by any means.
Apps are not a big thing for me (wouldn't make or break), but e-mails and web browsing are. Some of what you raised are of little interest to me (I don't have a TV with HD, for example)

Fair enough.. I'm not trying to sell you a phone. You asked me what was better on the N8, so I made a list, having tried both.

I would argue with your points on
1) The charger (if you have an iPod, for example)
2) The FM radio (there are some great web radio apps, better quality than FM, granted they do use data).
3) on-board maps with the iPhone, everything from fairly basic maps for
free to TomTom, the free Nokia/Ovi maps far outclass anything free on the iPhone though.
4) Apps made available to the general public must be loaded via iTunes store, but corporate apps can be added without going through the store, or the approval process.
5) The iPhone is capable of running on any network. The 4 needs a SIM modification.

To reply to those:
1. Having an iPod won't help you when you're visiting a client/friend/family member with your phone nearly dead, and you need a charge. MicroUSB is the mandated charger connection for all phones sold in the EU from now on. Apple are dragging their feet, where every other phone maker has adopted it.

2. Radio transmitter, not receiver (although there's a receiver too). Not a major thing for me, but it's handy in rental cars, as it would allow you to listen to your own music on the car stereo.

3. The "Free" maps on iPhone aren't free if you're abroad - they rely on network download to display: it's basically the same as opening Google Maps in your browser. If you leave your data roaming on, you could end up being charged the cost of a standalone TomTom. Nokia's are pre-loaded into the handset, and that's the big advantage, not just the quality of the maps.

4. When last I checked (granted it was a year ago), the corporate Apple deployment is only available to accounts with 200 handsets. That still rules out a lot of companies. There are also some handy functions (such as network diagnostic apps) which Apple flat out forbid.

5. The iPhone can not operate on all 3G networks. There are currently five frequency bands in use for 3G worldwide. Despite early prototypes being certified for all bands, the released iPhone can operate on four of these, with an appropriate SIM (clipping a SIM down to "micro" size makes it pretty hard to use in another phone later). N8 can work on all five. If you don't go to the USA or Japan this is not an issue, if you do it could be.

I think the N8 has a lot going for it.

I think so too.. the next firmware in February promises to make it a whole lot slicker, and lack of polish is the only real shortcoming of this phone. Actually, I'm surprised at how viciously negative the reviews of this device were -- they certainly don't match my own experience. I will just add that it didn't take too long to notice that pretty much all of the bad reviews were from US-based sources that never covered phones until the iPhone arrived.

I would rate Symbian above Android for app stability and it's pretty easy to use for anyone with a Nokia background, battery life kicks arse as well, I used to easily get a week from the E71. iOS is limited in personalisation and some things like turning on BT, WiFi, etc drive me nuts, far too many swipes and taps required.

It's swings and roundabouts.. some stuff on the N8 is way to hard to access, or, like your Bluetooth example, there is a slow way, and really quick way that is completely non-obvious (tap "Call", then long-press on "*").

I (and 90% of those I sold phones to) don't need a HDMI output or a killer e-mail client. Battery life is a deal breaker for some, but the most important thing is a reliable handset, no one wants to bring their phone back and sales people don't want to see them back. Absolute time wasting for all involved, I knew I could send someone away with a HTC, BB or Apple handset with confidence. I couldn't say the same for SE or Nokia, often launch handsets were (and still are) rushed to market lacking features and reliability.

I'd say 90% of people you've sold phones to don't care if it runs Android or Symbian. People go by the maker's name, not the OS, despite what the "tech media" would have you believe.

My N8 is one of the earliest ones in Ireland, and has been flawless. I've had duds from Apple (not phones) in the past. Both makers' return rates are around industry average, but Nokia have such a wide range of phones it's hard to compare.

It seems there were manufacturing issues with some N8s (powers down, won't power up); this has been fixed, and the phones will be replaced. This seems to have been in the very first phones, and don't think any affected units were sold here.

I'd argue about "Killer e-mail client" not being important: Blackberry managed to build an entire business with only an email client to offer. As for the HDMI, it's a bit of a gimmick now, but it'll get a lot handier when office projectors start coming with HDMI inputs, and you can play presentations directly out of the email inbox on your phone..

In the end, it really depends on your priorities. If you want something "cool", get the iPhone; if you use GMail and Google Calendar, get an Android handset; if you want a phone, get the Nokia.

Raedwald

Picked this up during the week and have been pretty happy with it so far.

Love the way it leaves the apps running in the background. Only problem I have really is that the Ovi Store is still a real weak link for Nokia and it's smart phones.

Mimikyu

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bd250110

I agree with a lot of what you say. I would probably take issue with the line ' "cool" go for iPhone'. The iPhone is a very capable device, the browsing experience is unmatched by any Symbian or Android browser. As for Flash, it just crashes my Desire, or causes loading to hang more often than not, so I've deactivated it!

All of that said, Nokia has a real chance with the N8 (and the upcoming form-factor variations). I see some users commented on the Ovi store, I think it will grow quickly. The essential apps will be added and the most popular ones from Android/iOS will probably be ported too. Nokia is still a huge competitor in the US, particularly in the corporate world, so the chances of Ovi strengthening are good, I would think. Although in Europe it will be hard for Ovi to break the Android/iOS duoploy.

Davy

Captain Morgan wrote: »

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It is indeed

Mimikyu

This post has been deleted.

Davy

Ok well the main settings are in 'destinations'. Where you set access points and priorities, etc

Menu > settings> connectivity > settings > destinations

On the previous pages, you can set "data in home network" to 'Always ask"

Kenny Powers

for java apps go to app manager - installed app press and hold on the app go to suite settings and change the connection to whatever you want.

KrisW

bd250110 wrote: »

I agree with a lot of what you say. I would probably take issue with the line ' "cool" go for iPhone'. The iPhone is a very capable device, the browsing experience is unmatched by any Symbian or Android browser. As for Flash, it just crashes my Desire, or causes loading to hang more often than not, so I've deactivated it!

The iPhone may be capable, but the shenanigans that Apple play with developers are shocking. I know a few application developers, and there's a real love/hate relationship - Apple treat them like dirt, but they've got to put up with it. There's nothing so demoralising as spending months developing an app only to have Apple reject it for no adequately explained reason.

All of that said, Nokia has a real chance with the N8 (and the upcoming form-factor variations). I see some users commented on the Ovi store, I think it will grow quickly.

Definitely agree on this. Even in the four weeks I've had my N8, the store has grown from an odball collection of wierd applications to a much richer experience. The Ovi Store application itself is also much better on N8 than on older handsets, and there's really nothing between it and the other stores anymore on that front.

Ant it's not just the N8, it's this whole family of phones that will give them a foot back in the door - the cheaper C7 and C6-01 (note the "-01", the "C6" is an oder phone) are basically the N8 hardware, repackaged at a lower price. For developers, this is a big deal - as it gives them a consistent platform with a broad reach. I had a look at the C7 today briefly, and I think this (and the smaller C6-01) will really make Nokia a player in the "applications phone" business again. Apple sold 40 million iPhones last year; combine C7,C6-01,N8 and E7, and Nokia can easily sell twice that number this year.

Behind the scenes, Nokia have been making the right oevertures to developers too: they might look a lot like the previous Series60 phones, but under the hood a lot of the software has been improved in a ways that makes developing applications for these new handsets so much easier than before. Also, any applications you write for this OS will also work on Meego, Nokia and Intel's OS for tablets and super-smartphones. That's what devs want: a quick way to get their software onto as many handsets as possible.

The essential apps will be added and the most popular ones from Android/iOS will probably be ported too. Nokia is still a huge competitor in the US, particularly in the corporate world, so the chances of Ovi strengthening are good, I would think. Although in Europe it will be hard for Ovi to break the Android/iOS duoploy.

Surely you accidentally got "Europe" and "US" swapped over in that sentence Nokia are almost an unknown in the US market these days.

Mimikyu

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