More on the "Psychoactive Substances" bill

Elevator

so my local health food store might not be able to sell
me hemp seeds soon?

Shulgin

Elevator wrote: »

so my local health food store might not be able to sell
me hemp seeds soon?

Cannabis seeds have to be exempt from this as they are not a 'psychoactive substance' unless cultivated. Same goes with mushrooms spores.

Some countries specifically ban seeds and spores.

Morning glory seeds on the other hand are extremely psychoactive in themselves, but are they covered under any other legislation? I dunno.

dasdog

I'm not suprised at all at the full on approach against synthetic Ireland after shops began selling instant powder highs (or nightmares to a small usually young minority). Allowing Gardai even senior, to make decisions on who is or is not breaking the law facilitates bribary and corruption and that's the Irish part to this legislation. Just wondering about the focus on hydroponic's and if the public servants who drafted this were ill informed as I'd imagine hydro setups are reasonably rare. Unsuprisingly we have a liberal party in coalition government who seem to remain very quiet about this. Maybe they are just being told to go to the corner and be good girls and boys like everything else that's a hot topic.

Vertigo100

Don't panic guys it looks as if there will be a "furious" new rc available online in the next week or so! Hopefully before this retarded piece of legislation is hurried through! (for those in the know i'm taking the piss calling it furious ) trip reports look more than promising!

Steodonn

Shulgin wrote: »

Cannabis seeds have to be exempt from this as they are not a 'psychoactive substance' unless cultivated. Same goes with mushrooms spores.

Some countries specifically ban seeds and spores.

Morning glory seeds on the other hand are extremely psychoactive in themselves, but are they covered under any other legislation? I dunno.

Did anyone read all of the ****ing bill

If its licenced as a food ( i.e you cant sell anything for human consumption unless the gov approves it hence legal highs say not for human consumption ) its legal so morning glory seeds are legal and nutmeg ect

Shulgin

Steodonn wrote: »

Did anyone read all of the ****ing bill

If its licenced as a food ( i.e you cant sell anything for human consumption unless the gov approves it hence legal highs say not for human consumption ) its legal so morning glory seeds are legal and nutmeg ect

Calm down dear.

I have read most of it, but others will spot stuff that I haven't.
Can you explain what you mean with a little more clarity?
Morning glory seeds are not food for a start. They are a psychoactive plant/flower seeds not under any food legislation.

Vertigo100 wrote: »

Don't panic guys it looks as if there will be a "furious" new rc available online in the next week or so! Hopefully before this retarded piece of legislation is hurried through! (for those in the know i'm taking the piss calling it furious ) trip reports look more than promising!

Yes, I know what you mean. The government are going to be furious alright.. 2010 could be another summer of love if that particular molecule kicks off.

Vertigo100

Yeah sounds tip top. Seems like it's gonna be hard to come across at first though and I bet this ban kicks in before it gets fairly widespread. A lot of uk vendors are only shipping to uk and it seems only 3 of them are getting it! Did u read the tr's on bluelight shulgin?

sunshiner

so im guessing they will ban music as it can alter perception lol and dancing which can produce an altered state. Or even religion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohmhZVjaqQo&feature=PlayList&p=DAF818612E7A3EC1&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=3

AMEN!

davrho

dasdog wrote: »

I'm not suprised at all at the full on approach against synthetic Ireland after shops began selling instant powder highs (or nightmares to a small usually young minority).

Most folk I know who use these products are 30+ years of age. I would say a lot more people are/were using these products than you think. The newspapers have created this myth of drug crazed youngsters. I know guards,soldiers,teachers,engineers etc who all like a wee dabble the odd weekend.

Augmerson

Any more on this? Anyone heard anything?

[Taken from Breakingnews.ie]

"The Government's crackdown on headshops is to include a provision to allow bail be refused to suspects.

New laws - banning all psychoactive substances - is being rushed through the Oireachtas.

They're going through the Seanad this afternoon, where the Justice Minister says he'll categorise the offences as "serious" to allow for the refusal of bail."

link - http://breakingnews.ie/ireland/no-bail-for-headshop-accused-in-govt-proposals-462790.html

barrackali

All good to hear, the bill looks like it will be in place before the long summer recess.

Al least they will have done something good....pity they fecked up our entire economy.

ScumLord

barrackali wrote: »

All good to hear, the bill looks like it will be in place before the long summer recess.

Al least they will have done something good....pity they fecked up our entire economy.

This just in, The illegal drugs are making their comeback and can be much cheaper than the legals were. To me this is great news.

Pace2008

barrackali wrote: »

All good to hear, the bill looks like it will be in place before the long summer recess.

Al least they will have done something good....pity they fecked up our entire economy.

Orange Sonics, Iron Crosses and Bentleys - all certified MDMA - have reached our shores.

This summer, I'll be enjoying them while you enjoy your false sense of security

barrackali

Pace2008 wrote: »

Orange Sonics, Iron Crosses and Bentleys - all certified MDMA - have reached our shores.

This summer, I'll be enjoying them while you enjoy your false sense of security

You do that

Shulgin

barrackali wrote: »

All good to hear, the bill looks like it will be in place before the long summer recess.

Al least they will have done something good....pity they fecked up our entire economy.

It is good that dodgy substances will not be available so easily on the main streets, people can't just go in and buy some party prescriptions out out of sheer curiosity.

On the other hand there is always the black market which will get back to normal supply soon enough, probably with a lot of research chemicals mixed in though. Also purchasing online from other countries will be common I`m guessing. Customs will surely only catch a very small amount of the 'psychoactive substances' in the mail.

It is a shame they strengthened the law against growing your own. This is backwards and is clearly going against global trends. What is the reason for this?

It will be interesting to see how this goes.

barrackali

Shulgin wrote: »

It is good that dodgy substances will not be available so easily on the main streets, people can't just go in and buy some party prescriptions out out of sheer curiosity.

On the other hand there is always the black market which will get back to normal supply soon enough, probably with a lot of research chemicals mixed in though. Also purchasing online from other countries will be common I`m guessing. Customs will surely only catch a very small amount of the 'psychoactive substances' in the mail.

It is a shame they strengthened the law against growing your own. This is backwards and is clearly going against global trends. What is the reason for this?

It will be interesting to see how this goes.

It will certainly be interesting, after all the headshops close down...then we will see how serious the government are with individuals who supply this crap.

ScumLord

barrackali wrote: »

It will certainly be interesting, after all the headshops close down...then we will see how serious the government are with individuals who supply this crap.

It doesn't matter how serious they get it won't make any difference. Arrest one drug dealers 3 more fight to replace him. America has already learned this lesson the hard way. It always amazes me how Ireland can watch every other country make mistakes, learn from their mistakes and start doing things the correct way only for Ireland to learn nothing from it and go through the same process wasting time and resources on an obviously flawed way of doing things

Myrddin

ScumLord wrote: »

It doesn't matter how serious they get it won't make any difference. Arrest one drug dealers 3 more fight to replace him. America has already learned this lesson the hard way. It always amazes me how Ireland can watch every other country make mistakes, learn from their mistakes and start doing things the correct way only for Ireland to learn nothing from it and go through the same process wasting time and resources on an obviously flawed way of doing things

Your assuming our politicians want to improve the country. Sadly this is not the case, making money is what drives our lads. And any high horse riders who disagree with that, I suggest you educate yourself, starting with the last ten years of fianna fail.

Steodonn

Were off to Northern Ireland to buy lots of drugs da da da da da da. Also have heard of a site still sending the stuff already banned to the UK and I assume Ireland. People have claimed to get large amounts of stuff completely undetected

If the government cant stop this ( and its impossible to stop with out spending millions ( or billions if you want to stop stuff form coming for the north ) the black markets supply is going to sky rocket and they will have no trouble feeding the demand this bill will create.

Make weed and ecstasy ( possible some other " safer " drugs) exempt form this bill and the misuse of drugs act and the war on more serious drugs and gangs might just be winnable

Prof.Badass

Steodonn wrote: »

Were off to Northern Ireland to buy lots of drugs da da da da da da. Also have heard of a site still sending the stuff already banned to the UK and I assume Ireland. People have claimed to get large amounts of stuff completely undetected

If the government cant stop this ( and its impossible to stop with out spending millions ( or billions if you want to stop stuff form coming for the north ) the black markets supply is going to sky rocket and they will have no trouble feeding the demand this bill will create.

Make weed and ecstasy ( possible some other " safer " drugs) exempt form this bill and the misuse of drugs act and the war on more serious drugs and gangs might just be winnable

Unless your "safer drugs" include both a classical stimulant and an opiate I wouldn't get my hopes up.

Steodonn

Prof.Badass wrote: »

Unless your "safer drugs" include both a classical stimulant and an opiate I wouldn't get my hopes up.

Ideally yes but I just don't see that happening

genericguy

Prof.Badass wrote: »

Unless your "safer drugs" include both a classical stimulant and an opiate there's not a chance.

i'd disagree with this - the vast bulk of drug profits are from weed, as the users of cocaine who would spend enough on it to make a drug dealer wealthy are very few and far between. and heroin users tend not to live very long.

it's essentially a case of kill the body and the head will die with drug gangs - cannabis is relatively harmless, so it's legalisation would provide massive revenue for the govt with very few negative repercussions, and simultaneously drive most drug dealers out of business.

Bleedin Delish

How do the Government even propose to enforce all of this legislation when the Gardai are already over-run with gun and knife crime etc. the whole country is fooked no matter what PR stunt legislation they bring in

ScumLord

genericguy wrote: »

i'd disagree with this - the vast bulk of drug profits are from weed, as the users of cocaine who would spend enough on it to make a drug dealer wealthy are very few and far between. and heroin users tend not to live very long.

it's essentially a case of kill the body and the head will die with drug gangs - cannabis is relatively harmless, so it's legalisation would provide massive revenue for the govt with very few negative repercussions, and simultaneously drive most drug dealers out of business.

In my experience there isn't a whole lot of big money in Cannabis, not for the small time dealer anyway. There's little chance to bulk it up like there is with the powders, any one at any stage can turn one gram of coke into two grams, not so easy with weed although it's not impossible.

Weed shifts though, it's a staple part of any drug users diet everyone wants it and while there's little profit for the small seller it's guaranteed to move.

Prof.Badass

genericguy wrote: »

i'd disagree with this - the vast bulk of drug profits are from weed, as the users of cocaine who would spend enough on it to make a drug dealer wealthy are very few and far between. and heroin users tend not to live very long. it's essentially a case of kill the body and the head will die with drug gangs - cannabis is relatively harmless, so it's legalisation would provide massive revenue for the govt with very few negative repercussions, and simultaneously drive most drug dealers out of business.

Weed is legal in holland, yet it still has plenty of cocaine, heroin and other drugs (in fact iirc their cocaine useage rate is roughly the same as ours).

Also,

and heroin users tend not to live very long.

Do you have stats for that?
Or is it just the impression you got from loonies ranting about "junkies" :rolleyes:.

hacx

Just another day at the office, it seems.

Anyone know of any parties in favour of loosening the drug laws?

Hammered hippie

No bail when selling herbal highs or when a guard suspects you sell/sold herbal highs...or was it herbal tea?....or was it just the way you looked like a hippy when you sold that tea...whateverrr!

Why not shoot at sight.

Why not put everyone that upsets Joe Duffy into a prisoner camp.

Why don't we do as it was done in Ennis and organise politically correct marches against these shops and then allow these shops to be ransacked and plundered by the public for hours and hours on end. Lets make our very own Kristallnacht.

Lets do that to more shops and institutions that Joe Doesn't like.
Every time a concerned caller complains about something in Joe's show we should invent a law against it and put the responsibles in prison.

Man isn't democracy a great thing when you can use it to entertain the masses with public excecutions. Power to the people so they can destroy ohter people....go Ireland go!

Hammered hippie

Prof.Badass wrote: »

Weed is legal in holland, yet it still has plenty of cocaine, heroin and other drugs (in fact iirc their cocaine useage rate is roughly the same as ours).

Also,

Do you have stats for that?
Or is it just the impression you got from loonies ranting about "junkies" :rolleyes:.

Holland has the lowest number of young people that use cannabis of all the western world, because it is legal and therefore uninteresting and for older 'hippies'. Heroin use is practically eradicated amongst the Dutch themselves...whereas it is very strongly on the rise in Ireland.
So I don't see your point mr prof Badass

Hammered hippie

hacx wrote: »

Just another day at the office, it seems.

Anyone know of any parties in favour of loosening the drug laws?

No one want's to upset Joe Duffy. So no party will be in favour of loosening the drug laws.
Before you know it Joe has a petition going against you and the media and some conservative small lobby groups ask for a law against this kind of party, because we have to think of the children.....

Takeshi_Kovacs

What i find interesting, is how much of a show they are making of the whole 'Banning of the Headshops' thing they have going on. One would think that it is a nice story to distract the masses, from other serious problems in the country going at the moment with which the government is coming under flak from.

What is funny is the lack of any comparison with alcohol sales from pubs, shops offlicenses etc, and the vastly larger problem that arise from alcohol abuse every week, all the while we have a politicians like healy-rae, moaning about talk of further reducing how much you can drink before driving.