Attempted abductions in Kildare/North Dublin [mod warning in effect #162 ]

Diddler1977

Well this thread doesn't do anything to allay fears about "strange men"......

Imagine reading this thread and being a foreign male who drives a van - you'd certainly be weary about approaching a child to provide assistance - you could be leaving yourself exposed to all sorts of allegations.

smelltheglove

Diddler1977 wrote: »

Well this thread doesn't do anything to allay fears about "strange men"......

Imagine reading this thread and being a foreign male who drives a van - you'd certainly be weary about approaching a child to provide assistance - you could be leaving yourself exposed to all sorts of allegations.

I think you arew msising the point in the last page that people are expressing sadness at the fact that men feel so uncomfortable around kids.

Diddler1977

smelltheglove wrote: »

I think you arew msising the point in the last page that people are expressing sadness at the fact that men feel so uncomfortable around kids.

I got that.

I think you missed my point. I was questioning where this uncomfortableness comes from.

It is no surprize a man will feel uncomfortable taking a little girl into the toilet given that there are threads like this.

Rumours and speculation of men in vans attempting abductions does not make it easier for a man to take their daughter's friend to the toilet.

See the point I am making?

smelltheglove

Diddler1977 wrote: »

I got that.

I think you missed my point. I was questioning where this uncomfortableness comes from.

It is no surprize a man will feel uncomfortable taking a little girl into the toilet given that there are threads like this.

Rumours and speculation of men in vans attempting abductions does not make it easier for a man to take their daughter's friend to the toilet.

See the point I am making?

Diddler I think you have a bit of negativity towards this thread, if it bothers you why post?

This unease with men has been around a lot longer than the internet I tell you. As someone above mentioned their father felt it years back. Sure I dont know if boards was even live when my brother had an issue changing my daughters nappy.

Do you not think this is a suitable place for parents to air their fears? The stories they have been invloved in or told about? I mean is that not what a parenting forum is for?

Would the debating forum not be more suitable to you if you have such an issue with parents fears etc being expressed via the internet maybe you could start a debate there about the issue and get some more constructive feedback on the issue.

Diddler1977

smelltheglove wrote: »

Diddler I think you have a bit of negativity towards this thread, if it bothers you why post?

This unease with men has been around a lot longer than the internet I tell you. As someone above mentioned their father felt it years back. Sure I dont know if boards was even live when my brother had an issue changing my daughters nappy.

Do you not think this is a suitable place for parents to air their fears? The stories they have been invloved in or told about? I mean is that not what a parenting forum is for?

Would the debating forum not be more suitable to you if you have such an issue with parents fears etc being expressed via the internet maybe you could start a debate there about the issue and get some more constructive feedback on the issue.

I think my points are just as relevant as people who take these rumours as fact.

I prefer not to live my life in fear.

I am always vigilant in relation to childrens safety. Hearing about these attempted abductions does not mean I go on high alert.

Does anyone else have any views on why men would be uncomfortable around little children (other then my view that stories of attempted abductions do not help).

PS. I thought a discussion board was about having a discussion. Did I make a mistake?

Nevyn

There is civil discussion and then there is arguement for the sake of it and browbeating.
We prefer civil discussion around these parts.

smelltheglove

Diddler1977 wrote: »

PS. I thought a discussion board was about having a discussion. Did I make a mistake?

It is obviously a discussion board, my reason for mentioning the debate forum is the fact that you dont agree with the majority of things posted on this thread, obviously you have an issue with 'rumours' and to be honest debating isnt my area, I notice that there are not many people coming in really willing to debate the subject with you, so you may get a better response or discussion about the matter in the debatong forum.

Also the thread was started to notify parents of attempted abductions, of course there will be exagerrated stories but in my honest opinion the way the thread has turned I think people will be turned off posting in this thread, people who genuinely want to hear about stories or post stories to warn other parents.

Diddler I am not against your opinion on everything, I agree that it is a sad state of affairs that men are afraid to approach a child if they are hurt or lost, I agree the white van man thing is a bit over the top and I agree that a lot of stories can be exagerrated. I also believe there is no smoke without fire, I take people at face value and if someone tells me they have personal experience of a situation I will believe them, I would not refer to peoples genuine stories as rumours. I believe in treating others as I would wish to be treated also.

Hank Scorpio

when i was very young i remember at least 2 incidents of people trying to get me into a car for a "lift"

i also remmeber a few friends of mine that it also happened too

on a side note when i was around 5 or 6 me and a friend thru berries at a van and the guy driving tryed pulling us into the back of it - maybe he was just really angry i dont know, luckily some-one who knew us seen us

its really not uncommon, there are some amount of sickos out there

Deliverance

nuxxx wrote: »

when i was very young i remember at least 2 incidents of people trying to get me into a car for a "lift"

i also remmeber a few friends of mine that it also happened too

on a side note when i was around 5 or 6 me and a friend thru berries at a van and the guy driving tryed pulling us into the back of it - maybe he was just really angry i dont know, luckily some-one who knew us seen us

its really not uncommon, there are some amount of sickos out there

That is true. When I was a kid myself and my friends witnessed a few events like this. A Flasher, a guy in car pulling up and masturbating. These events went unreported to the adults and the authorities at the time.

The 'Flasher' in this case got a short sharp shock, he worked in the area and flashed my young sister. Once word got around, all us youngsters sat waiting for him and 'bullied' him out of the area. He had to walk to his workplace every day past us. He did not last long.

We were v.young but we were a tight group. The 'strange men' in this case were driven away by us because we were not vulnerable kids. We were a bit 'feisty' in our time.

smelltheglove

I went to a convent school girls only and on large grounds, flashers were very common. Once after reporting one who pushed himself up against a window myself and my friend were at, wewere taken out of class to go in a squad car and look for him. Little did we know he had climbed a tree and hidden until we left the grounds after we had pulled out ready to come back again the next day.

It was quite horrible as it was only on rare occasion in belting heat that we could leave the building on breaks.

caseyann

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/england/lancashire/10475283.stm

A convicted paedophile from the UK has been remanded in custody for a week following his arrest in the Irish Republic on Wednesday.
Paden has 19 sexual convictions, including rape and indecent assault on a child.

With the likes of these people wandering around Ireland and able to come and go as they please without police checks is disgraceful,there is reason for taking reports with an open ear.
I really think time to take in the Australian ways in Ireland for security.

zuroph

caseyann wrote: »

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/england/lancashire/10475283.stm

A convicted paedophile from the UK has been remanded in custody for a week following his arrest in the Irish Republic on Wednesday.
Paden has 19 sexual convictions, including rape and indecent assault on a child.

With the likes of these people wandering around Ireland and able to come and go as they please without police checks is disgraceful,there is reason for taking reports with an open ear.
I really think time to take in the Australian ways in Ireland for security.

see the problem with your post?

caseyann

zuroph wrote: »

see the problem with your post?

He was arrested after three weeks on the missing list wandering around cavan and where else.
The thing was to point out not people just you know when the likes of him are coming in and out of the country willy nilly as they please.

So whats the problem with the post?

zuroph

caseyann wrote: »

He was arrested after three weeks on the missing list wandering around cavan and where else.
The thing was to point out not people just you know when the likes of him are coming in and out of the country willy nilly as they please.

So whats the problem with the post?

The problem is you complain about our security being too lax, when in reality the opposite is true.
Also, in the bold bit, again you twist the story and lie to suit your argument.

Police had been searching for William John Paden since he left an address in Blackpool, Lancashire last week

He was missing a week in total, maybe less, and was apprehended almost immediately. Would you prefer for a closed border with the North to prevent people free crossing because one in a million may be a paedophile? Seems to read to me that the UK and Irish police did a great job, and an attempt to abscond was quickly and professionally dealt with. Well done Authorities.

caseyann

zuroph wrote: »

The problem is you complain about our security being too lax, when in reality the opposite is true.
Also, in the bold bit, again you twist the story and lie to suit your argument.


He was missing a week in total, maybe less, and was apprehended almost immediately. Would you prefer for a closed border with the North to prevent people free crossing because one in a million may be a paedophile? Seems to read to me that the UK and Irish police did a great job, and an attempt to abscond was quickly and professionally dealt with. Well done Authorities.

I didnt say anything about the police at all.I said the security of them getting in,in the first place.
It is nice how you found a whole meaning that wasnt even there.
I would prefer proper installments so that pedophiles are not nor criminals of any threat allowed to have a passport and to be checked when without a passport.

P.S they changed it from three weeks to one week all of sudden,why i have no idea.

zuroph

caseyann wrote: »

I didnt say anything about the police at all.I said the security of them getting in,in the first place.
It is nice how you found a whole meaning that wasnt even there.
I would prefer proper installments so that pedophiles are not nor criminals of any threat allowed to have a passport and to be checked when without a passport.

P.S they changed it from three weeks to one week all of sudden,why i have no idea.

read my post again. we share an open border with the UK. since he was picked up near this, there is a good chance he came this way. Nothing could be done, and he was apprehended almost immediately. Seems the cross border security was working just great.

zuroph

caseyann wrote: »

I didnt say anything about the police at all.I said the security of them getting in,in the first place.

caseyann wrote: »

With the likes of these people wandering around Ireland and able to come and go as they please without police checks is disgraceful

:rolleyes:

metrovelvet

smelltheglove wrote: »

The fact is though many of them are afraid to be alone. I remember when I had my first my older brother looked after her for a couple of hours, he had a baby boy himself. Well the little one did a number 2 and my brother called me and asked would it be ok for him to change it or did I want him to wait for his wife to come home? He didnt know if it would be appropriate for a man to change the nappy of a girl who was not his daughter. I thought it was strange at the time but now I am a bit older I see why men are fearful.

On the school trip, I went instead, there was only one daddy there. I was telling him what my hubbie said and he felt the same only he didnt have a chice as his partner had a hospital appointment.

Sorry but if I had the care of someone else's child, I would specifically call them to ask their permission to change it.

I tell you, I had the fright of my life when I was walking down the stairs of a train station, with my three year old holding one hand, and carrying the stroller in the other, and this woman walked in front of us put her arms out and picked up my son and was about to carry him down the stairs. She thought she was helping, but she didnt ask first and my son didnt know what was happenning.

You dont touch other people's kids without asking first.

caseyann

zuroph wrote: »

:rolleyes:

Meaning when they arrive at an airport or a dock and come in to the country

Deliverance

Their is a UK website which highlights the most wanted missing sex offenders, link below:

http://www.ceop.gov.uk/wanted/

There was an incident in my area (Cork City) a couple of years back where an offender was apprehended. It transpired that during the time he was missing he worked as a DJ for a nearby schools' teenage disco. It was in the news, the amazing thing was that at the time of his arrest he looked nothing like his wanted photo. Simply because he had changed his style, hair etc.

TheFairy

caseyann wrote: »

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/england/lancashire/10475283.stm

A convicted paedophile from the UK has been remanded in custody for a week following his arrest in the Irish Republic on Wednesday.
Paden has 19 sexual convictions, including rape and indecent assault on a child.

With the likes of these people wandering around Ireland and able to come and go as they please without police checks is disgraceful,there is reason for taking reports with an open ear.
I really think time to take in the Australian ways in Ireland for security.

LOL it was my brother who spotted him and rang the Guards!

caseyann

TheFairy wrote: »

LOL it was my brother who spotted him and rang the Guards!

What made your brother spot him?

caseyann

Deliverance wrote: »

Their is a UK website which highlights the most wanted missing sex offenders, link below:

http://www.ceop.gov.uk/wanted/

There was an incident in my area (Cork City) a couple of years back where an offender was apprehended. It transpired that during the time he was missing he worked as a DJ for a nearby schools' teenage disco. It was in the news, the amazing thing was that at the time of his arrest he looked nothing like his wanted photo. Simply because he had changed his style, hair etc.

That in itself is scary,how they can leave countries and go anywhere they want,simple change of look and name and set up for good in new area,non the wiser community.

Mick Daly

caseyann wrote: »

What made your brother spot him?

He was outside a kids swimming pool.

caseyann

Mick Daly wrote: »

He was outside a kids swimming pool.

Are you fairy's brother?

Deliverance

caseyann wrote: »

That in itself is scary,how they can leave countries and go anywhere they want,simple change of look and name and set up for good in new area,non the wiser community.

Uk law awhile back: dictated that offenders were put on a list and should be monitored as such i.e. on the books as offenders. They lost the right to privacy by their actions.

I said to friends at the time that this was a not good idea as it would only drive offenders across the water to a country that was not as prepared in this new privacy law and did not have a registry that was in place.

The effect of this UK law was the driving of a problem which did occur i.e. the offenders came to Ireland to gain more privacy for themselves.

In my opinion these offenders have the 'oppurtunity' to travel into our country with the offences on record in the UK. Yet they are not recognised via our law in the same way as what the UK law demands.

This is why so many of them move to Ireland as a refuge in a way. The Irish gov needs to comply with the offenders registry that exists in the UK to properly achieve a responsible level of protection for children in this case by working with the English gov.

Pushing offenders from pillar to post is a bad idea, keeping track of them in a resonsible way is much better. Discussion should be had between govs to apply the law with regards to these people.

Some work needs to be done at the gov level in my opinion and experience.

caseyann

Deliverance wrote: »

Uk law awhile back: dictated that offenders were put on a list and should be monitored as such i.e. on the books as offenders. They lost the right to privacy by their actions.

I said to friends at the time that this was a not good idea as it would only drive offenders across the water to a country that was not as prepared in this new privacy law and did not have a registry that was in place.

The effect of this UK law was the driving of a problem which did occur i.e. the offenders came to Ireland to gain more privacy for themselves.

In my opinion these offenders have the 'oppurtunity' to travel into our country with the offences on record in the UK. Yet they are not recognised via our law in the same way as what the UK law demands.

This is why so many of them move to Ireland as a refuge in a way. The Irish gov needs to comply with the offenders registry that exists in the UK to properly achieve a responsible level of protection for children in this case by working with the English gov.

Pushing offenders from pillar to post is a bad idea, keeping track of them in a resonsible way is much better. Discussion should be had between govs to apply the law with regards to these people.

Some work needs to be done at the gov level in my opinion and experience.

I agree with you completely they need to be monitored and these laws implemented in Ireland also.I have heard they are crossing the waters to Netherlands also.The safe havens seem to be smaller places ie Iceland etc..also.
Would not the finger printing passports where touch of hand on screen all history come up be a great way forward?

Deliverance

caseyann wrote: »

I agree with you completely they need to be monitored and these laws implemented in Ireland also.I have heard they are crossing the waters to Netherlands also.The safe havens seem to be smaller places ie Iceland etc..also.
Would not the finger printing passports where touch of hand on screen all history come up be a great way forward?

Interesting thought. I had the same passport idea myself as this thread was developing. I imagine that once a genuinely convicted person had the offence recorded in some way. i.e. a brand or identifying mark in some way?

I imagined a red mark on the passport, or at least something identifying the man or woman as a potential offender that has served a sentence and is most likely to repeat. This would alert the authorities to the potential and would more importantly let the offender know that they are being monitored.

OK that sounds draconian in itself but is not the long term price to pay as a sentence via being identified as a 'free' paedophile who is a potential re-offender who could potentially ruin lives?

To me justice for a man or woman who ruins a child's life via abuse of this nature is the ultimate crime, and it is horrible, they made a choice and subsequently should have their right to privacy removed via the very nature of their crime against humanity (We all agree that it is said crime).

'Their' right to privacy should be removed in a responsible way via law. They gave up rights to absolute anonymity when they chose to hurt and destroy individuals lives as a life choice for their own selfish needs.

Apoligies for partial rant, but these folks need to be exposed and I think that a responsible and realised attitude towards them is paramount in our society to effectively deal with them.

Personally I see them as a subnormal part of society that is unusual and therefore outside normal law and indeed normal human practices. These offenders gave up their rights, they gave up those rights when they decided to put it upon themselves to take away the given rights of the kids that they abused. Children have rights, the abusers do not get that, they really don't. The abusers shoud be educated and punished as such.

Until a better system comes along then that is the best I can offer as an opinion.

TheFairy

caseyann wrote: »

What made your brother spot him?

He just thought the guy looked dodgy and that he knew him from somewhere, so we went back to the house and googled him. Seemingly he was a seriously dangerous individual.

zuroph

caseyann wrote: »

Meaning when they arrive at an airport or a dock and come in to the country

There is no airport or dock at the northern Ireland republic border.