Aid Floatillas Attacked

biko

bambooze wrote: »

West bank, not gaza. Two soldiers actually, my mistake.. all the gory details here..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000_Ramallah_lynching

Ah, that's why I've been reading about "lynching" in the hebrew papers.
To remind people of that incident and score points.

A commando who participated in the raid said that the attack "looked like the Ramallah lynch

Israel Navy commandos: Gaza flotilla activists tried to lynch us

IDF spokeswoman Avital Leibovitch says that the small group of activists were violent and had prepared to lynch the Israeli soldiers.

Major AVITAL LEIBOVITCH (Head, International Press Branch, Israel Defense Forces): They waited for them. They planned this. They stacked sticks, knives and different kinds of metal objects. It's more than an attack. I describe it as a lynch because when you have one Navy Seal and 10 activists jumping on him trying to break his arms and legs, for me, it's a lynch.

To punish (a person) without legal process or authority, especially by hanging, for a perceived offense or as an act of bigotry.

prinz

wes wrote: »

So do you think the IDF can go around and kill whoever they please btw?

Absolutely not.

wes wrote: »

Also, are the IDF the only people allowed to defend themselves?

No, never said that either. The difference is when defending yourself becomes something else.

wes

prinz wrote: »

Absolutely not.

In agreement.

prinz wrote: »

No, never said that either. The difference is when defending yourself becomes something else.

Yeah, I would agree , but I am sure we would both have different examples.

Ping Chow Chi

biko wrote: »

Major AVITAL LEIBOVITCH (Head, International Press Branch, Israel Defense Forces): They waited for them. They planned this. They stacked sticks, knives and different kinds of metal objects. It's more than an attack. I describe it as a lynch because when you have one Navy Seal and 10 activists jumping on him trying to break his arms and legs, for me, it's a lynch

you would have thought that if they had planned for this, that they would have had some machine guns and rpg's hidden about the place rather than stuff that, well you could probably dig up at a moments notice onboard a large ship....strange that.

Jerus

Is it by coincidence the largest ship in the Flotilla was Turkish - Israel's only muslim ally..? Was it by coincidence that a number of foreign nationals were on these ships..? Israel attacks a turkish vessel on international waters - the turkish government now break relations with Israel, isolating Israel from any muslim country. The other nationalities on board are protected by there own governments, These governments have to denounce Israel's actions thus isolating Israel further and putting the emphasis back on the blokade of Gaza and supprt/sympathy for the Gazan cause.
Whoever masterminded this little PR stunt did a very good job. Shame Israel doesn't play PR - Israel doesn't play full stop. In a territory where the controlling entity believe in one thing - violence. Ismail Haniyeh (leader of Hamas in Gaza) called for a day of 'Rage' in protest to the Israeli siege. A day of Rage..? Are you serious..? Nice people. Allow thousands of tonnes of 'humanitarian aid' in there and all will be used for peaceful means - feeding the palestinian people, building the infrastucture and schools for the children. The same children these Hamas animals brainwash to kill. They care for there young do Hamas. Any serious, open minded member of this forum should understand what Israel have to contend with on there doorstep. A vicious, brutal and callous group that uses there own young as walking bombs!
Hamas needs to recognize Israel, denounce violence and come to the table to talk peace. Hamas do not recognize the legitimacy of the state of Israel and encourage the most extreme violence against her. This is why there is a need to check all supplies entering Gaza. Israel have a duty first to protect her own citizens from attack. Any aid going into Gaza needs to be checked and ensured they cannot be used for violent means.
I've been a witness to a suicide bomb in Israel. The shock and horror of that night still haunts me today. I sympathise with the palestinian people but they need to understand with Hamas in control of Gaza there is never going to be any kind of peace. The frustration of the palestinian people is completely understandable but you cannot expect Israel to negotiate with a party intent on her destruction.

Indubitable

Jerus wrote: »

Is it by coincidence the largest ship in the Flotilla was Turkish - Israel's only muslim ally..?

......................................

I sympathise with the palestinian people but they need to understand with Hamas in control of Gaza there is never going to be any kind of peace. The frustration of the palestinian people is completely understandable but you cannot expect Israel to negotiate with a party intent on her destruction.

Please punctuate, it kills my eyes

bambooze

Media reports in Ankara on Wednesday revealed that three out of the four Turkish citizens that were killed during the raid declared their wishes to become shahids (martyrs). Another Dutch report claimed a Dutch activist, who was arrested by the IDF is suspected of being a senior Hamas operative.


Slowly but surely the details about just who these people were is surfacing.. angels they aint.

nice1franko

Slowly but surely the information about the Aid Floatillas being fired at before being boarded is coming out (Despite the Media Blackout by the Israelis):

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/flotilla-attack-first-the-shots-then-the-ship-was-turned-into-a-lake-of-blood-1988972.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jun/01/gaza-flotilla-eyewitness-accounts-gunfire

http://story.birminghamstar.com/index.php/ct/9/cid/b8de8e630faf3631/id/642270/cs/1/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0GY-wFjFF8

Ping Chow Chi

Jerus wrote: »

This is why there is a need to check all supplies entering Gaza. Israel have a duty first to protect her own citizens from attack. Any aid going into Gaza needs to be checked and ensured they cannot be used for violent means.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2008787298_macaroni26.html

I would love to know what violent means they thought that pasta was going to be used for o_0

its more than blockade on stuff that can be used to harm people in Israel, its a collective punishment, that's why people want to see it relaxed.

Surely you can see treating a people in this way is wrong?

oh and welcome to the boards Jerus, hope you stick about even after this latest tale unfolds.

Indubitable

Ping Chow Chi wrote: »

I would love to know what violent means they thought that pasta was going to be used for o_0

I would imagine pasta shells in a pipe bomb would really hurt.

Archie D Bunker

nice1franko wrote: »

Slowly but surely the information about the Aid Floatillas being fired at before being boarded is coming out (Despite the Media Blackout by the Israelis):

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/flotilla-attack-first-the-shots-then-the-ship-was-turned-into-a-lake-of-blood-1988972.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jun/01/gaza-flotilla-eyewitness-accounts-gunfire

http://story.birminghamstar.com/index.php/ct/9/cid/b8de8e630faf3631/id/642270/cs/1/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0GY-wFjFF8

the only thing actually said was that the IDF fired warning shots (so the ship will stop, which is customary if the ship refuses to stop) before they boarded the ship.

nice1franko

bambooze wrote: »

Media reports in Ankara on Wednesday revealed that three out of the four Turkish citizens that were killed during the raid declared their wishes to become shahids (martyrs). Another Dutch report claimed a Dutch activist, who was arrested by the IDF is suspected of being a senior Hamas operative.


Slowly but surely the details about just who these people were is surfacing.. angels they aint.

Frankly, I'm strongly suspicious of at least two posters who signed up to boards.ie when this thread surfaced and who have since posted nothing but unquestioning support of Israeli actions - despite widespread international condemnation.

We've shills before and we'll have them again.

nice1franko

Archie D Bunker wrote: »

the only thing actually said was that the IDF fired warning shots (so the ship will stop, which is customary if the ship refuses to stop) before they boarded the ship.

I suggest you read the links before summarising them.

"First it was warning shots, but when the Mavi Marmara wouldn't stop, these warnings turned into an attack."

bambooze

nice1franko wrote: »

Frankly, I'm strongly suspicious of at least two posters who signed up to boards.ie when this thread surfaced and who have since posted nothing but unquestioning support of Israeli actions - despite widespread international condemnation.

We've shills before and we'll have them again.

Attack the messenger when you don't like the message?

IrishTonyO

bambooze wrote: »

Media reports in Ankara on Wednesday revealed that three out of the four Turkish citizens that were killed during the raid declared their wishes to become shahids (martyrs). Another Dutch report claimed a Dutch activist, who was arrested by the IDF is suspected of being a senior Hamas operative.


Slowly but surely the details about just who these people were is surfacing.. angels they aint.

some references please

Ping Chow Chi

nice1franko wrote: »

Frankly, I'm strongly suspicious of at least two posters who signed up to boards.ie when this thread surfaced and who have since posted nothing but unquestioning support of Israeli actions - despite widespread international condemnation.

We've shills before and we'll have them again.

To be fair, we picked up more than before, maybe the boards are becoming popular in certain circles

Wibbs

Jerus wrote: »

I've been a witness to a suicide bomb in Israel. The shock and horror of that night still haunts me today. I sympathise with the palestinian people but they need to understand with Hamas in control of Gaza there is never going to be any kind of peace. The frustration of the palestinian people is completely understandable but you cannot expect Israel to negotiate with a party intent on her destruction.

Oh I agree. The only problem is that any time the arabs have suggested peace and ceasefires the land grabs continue. They've been forced into smaller and smaller and smaller areas since the founding of the state. More to the point since the UN borders of 1967.

Its my opinion that too many Israelis at the top are only too happy to have the hamas/al-Qaida/PLO boogieman out there. "Oh look what they do to us, so we have a right to defend ourselves" while stealing more and more land with government backing. And too many Palestinians at thetop are only too happy to whip up religious and racial fervour to keep power as well. The militants on both sides are in control and ordinary palestinians and israelis too have suffered and are suffering for it. Ordinary people on both sides who would be only too happy to just live their lives are caught up in the rhetoric and the BS on the back of fear. I read a report on the amount of post traumatic stress and suicide in former IDF soldiers. Scary reading. Its not just the Palestinians suffering, though their plight is more obvious.

Even on this thread we have polar opposites, both claiming the high moral ground, bringing their own issues to bear. Most living pretty sheltered lives by comparison too. No insult to people BTW, but this stuff is easy to take sides at a distance. If I was a Jew living on the border living under the threat of rocket attacks and suicide bombs from a culture alien to me, while from the womb I was told I was part of a group with a god given right to the land. Then put into military service barely out of my childhood? I'm pretty sure I'd have twitchy trigger fingers and would harbour distrust and hate towards my neighbours. If I was a Palestinian, watching missile attacks into my ever decreasing land, while being taught that this alien culture had the curse of god on them, I'm pretty sure I'd be lobbing rocks too. No one is a winner here.

Ping Chow Chi

good post wibbs, a nice balanced view

nice1franko

bambooze wrote: »

Attack the messenger when you don't like the message?

You've posted on four threads since you signed up on the 10th March:

Israel launches pre-emptive strike on peace talks
ECHR ruling on “Right of Return” for Refugees - A blow to Palestinian demands?
Israeli Secret Service asked to inspect Irish passport production facility
Aid Floatillas Attacked

Links listed here:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/search.php?do=finduser&u=315460

For the sake of honest and fair discussion it's only fair that trolls and shills are rooted out. Whichever... no one likes what you and your mate are selling.

bambooze

nice1franko wrote: »

You've posted on four threads since you signed up on the 10th March:

Israel launches pre-emptive strike on peace talks
ECHR ruling on “Right of Return” for Refugees - A blow to Palestinian demands?
Israeli Secret Service asked to inspect Irish passport production facility
Aid Floatillas Attacked

Links listed here:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/search.php?searchid=12430160&pp=25&page=2

For the sake of honest and fair discussion it's only fair that trolls and shills are rooted out... either way, no one likes what you and your mate are selling.

Umm..
Join Date: 31-05-2010

bambooze

nice1franko wrote: »

For the sake of honest and fair discussion it's only fair that trolls and shills are rooted out. Whichever... no one likes what you and your mate are selling.

Honest and fair discussion as long as its something you agree with? Got it.

mikom

bambooze wrote: »

Umm..
Join Date: 31-05-2010

Ever more incriminating.

bambooze

mikom wrote: »

Ever more incriminating.

Oh of course! I signed up so I could take part in a discussion that interested me. Unheard of on boards I suppose right? :rolleyes:

mikom

bambooze wrote: »

Oh of course! I signed up so I could take part in a discussion that interested me. Unheard of on boards I suppose right? :rolleyes:

Timing is everything.

But I could be wrong about you
If I am, and you spread yourself around boards......... then I look forward to your requests for pork recipes in the cooking forums.

nice1franko

bambooze wrote: »

Umm..
Join Date: 31-05-2010

That was meant for Archie D Bunker, as you might have guessed - since the link was to all the posts on that account.

bambooze

mikom wrote: »

Timing is everything.

But I could be wrong about you
If I am, and you spread yourself around boards.........

No promises, I don't usually spend much time posting on boards, just lurking.

then I look forward to your requests for pork recipes in the cooking forums.

I leave the cooking to the wife.

bambooze

nice1franko wrote: »

That was meant for Archie D Bunker, as you might have guessed - since the link was to all the posts on that account.

The link no longer works, being a cached search.. so I couldn't see what it was.

nice1franko

bambooze wrote: »

The link no longer works, being a cached search.. so I couldn't see what it was.

fixed.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/search.php?do=finduser&u=315460

biko

Any trolling posts can, and should, be reported and let the mods worry about it.
Hopefully this settles it and everyone can go back to discuss the matter at hand.

Winty

Wibbs wrote: »

Even on this thread we have polar opposites, both claiming the high moral ground, bringing their own issues to bear. Most living pretty sheltered lives by comparison too. No insult to people BTW, but this stuff is easy to take sides at a distance. If I was a Jew living on the border living under the threat of rocket attacks and suicide bombs from a culture alien to me, while from the womb I was told I was part of a group with a god given right to the land. Then put into military service barely out of my childhood? I'm pretty sure I'd have twitchy trigger fingers and would harbour distrust and hate towards my neighbours. If I was a Palestinian, watching missile attacks into my ever decreasing land, while being taught that this alien culture had the curse of god on them, I'm pretty sure I'd be lobbing rocks too. No one is a winner here.

I think it would be a good idea to finish this thread on the words of Wibbs