Rip off Ireland dead?

davo10

g32, in the last 2 months the exchange rate has gone from 96p/€1 to 82p/€1 today. Put in simple terms if you live in the South and buy in the North, goods have gotten over 14% more expensive during that period, this is not difficult to understand and is not just an opinion, it is a fact. If sterling rate falls further (which every economist expects it to), the purchase of goods in the North will become more expensive for Irish shoppers as they will not be getting as much sterling for their €. Now it does not require a lot of lateral thinking to understand that the cost differential will narrow and that the 30% you are talking about is a thing of the past. Incidently if the exchange rate goes below 70p/€1 then the goods you refer to will be cheaper here than in the North and all this without either retailer changing their prices, this is kids stuff.
Below cost selling as a loss leader is not the "going rate" in any sector of a market economy, it is an inducement to bring people into a store to buy other products and can only be offerred when bulk purchases and discounts can be obtained by the vendor.
If people do not want to buy alcohol the rest of us will just have to accept that, we have more important things to worry about.

Skopzz

davo10 wrote: »

g32, in the last 2 months the exchange rate has gone from 96p/€1 to 82p/€1 today. Put in simple terms if you live in the South and buy in the North, goods have gotten over 14% more expensive during that period, this is not difficult to understand and is not just an opinion, it is a fact. If sterling rate falls further (which every economist expects it to), the purchase of goods in the North will become more expensive for Irish shoppers as they will not be getting as much sterling for their €. Now it does not require a lot of lateral thinking to understand that the cost differential will narrow and that the 30% you are talking about is a thing of the past. Incidently if the exchange rate goes below 70p/€1 then the goods you refer to will be cheaper here than in the North and all this without either retailer changing their prices, this is kids stuff.
Below cost selling as a loss leader is not the "going rate" in any sector of a market economy, it is an inducement to bring people into a store to buy other products and can only be offerred when bulk purchases and discounts can be obtained by the vendor.
If people do not want to buy alcohol the rest of us will just have to accept that, we have more important things to worry about.

It won't slip much further because the UK economy and deficit are worrying investors.

davo10

It will, significant austerity measures, likely vat increases and a cut in capital expenditure will further impact the strength of sterling. The rate of change may slow slightly but it will continue.

borderlinemeath

Gucky wrote: »

I'm Northern Irish?
just checked my passport from cover to cover and I can't see any reference to 'Northern Ireland' on it. Only Ireland (Irish citizen)

Also their is nothing Juvenile nor dangerous about refusing to accept that one part of our Island is a 'different country'.

I actually am kind of shocked and sickened to read a comment like that on an Irish website.

Just for the record, their is nothing juvenile (nor false) in my beliefs and thoughts, I stand up for what I believe in (not in armchair politics as you referred to it) but in actions and words.

So you would behave in a manner to endanger life rather than have somebody class you as "Northern Irish"??
That to me is very juvenile or a very dangerous statement to make.

Have a look at a political map of this country - see the border?? Yes it's a different country.
World Cup is on at the moment - RoI nor Northern Ireland qualified. They play as different countries.
British General Elections - yes I do believe they voted in Northern Ireland.

Whatever you believe in it doesn't take away from the fact that there are trading differences between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland which is in line with the UK.

g32

davo10 wrote: »

Below cost selling as a loss leader is not the "going rate" in any sector of a market economy, it is an inducement to bring people into a store to buy other products and can only be offerred when bulk purchases and discounts can be obtained by the vendor.

You're lying, it is not a 'loss leader'. If anything, it gives a competitive advantage against the higher priced rivals. You're saying a low-cost retailer is operating at a loss (even though he/she gets more customers). Where do you get your facts from?

borderlinemeath

Skopzz wrote: »

You're judgmental of people. You ain't going to do well in business with that attitude.

Doing your 'patriotic' duty by shopping local - ah, how hypocritical.

It's a forum, I make judgements on what people write about themselves.

If somebody wants to project themselves as a suicidal nationalist based on what somebody says on a forum then yes by all means I judge them as either a young fool making a rash statement or somebody who is a danger to themselves and/or others.

What's hypocritical about shopping local? I shop around, I spend whatever I can in my local town and do my bit in keeping the shops going. I don't have to but I want to.

g32

davo10 wrote: »

It will, significant austerity measures, likely vat increases and a cut in capital expenditure will further impact the strength of sterling. The rate of change may slow slightly but it will continue.

Davo,

The UK has indicated that there will be NO Tax Rises to tackle their deficit. Just cut backs. In laymans terms, that means no other VAT rises. There you go, it did not stop cross border shopping.

Ghandee

borderlinemeath wrote: »

So you would behave in a manner to endanger life rather than have somebody class you as "Northern Irish"??
That to me is very juvenile or a very dangerous statement to make.

Have a look at a political map of this country - see the border?? Yes it's a different country.
World Cup is on at the moment - RoI nor Northern Ireland qualified. They play as different countries.
British General Elections - yes I do believe they voted in Northern Ireland.

Whatever you believe in it doesn't take away from the fact that there are trading differences between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland which is in line with the UK.

Where have i even come CLOSE to stating that I would endanger life?

Skopzz

borderlinemeath wrote: »

It's a forum, I make judgements on what people write about themselves.

If somebody wants to project themselves as a suicidal nationalist based on what somebody says on a forum then yes by all means I judge them as either a young fool making a rash statement or somebody who is a danger to themselves and/or others.

What's hypocritical about shopping local? I shop around, I spend whatever I can in my local town and do my bit in keeping the shops going. I don't have to but I want to.

If you were 'patriotic', you wouldn't be so double standard. On the one hand you want people to be 'patriotic' and shop local, while on the other you demonize those who raise the issue over sovereignty. Don't know if you knew this but a united Ireland would actually benefit you because there would be no cross-border shopping, maybe you weren't the brightest to think about that!

borderlinemeath

Gucky wrote: »

Moderator or not, your talking rubbish!





I for one would gladly die before declaring the North as a different country!
Shame on you!

There.

And no, why would I march? I'm not political nor from Ulster.

Although I was working in Dublin City Centre back in Feb 07 when the "Love Ulster" parade went through Dublin City Centre and every nationalist Thug came out of the woodwork and caused a riot. Set cars on fire, smashed windows and caused mayhem.
Really showed themselves up that day. I wasn't overly proud to be Irish.

g32

borderlinemeath wrote: »

There.

And no, why would I march? I'm not political nor from Ulster.

Although I was working in Dublin City Centre back in Feb 07 when the "Love Ulster" parade went through Dublin City Centre and every nationalist Thug came out of the woodwork and caused a riot. Set cars on fire, smashed windows and caused mayhem.
Really showed themselves up that day. I wasn't overly proud to be Irish.

You need to get your facts right before you bluff.

It was February 2006, not 2007.

borderlinemeath

Skopzz wrote: »

If you were 'patriotic', you wouldn't be so double standard. On the one hand you want people to be 'patriotic' and shop local, while on the other you demonize those who raise the issue over sovereignty. Don't know if you knew this but a united Ireland would actually benefit you because there would be no cross-border shopping, maybe you weren't the brightest to think about that!

I didn't "demonize"
I wasn't the only one who pointed out that politically and economically we are two different countries.

The forum isn't about a United Ireland it's about consumer economics.

You're romantic view of a united Ireland without cross border shopping would be nice though. But 400 years of history put a spanner in that works. Doh!

Ghandee

Skopzz wrote: »

If you were 'patriotic', you wouldn't be so double standard. On the one hand you want people to be 'patriotic' and shop local, while on the other you demonize those who raise the issue over sovereignty. Don't know if you knew this but a united Ireland would actually benefit you because there would be no cross-border shopping, maybe you weren't the brightest to think about that!

Couldn't have said it better myself!

TBH I'm still in shock and awe that a fellow 'Irish' man would lecture another on recognising political maps, drawn up (illegaly) by a country, who for over 800 years have murdered, enslaved and dictated to our country.

In one breath he claims to 'prefer' not to go up and spend money in the 6 counties to stop the UK exchequer getting his money, whilst in the next breath lecture me on being 'Northern Irish' as opposed to Irish, and the importance of political borders to seperate the two 'different countries'

I may have been born outside the 'real' Ireland borderlinemeath, but it would seem to me that I have more Irish and patriotism in my little finger than you do. Bearing in mind your a 'bona fide Irishman!'

davo10

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/8694558.stm
g32 type in "below cost selling alcohol Northern Ireland" in google.co.uk and you will get details of current UK government policy changes in store.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article7025833.ece
As for Vat increases, this is inevitable as it is one of the simplest ways of increasing revenue and one of the first things all governments look at.

borderlinemeath

g32 wrote: »

You need to get your facts right before you bluff.

It was February 2006, not 2007.

You're probably right about the year, I didn't partake in the march so I can't quite remember.I was working though and had to shut the shop I was working in and pull the shutters to protect the staff and customers from the Nationalist Thugs who were hell bent on causing trouble for peaceful Ulster marchers.
You seem to be fairly clued in on it though, maybe you were involved?

I do remember there was an Ireland V Wales rugby match on and the Welsh were fairly disgusted with what they saw and there was needless violence on the streets of Dublin, particularly Nassau St.

Ghandee

borderlinemeath wrote: »

There.

And no, why would I march? I'm not political nor from Ulster.

Although I was working in Dublin City Centre back in Feb 07 when the "Love Ulster" parade went through Dublin City Centre and every nationalist Thug came out of the woodwork and caused a riot. Set cars on fire, smashed windows and caused mayhem.
Really showed themselves up that day. I wasn't overly proud to be Irish.

I said I would gladly die, not I would gladly kill nor kill myself, which is neither endangering lives nor suicidal! :eek:

I asked if you would be marching because you sounded just like a loyalist/orangeman/Paisleyite with your Pro British speeches, and your lectures on recognising political borders to split the island in two.

On a closing note, I suggest having a read at your National Anthems lyrics.
Savour the words the next time your proudly singing it with your eyes closed, and decypher the chorus!

Ghandee

borderlinemeath wrote: »

You're probably right about the year, I didn't partake in the march so I can't quite remember.I was working though and had to shut the shop I was working in and pull the shutters to protect the staff and customers from the Nationalist Thugs who were hell bent on causing trouble for peaceful Ulster marchers.
You seem to be fairly clued in on it though, maybe you were involved?

I do remember there was an Ireland V Wales rugby match on and the Welsh were fairly disgusted with what they saw and there was needless violence on the streets of Dublin, particularly Nassau St.

Your an out and out laugh.

Read about your peaceful Orange marchers and their kindly ways here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drumcree_conflict#1999.E2.80.93present

g32

borderlinemeath wrote: »

You're probably right about the year, I didn't partake in the march so I can't quite remember.

I AM right about the year because you do not know what you are talking about.

borderlinemeath wrote: »

You seem to be fairly clued in on it though, maybe you were involved?

Good Lord man, do calm down.

borderlinemeath

Gucky wrote: »

Couldn't have said it better myself!

TBH I'm still in shock and awe that a fellow 'Irish' man would lecture another on recognising political maps, drawn up (illegaly) by a country, who for over 800 years have murdered, enslaved and dictated to our country.

In one breath he claims to 'prefer' not to go up and spend money in the 6 counties to stop the UK exchequer getting his money, whilst in the next breath lecture me on being 'Northern Irish' as opposed to Irish, and the importance of political borders to seperate the two 'different countries'

I may have been born outside the 'real' Ireland borderlinemeath, but it would seem to me that I have more Irish and patriotism in my little finger than you do. Bearing in mind your a 'bona fide Irishman!'

I'm a bona fide Irish Woman I'll have you know!!

I was born and raised in Dublin of Limerick and Kildare parentage.
As I have stated before my Great Great Aunt Margaret "Peig" Beatty was a member of the old IRA and while she didn't fight - she was a covert operative prior to the 1916 rising.
Her name is inscribed in Kilmainham for her efforts in the Cause.

I never said you were born outside the "real" Ireland. Northern Ireland is real- but it's still Northern Ireland. It's due to you're upbringing that you consider yourself Irish but some of your neighbours/co-workers etc consider themselves British.
But politically and economically Northern Ireland is a different country and there's no getting away from that fact and on a forum discussing cross border shopping it is a very relevent fact.

davo10

What has all this nationalist stuff got to do with rip off Ireland, could this please be discussed on a seperate new thread?

Ghandee

borderlinemeath wrote: »

I'm a bona fide Irish Woman I'll have you know!!

I was born and raised in Dublin of Limerick and Kildare parentage.
As I have stated before my Great Great Aunt Margaret "Peig" Beatty was a member of the old IRA and while she didn't fight - she was a covert operative prior to the 1916 rising.
Her name is inscribed in Kilmainham for her efforts in the Cause.

I never said you were born outside the "real" Ireland. Northern Ireland is real- but it's still Northern Ireland. It's due to you're upbringing that you consider yourself Irish but some of your neighbours/co-workers etc consider themselves British.
But politically and economically Northern Ireland is a different country and there's no getting away from that fact and on a forum discussing cross border shopping it is a very relevent fact.

Good on Peggy.

Shes not the one telling me that I'm 'Northern Irish' though, and you should go to a Derry v Armagh GAA match some Sunday afternoon and preach your beliefs, tell those supporters who drove for 3 hours to Dublin that they came from a different country! Wouldnt go down well, trust me!

Sorry, I wrongly assumed you were a man, dont know what made me think that, I stand corrected though.

Ghandee

davo10 wrote: »

What has all this nationalist stuff got to do with rip off Ireland, could this please be discussed on a seperate new thread?

it kicked off when I corrected someone on telling me that I came from a different country.
Back to the original topic though................:cool:

91011

Back to topic -

g32 - why aren't you complaining about the rip off fuel prices over the border?

Take strabane - its a utter rip-off that within just 1km you can pay €1.21 for a litre if diesel on the southern side of the border, just a few hundred metres further you'll pay £1.26 (€1.53) - thats a ridiculous 23% difference for the exact same product.

Surely the northern ireland fuel retailers are ripping off anyone that drops by for a few litres of diesel?

Put it another way - a standard 50 litre fill will cost you just over €60 south of the border and whopping rip off amount of €76.50 north of the border???

What gives??

davo10

excellent, g32 did you get a chance to read those links i posted?.

91011 great example, the UK government placed a high tariff on car fuel just as the irish government placed a high tariff on alcohol, I forget what percentage of a pint of beer goes to the revenue but I'm sure some readers in the trade will know. I'm also told that TV's and premium brand clothing is also more expensive in the North but have no hard facts on this.

borderlinemeath

Gucky wrote: »

Good on Peggy.

Shes not the one telling me that I'm 'Northern Irish' though, and you should go to a Derry v Armagh GAA match some Sunday afternoon and preach your beliefs, tell those supporters who drove for 3 hours to Dublin that they came from a different country! Wouldnt go down well, trust me!

Sorry, I wrongly assumed you were a man, dont know what made me think that, I stand corrected though.

She would probably have told you feck off home and make your Mammy a cup of tea wherever she lived!
She was a character and lived until she was 99 and her mind was still razor sharp til the day she died.
I did say way back that the GAA were the one thing that did Unify Ireland through sport. I have been to a few Armagh matches and Monaghan matches as my partner is from Monaghan although the talk is never of shopping!!

It is hard sometimes to guess whether posters are male or female. It seems the majority of posters on here are male and I don't really come across as a "girly girl" through my posts anywhere - I hope I don't come across as male though!

Ghandee

91011 wrote: »

Back to topic -

g32 - why aren't you complaining about the rip off fuel prices over the border?

Take strabane - its a utter rip-off that within just 1km you can pay €1.21 for a litre if diesel on the southern side of the border, just a few hundred metres further you'll pay £1.26 (€1.53) - thats a ridiculous 23% difference for the exact same product.

Surely the northern ireland fuel retailers are ripping off anyone that drops by for a few litres of diesel?

Put it another way - a standard 50 litre fill will cost you just over €60 south of the border and whopping rip off amount of €76.50 north of the border???

What gives??

I have answered this in another thread (and it got ignored)
Petrol and diesel may well be more expensive in the north, HOWEVER
We may well have a cheaper rate of fuel at the pumps, but that where the comparison ends.
We pay WAY more for motor tax, and we also pay tolls on the road.

So, to sum it up, if I used €70 a week in diesel to get from Kilkenny to Blanchardstown for a year in my 2006 Passat.
€70 x 48 weeks (allow for holidays etc) = €3360 (£2788 at .83p)
Toll charge (assuming Im registerd) 2€per trip so 20 euro per week based on a five day week x 48 = €960 (£796.80 per year)
Road tax per year = €582 or £483.06

total for year €3360 + €960 + €582 = €4902 per year. (£4068.66)

In the North, the same fuel would come to £72.89 (based on my 70 euro divided by our fuel rate of 1.21 to give me 57.85 litres, so multiply that by the norths £1.26 a litre)
£72.89 x 48 weeks = £3498 (€4215)
No road tolls in north = £0
Car tax on a 2006 Passat = £180 (€216.86)

total for year 3498 + 0 + 180 = £3678 (€4431)

so cost of running a car in north per year = €4431
versus our cost of = €4902

Obviously these are rough estimates, based only on theory (exchange rates variable etc) but its not all sweet here with our charges on motoring either!

Before I get jumped on I am the first to admit I am no mathematician so if I have miscalculated or misquoted please forgive me!

davo10

Gucky I think what we are trying to say is that the costs of goods snd services is complex and not dependent only on the vendors profit margin, currency exchange rates/tariffs/costs of doing business etc play an important part in what the consumer pays. If the vendor makes a loss on the goods he/she sells it is only a matter of time before they go bust. g32 thinks that because he pays less for something in another country, that anyone selling the same item here for more is taking a bigger profit, that's simply not true.

Ghandee

davo10 wrote: »

excellent, g32 did you get a chance to read those links i posted?.

91011 great example, the UK government placed a high tariff on car fuel just as the irish government placed a high tariff on alcohol, I forget what percentage of a pint of beer goes to the revenue but I'm sure some readers in the trade will know. I'm also told that TV's and premium brand clothing is also more expensive in the North but have no hard facts on this.

Dont think the TV bit is correct anyway Davo, I think we pay a higher rate of tax on electrical goods, plus we get whacked with a recycle charge(disposable levy) on top of that.
Oh, any by the way, the environmental disposal levy is charged *after* VAT, so basically I'm paying tax on my tax!

I know that it worked out a hell of a lot cheaper for me to buy a Plasma via Dixons in the North than here (back in 2007) and Amazon, Play.com etc have stopped shipping some electrical goods as they wouldnt get drawn into our WEE charges, (I THINK so dont murder me here) that they would have ended up having to foot the bill themselves and had no way of claiming the charges back.......... (stands back and waits to be corrected)

davo10

Just an aside gucky, did you have problems getting the irish stations on your TV?, I had to get sky because I could recieve analog stations on UK tv

Terrontress

Gucky wrote: »

I have answered this in another thread (and it got ignored)
Petrol and diesel may well be more expensive in the north, HOWEVER
We may well have a cheaper rate of fuel at the pumps, but that where the comparison ends.
We pay WAY more for motor tax, and we also pay tolls on the road.

So, to sum it up, if I used €70 a week in diesel to get from Kilkenny to Blanchardstown for a year in my 2006 Passat.
€70 x 48 weeks (allow for holidays etc) = €3360 (£2788 at .83p)
Toll charge (assuming Im registerd) 2€per trip so 20 euro per week based on a five day week x 48 = €960 (£796.80 per year)
Road tax per year = €582 or £483.06

total for year €3360 + €960 + €582 = €4902 per year. (£4068.66)

In the North, the same fuel would come to £72.89 (based on my 70 euro divided by our fuel rate of 1.21 to give me 57.85 litres, so multiply that by the norths £1.26 a litre)
£72.89 x 48 weeks = £3498 (€4215)
No road tolls in north = £0
Car tax on a 2006 Passat = £180 (€216.86)

total for year 3498 + 0 + 180 = £3678 (€4431)

so cost of running a car in north per year = €4431
versus our cost of = €4902

Obviously these are rough estimates, based only on theory (exchange rates variable etc) but its not all sweet here with our charges on motoring either!

Before I get jumped on I am the first to admit I am no mathematician so if I have miscalculated or misquoted please forgive me!

That's before VRT! The Irish motorist is one of the most heavily taxed on earth.