Sligo Mayo Greenway Is it possible

westtip

keithcan wrote: »

Westtip, you say that “someone ought to let these gobsh*te politicians know what a success they have on their hands (with the Mayo greenway) for such a small investment”. Would these politicians that you deride be the same ones who were involved in the decision to fund the Mayo Greenway and who, if I recall correctly, cycled the track when it was opened (I think I recall Dempsey being there) ? I find your ideas good, but your lack of constructive balance is silly and unnecessary imo. I’ve suggested before that you check with D/transport how much is allocated for such developments and in reply you state that “the national cycle network is on the agenda” and that “the cost of the (Sligo) greenway is actually affordable”. My original suggestion still stands: why not ask them what is available for 2011 for the national cycle network and will converting the northern section of the WRC be part of any spend. This is a constructive suggestion to you and getting the answer, whatever it may be, would greatly inform this debate. Let’s park the issue of the railway development, let's even assume it’s unfeasible (as you have convincingly outlined) and that therefore, converting the WRC as a cycleway is not blocked by the WRC supporters. I still say that with the current disastrous national financial position, the Sligo greenway will not be do-able. D/transport may manage to get a small amount of cycle network done around the country, but Sligo will be down the list. You may disagree and, of course, we can always revist this point in a year’s time to see what transpired. But in the meantime, why oh why not just check out the budget provision for the national cycle network…???? It may be slightly more hassle than taking cheap swipes, but it'd be a damn sight more constructive and helpful to this debate.

you have made some good points and at times I do shoot from the hip on these issues. I have made plenty of representation to both national and local politicians on this matter. DOT does have funds available (or at least did) for the National Cycle Network, I don't share the issue about Sligo being down the list - the spend on the NCN and parts thereof will depend on case by case based on local authorities making a pitch for the funds that are available - Mayo Coco have been very good at this Sligo need a wake up call.

The last letter I got from Dempsey on the matter was that - any changes to the overall plan to re-open the WRC and preserve the line from Claremorris to Collooney would have to come from the respective county councils; he effectively reneged on making a decison - but no surprises there - In the soon to be published and debated five year County development plan - I am hopeful Sligo Coco will adopt the policy of aiming to turn Collooney to county border into a greenway - support for the idea in Mayo to make a greenway from Claremorris to County border is moving forward with several councillors on board. If both Sligo and Mayo Coco adopt this idea as policy the money may well be available, from the central pot - that does exist for the National Cycle Network, I have not established how much and TBH everything will be on hold until the General election - despite all the trauma some capital projects will still have to happen - and the case for these cycleways to help tourism economics in the west may swing the arguments. They are good quality projects in terms of local employment and the facilities they create, they are highly visible projects - which is good for politicians they effect everyday lives (again good for politicians), and they are not that expensive - The entire national cycle networks project could be delivered for a paltry sum compared to some projects and be of benefit to so many citizens it would be great value.

I have also been in touch with Enda about the idea - and he has been very positive - as has jimmy Deenihan (shadow tourism minister). When I talked about Gobsh*te politicians I was in the main referring to Noel Dempsey - who has skirted around the issue of the northern WRC claremorris/Collooney section for over three years -

So despite ranting and raving on this thread as well as others on this subject I have in fact been in dialogue with several political representatives soon to be ministers and I hope - the soon to be Taoiseach about this subject - and apart from the current Minister of Transport - soon to be history - have actually met with quite a positive response, but as said at the mo I cannot get hold of the exact figure the DOT has in mind for the NCN and TBH I don't think it will be available until after the political dust has settled.

Dunlaffin

keithcan wrote: »

Let’s park the issue of the railway development, let's even assume it’s unfeasible (as you have convincingly outlined) and that therefore, converting the WRC as a cycleway is not blocked by the WRC supporters. I still say that with the current disastrous national financial position, the Sligo greenway will not be do-able.

Theres nothing to assume, thees not going to be a railway built there now, it's totally unfeasible and what is commonly called in fishing circles, a red herring. However, these type of Greenway projects are super Low-budget stuff. Reason being........90% of it is already there. Take a walk along the Great Western Greenway and look at the fabulous cut stone bridges that have lain in hiding for decades. If these bridges and culverts had to be built then this would be a pipe dream, but they dont, and that's the beauty of this idea.
The next section of the Achill - Mulraney Greenway is going to be opened soon. Judging by the photos this is going to be a national gem. Check it out.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Great-Western-Greenway-Newport-Mulranny-Cycling-Walking-Trail/118718021509032

Cost : Chump Change. Value : Priceless !

westtip

Dunlaffin wrote: »

Theres nothing to assume, thees not going to be a railway built there now, it's totally unfeasible and what is commonly called in fishing circles, a red herring. However, these type of Greenway projects are super Low-budget stuff. Reason being........90% of it is already there. Take a walk along the Great Western Greenway and look at the fabulous cut stone bridges that have lain in hiding for decades. If these bridges and culverts had to be built then this would be a pipe dream, but they dont, and that's the beauty of this idea.
The next section of the Achill - Mulraney Greenway is going to be opened soon. Judging by the photos this is going to be a national gem. Check it out.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Great-Western-Greenway-Newport-Mulranny-Cycling-Walking-Trail/118718021509032

Cost : Chump Change. Value : Priceless !

DL thanks for that input - and very valid point about just how little these greenways cost when placed along the routes of old rail lines - the point you make about the culverts and bridge infrastructure on the Achill-Mulranny-Newport greenway is very good, and the same of course applies to the Sligo-Mayo Greenway route. I passionately believe in this idea as being a good one for the west of Ireland - If a route greenway route from Claremorris to Newport could be connected to the Claremorris/Collooney route just think what that would do for activity tourism, You are right the Railway is not going to happen - however the caveat is - if in some distant future we really do need to rebuild the railway then the route is protected for ever in public ownership if it NEEDS to be done. The Great Western Greenway has been done apparently for 100k per kilometre - the Sligo Mayo Greenway from Claremorris to Collooney is just over 70 km = 7 million to convert the line to greenway - Activity Tourism is the future of tourism in the west of Ireland - and cycling and walking are two key areas for development. For 7 million the payback on this investment would be very immediate.

westtip

keithcan wrote: »

WI’ve suggested before that you check with D/transport how much is allocated for such developments and in reply you state that “the national cycle network is on the agenda” and that “the cost of the (Sligo) greenway is actually affordable”. My original suggestion still stands: why not ask them what is available for 2011 for the national cycle network and will converting the northern section of the WRC be part of any spend. This is a constructive suggestion to you and getting the answer, whatever it may be, would greatly inform this debate. Let’s park the issue of the railway development, let's even assume it’s unfeasible (as you have convincingly outlined) and that therefore, converting the WRC as a cycleway is not blocked by the WRC supporters. I still say that with the current disastrous national financial position, the Sligo greenway will not be do-able. D/transport may manage to get a small amount of cycle network done around the country, but Sligo will be down the list. You may disagree and, of course, we can always revist this point in a year’s time to see what transpired. But in the meantime, why oh why not just check out the budget provision for the national cycle network…???? It may be slightly more hassle than taking cheap swipes, but it'd be a damn sight more constructive and helpful to this debate.

Keithcan - I am trying t0 get an answer to your question about exact amounts available for the NCN. However I am actually encouraged by this exstract on page 49 of the National Recovery Plan, the emboldment is mine.

My point is this, Sligo and Mayo CoCo need to make a strong case for this linkage (Sligo-Mayo Greenway) to fight for the funds that will be available - they will be scarces but the NCN comes under the umbrella of improving cycling infrastructure, adn the authorities have seent the direct effects of the NewportMulranny project

.

turn to growth in tourism numbers is dependent on a recovery in external markets. But measures to improve the quality and diversity of the tourism product and our competitiveness will position the sector to take advantage of that recovery. Capital funding for the tourism sector will be focussed on completing the upgrade of major tourist attractions, developing a small number of key iconic attractions, improving infrastructure for recreational cycling, walking and water based activities and heritage attractions..

http://www.budget.gov.ie/The%20National%20Recovery%20Plan%202011-2014.pdf

keithcan

Westtip, Fair play looking to clarify this. Can I suggest that when the budget is announced next week, there'll be clarification available within a short time of that. Not many people seem to be aware of this, but each Department's budget is publicly available - this is the link to the 2010 one for all the government Departments - http://www.finance.gov.ie/documents/public%20expenditure/2010/REV2010.pdf and D/transport is there at no.32. I'd suspect the National Cycle Network is covered by the C1 or C2 subheads (possibly C1.5 or C2.1). When the 2011 Budget document is made available (probably on D/finance website) some time after the budget announcement, it'd be possible to see what allocations are there for these activities and specific questions to D/transport may also prompt specific info ('what is available in 2011 for NCN actions?' and 'what subhead is it covered by?').
You are correct that the two Councils are key to driving any such proposal. I'm afraid I'm still a sceptic not for reasons of merit of the proposal, but more down to the reality of the obstacles that need to be overcome to advance a project of this nature. Should all these obstacles be brushed aside? probably yes. If all local parties (mostly the Councils but probably others too) could throw their weight behind this, could it gain some traction? maybe yes. But the reality still is that there'll be way less money in 2011 for reasons taht are obvious to all. And importantly, there'll be any amount of competing priorities for this small pot, other regions, other projects, etc. Another reality: Mayo Co Co has done a good job on the Mulranny-Newport Greenway and they're starting with Phase 2. IMO, they will not have the capacity to focus simultaneously on another Greenway project.

In terms of cost, I'd suggest that based on the Mulranny Greenway, a more accurate cost is over €120,000 per Km, 20% more than your figure. So 70km from Claremorris to Collooney is €8.5m approx. Of course costs for Claremorris-Collooney could be less per Km than the Achill one, depending on the ground conditions, etc., but also could be a lot more. I completely agree with you that activity tourism is the future for tourism for the west of Ireland, with cycling/walking being key. And I admire your passion to this project. I just think it's not a straightforward matter of a politician deciding to do it; the cost is a real real issue and it's not all about useless politicians etc. I personally wish they would consider how moderate investment in the activity tourism area can reap rewards, and for example, there have been good developments on the walking trails scene in last few years from what I've seen, which I think was mostly down to O Cuiv. Finally, if there isn't enough negativity in what I've already said, have another look at the National Recovery Plan, specifically page 118, where it's announced that there's to be reduced funding for rural recreation. This is where an amount of the "infrastructure for recreational cycling (and) walking" gets funded, and it's cut for 2011. Is that logical? of course not, but there it is. Anyway, I'm throwing the curve balls at you but you're taking good swipes at them, so keep it up and hope you can keep the Claremorris - Collooney greenway idea floating, though I think you may have to look beyond our exchequer alone stepping in.

westtip

Thanks Keith - you clearly must be in the loop on all this stuff I am a bit harsh on our elected bretheren. You are right about O'Cuiv he did move the whole process forward a few yards, it just seems to take so long to do something that looks pretty simple in reality. In fact he actually floated out the idea of the Claremorris - Collooney Greenway to a West on Track conference in May 2009 (mind he got several letters from me about the matter before he made the speech and virtually verbatim used extracts from my letters in his speech!)

I will further digest your post and look at the links you suggest. The money for such a project is going to come from a number of different (public) pots, Failte Ireland, DOT, county councils - of course it all comes out of the same overdraft.

I think this whole project will rise or fall on the much loved "cost benefit analysis" which I really think will be a shoe in if an analysis of Mulranny is applied - it has definitely benefitted activity tourism big time in Newport/Mulranny area.

I know that the first major project they (DOT/FI) are looking at for the NCN is a seamless cycle track from Dublin to Galway, their is an existing lineage to link up - Grand canal, Mullingar/Athlone rail line, old N6 (separated cycle lane put in) - actually I think they should look at the parallel greenways to railways for this route as well - but that is another issue:

Have a look at this to see what I mean it is one of my favourite photos on this subject!

westtip

Sligo county council will be debating/discussing the managers report on submissions made by the public on the Sligo county Development plan 2011 - 2017 next monday January 17th. The council got a total of 15 written submissions on the idea to convert the old rail line into a greenway (this is actually quite a lot). The council will not release the managers report to the councillors until it has been debated - I will post a link on this thread when it is posted on Sligo coco website. In the meantime if you know any of your local councillors give them a call or speak to them asking them to support this idea - which I assume will be incorporated into the managers report to the council. make the call before their meeting on January 17th if you can

shanec1928

why waste public money?it could be better spent on schools that need upgrading or to go to the hospital..money for a walk way should be at the bottom of the pile.

westtip

forza rovers wrote: »

why waste public money?it could be better spent on schools that need upgrading or to go to the hospital..money for a walk way should be at the bottom of the pile.

You are entitled to your opinion - suggest you ask business people in Newport and Mulranny how the Great Western greenway has generated tourist income in the area this year. Generating economic activity = more taxes for hospitals schools etc.

A good quality walkway will reduce hospital bills: Healthier population with less coronary heart failure, less pedestrian victims on the roads.

This 47 mile walkway could be done for about 7 million it would pay for itself in economic activity it brings into the area - and since when did social infrastructure such as a footpath/cyclepath become a "waste of public money" compared to spending it on hospitals and schools.

Apart from anything else there is money available for the Natonal Cycle Network, this route is ideally suited to such a scheme, If Sligo County Council want to grab the opportunity now to get some of this (central Government) public pot spent in Sligo they should do - or they can sit around living in cloud cuckoo land in the fairy tale world of make believe thinking this railway line is ever going to be opened again.

This country is losing activity tourists such as walkers and cyclists because we don't have the infrastructure to deal with them - cycling long distance on a cycling touring holiday is torture on irish roads - this scheme would in someway help alleviate this situation in our county, plus local people need proper walking facilities.

kkontour

@westtip
Any Idea what came out of the meeting yeaterday?

T runner

westtip wrote: »

You are entitled to your opinion - suggest you ask business people in Newport and Mulranny how the Great Western greenway has generated tourist income in the area this year. Generating economic activity = more taxes for hospitals schools etc.

A good quality walkway will reduce hospital bills: Healthier population with less coronary heart failure, less pedestrian victims on the roads.

This 47 mile walkway could be done for about 7 million it would pay for itself in economic activity it brings into the area - and since when did social infrastructure such as a footpath/cyclepath become a "waste of public money" compared to spending it on hospitals and schools.

Apart from anything else there is money available for the Natonal Cycle Network, this route is ideally suited to such a scheme, If Sligo County Council want to grab the opportunity now to get some of this (central Government) public pot spent in Sligo they should do - or they can sit around living in cloud cuckoo land in the fairy tale world of make believe thinking this railway line is ever going to be opened again.

This country is losing activity tourists such as walkers and cyclists because we don't have the infrastructure to deal with them - cycling long distance on a cycling touring holiday is torture on irish roads - this scheme would in someway help alleviate this situation in our county, plus local people need proper walking facilities.

I think its a great idea. Great for tourists and locals alike. While money needs to go to healtha nd education we must keep a percentage for sustainable industry. People are maively into being more healthy these days.

I would also like to see mini walking crcuits in towns for local walkers, this can be done at minimal cost.

westtip

kkontour wrote: »

@westtip
Any Idea what came out of the meeting yeaterday?

I'm told Sligo coco have taken the recommendation in the managers report to the council on submissions from the public on the Sligo county development plan = something along the lines that the council supports the idea of a greenway from Collooney to the county border within the alignment of the railway as long as it doesn't jeopardise a future railway shoudl funding become available for that - as the railway restoration is about as likely to happen as FF getting an overall majority in March, I think we can safely say the Greenway is looking increasingly like the only option for this route - In additon Mayo Coco have already asked their county manager to look at the feasibility of a greenway along the mayo section Claremorris - Bellahy. So we may actually see this happen with funding available for the National cycle network from central government - the time has now come to canvass hard to make it happen. The Greenway from Claremorris to Collooney is now on the political agenda and the railway is not the only show in town.

westtip

T runner wrote: »

I think its a great idea. Great for tourists and locals alike. While money needs to go to healtha nd education we must keep a percentage for sustainable industry. People are maively into being more healthy these days.

I would also like to see mini walking crcuits in towns for local walkers, this can be done at minimal cost.

Mayo county Council apparently say the Great Western greenway gets 300 users a day in the summer weekday days and 1000 day in the weekends = these things do generate activity as all these people out and about get tired hungry and thirsty, they then eat drink and need beds to sleep in. They also buy new bikes to use these facilities, new trainers to walk on them, they rent bikes to use them etc - the mulitplier effect of something as simple as this idea on the local economy could be huge.

westtip

The idea got reported in the Champion today page 32 - with the proposal that the pathway will be alongside the old railway as logn as it doesn't interfere with the prospect of the rail line re-opening. As the old rail line has about as much chance of re-opening as Brian Cowen does of being elected President I think we can safely assume that the only show in town on the old rail alignment is the greenway - it is truly good news to see the council at least adopting this idea - even if they hold onto the forlorn hope that the railway will ever open again. Lets see them push this idea now.....because just as it has in Westport/newport/mulranny and soon to be Achill it has completely changed tourism in West Mayo lets make a similiar idea do the same in Sligo.

Now this idea is in the public agenda people need to get behind it and support it. Make it happen.

Whats more there will be funding believe it or not for this idea - under the National Cycle network policy - whereas a major capital project such as the Railway will simply be put to the back of the queue.

Also see the Weekender on page 10 - double page spread on the Greenway project.

il gatto

keithcan wrote: »

Westtip, you say that “someone ought to let these gobsh*te politicians know what a success they have on their hands (with the Mayo greenway) for such a small investment”. Would these politicians that you deride be the same ones who were involved in the decision to fund the Mayo Greenway and who, if I recall correctly, cycled the track when it was opened (I think I recall Dempsey being there) ? I find your ideas good, but your lack of constructive balance is silly and unnecessary imo. I’ve suggested before that you check with D/transport how much is allocated for such developments and in reply you state that “the national cycle network is on the agenda” and that “the cost of the (Sligo) greenway is actually affordable”. My original suggestion still stands: why not ask them what is available for 2011 for the national cycle network and will converting the northern section of the WRC be part of any spend. This is a constructive suggestion to you and getting the answer, whatever it may be, would greatly inform this debate. Let’s park the issue of the railway development, let's even assume it’s unfeasible (as you have convincingly outlined) and that therefore, converting the WRC as a cycleway is not blocked by the WRC supporters. I still say that with the current disastrous national financial position, the Sligo greenway will not be do-able. D/transport may manage to get a small amount of cycle network done around the country, but Sligo will be down the list. You may disagree and, of course, we can always revist this point in a year’s time to see what transpired. But in the meantime, why oh why not just check out the budget provision for the national cycle network…???? It may be slightly more hassle than taking cheap swipes, but it'd be a damn sight more constructive and helpful to this debate.

Sorry to quote your post so late, but I think you give politicians too much credit. When lobbied on an issue and made aware of it's viability, they voted to spend public tax money on it. When it was all done and dusted, they showed up to gain some publicity. In fact, many projects are kept closed off from the public until the appropriate minister is available to cut a ribbon (the Loughrea bypass for example, which sat idle waiting for Dempsey until they had to open it due to flooding).
If we want balance, should take into account that well paid public representatives voted to spend our money on a project put forward by others and then showed up to take credit for it. We shouldn't prostrate ourselves because our representatives occasionally deign to represent what we actually want.

westtip

il gatto wrote: »

Sorry to quote your post so late, but I think you give politicians too much credit. When lobbied on an issue and made aware of it's viability, they voted to spend public tax money on it. When it was all done and dusted, they showed up to gain some publicity. In fact, many projects are kept closed off from the public until the appropriate minister is available to cut a ribbon (the Loughrea bypass for example, which sat idle waiting for Dempsey until they had to open it due to flooding).
If we want balance, should take into account that well paid public representatives voted to spend our money on a project put forward by others and then showed up to take credit for it. We shouldn't prostrate ourselves because our representatives occasionally deign to represent what we actually want.

Il gatto keithcan came in with some constructive comments - I replied to him, I have worked my bollox off to get this whole greenway idea accepted by local politicians and indeed national politiicians, because no one else put their head above the parapet and campained so relentlessy like I have (my identity I think is no secret - read the press), politicians will always take the credit for good ideas -but I don't see any harm in that - if you have a good idea you simply have to play the system, you have to lobby the politicians, journalists, "stakeholders" you have to keep plugging with your idea and make the politicians adopt it until they think it is their own - plant a seed and watch the acorn grow into an oak. "My" idea is not original others have written about this over 20 years ago, i picked it up and got passionate about - because I truly do believe in it. Our next stage now the politicians have adopted it - is to pressurise and lobby to make sure it happens. I truly do look forward to the day when pupils at St Attractas in Tubercurry living say halfway between Tubber and Charlestown can safely cycle to school because of this greenway, I look forward to the day when the marching young mums of tubber, coolaney, Charlestown, Kiltimagn and Claremorris can enjoy their evening walk on this Greenway, I look forward to the day when B&B and hotesl along this route feed Tired Hungry Tourists who have enjoyed a hassle free day cycling on our Greenway take a deserved break - this is a massive opportunity for the county, the councillors have had there eyes opened and in the past they had their eyes blinkered to something that was never going to happen.

We now have to make this happen - if paying lip service to politicians is something we have to do - in fact I have found engaging with our politicians on this matter laying out the facts, arguing the case that this is the only show in town has in fact been quite a challenge - most of the council i think breathed a collective sigh of relieve on this matte because in this idea they at long last saw members of the public coming at them with what is actually an achievable objective - unlike other ideas for this alignment which frankly are cloud cuckoo land - Now at last something is going to happen and we are going to make it happen. Perhaps, for once, it is power to the people.

keithcan

il gatto, I can see why you might make the point that politicians, when lobbied on an issue and seeing it as popular, may jump on the badwagon and use public funds to 'deliver' it. I should better explain my defence of the politicians' role. They certainly don't have a monopoly on good ideas and none of us should leave it solely to our politicians to come up with the next good idea. If individual citizens like westtip or activist groups develop and drive an idea and convert people to it's merits, then I'm happpy to see a politician stepping in and championing it. Especially if they can spend the time that you and I don't have to get the State's various bodies lined up behind it. The latter is a head wrecking undertaking, so a strong-willed politician with a brass neck can be an agent for change here. To some extent, that is their role. It can be categorised as 'glory hunting' etc, but I still hold that it's not the worst system if citizen activists press the idea and politicians might ultimately facilitate it happening. I'd like it better if the Sligo County Manager and his team latched onto this and drove it, but it probably needs the combined forces of them, plus the politicians, with citizens lobbying as a key element.

I think that was the receipe for the Mayo greenway, with a good dollop of cash from different govt departments, mostly transport. Yhea that IS our taxpayer money, but somebody has to prioritise where it'll be spent, and I reckon the bike hire people and the Mulranny Park Hotel (and the many walkers + cyclists) are glad that everyone involved gave it a go - from the ministers, Mayo county manager, local activists and individual landowners.

To add a point about this broad activity tourism area - more and more I'm hearing that there's a slow but steady growth in the number of tourists that are coming from all over (Irish and foreign) to use walking trails. The view I've heard is that we are now, a few years down the road, seeing tangible benefits of what mostly Eamon OCuiv did on this when he tackled the longstanding issue of trail access being blocked. Since then a good amount of trails have been sorted to complement the work that was always being done by local activist groups. Result as I hear it is Failte ireland are now marketing Ireland as a walking destination and locals and visitors alike can decide to walk a trail and know with confidence it will be open and well maintained. I wouldn't prostrate myself in front of the man, but he helped crack that one, along with the work of the likes of Joss Lynam, who sadly died recently http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0110/1224287158364.html and had done great work to develop activity trails and centres - a citizen activist being facilitated by a politician, and a decent outcome ensued.

westtip

Keithcan agree entirely. No point getting angry and emotive and saying "why don't they do this or that" - I have always wondered who "they" are. Putting forward good arguments and counter arguments to an opposite view and keep doing in long enough and eventually the idea will be picked up:

Anyway coverage on Mid West this morniing and indeed on page 2 of the irish times today in lead piece on home news about Enda supporting the greenway idea.

Kenny sees old railway as tourist trail
In this section » FRANK McDONALD, Environment Editor

FINE GAEL leader Enda Kenny has lent his support to plans for a walking and cycling “greenway” on part of the western rail corridor, implicitly ruling out its reinstatement as a railway.

“I favour this kind of development . . . which will have a considerable impact in respect of tourism,” Mr Kenny told Sligo-based greenway promoter Brendan Quinn, saying it should be subject to a feasibility study by Mayo and Sligo county councils.

The proposal is to create a greenway on the corridor between Claremorris, Co Mayo, and Collooney, Co Sligo, based on the success of the Great Western Greenway from Newport to Mulranny, Co Mayo, which is now being extended to Achill Island.

Last summer, the existing route attracted 300 walkers and cyclists on weekdays and up to 1,000 at weekends. It has been a “phenomenal success”, according to Mr Quinn. “Imagine what that is doing for these sleepy backwaters of Irish tourism,” he said.

Local politicians in Mayo and Sligo had woken up to the value of greenways as revenue-generators for local economies. Sligo County Council’s decision last week to include it as an objective was a huge breakthrough, he said.

Only one section of the western rail corridor, between Ennis and Athenry, has been reinstated for rail services. Plans to extend it further north to Tuam and Claremorris were included in the Government’s Transport 21 investment programme but are “on hold”.

Mr Quinn said Mayo County Council is investigating the opportunity to create a greenway on the rail alignment from Claremorris to Charlestown, rather than persist with the “rather forlorn idea” that the railway line would reopen.

Referring to the West on Track campaign, which is seeking to have the entire rail corridor reopened, he said this was unlikely to happen “any time soon, or at all” because the route did not have the population density to sustain a rail service.

“I don’t think the Ennis-Athenry line has set the world alight,” Mr Quinn said. “The X51 bus from Limerick to Galway does it in just over an hour now with the Gort bypass. The train takes almost two hours and is a lot less frequent.

“I am not anti-rail, but I do recognise that we have to be pragmatic and realistic. We ain’t going to get the line reinstated, so let’s use the track bed for something useful. The greenway idea will deliver something very cost-effectively and very quickly.”

He envisaged disused rail lines in Co Donegal could also be developed as greenways, creating a network of safe cycling and walking routes that would boost activity tourism in the west while also protecting the rail alignments.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0131/1224288605586.html

islanddoc

well done westtip- "There's no limit to what a man can achieve, if he doesn't care who gets the credit." Laing Burns, Jr.

Keep up the lobbying...

as an aside - how many people currently use the lower part of the western rail corridor by train- compare to the numbers who use the greenway in Mulranny- Newport - i dare say there is no comparison.

westtip

islanddoc wrote: »

well done westtip- "There's no limit to what a man can achieve, if he doesn't care who gets the credit." Laing Burns, Jr.

Keep up the lobbying...

as an aside - how many people currently use the lower part of the western rail corridor by train- compare to the numbers who use the greenway in Mulranny- Newport - i dare say there is no comparison.

Well certainly not 300 a day during the week and 1000 at weekends. but here is a post reporting on numbers last week - and it seems the only part of the line that is busy is the section from Ennis to Limerick - Ennis - Athenry is a dead duck and with buses running direct Limerick - Galway in just over an hour - the trains as a through route "inter city" on the so called corridor are running virtually empty for through route.

Read this post on the WRC thread from C&T http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=70299963&postcount=1284

the figures in this anecdotal report suggest the new bit of the corridor that was campaigned for and re-opened last year between Ennis and Athenry has very low patronage figures. God knows what kind of numbers they expect on Tuam Athenry Galway and Claremorris Tuam Athenry Galway, but really they just don't stack up - as for our greenway section of the line, tis complete cloud cuckoo land to even dream about a train on that line again.....

il gatto

Tourism is virgin money to an economy (generated elsewhere, spent here). It is one of the most profitable and sustainable means of income to a region. Most other areas of Ireland realised this and worked on it over decades. We have been poorly served in this regard. I applaud westtip and all others who work to bring about that which people the majority see worthy of election are blind to. My scorn for the vision and abilities of people well paid to advance our locality is more based on being apalled rather than angry.

westtip

I like your phrase tourism is virgin money very good - and its true - tourism money just comes in from outside and we need more of it.

Make the sligo mayo greenway an election issue tell the candidates you want to see it happen - sooner rather than later and to just get on with it and when the time comes - if we are to have a railway on the line to just build the railway with a parallel greenway.

The Railway will not happen in the lifetime of the next dail or the one after that or after that. In the meantime we are losing the opportunity the alignment gives us to generate tourism income.

Tell your candidates on the doorstep you want it now!!!!!!!

cartoncowboy

I think this is a great idea. I never knew about the whole greeway thing until i stumbled upon this thread. We all know the opening of the railway from Sligo to Claremorris is a non runner, not in this decade anyway. Changing it to a greenway is the next best thing.

We have huge tourism potential and its not marketed enough in my opinion, something like this would be fantastic and if done in the right way, with commercial support and proper marketing overseas, any government would get the money back on it.

Money is tight to say the least at the mo with the IMF etc but hell we cant just sit around and do nothing while Europe hang us out to dry. Lets play to our strengths and if tourism and a project like this isnt one of them then lets all emigrate and let the last person out of Ireland turn out the lights. Come on politicians grow some BALLS !

westtip

cartoncowboy wrote: »

I think this is a great idea. I never knew about the whole greeway thing until i stumbled upon this thread. We all know the opening of the railway from Sligo to Claremorris is a non runner, not in this decade anyway. Changing it to a greenway is the next best thing.

We have huge tourism potential and its not marketed enough in my opinion, something like this would be fantastic and if done in the right way, with commercial support and proper marketing overseas, any government would get the money back on it.

Money is tight to say the least at the mo with the IMF etc but hell we cant just sit around and do nothing while Europe hang us out to dry. Lets play to our strengths and if tourism and a project like this isnt one of them then lets all emigrate and let the last person out of Ireland turn out the lights. Come on politicians grow some BALLS !

Thanks for the encouragement visit www.sligomayogreenway.com and let your candidates know if you are in Sligo/N Leitrim or if you are in Mayo the same. It would indeed pay for itself total estimated cost for the 70km of this stretch is 7 million. It would generate enough tourism and local usage - all out taking exercise and spending afterwards (the tired hungry trail user theory) to pay for itself in increased ~VAT take on products sold as a result of trail activity, plus visitor money just coming into the area to use the trail I reckon in it would contribute enough to the local economies to pay for itself in less than three years.

keithcan

The phrase that gets used to describe the benefit that tourism brings is 'the regional distributive effect of tourism as an industry'.

There is a wide range of activity tourism that can be exploited for the specific benefit of rural areas, but also for national benefit; what's being discussed here re Greenways is definitely a key focus, but all the others are there to be tackled with the right level of focus. For the sake of smallish investments, bird hides can be constructed at appropriate sites and attract a good number of bed-nights. Other activity tourism stuff, being perfect for development in rural areas, need to be addressed. There is good stuff going on, for example the mountain biking that the Ballyhoura area in Co Limerick has hit on.

Failte Ireland tell us that "Despite the fall off in global tourism in recent years, the adventure travel sector was less affected by the downturn". Stats are at http://www.failteireland.ie/Research-Statistics/Tourism-Facts/Tourism-Activities So it's an area worth the focus. All the cliches apply: we could be the New Zealand of the northern hemisphere, etc. etc.

One of the catalysts for a local area is often the local rural development group, who get EU funding. Here's the list of who and where they are- http://www.nrn.ie/the-national-rural-network/contact-details-for-leader-companies-in-ireland/

westtip

Keithcan thanks for those links - this is now a good debate. I think the issue of Railway versus Greenway has been resolved, the motion passed by Sligo CC has effectively made the Greenway the preferred option now matter how it is fudged about protecting the alignment and alongside the railway arguments etc - now it is a matter of how is it going to be done. How realistically can it be funded, which pots do we need to nick a bit from here and bit there, how do we get a group along the line behind the idea to support it (the latent support is there and the political will is there).

Can this project done on a local project by local project basis.

The Tubercurry Greenway, the Charlestown Greenway, the Kiltimagh greenway, and gradually get them to link up. This is how we now need to think to achieve this project. Several local groups working towards the one objective.

BTW if people are interested in the greenway pick up a copy of todays Western and read the front page of the community life section which leads with a story about the huge number of visitors the Great western greenway has bought to Mulranny.

westtip

I reckon we might see this along the whole of the Western Rail corridor from Collooney to Athenry, the FG manifesto is hardly a ringing endorsement of the supposed phase 2 and 3 of the Western Rail corridor (phase 1 was ennis Athenry) phase 2 is supposed to be Athenry Tuam then phase 3 Tuam Claremorris but the FG manifesto says:

From the back pages (page 79) of the FG manifesto:

the Western Rail Corridor, which will be subject to a cost benefit analysis by independent experts

Hardly a ringing endorsement for trains to Tuam and Claremorris and as for Claremorris to Collooney, well that truly is a piped dream. it sounds to me like FG are trying to get off the hook with the help of independent experts, don't blame them can't see the rest of the country putting up with money being spent on a pretty pointless rail line from Athenry to Claremorris.

westtip

great news feature about the sligo mayo greenway in the Champion of March 2nd see pages 34/35

westtip

The programme for Government PFG seem decidely thin on transport

I have found a bit of encouraging news for the Sligo Mayo Greenway in the new programme for government (link to full document http://www.finegael.ie/upload/ProgrammeforGovernmentFinal.pdf)

We will continue to invest in the National Cycle Policy

-m page 62

There is no mention of any specific transport projects - save everything will be subject to Cost benefit analysis. The Western Rail Corridor which did get mentioned by name in the FG manifesto does not get singled out for any mention in the PFG, mind you nor does any of the really big projects like Metro North. The fact the National Cylce policy is singled out - and ergo the national cycle network is part of that policy - is encouraging - if means it is very much on the radar screen and focus must be on Minister of Transport/ and of tourism to keep pointing this out - This is in your programme for Government as a named project what are you going to do about it. This must now be the focus of the campaign.

westtip

does anyone know when they moved the old railway gates off the rail crossign in Tubercurry and put up the builder fencing with padlocks on too stop peopel having access to the line to walk on.

and BTW sligomayogreenway is now on facebook if you want to like the page or join as a friend got to

http://www.facebook.com/#!/profile.php?id=100001773703036

With the cutbacks in Government expenditure the chances of the Western Rail Corridor ever happening (even the bit between Athenry and Tuam and Tuam and Claremorris looks in jeopardy now) are very slim - the government needs low cost projects that will deliver jobs - the sligomayo greenwway will do this so link up on facebook and become a friend and don't forget to keep on at John Perry about it!