Brazilian Ronaldo at 20 is far more impressive than Messi at 22

kinaldo

Although this thread is almost embarrassing I'll just add that for the record Messi tonight equalled Ronaldo's 34 league goals and 47 goals in all competitions.

Ronaldo scored 47 goals in 49 games and Messi has now scored 47 in 53 games, although Messi's 34 league goals came in 35 games compared to Ronaldo's 34 in 37.

I love stats.

http://www.marca.com/2010/05/16/futbol/equipos/barcelona/1274035304.html?a=PRO365e7e8bf1adbf23f5ce891d76a764d6&t=1274055593

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lionel_Messi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronaldo

FatherTed

Why do some people always feel the urge to compare players, make up lists etc? Just enjoy them for what they are. Stop comparing Messi to Ronaldo to Maradona to Pele etc.

That_Guy

FatherTed wrote: »

Why do some people always feel the urge to compare players, make up lists etc? Just enjoy them for what they are. Stop comparing Messi to Ronaldo to Maradona to Pele etc.

Without comparison there'd be no Berbatov to rip the piss out of.

Jordan Berbatov

That_Guy wrote: »

Without comparison there'd be no Berbatov to rip the piss out of.

keane2097

CSF wrote: »

Ahahahahahahahaha.

Mr Alan wrote: »

Are you Gary Doherty?

CSF wrote: »

Typo corrected

Lol - see what I mean?

Did you play the game to as high a level as Ronnie Whealen by the way?

Because you're about as much of an expert as he is.

Jamie Redknapp is shaking in his boots as well I'd say - he remembers you playing alongside Xabi Alonso at Old Trafford :pac:

TheDoc

plasmaguy wrote: »

Wrong!

Pele scored over a thousand club goals playing in Brazil during a time when all the best Brazilian players played in Brazil and Brazil was by far and away the best footballing nation in the world. Even if Ronaldo had not been injured he would not have scored over a 1000 club goals.

Maradona lead two average teams, Argentina in 1986 to the WC and Napoli to the league title. Neither have done anything since Maradona retired. He almost single handedly beat England in the quarters, while scoring a wonder goal against Belgium in the semis and pulled the strings against Germany in the final, setting up the winning goal. Maradona was also crucial to Argentina's march to the final in 90, playing on one of the poorest Argentinian sides ever, he set up the winning goal against Brazil.

Ronaldo flopped in 98 at the WC final, and was fortunate to always play with a good Brazil side thereafter.

Even if injuries hadn't affeced him, and they didn't affect him in 98, he would still have a long way to go to surpass Maradona and Pele.

Even if he has been fit throughout his career, there are many more players I rate as being more gifted than Ronaldo. Like I say he was a good player, but fortunate to play on good teams which always makes it easier.

Pele scored so many goals because he was a player that was ahead of his time. You only have to look at some of the video footgae and just drop your jaw at how teams defended and how defenders in general operated.


All this threads are aboslute nonsense and its motly nigh on impossible to compare players from different generations.

Players playing today, and in the last five years are playing in a totally different world of football.

Tactics are completely new, the modern day winger doesnt rely on crossing ability, but pace and hitting the by line, aswell as cutting inside.

Defenders arnt brick walls taking legs, they are game readers, with their powers coming from reading the game and positioning over hard crunching tackling.

All big teams use an anchoring midfielder, most of the time across a five man midfield.


Theres so many variants, its impossible to say who is better, its ltierally uncomparable, and i dont know why people do.

Ronaldo was sensational, in his era he was a great, to remodel his game like he did, probably puts him higher then most. But what you see most of the time from "older" legends, was that they were just ahead of their time, they played like modern players, giving them a massive advantage.

In the last few years, there hasnt been one player who just stands head and shoulders above everyone as being the absolute best.

For a while rhonaldhino was tremendous, then it was all about kaka, henry made a glimpse into the fold, ronaldo came along and set the world alight, and messi has been tremendous the last few seasons.

But you judge a player when they retire on how great they were.

Rhonaldhino has very much fluttered away, and after what, 2-3 great season at barcelona hasnt figured much in the way of world greats.

Kaka had 2-3 seasons of influence where he was named as one of the best, but has had shaky times as of late.

Henry is the same, moving from Arsenal to being a very much bit part shadow of his former self.

This season Rooney has come to the front a tremendous amount of goals, but yet stil lgot beat by Drogba..Lampard compelted another fantastic season for his goalscoring.

Its just impossible to pick and choose, theres different incluencing factors from the differing leagues, and whilst the true legends did it for their whole careers with blips, theres some players who after 2-3 seasons are being heralded as the greatest.

Messi and Ronaldo are on the right track, but they need to keep it going. And in a way it nearly makes it harder.

When you talk about the TRUE greats, you also mention international football. Players who carried their country to glory, or were an essential part of a winning machine.

Ronaldo and messi, imo, havnt really set the international stage alight. Both their national teams dont look like contenders or winners.

The point is that you wait til lthe end of a players career. So lets re-open this topic, and all the other stupid topics in this category, in ten years time, when there is time to look back and see whats being done.

At the moment, I'd forsee a thread in a decades time " The greatest players enver to win an international tournament" and messi and ronaldo could well top that list.

And when you compare them withthe zidanes, ronaldos peles etc.

Not having a world cup or european championship under your belt, might make the arguement more compelling...

plasmaguy

I think Torres is a great player. If Torres was playing with Chelsea, Inter Milan, Barca or Real Madrid, it's quite possible people would be saying it's between him, Messi and Ronaldo for best player in the world. But I think most people would have Torres in their top 3 world players at the moment.

I like the idea of the best player of the current generation of players.

Going back through the decades, my take on it would be something like this...

Pele, Cruyff, Maradona, Romario, Zidanne, Messi.

Best players of their generation, in that order. Others might disagree.

I also think the minimum a player has to do it at the top level to be considered among the all time greats is 5 years.

Davaeo09

Comparing players, with stats and ages is just damn right silly...
Every single game both these players have been apart of have been different, different goal keepers, different defenders, different circumstances all together. To compare just stats and ignore factos like luck, wind, deflections, bad defending etc etc, really shows that some of haven't a clue what ye are taking about :pac:

SlickRic

plasmaguy wrote: »

I think Torres is a great player. If Torres was playing with Chelsea, Inter Milan, Barca or Real Madrid, it's quite possible people would be saying it's between him, Messi and Ronaldo for best player in the world.

sorry, no.

if Torres could stay fit people would be saying it's between him, Messi and Ronaldo for best player in the world.

nothing to do with the fact he's at Liverpool.

sure he was mentioned in that breath 2 seasons ago when he had a mostly full campaign.

David Villa's the one that needs to move if he wants to get the recognition he deserves IMO. i don't like that that's the case, but it is.

iregk

Yay another waste of a time thread!!!

We have a simply world class player on our hands so lets enjoy it and him. Lets not just completely dismiss him as he didn't quite have the same figures as another guy. Relax lads, sit back and just enjoy the talent.

If you have to constantly snipe at a players ability I feel truely sorry for you as your clearly not enjoying the beautiful game.