Series 5, Episode 10 - "Vincent and the Doctor"

Harmsden

I was initially surprised at the positive feedback this episode received, but reviewing it now I can accept it. The monster isn't incidental to the plot. It reflects the episode's main focus, one man's struggle with an invisible monster: depression.

The BBC production, as usual with period stuff, was faultless. It was great. The CG was on par with American SF and the night sky morphing into starry night was lovely.

However 'Blink' set the bar for filler episodes. Bad storytelling is bad storytelling no matter the scheduling and the budget.

The scenes dealing with Van Gogh's passion and mania feel shoehorned in, as though someone is ticking off a checklist with half an ass. The episode feels unfinished. It feels like Curtis had two ideas: jizz over Van Gogh and have Van Gogh fight a big monster. We got the jizz. We got the monster but there was very little flesh to be found. What exactly is the chemistry between Van Gogh and Amy? Red hair? Why was the monster left behind? What did it actually eat? Why could Van Gogh see it when no one else could? On one level it's a manifestation of his mental illness, but on another level it's a vague scavenging alien that feeds on... I'm sorry, what exactly did it feed on again?

I could go on, but I won't. In the right mood, maybe I'd enjoy having someone fumble around my emotions, furiously stabbing for my g-spot. I wasn't in the right mood. I wanted a meal first. I wanted meat.

Banjo Fella

I absolutely loved this episode! I thought it dealt with depression and friendship in a very sensitive way, and was by far one of the most emotionally adventurous episodes of the revived series. Fantastic stuff.

I loved the actor playing Van Gogh, very well suited to the role! The scene where the night sky transformed into The Starry Night was brilliantly realised, and I chuckled at the nod to Bedroom in Arles when the Doctor wakes Vincent. The implication that Vincent's synaesthesia allowed him to see the beast was great, too, tied in nicely with the allegory for depression.

monkeyfudge

I enjoyed it a lot as well.

Excellent performance from Tony Curran. I also liked how the BBC put up a depression help line number at the end as well.

The definitely could have done something more interesting with the monster though. I was hoping for something along the lines of the Id monster from Forbidden Planet.

iguana

pixelburp wrote: »

It handled van Gogh's depression quite well & decided not to ignore or pretend it didn't exist. Nor did the episode patronise by implying it could have been cured by a quick visit to the future;

Richard Curtis' sister, who had severe depression, committed suicide recently. So I'm sure in many ways the episode was about her and what she suffered.

Fysh

Had it been less drowned by sentimentality, I would have enjoyed this more, because the bones of a very good standalone episode were there. The incessant "ZOMG! BEST ARTIST EVARR!" stuff (particularly at the beginning with the Doctor and Amy mugging at each other) was frustrating. It made it feel a bit too much like an "educational" show, rather than just a well-written and entertaining show that also educates along the way.

Amy's horror at the idea that her new pal would still end up killing himself, and her belief that one trip into the future to see that future masses would appreciate his work, seemed overly simplistic and contrived. Especially given the way that death and high-bodycount adventures are usually handled in the show.

There were some very nice moments too - Matt Smith's Doctor continuing to be slightly weird and generally unconcerned with being cool (except when it comes to bow ties), the ridiculous gadget he pulled out so that he could see the monster (which was basically a box with a couple of lights and a wingmirror attached - excellent!), and the sequence at the end showing the transition from "reality" to the night sky painting.

exaisle

Compart and contrast....around the 23/24 minute mark....I cant help thinking that for the scenes shot outside the church, she may, in fact, have gone commando....her legs look suspiciously...uhm...white...

bigar

Not the worst episode but I would have like it they would have thought of something else than a monster from a Chinese New Year parade.
Just hated they kept on saying van Goff.

Bill Nighy, althogh a small part, was just amazing in this and not just because he pronounced van Gogh almost as a native Dutchman

Pittens

Just hated they kept on saying van Goff.

Actually they were pronouncing it properly in Dutch. Bablefish error.

monkeyfudge

Pittens wrote: »

Actually they were pronouncing it properly in Dutch. Bablefish error.

Bill Nighy was the only one to really pronounce it right though.

K-9

iguana wrote: »

Richard Curtis' sister, who had severe depression, committed suicide recently. So I'm sure in many ways the episode was about her and what she suffered.

Ah, that makes sense. I thought originally bringing him back to 2010 was typical Curtis OTT sentimentality but, then I wondered, why would he? Maybe a nod to family and friends wondering about "what if I did this?"

The scene was a bit OTT but was saved by excellent acting all round. Thought this episode had the best acting so far in the series.

Overall, barring the Weeping Angels, the best episode so far.

Actually worried about the CGI budget when they had an invisible monster! Thought "are things that bad in the Beeb?"

Only reference to the future episodes I seen was the burning door on the Tardis. Don't think I missed anything else.

Oh and Amy just gets better. She was even more delightful in this episode and looked even more stunning than I thought possible in the Sunflower scene. I believed her thinking everything would change when they went back. She's still very innocent and childlike which makes sense, after all, Rory is forgotten.

monkeyfudge

K-9 wrote: »

Only reference to the future episodes I seen was the burning door on the Tardis. Don't think I missed anything else.

That was the posters that had been plastered all over the box having being burned off in the vortex.

doctorwhogirl

I loved this episode. It has to be said. Thought it handled the subject matter skillfully and all actors were superb.

Great episode for me as a Whovian art lover with a soft spot for Bill Nighy!

I loves James Corden but he is just everywhere! Looks like it could either be ok, or another "Fear Her" style episode. *shudder* I'll reserve judgement.

Nearly fcuked the remote at the tv when it came to the Adventure Game ad. Damn BBC. I could totally go on an unnecessary republican rant over it....

Jessibelle

I liked it alot. I really didn't want to, as most shows deal with depression in a really mawkish awkward way, and while this did tip towards it at times, overall I felt it dealt with it quite sensitively. Also as a somewhat personal aside, a friend who lost a family member to suicide from depression was watching this with me, and she was gratified that time wasn't changed to let Vincent live, aside form historical accuracy, she felt it showed that sometimes unfortunately there's nothing that can be done to prevent suicide from happening.
Also loved the scene where the sky transformed into the Starry Night. That was fantastic! Also, Bill Nighy for Dr!!!

K-9

monkeyfudge wrote: »

That was the posters that had been plastered all over the box having being burned off in the vortex.

Doh! Thought it was linked to the sign in last weeks episode.

pixelburp

Jessibelle wrote: »

Also, Bill Nighy for Dr!!!

Face it people, Matt Smith has been stellar 'n all, but the above needs to happen. I propose travelling back in time, kidnapping Stephen Moffat, taking his place and hiring Nighy. Who's with me? And who can do a good Scotish accent?

K-9

Jessibelle wrote: »

I liked it alot. I really didn't want to, as most shows deal with depression in a really mawkish awkward way, and while this did tip towards it at times, overall I felt it dealt with it quite sensitively. Also as a somewhat personal aside, a friend who lost a family member to suicide from depression was watching this with me, and she was gratified that time wasn't changed to let Vincent live, aside form historical accuracy, she felt it showed that sometimes unfortunately there's nothing that can be done to prevent suicide from happening.
Also loved the scene where the sky transformed into the Starry Night. That was fantastic! Also, Bill Nighy for Dr!!!

Exactly and if his sister died because of it recently, makes sense. The episode was quite dark over all and probably needed a lift. The idea of bringing him back to 2010 was brilliant and the acting was brilliantly handled and I include Matt and Karen in that.

As for Nighy as the Dr. I just can't see him. Brilliant actor, but guilty of over acting every so often, including this episode. Matt handled this one perfectly, played it perfectly at the right times.

monkeyfudge

Well Romana got to regenerate into someone she liked the look of. So I guess it's possible for the Docotor to take the form of someone who he admired, such as Dr. Black in this episode.

Daemos

Proof (as if you needed any) that Bill Nighy is a living legend that can do anything

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2v4od_bill-nighy-christmas-is-all-around_music

K-9

DaPoolRulz wrote: »

Proof (as if you needed any) that Bill Nighy is a living legend that can do anything

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2v4od_bill-nighy-christmas-is-all-around_music

Hamming it up is not acting! He hammed this one up, though very well.

K-9

Gorgeous outfits but Robert Palmer still wins!

pixelburp

K-9 wrote: »

Hamming it up is not acting! He hammed this one up, though very well.

He wasn't hamming up the scene, he was just Nighy'ing it up

Fysh

pixelburp wrote: »

He wasn't hamming up the scene, he was just Nighy'ing it up

Same thing, isn't it? :P

I'm not feeling Nighy as the Doctor, though it would depend on what they did with him...

Doctor DooM

Does the Doctor remember Rory?

I'm a little unclear.

Daemos

I always assumed he did remember him, remember he hid the engagement ring from Amy at the end of Cold Blood?

pixelburp

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Does the Doctor remember Rory?

I'm a little unclear.

Yes he does, at least I think so - remember when they all ran into the church and closed the door behind them? Doctor yabbers an instruction and says "... Amy, Rory..." then looked sheepishly at Amy.

nicowa

pixelburp wrote: »

Yes he does, at least I think so - remember when they all ran into the church and closed the door behind them? Doctor yabbers an instruction and says "... Amy, Rory..." then looked sheepishly at Amy.

And when Vincent is telling Amy it's alright to be upset about losing someone and she can't remember what he's talking about the Doctor looks very upset and uncomfortable.

Doctor DooM

It's just weird the way he immediately gave up trying to convince her so when the TARDIS took a knock.

Also weird he's not trying to save him.

Fysh

Doctor DooM wrote: »

It's just weird the way he immediately gave up trying to convince her so when the TARDIS took a knock.

Also weird he's not trying to save him.

I suspect that while he doesn't quite know what's going on with the cracks, he's not sure if he can save him.

Daemos

Doctor DooM wrote: »

It's just weird the way he immediately gave up trying to convince her so when the TARDIS took a knock.

If I remember correctly, it was the knock that broke Amy's concentration while trying to remember him, the Doctor realised it so gave up because he knew it wouldn't work. At least I think that's what happened, I'd have to watch it again to be sure.

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Also weird he's not trying to save him.

He knows he can't go back in his personal timeline or the personal timeline of others (except for cheap tricks ). I mean technically you could say why doesn't he save everyone that dies, it's just a part of the show, and has been since '63.

Also since the big explosion is going to happen on what would have been Amy's wedding day, I wouldn't 100% rule it out as a possibility

norrie rugger

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Also weird he's not trying to save him.

Wibbley wobbley timey wimey stuff is stopping him