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I seen her...that is to say I SAW her

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  • 02-06-2010 5:14pm
    #1
    Benny Lava
    Registered Users Posts: 534 ✭✭✭


    Maybe this has always been the case but it appears that more and more people are abandoning proper grammar in favour of these horrid phrases.

    SO many people are saying "I seen" instead of "I saw" and "I done" instead of "I did".

    Has anyone else noticed an increase?


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Comments

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    #2
    DEVEREUX
    Registered Users Posts: 541 ✭✭✭DEVEREUX


    I'm guilty of saying "seen" instead of "saw". Throw me to the wolves!


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    #3
    Freddy B
    Registered Users Posts: 25 ✭Freddy B


    I agree OP. However, I wouldn't recommend using the word "horrid" to make a point. Makes you sound like a Victorian schoolmistress. Or a prig ;)


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    #4
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    Horrid, abysmal, atrocious, horrific, horrible e.t.c....

    Horrid isn't archaic so I can't see why it shouldn't be used. I hate it when people say "I seen". It's embarassing to not know proper grammar for your first language. As far as I know, "I saw" is the simple past tense and "I have seen" would be the present perfect tense and "I had seen" would be the past perfect tense.


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    #5
    DonalN
    Registered Users Posts: 868 ✭✭✭DonalN


    Aye, there do be a lot of them there folks pickin up on the bad grammer these past comin days.....to be sure, to be sure ;-)


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    #6
    Benny Lava
    Registered Users Posts: 534 ✭✭✭Benny Lava


    DEVEREUX wrote: »
    I'm guilty of saying "seen" instead of "saw". Throw me to the wolves!

    Will do!
    Freddy B wrote: »
    I agree OP. However, I wouldn't recommend using the word "horrid" to make a point. Makes you sound like a Victorian schoolmistress. Or a prig ;)

    What word would you use to emphasise a monstrosity of this degree?
    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    Horrid, abysmal, atrocious, horrific, horrible e.t.c....

    Horrid isn't archaic so I can't see why it shouldn't be used. I hate it when people say "I seen". It's embarassing to not know proper grammar for your first language. As far as I know, "I saw" is the simple past tense and "I have seen" would be the present perfect tense and "I had seen" would be the past perfect tense.

    Indeed. It's not as if it's a complex construction.


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    #7
    Benny Lava
    Registered Users Posts: 534 ✭✭✭Benny Lava


    DonalN wrote: »
    Aye, there do be a lot of them there folks pickin up on the bad grammer these past comin days.....to be sure, to be sure ;-)


    I knew this would happen in a thread like this.


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    #8
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    DonalN wrote: »
    Aye, there do be a lot of them there folks pickin up on the bad grammer these past comin days.....to be sure, to be sure ;-)

    :eek: :pac:
    Benny Lava wrote: »



    What word would you use to emphasise a monstrosity of this degree?
    Abominable? Invidious? Or if you really want to be sensational...
    Scandalous :pac:


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    #9
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    http://grammarstars.blogspot.com/2007/09/saw-seen-spin.html


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    #10
    Yakuza
    Registered Users Posts: 5,141 ✭✭✭Yakuza


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    :eek: :pac:

    Abominable? Invidious? Or if you really want to be sensational...
    Scandalous :pac:
    "egregious" /thread


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    #11
    Donkey Oaty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,533 ✭✭✭Donkey Oaty


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    Horrid isn't archaic so I can't see why it shouldn't be used.

    Outside of publishing houses, there usually isn't a list of things you should or shouldn't use that you can consult on matters of style.

    You either got it or you ain't, partyatmygaff!


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    #12
    pickarooney
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,472 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    Horrid, abysmal, atrocious, horrific, horrible e.t.c....

    Horrid isn't archaic so I can't see why it shouldn't be used. I hate it when people say "I seen". It's embarassing to not know proper grammar for your first language. As far as I know, "I saw" is the simple past tense and "I have seen" would be the present perfect tense and "I had seen" would be the past perfect tense.

    The split infinitive is forgivable but you should really learn how to spell 'embarrassing' and that sentence is very poorly constructed overall.


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    #13
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    pickarooney wrote: »
    The split infinitive is forgivable but you should really learn how to spell 'embarrassing' and that sentence is very poorly constructed overall.
    I had my French exam the day I wrote that post ;)

    The particulars of english spelling, grammar and syntax weren't exactly at the forefront of my mind, so to speak.


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    #14
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    pickarooney wrote: »
    The split infinitive is forgivable but you should really learn how to spell 'embarrassing' and that sentence is very poorly constructed overall.
    I know a better construction would be

    It is an embarrassment to not know the proper grammatical rules for your first language.

    I was going to type that instead but it sounded a bit too formal.


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    #15
    asahi
    Registered Users Posts: 35 ✭asahi


    We're speaking Hiberno-English, so we don't have to stick to the rules of Standard English, do we?


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    #16
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    Anglo-English and Hiberno-English don't have many differences. Our dialect of English is fairly similar to "Standard" English.

    So yes, we DO have to follow the rules of standard English :p


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    #17
    asahi
    Registered Users Posts: 35 ✭asahi


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    Anglo-English and Hiberno-English don't have many differences. Our dialect of English is fairly similar to "Standard" English.

    So yes, we DO have to follow the rules of standard English :p

    Why? What happens if we don't?


    We don't pronounce the language the way it says to in the dictionary (listen to an English person say the word "car") so why should religiously follow the grammar rules?


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    #18
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    asahi wrote: »
    Why? What happens if we don't?


    We don't pronounce the language the way it says to in the dictionary (listen to an English person say the word "car") so why should religiously follow the grammar rules?

    Take for example an English teacher in Ireland and an English teacher in England.

    They both have different accents (Usually) and may have their own distinct phrases but they both generally adhere to the same grammar rules when they're writing.

    Nothing will "happen" if you don't follow the proper grammatical rules. It's not as if we're going to hunt you down for incorrect syntax ;)


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    #19
    asahi
    Registered Users Posts: 35 ✭asahi


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    Take for example an English teacher in Ireland and an English teacher in England.

    They both have different accents (Usually) and may have their own distinct phrases but they both generally adhere to the same grammar rules when they're writing.

    Why should they not extend the fact that Hiberno-English has a distinct vocabulary and pronunciation rules to allow that it also has distinct grammar?


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    #20
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #21
    thirtythirty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭thirtythirty


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    +1

    "I seen" is just a short step from "I done", and then you're only a stone's throw away from "I do be"!

    "Hairdresser talk" is another one that makes me cringe


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    #22
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    asahi wrote: »
    Why should they not extend the fact that Hiberno-English has a distinct vocabulary and pronunciation rules to allow that it also has distinct grammar?
    We do not have any distinct grammar rules.


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    #23
    Yakuza
    Registered Users Posts: 5,141 ✭✭✭Yakuza


    spottyelephant wrote: »
    +1

    "I seen" is just a short step from "I done", and then you're only a stone's throw away from "I do be"!

    Don't forget the double gerund "I'm going doing that now". /Shudder


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    #24
    Donkey Oaty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,533 ✭✭✭Donkey Oaty


    spottyelephant wrote: »
    +1

    "Hairdresser talk" is another one that makes me cringe

    Do you mean stuff like "Are you going anywhere nice on your holidays this year?"


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    #25
    SomeDude
    Registered Users Posts: 284 ✭✭SomeDude


    Here's another one! It's amazing the number of highly educated people I hear saying things like "we bet that team last week". I cringe every time I hear it.


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    #26
    pickarooney
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,472 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    We do not have any distinct grammar rules.

    "I'm after" ?
    Don't forget the double gerund "I'm going doing that now". /Shudder

    I'm going swimming now?


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    #27
    Donkey Oaty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,533 ✭✭✭Donkey Oaty


    Okay, quick test: which of the following sentences is correct?

    1) Asahi wondered if we should consider speaking naturally rather than conform to an idealised standard of English, and raised interesting issues about the significance of regional/local dialects in our increasingly globalised culture.

    2) Asahi wanted some patronising career advice and a list of linguistic pet hates.


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    #28
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    pickarooney wrote: »
    "I'm after" ?
    That is colloquial spoken English. The matter at hand here is written English. Personally, I have never seen anyone write "I'm after...." in an English essay for example. If I wrote "I'm after...." in an English essay I would more than likely get marked down for mechanics as strictly speaking it is not grammatically correct.


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    #29
    pickarooney
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,472 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    That is colloquial spoken English. The matter at hand here is written English.

    It's not. This thread is about spoken English.
    Besides, how many English essays written by Irish students have you met and how can you be sure one would be marked down for using "I'm after +ing"?


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    #30
    enda1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭enda1


    I'd say the usage is actually on a decrease.
    It is a very Dublin thing, though I think not as prevalent as it was previously before the half-Americanisation of most of the county...


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    #31
    bette
    Registered Users Posts: 496 ✭✭bette


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    I had my French exam the day I wrote that post ;)

    The particulars of english spelling, grammar and syntax weren't exactly at the forefront of my mind, so to speak.

    Sans blague?


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