ragworth and thistles

F.D

with growth been later that usual this year,
1) Is it to late to spray thistles, looking at them they dont seem to be to established yet or are you better waiting untill later in the year?

2)The Ragworth we hand pulled most of it last year but there is a few acres we couldnt reach on (same field as the thistles but also most effected field) i can see some new ragworth starting to grow, real lush green leaves on it.
My question is if i pull the stalks that are left from last year ( which look dead) with the roots and all will it stop it growing again or are these dead now and it is the seeds that would have fell out of these that will be growing this year.
the reason i ask with having the few days off if i pull up the old roots will i be getting rid of most of the problem before it takes hold again or will i be wasting my time?
or should i focus spraying or pulling what is green new growth?
hope i didnt make this too confusing would appreciate all advice, thanks

whelan1

was thinking the same my self am going to ring my spray man on tuesday as i can see them regrowing assume with everything being a few weeks behind we need to do them soon

snowman707

no problem with ragwort here .. sheep

best time to to spray thistles is when they are in bud and before they go info flower. usually early to mid july

pakalasa

If you sprayed the ragwort last year, no need to worry about it. it definitely wont grow again and I'm amost certain it wont seed. You can spray the new green stuff growing, around July Is best.Or you can continue to pull the new stalks, best to do before the head turns yellow. If you pull them every year the number will be feck all after a few years. This is what I've done. I make a habit uf pulling a few every time I herd the cattle. Wear gloves also. I never did until I read here that they are poisonious to handle. I didnt know that:eek:.

I spray the thistles around July with MCPA in a Knapsack. I also knock the heads of them when passing with a stick, to stop the seeds forming. When they flower and the heads spread seed, they can cover the place in a few years.

johngalway

pakalasa wrote: »

y the thistles around July with MCPA in a Knapsack. I also knock the heads of them when passing with a stick, to stop the seeds forming. When they flower and the heads spread seed, they can cover the place in a few years.

You're not wrong about them covering the place quickly. I need to deal with mine this year.

bogman_bass

johngalway wrote: »

You're not wrong about them covering the place quickly. I need to deal with mine this year.

when do you spray for ragwort? I'm afraid to do it because I heard cattle tend to try and eat them after spraying

johngalway

bogman_bass wrote: »

when do you spray for ragwort? I'm afraid to do it because I heard cattle tend to try and eat them after spraying

I don't have any ragwort, so not sure when you'd do it.

bogman_bass

sorry quoted by accident. wasnt asking you spacifically

whelan1

the most important thing to o remember when spraying ragworth is that cattle should have no access to it for 3 weeks after spraying it is toxic and fatal if eaten when dying - it is very sweet when dying . also make sure it is fully dead before letting them back in on the ground

F.D

Well i went out for a few hours ragwort pulling over the past few days and dug/pulled up the dead stalks from last year with some of the roots looking very much alive and also dug up the new growth usually not to far from the old one tedious job but hopefully it pays off,
Spraying would have been easier it probably would have checked the thistles as well but i was afraid it would take longer for the ragwort to die off and then the grass would have been getting to strong and as its rough ground it can only be grazed

pakalasa

F.D.,

I should have mentioned also, the best time to pull the Ragwort is when the ground is very wet. Much easier than say now, when the ground is very dry. Easier on the back too.
Take them out of the field too. That way cattle wont eat them and they wont seed (if yellow).

whelan1

just spoke with my local spray man he said to spot treat with graz on 90 on the ragworth

charliecon

whelan1 wrote: »

just spoke with my local spray man he said to spot treat with graz on 90 on the ragworth

Am sorry to contradict you whelan but grazon 90 is very very slow to kill ragworth if at all (think it actually says it on the bottle that it is not recommended for them) but it is brilliant for thistles ,docks ,nettles and briars . I used Mortox 50 a week ago on ragworth so hoping to see results soon .

whelan1

charliecon wrote: »

Am sorry to contradict you whelan but grazon 90 is very very slow to kill ragworth if at all (think it actually says it on the bottle that it is not recommended for them) but it is brilliant for thistles ,docks ,nettles and briars . I used Mortox 50 a week ago on ragworth so hoping to see results soon .

i normally use d50 for ragworth but i am just spot treating these ones going to do them on friday with the graz on have used it for the last 5 years or so and found it great - different folks different strokes:D

LostCovey

whelan1 wrote: »

i normally use d50 for ragworth but i am just spot treating these ones going to do them on friday with the graz on have used it for the last 5 years or so and found it great - different folks different strokes:D

I gave up on spraying ragwort, I just pull it. Mind you I don't have huge numbers as I have been pulling it for years. The beauty of a suitable spray is that it would nail the first year plant which hasn't the yellow flower and is so hard to spot.

LostCovey

whelan1

i pull it too but a motorway and a gas pipeline went through our farm so theres plenty of it so i try and spray some too

Casinoking

2,4D is the chemical you want for ragwort, be it D50, Dioweed 50, Depitox or whatever the brand name. It's a biennial plant so you have to spray 2 years in a row to get good results. You also have to hit it while the plant is young, well before it gets to flowering stage. Thistles, on the other hand, should be sprayed when they're growing strong later in the season so it's very hard to do a good job on both with one treatment. MCPA does a good job, Thistlex is great stuff but more expensive from memory

johnstown

I have no cattle, but still I pull any ragworth if I see it, just to keep the place clean and as a matter of respect to neighbouring farmers (not to be mention that it is a banned noxious weed).

However, at the bottom of one of the fields a margin beside the river was quiet infested. Took me an entire day to clear it all by hand. As far as I am concerned, the problem stems from the farmer across the river who has quite an infestation and doesn't seem to be bothered by these weeds. It amazes me, as he is a dairy farmer and you'd think he would know better.

Do the Department not penalise anyone found with these growing?

Are the councils not obliged to also clear the roads of these weeds? Sends out a bad message.

pakalasa

There was a photo recently on the Farmers Journal showing Kildare Co. Council out pulling Ragworth. I wish other Co. Councils would follow their example.

johngalway

pakalasa wrote: »

There was a photo recently on the Farmers Journal showing Kildare Co. Council out pulling Ragworth. I wish other Co. Councils would follow their example.

The only place there's ragworth around here is by the side of the road where the council have done work :rolleyes:

Pull it? They pretend not to see it, it's less work!

F.D

back to this old chestnut, i see the little buggers putting there heads up again, after all the work pulling the stuff last year i'm getting fed up with it so as soon as the rain stops it will be out with the sprayer, just thinking i am in reps will this cause problems? i know you can spray noxious weeds but i'm not sure if that means spot spray or blanket?
anyone else be able to help me on this? thanks in advance

whelan1

i sprayed with d50 about a month ago and the feckers didnt die , resprayed last week:mad:

marknjb

whelan1 wrote: »

the most important thing to o remember when spraying ragworth is that cattle should have no access to it for 3 weeks after spraying it is toxic and fatal if eaten when dying - it is very sweet when dying . also make sure it is fully dead before letting them back in on the ground

just checking u reckon once the stalk has died and turned brown its ok to let the cattle back in even if the stalks are still standing there

whelan1

2 weeks is the reccommended time to have the cattle off BUT i lost cattle with ragworth posioning , that i had bought in , as ragworth are very palatable when dying i would leave them off for 3 weeks and make sure they are dead.Better safe than sorry

F.D

Our cattle will be off for 3 weeks still at least so i should be ok, we have no stalks its just at ground level where its starting to grow so hopefully the grass will have outgrown it also
is the d 50 expensive ? does it stunt the grass much

whelan1

i am probably paranoid on this issue , so i get our co-op guy to look at it before i let the cows in on it:)

djmc

Has anyone used a weed licker to kill ragworth spot spraying seems slow if it gets out of control

what happen

whelan1 wrote: »

2 weeks is the reccommended time to have the cattle off BUT i lost cattle with ragworth posioning , that i had bought in , as ragworth are very palatable when dying i would leave them off for 3 weeks and make sure they are dead.Better safe than sorry

you bought them 10 pedigree holstein cows from a cousin did he pay up as he would be to blame given the time it took for the ragworth poison to work.

whelan1

what happen wrote: »

you bought them 10 pedigree holstein cows from a cousin did he pay up as he would be to blame given the time it took for the ragworth poison to work.

awaiting judgement from the courts:rolleyes: it is 18 months since i bought them , am totally fed up at this stage , i am well out of pocket as i had culled off cows on the basis of these heifers coming in and couldnt afford to replace them . So my milk sales , income etc where well down last year:mad: I also took out a loan to buy them , which i am still paying on top of the vets bills , time and effort i put in to them. Do i sound bitter ? thats cause i am:cool:

bogman_bass

was in The Co-op today and was told to mix MCPA and D-50 together that they arent recomending MCPA on its own any more

what happen

whelan1 wrote: »

awaiting judgement from the courts:rolleyes: it is 18 months since i bought them , am totally fed up at this stage , i am well out of pocket as i had culled off cows on the basis of these heifers coming in and couldnt afford to replace them . So my milk sales , income etc where well down last year:mad: I also took out a loan to buy them , which i am still paying on top of the vets bills , time and effort i put in to them. Do i sound bitter ? thats cause i am:cool:

i would not blame you and trying to build a good herd and buying them in good faith and then that to happen.you learned a hard lesson buy or sell anything from family.hope you get your money back plus costs and you having a young family to rear hope you get a good outcome good luck.

whelan1

thanks.... hopefully it will all work out well in the end... this guy has no shortage of money and could well have sorted this along tome ago:mad:

Craggy Island

F.D wrote: »

Our cattle will be off for 3 weeks still at least so i should be ok, we have no stalks its just at ground level where its starting to grow so hopefully the grass will have outgrown it also
is the d 50 expensive ? does it stunt the grass much

F.D I was quoted €44.50 for 10 Litres of 2 4D/ D50 yesterday in our co-op
Magenta direct have it fir €51 for ten Litres. Hold on.... My co-op is cheaper than somewhere else in Ireland..:eek: This can't be right... No - it is:). I was told it had come down recently.

I think 2 litres/acre is the rate. Pulled some ragwort last year. Kinda backbreaking work so going to get at it in time this year. My ragwort is mostly just flush with the ground at the moment. Got to spray it in time before the second grazing with the cows .
Craggy

F.D

still have this problem its hard to know if i will ever get the better of it but just noticed out herding the cattle they seem to be eating the ragworth leaves its in the middle of good crops of grass, has anyone ever seen them do this? its not as if there hungry i wonder are they taking it up in mouthfulls with the grass i'm getting concerned about it now because i seen it in a few different patches, maybe there spitting it out? these are plants that have not got the flower on it yet by the way so its even hard for me to see it until theve grazed around it

ootbitb

had a severe ragwort problem years ago. sprayed them during a mild dry spell in February with stuff called Mortox50. ...total success.

whelan1

F.D wrote: »

still have this problem its hard to know if i will ever get the better of it but just noticed out herding the cattle they seem to be eating the ragworth leaves its in the middle of good crops of grass, has anyone ever seen them do this? its not as if there hungry i wonder are they taking it up in mouthfulls with the grass i'm getting concerned about it now because i seen it in a few different patches, maybe there spitting it out? these are plants that have not got the flower on it yet by the way so its even hard for me to see it until theve grazed around it

pull it... i spend a day a week at this time of year pulling ragworth... i hope to have a ragworth free zone soon, just make sure the roots come up also and wear gloves

Pharaoh1

Luckily I have no problem with ragwort or thistles.

I generally top each grazing paddock after grazing and top it fairly tight after tight grazing.
Most of the paddocks would be topped 6/7 times each year. I'm probably overdoing it but its not a big area and my drystock will not really clean it out to my liking.
The only ragwort/thistles I have to pull/cut are under the electric fence where the topper doesn't go such as close to posts.
Fertiliser/slurry applied as per soil tests and I'm wondering if this helps.

I am beginning to see more broadleaved weeds so I'll need to start a spray regime for these next year.
Is the continuous topping/tight grazing/soil fertility the reason I have no problems or am I just lucky?

Pharaoh1

Luckily I have no problem with ragwort or thistles.

I generally top each grazing paddock after grazing and top it fairly tight after tight grazing.
Most of the paddocks would be topped 6/7 times each year. I'm probably overdoing it but its not a big area and my drystock will not really clean it out to my liking.
The only ragwort/thistles I have to pull/cut are under the electric fence where the topper doesn't go such as close to posts.
Fertiliser/slurry applied as per soil tests and I'm wondering if this helps.

I am beginning to see more broadleaved weeds so I'll need to start a spray regime for these next year.
Is the continuous topping/tight grazing/soil fertility the reason I have no problems or am I just lucky.

whelan1

the only ones i have are under the fences also and anywhere that hasnt been topped

Graces7

Thanks for this thread. I cam on to ask re this as we are surrounded by grazing fields and are concerned re what is being sprayed and may be drfiting onto our garden. Which we were planning to ne organic .

He has topped the fields and now is going to spray the hedges for brambles and the weeds also in the fields.

Almost no ragwort; I pulled what there was last week. Thistles and nettles and docks in abundance.

We are new to cattle country and also have someone in the family with serious allergies to chemicals of all kinds.

We have asked him not to spray the hedgesd to our garden and that we will find someone to clean them and clear them instead.

He means blanket spraying.

ootbitb

there is a no slurry rule close to dwellings surely there must be a similar rule regarding toxic sprays?

F.D

whelan1 wrote: »

pull it... i spend a day a week at this time of year pulling ragworth... i hope to have a ragworth free zone soon, just make sure the roots come up also and wear gloves

We have been pulling it, it still keeps coming, this is regrowth that would have been missed or at the floral stage and missed until the next rotation
I thought it was supposed to be sour and the cattle did not eat it, i wouldn't even mind if we were grazing them tight but we're not.
its a strange one, will have to go checking the paddocks ahead of them now, was easier letting them graze then pull it as i was going around topping the grass off afterwards,

whelan1

i find where i pulled them last year they didnt come back, when i am bringing in the cows i would also pull a few, i throw them in a skip i have in the yard

JohnBoy

Does ragwort have a first cousin?

I was pulling it over the last few nights. ditches and paddock fences had a fair bit, filled a 7x4 car trailer in 15 acres.


I also found some stuff in the wet end of the field, looked like ragwort, but different.

the stem was fully purple, there were fewer leaves, the leaves werent as furled as ragwort, looked more like an oak tree leaf and the flowers had fewer petals.

Anyone know what this might be? I took a pic but havent gotten it off my phone yet.


Also what's the story with "encouraging" a neighbour to sort out a problem? there's a field of horses next door that's getting more and more covered in them and I'm afraid any pulling we do is only going to be a losing battle with that field uphill and down wind of us

whelan1

i know of some one who reported his neighbour to the guards under the noxious weeds act for having ragworth

pakalasa

I had more or less got rid of it too by pulling it, but this year there is some just inside a boundry ditch. On the other side is land that is rented out. The farmer that has it keeps his own place weed free, but doesnt give a damn about the ground he's renting. It's a sea of thistles and ragwort.:mad:

Graces7

ootbitb wrote: »

there is a no slurry rule close to dwellings surely there must be a similar rule regarding toxic sprays?

That is interesting. Anyone have a reference please; and of course it makes sense. Come to think of it they did not put slurry on the field that is by us.

Please? What do you do re fields where there are dwellings?

20silkcut

I was pulling ragworth earlier this week first time we had to do this in years. Didn't use any gloves either. Not feeling any effects yet.

CardBordWindow

20silkcut wrote: »

I was pulling ragworth earlier this week first time we had to do this in years. Didn't use any gloves either. Not feeling any effects yet.

I've often pulled it by hand without a glove, and the only ill effect is the horrible smell left on your hands!

whelan1

20silkcut wrote: »

I was pulling ragworth earlier this week first time we had to do this in years. Didn't use any gloves either. Not feeling any effects yet.

slow effects over the years i think

Tora Bora

pakalasa wrote: »

I had more or less got rid of it too by pulling it, but this year there is some just inside a boundry ditch. On the other side is land that is rented out. The farmer that has it keeps his own place weed free, but doesnt give a damn about the ground he's renting. It's a sea of thistles and ragwort.:mad:

I sympathise with you. Grand bit of land rented out next door to me. It's a sea of ragwort.
I have been pulling the stuff on my side for four years now. Not bad at this stage, but simply no hope of getting rid, if the land next door is let run riot with the stuff:(