You are not a f*cking DJ. You’re an overpaid, untalented, cake-throwing c*nt.

Is mise le key

The final straw & certainty for the IMF deal has now been drawn,

http://www.politicalworld.org/showthread.php?t=6085

Sold.

Fu.ck you deputy Quinn, actually fu.ck you Labour, whatever glimmer there was that some kind of Left view would be in government is well & truly gone, they really do not deserve to call themselves the labour Party.

jtsuited

Political debate time on the off-topic thread begins....

And once again I have to go to work!

ianuss

Is mise le key wrote: »

The final straw & certainty for the IMF deal has now been drawn,

http://www.politicalworld.org/showthread.php?t=6085

Sold.

Fu.ck you deputy Quinn, actually fu.ck you Labour, whatever glimmer there was that some kind of Left view would be in government is well & truly gone, they really do not deserve to call themselves the labour Party.

Not that I agree with the bailout, but what are the alternatives?

Is mise le key

jtsuited wrote: »

Political debate time on the off-topic thread begins....

And once again I have to go to work!

Thank god as i also have to do some work & if you got involved jeff it would take up most of my day.

ianuss wrote: »

Not that I agree with the bailout, but what are the alternatives?

Have a read through this,

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056118177

Android 666

Is mise le key wrote: »

Thank god as i also have to do some work & if you got involved jeff it would take up most of my day.



Have a read through this,

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056118177

That pdf link isn't working on that thread is mise

stomprockin

The bottom line on the economy is where all F&*-ed :)

Is mise le key

Android 666 wrote: »

That pdf link isn't working on that thread is mise

Just opened it there

Maybe the version of acrobat you have, nothing you havnt heard before, just me rabble rousing drummming up support for the march today, although i do feel somewhat anngrier now as that Rurai Quinn cu.nt has said they will vote yes to the IMF deal:mad:

Zascar

Should we split off and have a Politics thread as well lol? At this rate we'll have out own little mini forum within the EM&DJ forum!

Stomprockin is kinda right though - I've really been trying to ignore the badness but its definitely getting to be of late. Actually properly considering looking overseas at this stage.

BaZmO*

Is mise le key wrote: »

Just opened it there

Maybe the version of acrobat you have, nothing you havnt heard before, just me rabble rousing drummming up support for the march today, although i do feel somewhat anngrier now as that Rurai Quinn cu.nt has said they will vote yes to the IMF deal:mad:

Do you really believe that any of the opposition, regardless of what their party is "supposed" to stand for, have an alternative to getting us out of the mess?

Is mise le key

BaZmO* wrote: »

Do you really believe that any of the opposition, regardless of what their party is "supposed" to stand for, have an alternative to getting us out of the mess?

Yes simply, default on the private banks debts.

And i would be pushing for anyone on the dole with skills to be put to work for the money, that way getting service for the money & getting rid of the scammers in one go.

BaZmO*

Is mise le key wrote: »

Yes simply, default on the private banks debts.

I know what you want them to do, but do you think they actually have the balls to do it?

Is mise le key wrote: »

And i would be pushing for anyone on the dole with skills to be put to work for the money, that way getting service for the money & getting rid of the scammers in one go.

And how exactly do you mobilise these workers without putting existing jobs at risk?

ianuss

Is mise le key wrote: »

Have a read through this,

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056118177

Sorry man, but there is absolutely nothing of any interest in that thread.

You say; default on the debt. Fine. Where do we get the money to actually run the country? The markets? But now bond yields are way higher because we've added to the already enormous uncertainty

We have no money! We are broke!

If we default on the debtors, it still doesn't solve the problem of where we get the cash to run the country. Whether it's the IMF/EU/Bond markets, it doesn't really make a difference. We still need to borrow.

Is mise le key

BaZmO* wrote: »

I know what you want them to do, but do you think they actually have the balls to do it?

Then the only option left is a bankrun,

http://www.bankrun2010.com/

BaZmO* wrote: »

And how exactly do you mobilise these workers without putting existing jobs at risk?

You have them doing any work that would normally be paid overtime, harsh?
Saves money & gets worth for handing out welfare all the while the existing workers maintain there full working week.

We have just been sold out,

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1215/imf.html

ianuss

BaZmO* wrote: »

And how exactly do you mobilise these workers without putting existing jobs at risk?

Great point. This whole Work Placement Programme is a farce. A lot of the jobs advertised on it are for 40hrs a week - skilled labour too. That system is being massively abused by employers.

Is mise le key

ianuss wrote: »

Sorry man, but there is absolutely nothing of any interest in that thread.

You say; default on the debt. Fine. Where do we get the money to actually run the country? The markets? But now bond yields are way higher because we've added to the already enormous uncertainty

We have no money! We are broke!

If we default on the debtors, it still doesn't solve the problem of where we get the cash to run the country. Whether it's the IMF/EU/Bond markets, it doesn't really make a difference. We still need to borrow.

Bankrun.......we have the money as ours to withdraw.

Tell me this, if this is a rescue deal to save the euro & europe from the ECB then why isnt it being lent at 0%???

BaZmO*

Is mise le key wrote: »

You have them doing any work that would normally be paid overtime, harsh?

Ah c'mon, you want to have a skilled worker paid less than the minimum wage to take up the slack of people who can't get their work done during normal working hours?

I actually don't get paid overtime. If a job needs doing, you just do it. If you don't do it, there are plenty of people that will do it.

ianuss

If we're going to default on the debt.... We would realistically need to leave the Euro and revert to Punt. Then try and raise finance at inflated levels, devalue our currency massively and aggressively seek to get growth going in the economy.

84% of the worlds population is from emerging markets. These are the areas which are experiencing growth and these are the people with spending power. We should be positioning ourselves to profit from their growth. There absoltuley has to be a plan to re-energize the economy.

Android 666

Is mise le key wrote: »

Bankrun.......we have the money as ours to withdraw.

A bank run is beyond retarded. The result would be the complete collapse of our economy.

Pandoras Twist

The banks and the bailouts are two different issues. We dont have money to run the country, so the bailout is necessary. There is no other option to actually get the cash that we need.

The cash we need is increased by the bank guarantee, but it's not as simple as letting the banks go to the wall and we will suddenly be solvent again.

Morally I think there should be some sort of polluter pays principle being applied, or at least the burden should be shared but economically speaking I don't think that's possible.

I completely agree with getting people on the dole to work. There was a scheme suggested earlier on in the year but I haven't heard much about it since. It makes perfect sense as it reduces the mental side-effects of unemployment, it can add skills to a persons CV for after the recession goes back into hiding until the next time and the county council/local government areas that are short staffed can be assisted. Community outreach programmes, painting community centres or using whatever skills you can add etc.

The dole is supposed to be a jobseekers allowance. Even if you decided to physically walk to around every single shop and office in the city centre and personally hand in a CV it wouldn't take you much longer than a few days. So they are essentially paying people to do nothing.

And it's a great way to a) reduce the amount of scammers and b) bring the scammers back to a working mentality.

ianuss

Is mise le key wrote: »

Bankrun.......we have the money as ours to withdraw.

Tell me this, if this is a rescue deal to save the euro & europe from the ECB then why isnt it being lent at 0%???

I don't know how to do multiple quotes.

But in relation to your first point. What do we when that money runs out? We are, and will be running a deficit for at least the next 5/6 years.

As for the second point. The same reason that there won't be collective EU bonds issued. The role of the EU is not to compensate countries for running reckless policies. If you make a mess of your economy, you'll be offered assistance, but you're going to have to pay for it. It's a global financial marketplace - not a creche.

Android 666

Pandoras Twist wrote: »

The banks and the bailouts are two different issues. We dont have money to run the country, so the bailout is necessary. There is no other option to actually get the cash that we need.

The cash we need is increased by the bank guarantee, but it's not as simple as letting the banks go to the wall and we will suddenly be solvent again.

Morally I think there should be some sort of polluter pays principle being applied, or at least the burden should be shared but economically speaking I don't think that's possible.

I completely agree with getting people on the dole to work. There was a scheme suggested earlier on in the year but I haven't heard much about it since. It makes perfect sense as it reduces the mental side-effects of unemployment, it can add skills to a persons CV for after the recession goes back into hiding until the next time and the county council/local government areas that are short staffed can be assisted. Community outreach programmes, painting community centres or using whatever skills you can add etc.

The dole is supposed to be a jobseekers allowance. Even if you decided to physically walk to around every single shop and office in the city centre and personally hand in a CV it wouldn't take you much longer than a few days. So they are essentially paying people to do nothing.

And it's a great way to a) reduce the amount of scammers and b) bring the scammers back to a working mentality.

They only thing they've done is set up this Internship programme which as far as I can tell is to let people work in offices for free and claim the dole - maybe I'm wrong? The consequences of this will be free labour for companies and a further block on graduates being able to get proper paid employment forcing them to emigrate. Sounds completely nonsensical to me...

BaZmO*

Pandoras Twist wrote: »

I completely agree with getting people on the dole to work.

Do you not think that people on the dole actually want to work.

I detest all this "work for your dole" ranting. Where was it during the good times. People scamming the dole during the good times was the problem. Unless you had serious physical problems during the Tiger days you shouldn't have been claiming the dole. The vast majority of people actually want to work.

It's up to government, not to create jobs, but to create an environment where jobs can be easily created. Look at the Civil Service for an example of what happens when governments try to create jobs.

Is mise le key

BaZmO* wrote: »

Ah c'mon, you want to have a skilled worker paid less than the minimum wage to take up the slack of people who can't get their work done during normal working hours?

I actually don't get paid overtime. If a job needs doing, you just do it. If you don't do it, there are plenty of people that will do it.

If your on your ass doing f all getting handputs then you should earn it at that rate & it would,

1. Get value for the money
2. Reduce the states pay bill
3. get rid of all scammers
4. incentivize the very skilled people you refer to to seek employment with a wage they want.

ianuss wrote: »

If we're going to default on the debt.... We would realistically need to leave the Euro and revert to Punt. Then try and raise finance at inflated levels, devalue our currency massively and aggressively seek to get growth going in the economy.

84% of the worlds population is from emerging markets. These are the areas which are experiencing growth and these are the people with spending power. We should be positioning ourselves to profit from their growth. There absoltuley hads to be a plan to re-energize the economy.

You sound just like a minister for finance, perfect brainwashed capitalist speak.

Android 666 wrote: »

A bank run is beyond retarded. The result would be the complete collapse of our economy.

Did you get the point of it?

You withdraw your money & force the IMF/ECB Bondholders etc etc etc etc to agree to realistic fairer terms seeing as the fractional lending is false economy debt & the 'loans' are based on the same system.

We have to shift the balance of power in favor of the people, not the IMF and the rest.

Pandoras Twist

I know they want to work. Half my friends are on the dole and it does their head in. The boredom most of all. There's only so much Jeremy Kyle someone can watch before their brain starts to rot. I'm not saying send them out into the fields for a 50 hour week. But a few hours every day or every few days to keep the mind occupied, add ons for the CV and generally to detach the impression of dole spongers.

The internship programme sounds ridiculous. Its so frustrating when they go about it so wrong

The question of creating a jobs environment is a difficult one. We really have to decide where we want to stand on the scale. If we want to maintain our high standards of living then we have to move away from low skilled minimum wage manufacturing industries. We can't even begin to attempt to compete on price. We should be looking at (and I have this phrase) the knowledge economy. But that requires the government to get off the fence and take a risk on certain areas. I was at the Irish Taxation Institutes budget briefing last week and the head of microsoft Ireland was speaking and he said that there should be investment in cutting edge areas such as cloud computing because we have the IT skills and we could become a hub for its growth.

There's **** all innovation in the current budget/government/country. I add country because I don't think the opposition have a notion either.

ianuss

Is mise le key wrote: »

You sound just like a minister for finance, perfect brainwashed capitalist speak.

I'm actually trying to add to the debate here. I mean, what's your solution? You haven't come up with anything remotely intelligent.

'Eh, default on the debt...... take our money out of the bank..... run the country on fresh air.....get people to for work peanuts'......

Why don't we all just sit around and make fukking daisy chains whilst we're at it?

This is just pie-in-the-sky amateur leftist hippy gibberish.

Is mise le key

ianuss wrote: »

I don't know how to do multiple quotes.

But in relation to your first point. What do we when that money runs out? We are, and will be running a deficit for at least the next 5/6 years.

As for the second point. The same reason that there won't be collective EU bonds issued. The role of the EU is not to compensate countries for running reckless policies. If you make a mess of your economy, you'll be offered assistance, but you're going to have to pay for it. It's a global financial marketplace - not a creche.

Offered assisstance!!!!! You are deluding yourself,

1. A huge chunk is going to the 'bondholders', in other words back into euro banks at OUR expense, why is it lost on everyone that THIS IS NOT THE PEOPLES DEBT.
2. The rest of the funds would be half of what we are getting at the moment if we justifyably strike out the first point & if it was real assisstance it wouldnt be at such a high interest rate & add into all that again that its all based on fractional lending, the majority of the debt can be written off.

BaZmO* wrote: »

Do you not think that people on the dole actually want to work.

I detest all this "work for your dole" ranting. .

Jesus man, its not 'work for your dole', it 'WORK FOR YOUR MONEY'
Every one should have to earn there money if they are capable.

ianuss

Is mise le key wrote: »

We have to shift the balance of power in favor of the people, not the IMF and the rest.

Couple of points.

1). People are idiots.
2). See point 1


I do however agree with you that there should be a renegotiation of bond-holder debt. Maybe 50c to the €1 or something realistic. They have to take some of the burden themselves.

Is mise le key

ianuss wrote: »

I'm actually trying to add to the debate here. I mean, what's your solution? You haven't come up with anything remotely intelligent.

'Eh, default on the deb...... take our money out of the bank..... run the country on fresh air.....get people to for work peanuts'......

Why don't we all just sit around and make fukking daisy chains whilst we're at it?

This is just pie-in-the-sky amateur leftist hippy gibberish.

Oh yes your solution has already been agreed,

Borrow €85,000,000,000 at 5.8% half of which will go to pay the 'bondholders' on MY BACK.

THIS IS NOT OUR DEBT

Is mise le key

ianuss wrote: »

Couple of points.

1). People are idiots.
2). See point 1


I do however agree with you that there should be a renegotiation of bond-holder debt. Maybe 50c to the €1 or something realistic. They have to take some of the burden themselves.

50c to the euro,

The reserves used to create the debt are at its biggest 10c to the euro, i read over a year back now thhat the lending was as high as a ratio of 40:1

So that would make it that the bondholders reserves were actually more like 2.5c to every euro being created in debt.

This is madness, i really cannot fathom how you can accept we for one second should pay the debts of the Irish banks. Its a con.

ianuss

Is mise le key wrote: »

Oh yes your solution has already been agreed,

Borrow €85,000,000,000 at 5.8% half of which will go to pay the 'bondholders' on MY BACK.

THIS IS NOT OUR DEBT

That ain't my solution; and nowhere in this thread, or any other did I say it was.

But seriously, what's your solution?