How high is the quality of the LOI?

DB10 · 08-05-2010 2:28pm #1

Just wondering for LOI fans or people who know any of the players, how good are they?

Just thinking how hard is it to make it as a LOI player? I mean most good Irish players move to England, so what of those that are left? Are they just really hard workers who were dedicated in making it in in the LOI?

Surely there must be a few on here that grew up with League of Ireland players..where they that good growing up?:)

Interesting I feel to see what people think.

Helix · 08-05-2010 2:36pm

kevin doyle and keith fahey are current premiership players who played in the LOI for years

3hn2givr7mx1sc · 08-05-2010 2:41pm

I know 4 players who play at under age levels(three under-20s and one under-17s) three have had trials for League 1, Championship and SPL(Celtic and Inverness I think, not sure about Inverness) clubs and one of those three have trials for Aston Villa this summer.

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 2:46pm

Every year one or two go off to play premiership while 6 or 7 to the championship. I'd say it's par with the spl . The better teams would be mid table championship with others mid table league one or spl(bar celtic and rangers)
One their day Bohs or Rovers could challenge Celtic or Rangers

DB10 · 08-05-2010 2:48pm

Helix wrote: »

kevin doyle and keith fahey are current premiership players who played in the LOI for years

Yeah I know mate also that Murphy guy from Bohs transferred to Ipswich recently.

These are probably your top LOI players.

On the other hand guys like, John O'Flynn and Roy O'Donovan ripped up the LOI scoring charts moved over to England, are are slumming it at the bottom of the 3rd and 4th division. Maybe even non league for O'Flynn.
And O'Donovan played in the Prem and really didn't hit it off at all.

This is sort of off my point really. Just want to see how good your average LOI player is. How much better is he than Joe Bloggs on the street that works everyday but is a class act for Sunday league etc.

3hn2givr7mx1sc · 08-05-2010 2:51pm

Well, Twiggy could start up front for United, tbh.:P

Tom10 · 08-05-2010 3:06pm

It's not the highest quality ever, but the supporters that go to watch the games rave about them so clearly there is a lot to be said for seeing them in the flesh.

The problem with the quality is that few teams play constructive football and mostly are concerned with winning about all else (it can be said about 99% of teams but still). Another problem is that any decent player is quickly signed by English and Scottish teams so there's very little continuity of quality.

And finally, the teams just can't attract Irish players playing overseas to finish their playing careers in Ireland. This is the biggest shame really as most other countries with similar levels of player participation can get their best players to play the last 2 or so years of their careers in their home clubs - I can only imagine what kind of affect that has on young players in these clubs. Can you imagine if Robbie Keane finished his career playing for one of the Dublin clubs, the knowledge he could pass on to the younger players would improve the club immensely.

DenMan · 08-05-2010 3:12pm

Why don't they do that? They have made their money, so why not go home for a year and play football in Ireland. In that way they are giving back to the league that started them off and gave them their start. I think it would be brilliant if players like Robbie Keane, Damien Duff and Shay Given went back at the end of their careers and spent even a year in the LOI before they retire. Then if they wanted they could become coaches and managers in the League of Ireland.

Mr. Incognito · 08-05-2010 3:16pm

One their day Bohs or Rovers could challenge Celtic or Rangers

No they couldn't.

It's on par with League one i'd say.

Tom10 · 08-05-2010 3:20pm

DenMan wrote: »

Why don't they do that? They have made their money, so why not go home for a year and play football in Ireland. In that way they are giving back to the league that started them off and gave them their start. I think it would be brilliant if players like Robbie Keane, Damien Duff and Shay Given went back at the end of their careers and spent even a year in the LOI before they retire. Then if they wanted they could become coaches and managers in the League of Ireland.

The only reason I can think of is that there is no real love of Irish club teams here so they don't see a point in playing in front of a few thousand people. If the teams could attract even decent crowds I think they could be sold on the idea.

Oh, and just while I'm on a rant - the standard of coaching (with only a few exceptions) is very poor here. I mean hardly any of the Irish league managers get jobs abroad and the few that did, have by and large failed badly when they have been given the opportunity.

3hn2givr7mx1sc · 08-05-2010 3:21pm

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

It's on par with League one i'd say.

SPL outside the top 3/4, imo.

The Volt · 08-05-2010 3:22pm

IIRC Damien Duff wants to finish with Rovers.

3hn2givr7mx1sc · 08-05-2010 3:23pm

Voltwad wrote: »

IIRC Damien Duff wants to finish with Rovers.

Yeah, I was just about to say that I'm nearly sure that I read that somehwere and that Robbie Keane and Richard Dunne want to finish their careers in the AL, I think they said Rovers, not sure, though.

Keano! · 08-05-2010 3:24pm

League 1 in England maybe? I always believed and still do that the likes of Bohs would be able to cut it in the Championship, but the majority are League 1 and even League 2 for some.

Tom10 · 08-05-2010 3:27pm

baz2009 wrote: »

Yeah, I was just about to say that I'm nearly sure that I read that somehwere and that Robbie Keane and Richard Dunne want to finish their careers in the AL, I think they said Rovers, not sure, though.

Well if that did happen, it could make football clubs attractive to a casual fan again. I mean all you have to do is look at the rugby; because they have the best Irish players people are flocking to see them. With football even more popular in Ireland than rugby, you put Keane, Duff and Dunne in the league and I guarantee that attendances will go up by 100% for the games they play in. You keep it going for a few years (preferably get these players to coach and manage) and within 10 years the league would be on a par with championship football in England and consistently qualifying for Europa League group stage.

GLaDOS · 08-05-2010 3:28pm

About league 1 or Championship level I'd reckon myself.

redout · 08-05-2010 3:32pm

Mid-table Championship ?

Thats a bit of a stretch in my opinion.

Championship teams are quite good.

I would say top LOI teams would be between Mid-table to relegation.

The rest would be good league one teams.

applehunter · 08-05-2010 3:33pm

Teams would be around the lower reaches of the Gambrinus Liga.

A lot of it is to do with budgets. Most teams would be working off less than c. €1,000,000 for their yearly budget.

ziggy · 08-05-2010 3:34pm

This post has been deleted.

GLaDOS · 08-05-2010 3:36pm

ziggy wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

In fairness, Celtic have been ****e this season. Ross County?

Zonda999 · 08-05-2010 3:39pm

redout wrote: »

Mid-table Championship ?

Thats a bit of a stretch in my opinion.

Championship teams are quite good.

I would say top LOI teams would be between Mid-table to relegation.

The rest would be good league one teams.

Think about a similiar level myself, have thought about this too a lot, is it fair to say everyone here thinks nearly loi premier team would be better than most league 2 teams?
Its hard to measure it really..

Helix · 08-05-2010 3:41pm

imo if you made a super league of irish and scotish teams, rangers and celtic wouldnt finish top 2 every year

nor would the lower reaches be dominated by the LOI teams

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 3:43pm

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

No they couldn't.

It's on par with League one i'd say.

ziggy wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Who's better Salzburg or Celtic and Rangers.
Salzburg , Bohs came within 4 minutes of beating them.
Have you even ever been to a match

DB10 · 08-05-2010 3:45pm

Zonda999 wrote: »

Think about a similiar level myself, have thought about this too a lot, is it fair to say everyone here thinks nearly loi premier team would be better than most league 2 teams?
Its hard to measure it really..

I really think most of them are around League 2 level/League 1 relegation sides.

I mean people saying Championship level are just fooling themselves IMO. The likes of Sheff Wed have just been relegated from the Championship, I think they would beat most Irish teams. So would the likes of Leeds, Millwall and several other League 1 sides.

The SPL is a hard to measure though. Mainly because that league at this stage is a pile of ****e. Most of the SPL would be trounced in the Championship.

applehunter · 08-05-2010 3:45pm

BOHtox wrote: »

Who's better Salzburg or Celtic and Rangers.
Salzburg , Bohs came within 4 minutes of beating them.
Have you even ever been to a match

Would Celtic or Rangers have tried to hang onto a 0-0 at home for 90 mins. in a Euro tie against a team like Salzburg?

DB10 · 08-05-2010 3:47pm

applehunter wrote: »

Would Celtic or Rangers have tried to hang onto a 0-0 at home for 90 mins. in a Euro tie against a team like Salzburg?

Probably judging on both sides recent European campaigns.

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 3:47pm

applehunter wrote: »

Would Celtic or Rangers have tried to hang onto a 0-0 at home for 90 mins. in a Euro tie against a team like Salzburg?

It was a tactic that nearly worked and yes

GLaDOS · 08-05-2010 3:47pm

applehunter wrote: »

Would Celtic or Rangers have tried to hang onto a 0-0 at home for 90 mins. in a Euro tie against a team like Salzburg?

The argument was that they could snatch a result, not that they were necessarily better

applehunter · 08-05-2010 3:48pm

DB10 wrote: »

I really think most of them are around League 2 level/League 1 relegation sides.

I mean people saying Championship level are just fooling themselves IMO. The likes of Sheff Wed have just been relegated from the Championship, I think they would beat most Irish teams. So would the likes of Leeds, Millwall and several other League 1 sides.

The SPL is a hard to measure though. Mainly because that league at this stage is a pile of ****e. Most of the SPL would be trounced in the Championship.

What kind of WUM are you?

Your 1st post was all doe eyed and innocent and then you splurge this ****.

Zonda999 · 08-05-2010 3:49pm

Maybe championship is pushing it as bit really, that is only a league down from the premier league, leeds united vs boh's would be a match i'd like to see, would give a real indication of the quality difference

DB10 · 08-05-2010 3:52pm

applehunter wrote: »

What kind of WUM are you?

Your 1st post was all doe eyed and innocent and then you splurge this ****.

Seriously can the Old Firm/LOI fanatics either come back to reality or leave this thread.

It wasn't intended to be another English football vs SPL vs LOI thread.

For goodness sake Irish teams are not better quality than the likes of Leeds and anyone that believes so is just deluded.

greendom · 08-05-2010 3:53pm

ScienceNerd wrote: »

About league 1 or Championship level I'd reckon myself.

The top performing teams might scrape League One. The worse performers would struggle in the Conference

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 3:54pm

DB10 wrote: »

Seriously can the Old Firm/LOI fanatics either come back to reality or leave this thread.

It wasn't intended to be another English football vs SPL vs LOI thread.

For goodness sake Irish teams are not better quality than the likes of Leeds and anyone that believes so is just deluded.

How many matches have you been too?

DB10 · 08-05-2010 3:56pm

Zonda999 wrote: »

Maybe championship is pushing it as bit really, that is only a league down from the premier league, leeds united vs boh's would be a match i'd like to see, would give a real indication of the quality difference

The difference would come to light quickly IMO. Leeds have players like Beckford on the bench for some games. And they won at OT playing good football.

Really the majority of LOI players are not good enough to play for Leeds. I have no affinity to Leeds at all and I would love to see the LOI improve the standards, but we have to be honest with ourselves here.

Helix · 08-05-2010 3:56pm

DB10 wrote: »

For goodness sake Irish teams are not better quality than the likes of Leeds and anyone that believes so is just deluded.

youre only saying that because you percieve leeds as a big name, and therefore a good team

those days are over

applehunter · 08-05-2010 3:58pm

DB10 wrote: »

Seriously can the Old Firm/LOI fanatics either come back to reality or leave this thread.

It wasn't intended to be another English football vs SPL vs LOI thread.

For goodness sake Irish teams are not better quality than the likes of Leeds and anyone that believes so is just deluded.

This is just blatent WUMerchanting.

DB10 · 08-05-2010 3:59pm

BOHtox wrote: »

How many matches have you been too?

Oh for flips sake here we go...:rolleyes:

I don't have a LOI team near me so I don't go to games. Watch alot of the decent games on the TV.

gimmick · 08-05-2010 3:59pm

The standard of the LOI is alot lower now than what it was between 2002-2007. I would say in those years the better teams, Cork City, Derry, Bohs, Shels, were about bottom half championship level, while the rest would have been decent League one clubs.

I would say today that the better teams would be middling League One teams, while the remainder would be bottom half League 2 clubs, while the standard of the 2st division is utter utter dross, probably mid conference at best.

I say that as a lifelong Cork City fan, and not as a LOI basher. Its just a realistic opinion. FFS, a few years ago, some would have you believe that the better teams would have been championship winners, which was never really the case

DB10 · 08-05-2010 4:01pm

applehunter wrote: »

This is just blatent WUMerchanting.

WTF?

Twice you said that now, can you not either debate the point or get over yourself? You tell me why they are better then sunshine because they certainly don't look that way.

Honestly these superfans just piss you off. I have not come in here and rubbished the LOI or any club. Just gave an honest assessment.

Töpher · 08-05-2010 4:02pm

It's impossible to gauge, where in the Championship in England you can have 20 odd teams that are relatively close in terms of ability, in Ireland the difference in quality between the top and bottom of the 10 team top flight is staggering.

Bray would probably get tanked in the Conference each week, whereas Bohs on their day could well survive (or be in with a good shout of surviving) in the Championship. It's too wide a range to narrow down.

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 4:02pm

DB10 wrote: »

Oh for flips sake here we go...:rolleyes:

I don't have a LOI team near me so I don't go to games. Watch alot of the decent games on the TV.

That's ridiculous your such a wum, false Irishman and a barstooler

leninbenjamin · 08-05-2010 4:04pm

I recently started going down to the United matches of late. I have to say I was surprised by how technically good some of the players you see are. I think what holds the league back the most is the organization and back room setups. Some absolutely awful football played as a result of disorganization and in some cases ridiculous tactics.

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 4:04pm

Töpher wrote: »

It's impossible to gauge, where in the Championship in England you can have 20 odd teams that are relatively close in terms of ability, in Ireland the difference in quality between the top and bottom of the 10 team top flight is staggering.

Bray would probably get tanked in the Conference each week, whereas Bohs on their day could well survive (or be in with a good shout of surviving) in the Championship. It's too wide a range to narrow down.

Fair assesment , on average I'd say it's par with the spl

DB10 · 08-05-2010 4:05pm

gimmick wrote: »

The standard of the LOI is alot lower now than what it was between 2002-2007. I would say in those years the better teams, Cork City, Derry, Bohs, Shels, were about bottom half championship level, while the rest would have been decent League one clubs.

I would say today that the better teams would be middling League One teams, while the remainder would be bottom half League 2 clubs, while the standard of the 2st division is utter utter dross, probably mid conference at best.

I say that as a lifelong Cork City fan, and not as a LOI basher. Its just a realistic opinion. FFS, a few years ago, some would have you believe that the better teams would have been championship winners, which was never really the case

Fully agreed mate. I'm no LOI basher either like some are trying to say, but what you have written there is spot on.

We would all love it if the LOI standard was higher, but honestly that is not the case.

gimmick · 08-05-2010 4:07pm

BOHtox wrote: »

That's ridiculous your such a wum, false Irishman and a barstooler

he is a false Irish man because he is not stupid enough to go watch the dirge that is LOI football? Jesus H Christ.

I go to London alot and watch Leyton Orient, a pretty terrible League One side. I guarantee that they would challenge to win the LOI premier division every season. They are better technically and stronger than almsot everything you will see in LOI.

Look at any league 2 side, far stronger physically than LOI players, which over the course of a season will make a difference.

As I said, Bohs, maybe Rovers would do well in League one. The rest would not.

gimmick · 08-05-2010 4:08pm

applehunter wrote: »

This is just blatent WUMerchanting.

Why, because he thinks, correctly, that the standard of LOI is quite low?

DB10 · 08-05-2010 4:08pm

BOHtox wrote: »

That's ridiculous your such a wum, false Irishman and a barstooler

Oh dear...:D

"False Irishman" the best you can come up with?:pac:

90 percent of the country must be false Irishmen by your reasoning so.
Seriously get a grip of yourself. Honestly it is people like you that the LOI gets so much stick.

greendom · 08-05-2010 4:09pm

BOHtox wrote: »

Fair assesment , on average I'd say it's par with the spl

You're talking about the Southern Premier League, right?

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 4:10pm

gimmick wrote: »

he is a false Irish man because he is not stupid enough to go watch the dirge that is LOI football? Jesus H Christ.

I go to London alot and watch Leyton Orient, a pretty terrible League One side. I guarantee that they would challenge to win the LOI premier division every season. They are better technically and stronger than almsot everything you will see in LOI.

Look at any league 2 side, far stronger physically than LOI players, which over the course of a season will make a difference.

As I said, Bohs, maybe Rovers would do well in League one. The rest would not.

No comment. That's just idiotic

3hn2givr7mx1sc · 08-05-2010 4:10pm

If Rovers and Bohs both played at their best, Rovers would win, imo. We also have the best squad, imo and would fare best in League 1.

BOHtox · 08-05-2010 4:11pm

DB10 wrote: »

Oh dear...:D

"False Irishman" the best you can come up with?:pac:

90 percent of the country must be false Irishmen by your reasoning so.
Seriously get a grip of yourself. Honestly it is people like you that the LOI gets so much stick.

But you agree with the wum and barstooler ye?

How high is the quality of the LOI?

Comments