Cat License

syklops

planetX wrote: »

Why would anyone want to walk a cat on a lead? When you walk a dog, you are simulating the patrolling of pack territory - scenting along the way etc It's in the dogs genetic make-up to want to do this.
There is no reason a cat would want to be taken for a walk, and it would be traumatic for most of them, they are not social pack animals!!! Cats need to be climbing up trees, hiding and pouncing on things, not walking in a straight line. Insane.

This post is a load of rubbish. There is no link between walking a Dog on a lead and 'simulating the patrolling of pack territory. You walk a dog on a lead because it needs exercise and you cant let it run wild.

A cat would want to be taken on a lead for the same reason. Exercise and getting out and about. And what would be traumatic about it???

Bravo; and so he should have been. Good for the judge...

This is a case of my friends mothers daughter told me... so we dont have all the answers. Is there no chance the defendant who killed the cat had a valid reason? If a dog is worrying farm animals the farmer shoots the dog. If a cat is making a nuisance of its self, I dont see why the Farmer would do any different.

Orla K

syklops wrote: »

This is a case of my friends mothers daughter told me... so we dont have all the answers. Is there no chance the defendant who killed the cat had a valid reason? If a dog is worrying farm animals the farmer shoots the dog. If a cat is making a nuisance of its self, I dont see why the Farmer would do any different.

Your friends sister or did you mean you friends daughters mother (or their other half/ex) It doesn't really matter but it is confusing me.

I really can't see what a valid reason for killing a cat be. In the case of dogs they would be killing/fatally injuring/injuring the farmers method of making money. Cats can really do that much damage to peoples livelyhoods. Cats might fancy their chances at poultry but they wouldn't do much.

The biggest thing I can think of that a cat might be able to kill is a chicken and the animals dogs worry/kill would be of greater value (money wise)

Even they way you've said it, a dog worries animals and a cat makes a nuisance of itself, they're not equal.

I don't think there are many valid reasons to killing animals, esp peoples pets.

planetX

my post isn't rubbish, and what a rude way to respond. IN MY OPINION that is why dogs ENJOY a walk. They don't think 'I'm going to get exercise'. Dogs enjoy taking the same route, the same smells, I have absolutely no doubt that it is a pack thing. It's why dogs enjoy having a human with them on the walk. There are dogs living near me who are just let out, and they wander around aimlessly looking vaguely miserable. Structure, dogs love it. Cats hate it.

docmol

Orla K wrote: »

Your friends sister or did you mean you friends daughters mother (or their other half/ex) It doesn't really matter but it is confusing me.

I really can't see what a valid reason for killing a cat be. In the case of dogs they would be killing/fatally injuring/injuring the farmers method of making money. Cats can really do that much damage to peoples livelyhoods. Cats might fancy their chances at poultry but they wouldn't do much.

The biggest thing I can think of that a cat might be able to kill is a chicken and the animals dogs worry/kill would be of greater value (money wise)

Even they way you've said it, a dog worries animals and a cat makes a nuisance of itself, they're not equal.

I don't think there are many valid reasons to killing animals, esp peoples pets.

I've killed a couple of cats in the past. My father breeds canaries and his aviary is a cat magnet. I opened the door one morning, to feed them when he was on holidays, and a cat I recognised streaked out by me. There were about twenty headless canaries scattered around the shed. I killed the cat soon after. This sort of thing happens from time to time. The aviary these days is like fort knox, but they still manage to get in. Totally securing an outside building from cats is almost impossible, we've tried electrical devices, cat reppelant chemicals, chicken wire and we've always had a dog. At the moment the cages are attached to the inside wall of the shed with a wall of chickenwire on frames completely surrounding them. It takes about ten minutes for a human to move the wire to get in at the birds! I very much doubt any court in the land would convict me of cruelty for doing this, in the same way a sheep farmer is not going to get into trouble for shooting dogs in his fields. I only wish the owners of the cat would have taken responsibilty for their pet, and kept it under control. The sooner chips and licencing for cats, the better.

Zulu

Just so we're all clear, it's in your opinion but with nothing to back it up - right?

lrushe

docmol wrote: »

I've killed a couple of cats in the past. My father breeds canaries and his aviary is a cat magnet. I opened the door one morning, to feed them when he was on holidays, and a cat I recognised streaked out by me. There were about twenty headless canaries scattered around the shed. I killed the cat soon after. This sort of thing happens from time to time. The aviary these days is like fort knox, but they still manage to get in. Totally securing an outside building from cats is almost impossible, we've tried electrical devices, cat reppelant chemicals, chicken wire and we've always had a dog. At the moment the cages are attached to the inside wall of the shed with a wall of chickenwire on frames completely surrounding them. It takes about ten minutes for a human to move the wire to get in at the birds! I very much doubt any court in the land would convict me of cruelty for doing this, in the same way a sheep farmer is not going to get into trouble for shooting dogs in his fields. I only wish the owners of the cat would have taken responsibilty for their pet, and kept it under control. The sooner chips and licencing for cats, the better.

When I was younger my Dad also had an aviary with finches, canaries and budgies. We had a resident female sparrowhawk (actually think I've a phote of it somewhere) who would pluck birds through the wire that were sitting too close to the wire, we took some measures to prevent it but largely we just had to accept that it was a possible danger of keeping small birds out in the open.
To use your logic we should have killed the sparrowhawk because it was a nuisance to us??? Killing any animal, especially someone's pet is a tit for tat lazy man's way out. We are supposed to be the superior race, surely it was in your ablity to out smart a simple cat????

docmol

lrushe wrote: »

When I was younger my Dad also had an aviary with finches, canaries and budgies. We had a resident female sparrowhawk (actually think I've a phote of it somewhere) who would pluck birds through the wire that were sitting too close to the wire, we took some measures to prevent it but largely we just had to accept that it was a possible danger of keeping small birds out in the open.
To use your logic we should have killed the sparrowhawk because it was a nuisance to us??? Killing any animal, especially someone's pet is a tit for tat lazy man's way out. We are supposed to be the superior race, surely it was in your ablity to out smart a simple cat????

I think sparrowhawks are protected. Our cages are in a shed, that has been re-roofed, a new ceiling installed and a wire cage put around the cages. I did outsmart it, it's dead. I had asked the cats owners to keep it in at night and was told that was not going to happen. If the cats owners had have looked after their "pet" it wouldn't have become our pest. When you have cleaned up the remains of a cats killing spree, a killing spree that destroyed years of my Dads breeding maybe you will be a little more understanding.

The Sweeper

planetX wrote: »

Structure, dogs love it. Cats hate it.

That's actually completely incorrect. Cats are creatures of habit. Wild cats patrol the same territory regularly, sticking to a routine in terms of where they are at what time of day. Setting up routine allows an animal to perceive changes more easily, and changes are often synonymous with danger. It follows, therefore, that most animals prefer regular routine than constant change. (How do you think Big Cat Diaries manage to find the cats they film on a regular basis in all that space? Because they can expect them to be in certain places at certain times.)

Domestic cats will settle more easily and have fewer behavioural problems if there is routine - or 'structure' - to their day. Time inside or out, feeding at the same time, in the same place, litter trays in the same place, so on, so forth.

Cat protection societies advise setting up a routine and sticking to it as one of the first tasks for settling a new cat into your household, or successfully moving house with your cat.

Zulu

lrushe wrote: »

We are supposed to be the superior race, surely it was in your ablity to out smart a simple cat????

Of course you realise if the cat's owner was responsible, it would have prevented this from happening. It appears they weren't though; it appears they couldn't care less where their cat wandered & what danger it'd wander into.

How very sad.

syklops

Orla K wrote: »

Your friends sister or did you mean you friends daughters mother (or their other half/ex) It doesn't really matter but it is confusing me.

I meant the manner in which we have heard the story about the guy who got convicted for killing the cat was similar to a "My friends sisters cousin nephew- told me...". What I meant was we have no source for the story, we dont know the full facts surrounding the situation. All we know is Man killed cat.

Originally Posted by planetX View Post
Why would anyone want to walk a cat on a lead? When you walk a dog, you are simulating the patrolling of pack territory - scenting along the way etc It's in the dogs genetic make-up to want to do this.
There is no reason a cat would want to be taken for a walk, and it would be traumatic for most of them, they are not social pack animals!!! Cats need to be climbing up trees, hiding and pouncing on things, not walking in a straight line. Insane.

syklops wrote:

This post is a load of rubbish. There is no link between walking a Dog on a lead and 'simulating the patrolling of pack territory. You walk a dog on a lead because it needs exercise and you cant let it run wild.

A cat would want to be taken on a lead for the same reason. Exercise and getting out and about. And what would be traumatic about it???

my post isn't rubbish, and what a rude way to respond. IN MY OPINION that is why dogs ENJOY a walk. They don't think 'I'm going to get exercise'. Dogs enjoy taking the same route, the same smells, I have absolutely no doubt that it is a pack thing. It's why dogs enjoy having a human with them on the walk. There are dogs living near me who are just let out, and they wander around aimlessly looking vaguely miserable. Structure, dogs love it. Cats hate it.

I am sorry if you thought I was rude, but the way in which you posted made it sound like scientific fact(theory), rather than your opinion.

First off, why, in your opinion would it be traumatic to take a cat on a lead?

As for cats hating structure, if that were the case, when you let them out for their nightly prowl, you would never see them again.

Graces7

planetX wrote: »

Why would anyone want to walk a cat on a lead? When you walk a dog, you are simulating the patrolling of pack territory - scenting along the way etc It's in the dogs genetic make-up to want to do this.
There is no reason a cat would want to be taken for a walk, and it would be traumatic for most of them, they are not social pack animals!!! Cats need to be climbing up trees, hiding and pouncing on things, not walking in a straight line. Insane.

Actually....When I first came to Ireland, I brought the last three of my Siamese with me; used to breed them.

They used to follow me whenever I went for a walk; in a neat line behind me. All three together.
That was their choice.

When I had the two lambs, they would tag on at the end of the line, and an old tame hen behind them.

If I sat a while, then they would climb trees and play; but never if I was walking.

Graces7

This is a case of my friends mothers daughter told me... so we dont have all the answers. Is there no chance the defendant who killed the cat had a valid reason? If a dog is worrying farm animals the farmer shoots the dog. If a cat is making a nuisance of its self, I dont see why the Farmer would do any different.[/QUOTE]

Clearly the judge was satisfied else.

And killing an animal like that is not defensible. had it been the charges would never have been brought.

To some here, anything a cat does is "making a nuisance of itself"

I wish often that the people here who hate cats so much would join others in trying to reduce the number of ferals in the TNR scheme.

Family in Canada tell us that the license issues come up there because of ferals.
If we could control them here with this method...

Zulu

Graces7 wrote: »

To some here, anything a cat does is "making a nuisance of itself"

No, no, no, no, no, no!

It's anything a rogue cat does is making a nuisance of itself; anything an unsupervised cat, outside it's owners property (or more accurately - trespassing on my property) is making a nuisance of itself.

Why is this so hard for people to understand?

Some attitudes here amount to little more than: I'm getting an animal, and if that animal invades YOUR private space, and causes YOU concern - tough bloody shit. I'm clearly not responsible.

Madness.

syklops

Graces7 wrote: »

I wish often that the people here who hate cats so much would join others in trying to reduce the number of ferals in the TNR scheme.

Family in Canada tell us that the license issues come up there because of ferals.
If we could control them here with this method...

Im getting fed up of this Cat vs dog argument. I dont honestly think anyone on this forum actually hates cats. Some people prefer cats as pets, some people prefer dogs.

I am a dog lover, though I had a cat when younger, but if a 'foreign' dog was interfering with my Parents livestock, I would take a shotgun to it, as I am legally entitled to do(I would then probably drink a bottle of scotch and cry my eyes out).

If a cat was interfering with them, and I know it sounds unlikely but my mother has hens and Ducks, who hatch out chicks and ducklings, and would be at risk from a cat, if a cat touches them, I have no come back.

This is what the discussion is about. The double standard. So dont get personal and dont for gods sake suggest that people who are genuinely concerned with animal welfare are mere cat-haters.

What this conversation is about is the fact that both dogs and cats are predators. Both will roam if given the opportunity. However we have laws in place to restrict where dogs can go, and how they are kept. There are no such laws or restrictions on cats.

Orla K

docmol wrote: »

I think sparrowhawks are protected. Our cages are in a shed, that has been re-roofed, a new ceiling installed and a wire cage put around the cages. I did outsmart it, it's dead. I had asked the cats owners to keep it in at night and was told that was not going to happen. If the cats owners had have looked after their "pet" it wouldn't have become our pest. When you have cleaned up the remains of a cats killing spree, a killing spree that destroyed years of my Dads breeding maybe you will be a little more understanding.

Sparrowhawks aren't protected, they are the most common bird of prey in Ireland, eagles are protected as well as peregrines and a few others.

In fairness if licences were introduced it would be completely pointless. Were I live alot of dogs roam free, the dog warden only asks the person to have a licence, and he brings the dog home(dogs home) if found wandering far away. Alot of dogs are walked off lead, and some of these are from the rb list. I only once saw a dog on a lead with a muzzle, it wasn't a pure breed, it may have been a gs cross. If cat licences were introduced all it would be is a method of making money, the cats would have no extra rights and the owners would have no obligations other than to pay for a licence

Graces7

Zulu wrote: »

No, no, no, no, no, no!

It's anything a rogue cat does is making a nuisance of itself; anything an unsupervised cat, outside it's owners property (or more accurately - trespassing on my property) is making a nuisance of itself.

Why is this so hard for people to understand?

Some attitudes here amount to little more than: I'm getting an animal, and if that animal invades YOUR private space, and causes YOU concern - tough bloody shit. I'm clearly not responsible.

Madness.

Your words prove my point beautifully.

A cat is a cat;not a stuffed toy.

To speak of a cat "trespassing" implies intent.

It is simply a cat being a cat.

And using the word "unsupervised"!!:D

Graces7

syklops wrote: »

Im getting fed up of this Cat vs dog argument. I dont honestly think anyone on this forum actually hates cats. Some people prefer cats as pets, some people prefer dogs.

I am a dog lover, though I had a cat when younger, but if a 'foreign' dog was interfering with my Parents livestock, I would take a shotgun to it, as I am legally entitled to do(I would then probably drink a bottle of scotch and cry my eyes out).

If a cat was interfering with them, and I know it sounds unlikely but my mother has hens and Ducks, who hatch out chicks and ducklings, and would be at risk from a cat, if a cat touches them, I have no come back.

This is what the discussion is about. The double standard. So dont get personal and dont for gods sake suggest that people who are genuinely concerned with animal welfare are mere cat-haters.

What this conversation is about is the fact that both dogs and cats are predators. Both will roam if given the opportunity. However we have laws in place to restrict where dogs can go, and how they are kept. There are no such laws or restrictions on cats.

So get over it? This is how it is. And with sound reasons.

And please don't blaspheme. It is not necessary or acceptable.

Nothing I said was being personal; there have been posts on threads where virulent hatred of cats has been an issue.

Where cats have been accused of deliberate unprovoked sabage attacks on people and livestock.

lrushe

docmol wrote: »

I think sparrowhawks are protected. Our cages are in a shed, that has been re-roofed, a new ceiling installed and a wire cage put around the cages. I did outsmart it, it's dead. I had asked the cats owners to keep it in at night and was told that was not going to happen. If the cats owners had have looked after their "pet" it wouldn't have become our pest. When you have cleaned up the remains of a cats killing spree, a killing spree that destroyed years of my Dads breeding maybe you will be a little more understanding.

Killing cats isn't exactly legal
What a sad comment to make outsmarting an animal by killing it
So if your dad's birds chirping and singing annoys me I have the right to kill them, if my neighbours dog barking becomes a pest to me then by your logic I am perfectly justified posioning it???? Where does it end?
I have had to clean up something similar so don't think I don't understand but to me two wrongs don't make a right

Our man in Havana

Closed! :mad:

This thread is going nowhere, so best stop it now.