Who will be at Inferno 10 on 05/06/10?

Owwmykneecap

No

Wasn't the money for the top 3 players who didn't take the evo trip?

mr_kyle

UberPrinny_Baal wrote: »

Prize acceptance is the responsibility of the participants.

Yes, I agree with you. This part of the point I am making. There was no clear cut desicion to who would be allowed to decide.

chopperbyrne wrote: »

Myself, Chunkis and Doom (Who although not an organiser is personally fronting some cash for this so definitely deserves a say) discussed this after the event.

We knew that Cobelcog, Bush and Roogle had said they couldn't go and that Azza had said he was going to be starting a job that would have him working weekends and had been quite clear that he did not want this to have anything to do with Evo and just be an Inferno as normal.

We all assumed that he did not want to go to Evo. Liquidswords was the next highest finisher and we knew he wanted to go. We were all in agreement, that we would be happy to send him as our representative.

I posted on the forum saying that the prize was his if he wanted it without double checking with Azza first. I was wrong to do this and am truly sorry for getting John's hopes up. A few hours after I posted, Azza then posted to say that he actually could and did want to go.

After this Cobelcog suggested that he might go, but has since stated that he can't.

Chunkis is in charge of the Evo prize, so hopefully he'll get on to post here later, but I think as it stands, Azza will be receiving the prize.

+rep for this post Chopper. Thank you. This adds alot of clarity. Give John a shout about this if you have not already. I'm sure he would greatly appreciate it.

But please, in future, the more that is communicated about prize distribution once ranks have been determined their and then the better. In this situation it was the unclear nature of the resolution that was the initial cause of bother.

chopperbyrne

No

I was already speaking to John earlier. Wanted to speak with him before making any kind of public post.

Sisko

No

mr_kyle wrote: »

Sisko, you have misinterpreted me quite spectacularly.

Sorry man, I didn't misinterpret you, my post probably wasn't clear. It was in response to cobelcog who said your OP was correct. And I was just saying how your post made it out like things were more clear cut and straight forward when in fact things got quite messy once the event was over unfortunately. Was just trying to make things clear for anyone else who was not there reading this thread.

I know you were not there and if I was not there either I would have pictured things the same as you did.

I wouldn't rip into the organisers as much, their job was to run an inferno and that they did well, the evo thing was landed on top of them.

Kirby

I understand that being told you have the ticket......and then being told a day later you don't is heart breaking. I know i'd be well pissed off liquid. So I hear you. We all do mate. And we definately want to see you come to the next inferno. It would be a damn shame if we lost players due to stuff like this.

Regardless of who said what and when they said it..... the winner deserves to go.

In my eyes, Cobelcog won so he should be given a day or two to decide if he can or not. He is the winner and therefore the most deserving to go. And then Bush and Azza. and the liquid and hound and further down the line if they decide they can't go.

It would be different if Azza turned around and changed his mind a couple of days before the event. But the tourney isn't on for another month....and he did finish high up. If Cobelcog and Bush can't go I think Azza should get the ticket.

People have to find out if they can get time off from work or college and to see if they have the money for it. Something like that can't be decided in a split second.

Ideally, this should have been out in the open before it started but there was a bit of confusion which i'm sure won't happen next time.

On a personal note I'm glad it went well and had a good turn out. I'm gutted to miss it myself but I've been rather busy lately with stuff. Definately hope to make the next one though.

Doctor DooM

No

mr_kyle wrote: »

But please, in future, the more that is communicated about prize distribution once ranks have been determined their and then the better. In this situation it was the unclear nature of the resolution that was the initial cause of bother.

I agree completely but bear in mind none of us have ever done anything like this before. If I have involvement in organising events again I will not allow a repeat to happen. I am genuinely quite upset right now that this has stopped being a bunch of people arguing over how we should run a little club and there is someone suffering because of it. Especially as it's John who I consider quite a class act.

We've been dealing with stuff waaaaay too much on the back foot lately.

Also, I really have to say, I know you're angry John but I seriously, seriously doubt Azza is doing this to annoy or pick on you. I've known him for over a year and he has never come accross as anything but unwaveringly fair and honest (even when that honesty is something you would rather not hear!) and the amount of work he's put in to get us to this point- like many people in the community- has been truly massive.

Liquidswords

Seeing Chris can't go I'm resigned to the fact that I won't be able to make it. Obviously I have no problem with the fact that 3rd place trumps 5th it's the snake like way Azza went about it that pissed me off. To get a text that he had pulled it from under me like that while out and not beng able to reply was a complete melt and just ****ed up my day perfectly.

I don't know about the rest of you but the sequence of events that Mr Kyle asked about was exactly how I seen it. It was more or less decided I'd be going and seeing Azza was so for scraping the Evo qualifier entirely, then he gets 3rd takes his prize and wants the ticket as well, please. You would have 40 Euro in your hand and Chunkis relationship with Evo would be in jeopardy if you had got your way.

Like I said I had a hard time accepting the prize seeing I didn't play particularly well and didn't place particularly high but seeing I got 5th with a character I haven't touched in Super I was happy enough and thought with proper practise over the next month I could reach a level I would be happy with. Gearing myself up for this after being quite negative about the idea then getting a 'sorry about that...' was absolute grimness.

Sisko

No

Sorry to hear you think this was done in a snake like fashion. Azza had nothing to do with organising todays event btw. I can't speak for the guy but I'd imagine one of the reasons he was reluctant for it to be an evo thing over inferno on saturday was to avoid the mess and anger we have now.

Note that if Evo qualifier had happened the weekend before, with the 10 people there, chances were high that azza would have come 1st.

He also said that weekend that he'd go if he won it.

There wasnt any sneakyness or malice behind any of this m8 just pure miscommunication.

Sounds like you were really looking forward to going alright and obviously gutted now. I'm really sorry this has happened like this , I dunno what else to say man.:( I'd deffo be for free trip to the next inferno idea.

I really hope you won't hold any resentment to anyone over this.

Placebo

just do another fight between the WANT TO GO people

winner takes it.

Azza

No

I'm sorry Liquid you seem to think I have something personaly against you.
I don't even know you to be honest, I've barely spoken to you for more than 2 minutes. I don't even know your actual name.

You can ask anyone in the community if I have ever even mentioned your in anger before or actually ever even mentioned you at all.

I'm sorry about that time you where put in the phantom play off group. It was a genuine mistake on my part due to a miscount and I did aplogise repeatedly on the day and afterwards on boards as well as refund you and other person who did well in the play off group part of your entry fee. I'd hardly call that ****ing you over.

As for the tournament on the day, when I was asked I said I'd have to look into it. I did not actually say no, so I don't see my position as flip flopping. I did hear Roogle call your name out but I thought he was being sarcastic when he did it. I left assuming it would be decided in day or so with everyone having time to think about it. I mentioned I was considering going to Doom on IRC on the Saturday night when I got home but I'd have to think about it. When I got up the next day and I saw your name being put down seriously for taking the prize, I decided it was best to post my interest straight away to avoid having you led on any further, but I still had to wait to what my work situation was the weekend of EVO. As soon as it was confirmed I wasn't working (as opposed to taking off work and loosing several hundred euro which is alot when you don't have a regular job) I posted on boards.

As for taking the third place prize money of €15 euro I thought they prize money was to be given out regardless of who took the evo trip. If that isn't the case I'll glady give the €15 back.

Both Bush and Cobelcog considered it afterwards and as far as I'm aware both of also favoured a regular Inferno beforehand as well. As far as I'm aware Cobels gave a definitive no on the day where as I did no such thing.
Yet you seem to only have an issue with me?

Yeah I had a preference for a regular Inferno event before hand for numerous reasons many of which I doubt you are aware of.

Had I won the prize the weekend before at the event before, I would of probably said I'll take provisionally until I can confirm my work situation. If I had to take several days off work I would of just handed the prize over to someone else.

Liquidswords

Nah man, in the scrapped playoff it was already clear I came out on top it was AFTER that you came along and said I'm out anyway. When I had been picked to go to Evo you came along AFTER and stated your intentions. There is clearly a parallel, I wouldn't have brought it up again if there wasn't and I got like 5 euro back not a refund.

Chris reconsidered when I told him I would go off my own back regardless and asked if he could take his prize if I were to travel with him. At that stage I was pretty fired up to go, I have the finances to do so and I thought yeah why not. He didn't pull a b1tch move and try to pull the rug out from under me. That's why I have an issue with you, WTF is an IRC? You couldn't state your interest here?

You got 3rd, you deserve it over me but to pull rank like that after the fact was a tad feminine. I don't really care to go anymore and I have no interest in a long back and forth discussion on a message board. I hope you have a nice time in Vegas and do the community proud but I seriously doubt I could keep it civil with you face to face man, simple as that.

Azza

No

When I put you in the play off I thought only 14 had gone through to the double elimination stage. While that playoff group was running I recounted the people who went through and then realised we already had 16 people. At this point I was kinda hemming and hawing what to do because it was akward. So I asked a few people for advice and they said just explain it was an accident. By the time I went over to explain it to you the playoff group had already been run and you and another chap where first and second. Its at this point I explained to you my error and aplogised to you both as well as part refund you (and I said it was a part refund in the previous post). There was absolutley nothing intentional about that.

Seriously I barely spoken to you before that, what possible reason would I have to do that intentionally. Do you think I've randomly picked you out for some reason to mess about with? I'm not perfect you know I make mistakes but I don't just randomly start making problems with people I don't know.

IRC is a internet chat program. Alot of the community is on that. When I mentioned my interest to Doom on IRC I did not know at the time you where seriously considering going. I did not realise someone had told you that you could have the EVO prize. I thought it was still open. I did not post on boards because I wasn't sure if I could go yet. I did when I got confirmation, I could not get confirmation any quicker than I did.

Now Chris is entitled to the Evo trip over me as is Bush, I'm next in line behind them. But your saying if Chris changes his mind from no to a yes its okay. But if I change my mind from I'm not sure to a yes, I'm a snake?. Chris is allowed to change his mind but I'm not allowed time to make a decision?

ayjayirl

Highest Rank goes. end of.

Build a Bridge and get over it. As for he passive threat that I have just read from Liquid Sword...... unacceptable. "Couldn't be civil face to face".

What are you? 12?

animaX

No

By the way, isn't EVO played on ps3 only? How could chris play on his pad?

Dreddybajs

Liquidswords wrote: »

Nah man, in the scrapped playoff it was already clear I came out on top it was AFTER that you came along and said I'm out anyway. When I had been picked to go to Evo you came along AFTER and stated your intentions. There is clearly a parallel, I wouldn't have brought it up again if there wasn't and I got like 5 euro back not a refund.

Whatever about every other aspect of what's gone on, it's my opinion that Azza has tried to be as fair as possible in every decision he made while running the Inferno tournaments, and put a lot of thought behind every decision, as well as being open to discussion and advice from others in the community.

I seriously doubt any event that's transpired between he and you has been intentional in any way. You completely have the right to be pissed off at the situation but I think the idea of Azza having some personal problem with you is unfounded.

Liquidswords

Why labor the point of the playoff like it's the main bone of contention? I mentioned t wasn't the first time I'd been mistreated at an Inferno. Obviously you don't know me well, intentional or unintentional. Whatever.

Man, I thought interest was being registered at the door and the ticket would be purchased ASAP because of costs. Your flip flop was news to me and I thought it was underhanded, you doing this opened the door for Chris though I don't think any of the rest would have said they were interested like that after a choice had been made. That took a special breed of wanker.

Bottom line. You're of higher rank, you go and I wish you well.

Liquidswords

ayjayirl wrote: »

Highest Rank goes. end of.

Build a Bridge and get over it. As for he passive threat that I have just read from Liquid Sword...... unacceptable. "Couldn't be civil face to face".

What are you? 12?

I don't even know who you are. Your opinion is irrelevant.

I said I couldn't be civil, meaning not shake hands, accept an apology etc. I even stated I won't be traveling South for tournaments in future.

ayjayirl

Liquidswords wrote: »

Why labor the point of the playoff like it's the main bone of contention? I mentioned t wasn't the first time I'd been mistreated at an Inferno. Obviously you don't know me well, intentional or unintentional. Whatever.

Man, I thought interest was being registered at the door and the ticket would be purchased ASAP because of costs. Your flip flop was news to me and I thought it was underhanded, you doing this opened the door for Chris though I don't think any of the rest would have said they were interested like that after a choice had been made. That took a special breed of wanker.

Bottom line. You're of higher rank, you go and I wish you well.

I'm sorry but the highest rank player gets the right to decide whether to go or not. If that means he wants to think about it beforehand, so be it. As for you perceived thought that Azza somehow has it in for you and that he is, and I quote, "A special Breed of Wanker", is a little far fetched, even for Azza.

You'll just have to beat him next time

ayjayirl

Liquidswords wrote: »

I don't even know who you are. Your opinion is irrelevant.

I said I couldn't be civil, meaning not shake hands, accept an apology etc. I even stated I won't be traveling South for tournaments in future.

Irrelevant........ I've been called many things, never irrelevant. I'm gonna write that one down.

Now throw all the toys out of the pram.

ayjayirl

Begs the need for a formal competition rules book or something?

Just a thought.

Sorry I couldn't make it on Sat, looks like it was fun.

Doctor DooM

No

Liquidswords wrote: »

That took a special breed of wanker.

I understand you're upset but you're not allowed sling personal insults here man.

I'm going to let this one go as you're upset and I can understand why and to be honest if it was me I'd be bulling too but I really think you need to calm down.

Doctor DooM

No

ayjayirl wrote: »

Irrelevant........ I've been called many things, never irrelevant. I'm gonna write that one down.

Now throw all the toys out of the pram.

Not helping.

If it was you you'd be making just as much noise, tbh.

ayjayirl

That would mean I got out of groups........... Don't think I'd be upset =p

All seriousness, yeh, I'd probably be miffed alright...... I would then concede the point though without resorting to some personally directed Rage at Azza though followed by some diatribe about the vendetta that he has displayed towards me.........

Either way, I'm not going to Vegas

Doctor DooM

No

ayjayirl wrote: »

That would mean I got out of groups........... Don't think I'd be upset =p

All seriousness, yeh, I'd probably be miffed alright...... I would then concede the point though without resorting to some personally directed Rage at Azza though followed by some diatribe about the vendetta that he has displayed towards me.........

Either way, I'm not going to Vegas

A little empathy costs nothing my friend.

This is a very saddening occurance and I don't know what we can do to make it better- if in fact there is anything which could be done

Xinkai

No

Cobelcog won the event so in this matter I'd say he has the right to clear this up & choose who goes to evo.

Doctor DooM

No

Xinkai wrote: »

Cobelcog won the event so in this matter I'd say he has the right to clear this up & choose who goes to evo.

Moving the problem onto his shoulders for winning is not the solution.

roy nelson

split the prize, swords said hes got the financial means to pay for half and if azza can come up with the rest, its all turned up roses.

plus they can go together, even though they dont know each other

UberPrinny_Baal

No

Doctor Doom wrote:

Moving the problem onto his shoulders for winning is not the solution.

Aye, it's not like the prize was a packet of crisps he gets to pass off to a friend if he isn't hungry, this was a community driven event, and people like Chunkis and Doom I understand are putting forward significant amounts of their own personal money to make sure it happens.

Due to the special circumstances involved, I think Cobelcog only really gets to accept or pass; and since we as a community are trying to get the best representation at evo possible, the option of passing on the prize should make its way down the final rankings as it has.

The big point of contention seems to be there was no definitive deadline for the top guys to pass, but since it was like herding cats trying to get anyone to agree on anything regarding evo, we only have ourselves to blame.

I feel bad for Liquidswords, and it's a shame the details surrounding this have gotten so salty; but as a community trying to get wider world recognition we should really send the best player we have who's able to go.

"Best" is obviously variable by time and occasion, but the benchmark we chose to determine it in this case was the recent Inferno, and Azza was higher ranked, so I think we should send Azza.

I dunno if it makes Liquidswords feel any better, but at the point when players were being discussed to attend, and Doom was next in line after you, he was still pushing for you to go over him (keep in mind he's contributing more of his own money towards this than anyone else as far as I know). Which is pretty cool considering he could have said you were some kind of malicious child rapist and tried to snag the trip for himself.

But he was, in a community minded way, pushing for the best player who was able to go.

At the time that was you.

Right now, it's Azza.

Sorry

fake_roogle

Really couldn't be bothered reading this thread anymore, but I'll just say this as a point:

In the future, if a prize involves being able to travel somewhere, when you're doing signups, there should be an extra column that dictates whether you are able to take the prize or not should you win or be the highest placer. That cuts out all of this bull**** and faffing around trying to figure out who's going or not. FWIW, no other tournament I've played in other games allows time for you to decide whether you want to take the prize or not in the situation of a hand me down. You either give an answer right there and then or you forfeit it. Some don't even allow you to enter if you're not 100% that you can go. If people wanted it enough, they would have made sure they could attend in the event that they could win.

Whether this wasn't a regular Inferno or not is irrelevant, things need to be clear cut from the beginning so that things like this can be avoided in the future.

Sisko

No

I really don't understand the anger pointed so directly at Azza.

I can't imagine anyone doing any different in his place. If I was as good a player as you guys, and I came 3rd but could not confirm if I could go or not, heard nothing but confusion and hear say about who's talking about going and find out I indeed can go the next day, I'd certainly post about it on the forum.

Last thing I'd expect is to end up with a nemesis for doing so.

& I put it to anyone else on here including Liquidswords that they'd have done the same. I really don't understand the hate , it's such a shame this has happened.

I don't think theres much else I can say on this matter, I can't believe the damage this evo thing has done to the community.