Israel attacks Aid Flotilla. At least 2 dead

Amhran Nua

Lailah Black Rabbit wrote: »

I think we'd all agree with you there.

But when a boarding party is attacked by the occupants of these craft when options are left?.

Someone mentioned "suicide by cop" - I think thats very close to the truth this morning.

Perhaps, but you don't need to board to deploy prop foulers, just sail past them. Failing all else they could have just shot the rudders off.

danbohan

Glenshane Pass wrote: »

As I said, anyone who makes such an effort to derail and insult has a story to themselves. FlutterinBull has no doubt another such story, or maybe he is just bored and gets a kick out of being 'against the grain'.

hes just unhappy with his negative equity ignore him , Europe should for once unite and deport all Israeli ambassadors and close their embassy's for 6 month period as well as inforcing a total ban on all israeli travel to and from europe and a ban on Israeli products

Memnoch

jimi_t2 wrote: »

It was a 10,000 tonne flotilla, independent of any aid organisation or country, which was full-steam going at a military blockade outside of a warzone.

Calling it an ''aid'' flotilla lends them credibility which they haven't earned.

What international aid or humanitarian organisation condoned their original action?

They were absolutely an aid flotilla regardless of the IDF or you attempts to obfuscate this. The ships were checked prior to departure, and if the israelis had wanted to check them, they could have, but the Israeli's aren't satisfied with checking aid, they are using the rockets as an excuse to limit the aid to gaza and inflict collective punishment on its civilian population. They are using one illegal act to prop up another and one illegal act to justify another.

This isn't the Red Cross or MSF. This is a bunch of privately owned boats with people on their own remit, some of them flying Turkish flags, sailing at a military blockade.

An illegal military blockade in international or gazian waters. Unless these ships are heading for Israeli waters, which they weren't Israel had no right to touch them.

Citation? I've a fair idea of the rules of engagement and naval procedure and I'm not sure I follow your line of reasoning.

Please show me the rules of engagement and naval procedure that allow Israel to firstly blockade Gaza, secondly to board civilian aid ships in international waters?

As far as I'm aware, even the Israeli government aren't disputing the fact that these ships were carrying humanitarian aid, not rockets/missiles/guns/grenades/bombs etc.

jimi_t2

Glenshane Pass wrote: »

Don't board it.

Don't sail at a military blockade after being told of the consequences of not stopping.

Then when this happens, don't go ''resisting'' armed soldiers.

The last intention of the Israeli marines was going to be to go shooting non-soldiers when the eyes of the world were on them.

paulaa

jimi_t2 wrote: »

I'd say its more to do with stopping rockets getting into the country. They can't do a whole fecking lot with the gas if there's incendiary devices flying all over the place.

I don't agree with any of that. This is the 4th largest and best equipped army in the world supposidly. It is collective punishment to over 1.5 million trapped in and enclave with no escape.

It is because Israel didn't like the results of the democratic elections in Gaza and it is also because of the capture of 1 Israeli soldier while over 11,000 Palestinians, including many under the age of 14, are held in Israeli prisions. Many of these are held under "administrative detention", no court cases, no charges have been brought against them.

It is also imo about the gas reserves which Israel would love to get her hands on. They have already made tentative deals with gas exploration companies in expectation of being able to steal them.

All that aside, Israel has really shot herself in the foot today and the whole world sees it. They have alienated their one ally in the ME, Turkey. They have shown the world finally what happens to Palestinians on a daily basis.

Their IDF spokeswoman has just been lying through her teeth on TV and comes across as ridiculous.

Byron85

jimi_t2 wrote: »

Who said anything about unarmed?

Sticks < Sub-Machine Guns

ei.sdraob

Eight Irish activists on AID ships

Eight Irish people were travelling on a flotilla of aid ships where 15 people were reportedly shot dead today by Israeli commandos.

Michael Martin, Foreign Affairs Minister, said consular officials were working to confirm the safety of Irish people caught up in the incident.

"I am gravely concerned at the reports emerging of the storming of a Turkish ship this morning by Israeli commandos," the minister said.

Glenshane Pass

jimi_t2 wrote: »

Don't sail at a military blockade after being told of the consequences of not stopping.

Then when this happens, don't go ''resisting'' armed soldiers.

The last intention of the Israeli marines was going to be to go shooting non-soldiers when the eyes of the world were on them.

Again, don't board the ships.

I'd say its more to do with stopping rockets getting into the country. They can't do a whole fecking lot with the gas if there's incendiary devices flying all over the place.

Rockets from where, Ireland? LOL. Jeez. Even Israel aren't claiming that.

Memnoch

jimi_t2 wrote: »

Don't sail at a military blockade after being told of the consequences of not stopping.

An illegal military blockade, that has no right to police international waters or gazian waters, giving an illegal directive, threatening illegal consequences to civilian ships carrying humanitarian aid.

Then when this happens, don't go ''resisting'' armed soldiers.

The armed soldiers illegally boarded their vessels and opened fire. A handful of people were bound to try and defend themselves.

The last intention of the Israeli marines was going to be to go shooting non-soldiers when the eyes of the world were on them.

The IDF has a long and established track record of killing innocent civillians and reporters. The fact that they do not allow journalists access any more goes a long way towards broadcasting their intentions.

jimi_t2

Memnoch wrote: »

They were absolutely an aid flotilla regardless of the IDF or you attempts to obfuscate this.

There's a large large number of aid organisations in the world.

My main question here is why none of these were doing this, rather than a rag-tag bunch of people on a number of ships, some with a distinct Islamic agenda.

All it takes is one lunatic out of the many hundreds of humanitarians.

Please show me the rules of engagement and naval procedure that allow Israel to firstly blockade Gaza, secondly to board civilian aid[ ships in international waters?

Of course its illegal, we all know its illegal, but the facts remain that this was NOT a mission condoned by any government or aid organisation. This was a privately owned flotilla.

As far as I'm aware, even the Israeli government aren't disputing the fact that these ships were carrying humanitarian aid, not rockets/missiles/guns/grenades/bombs etc.

And I'm not suggesting otherwise. I'm just trying to temper the alarmist nature of some of both sides.

BluePlanet

I think these are the 8 irish people.
Pic from breakingnews.ie


Don't they look dangerous!

Glenshane Pass

My main question here is why none of these were doing this, rather than a rag-tag bunch of people on a number of ships, some with a distinct Islamic agenda.

An Islamic agenda, jesus! Whats an Islamic agenda tell me, and who on the ships have this Islamic agenda? Could there have been a Christian or Jew agenda also? Perhaps even a Jehova's Witnesses one?

Glenshane Pass

Heres why Red Cross aren't involved. And the fact that the missile hit the centre of the cross says a lot for me.

Byron85

jimi_t2 wrote: »

There's a large large number of aid organisations in the world.

My main question here is why none of these were doing this, rather than a rag-tag bunch of people on a number of ships, some with a distinct Islamic agenda.

It was organised by a Turkish Human Rights Organisation.

Is that ok with you?

jimi_t2

T.W.H Byron wrote: »

Sticks < Sub-Machine Guns

Stick + Back of the head = Free sub-machine gun

Regardless of who you are, you just don't **** with soldiers in any country, no matter how morally right you are or how illegal their actions are. The whole world was watching, they could have just kept the head down, docked and then made their case.

From what I hear some people of the many hundreds consisting the flotilla attacked the marines with timber and axes. The true facts may never come out, but at the moment I'm just going on what was said on reuters.

Pride Fighter

Awful news. The Israeli ambassador should be expelled. Assaulting an aid convoy in international waters is not on. There are people in Gaza hungry and living in tents. There is no sanitation there so disease is rife. This is the only way for aid to get through properly. Israel cannot be trusted to feed and provide medicine for the people of Gaza. They are doing an awful job so far.

digme

Pride Fighter wrote: »

Awful news. The Israeli ambassador should be expelled. Assaulting an aid convoy in international waters is not on. There are people in Gaza hungry and living in tents. There is no sanitation there so disease is rife. This is the only way for aid to get through properly. Israel cannot be trusted to feed and provide medicine for the people of Gaza. They are doing an awful job so far.

the isrealis dont look at them as people.

paulaa

Glenshane Pass wrote: »

An Islamic agenda, jesus! Whats an Islamic agenda tell me, and who on the ships have this Islamic agenda? Could there have been a Christian or Jew agenda also? Perhaps even a Jehova's Witnesses one?

lol. Someone has been listening to the Israeli apologist on TV or the newest hasbara bulletin is out !!!

jimi_t2

T.W.H Byron wrote: »

It was organised by a Turkish Human Rights Organisation.

Well then why the **** were they flying the Turkish flag? HROs strive to be independent of any country and go out of their way to be non-provocative. Name another HRO which sails at a military blockade?

Turkey wouldn't have the best track record in human rights themselves btw

dan719

Zulu wrote: »

Folks, why are you intent on side tracking this? Why can't you accept what happened?

Today Isreali commandos stormed an aid ship in international waters, and slaughtered civilians aboard.

Thats what happened.

Today a group of ships attempted to bypass a blockade that has been in place for three years. After ignoring orders to turn around from the Isreali Navy, they were attacked. Seriously, what did these people think would happen?

Glenshane Pass

jimi_t2 wrote: »

Well then why the **** were they flying the Turkish flag? HROs strive to be independent of any country and go out of their way to be non-provocative. Name another HRO which sails at a military blockade?

Turkey wouldn't have the best track record in human rights themselves btw

Because they were a Turkish registered ship?

Nice try on derailing to Turkeys human rights, who funnily enough, are pretty much in bed with Israel, so what are you trying to do here. Wish to address this, one of the reasons Red Cross might not be involved? Why don't you 'why the ****' this?

paulaa

jimi_t2 wrote: »

Stick + Back of the head = Free sub-machine gun

Regardless of who you are, you just don't **** with soldiers in any country, no matter how morally right you are or how illegal their actions are. The whole world was watching, they could have just kept the head down, docked and then made their case.

From what I hear some people of the many hundreds consisting the flotilla attacked the marines with timber and axes. The true facts may never come out, but at the moment I'm just going on what was said on reuters.

The true facts are already on video for everyone to see. I wonder did the person carrying a white flag on board that ship attack one of the commandos with it ?

jimi_t2

paulaa wrote: »

The true facts are already on video for everyone to see. I wonder did the person carrying a white flag on board that ship attack one of the commandos with it ?

Link?

Glenshane Pass

Fair play to those who resisted Israeli attempts to illegally board the ship.

arybvtcw0eolkf

dan719 wrote: »

Today a group of ships attempted to bypass a blockade that has been in place for three years. After ignoring orders to turn around from the Isreali Navy, they were attacked. Seriously, what did these people think would happen?

They knew exactly what would happen, and got the reaction from the IDF they'd hoped for.. Then we all seen how quickly their propaganda machine kicked in!.

I keep qouting it, but no one appears to listen - Col.Kemp (again)..

Some people just want to believe Israel will commit war crimes at every turn of the dice and they're too blinded by hatred to see otherwise.

Glenshane Pass

Lailah Black Rabbit wrote: »

They knew exactly what would happen, and got the reaction from the IDF they'd hoped for.. Then we all seen how quickly their propaganda machine kicked in!.

I keep qouting it, but no one appears to listen - Col.Kemp (again)..


Some people just want to believe Israel will commit war crimes at every turn of the dice and they're too blinded by hatred to see otherwise.

Propaganda machine is right. Try and be honest to the good folk reading this by being upfront about your history with the Israeli military.

And tell me, what the **** is the point of the video? Some Brit giving his version on the conflict? What weight does this carry?

arybvtcw0eolkf

Glenshane Pass wrote: »

Fair play to those who resisted Israeli attempts to illegally board the ship.

One of the most stupidest posts in the history of the internet - PEOPLE DIED!.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Glenshane Pass wrote: »

Propaganda machine is right. Try and be honest to the good folk reading this by being upfront about your history with the Israeli military.

Thats gone right over my head, why don't you educate us all on my history with the Israeli military?.

paulaa

jimi_t2 wrote: »

Link?

http://www.google.ie/search?q=israel+attacks+aid+convoy&btnGNS=Search+youtube.com&oi=navquery_searchbox&sa=X&as_sitesearch=youtube.com&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Lag&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial

Glenshane Pass

Lailah Black Rabbit wrote: »

One of the most stupidest posts in the history of the internet - PEOPLE DIED!.

Of course they did, my point stands.

Lailah Black Rabbit wrote: »

Thats gone right over my head, why don't you educate us all on my history with the Israeli military?.

Easily attained on the WWW. I'm just letting people know the nature of you're unbiased information.