[Article] TK Maxx Ordered to Stop Selling from Retail Park

Junior

ex_infantry man wrote: »

what killed the city centre is pedestrianisation, it killed a very good pub trade down that area and its killing the retail trade now that and the lack of good parking!!!!! you could say just bad planning as a whole!!!!!!!

Pedestrianisation didn't kill the city centre, it's the fact nothing happened besides this up until this year with the city centre, parking in and around the city centre is a laugh. You should try drive a van in the mornings in and around there and try get a space, couple that with those f*ckin taxi drivers along by The Stand who seem to think parking in the road is an ok thing to do and you wonder why people don't bother coming in and around.

You also look at the variety of parking charges been extracted from Customers along the Quay and you don't have to think twice why people only get in and get out of the city centre. The outcry that was heard when the Tall Ships were running over the city centre been closed down was unreal, however the Park and Ride system really showed how simple and easy things could be for Waterford to try and have a vibrant city centre.

Cabaal

ex_infantry man wrote: »

what killed the city centre is pedestrianisation, it killed a very good pub trade down that area and its killing the retail trade now that and the lack of good parking!!!!! you could say just bad planning as a whole!!!!!!!

Your kidding me?

How exactly did pedestrianisation kill the pub trade?

Did it stop people driving to the pub having a drink and driving home?

merlante

Aquos76 wrote: »

I agree with what you are saying in regards to pedestrianisation, I actually think this is great for our city centre and I would hate to see JR square reopened to traffic, however I think you are underestimating how lazy some people can be. You only need to look at the car park out in tesco Ardkeen for example, there is a set down area which is always full of parked cars, as is the end of every row of parking spaces where there is not even a parking space.

My point is that say for example if someone was to park in City Square, they will not be inclined to walk down as far as railway square to TK Max, and like wise, they will not be inclined to walk from millers marsh up in to JR Square. Maybe I am wrong but I spend a lot of time in around our CC and the amount of people that drive around all day looking for a parking space as close to City Square as possible is crazy. People in general are just lazy. You should check out any of the local schools in the mornings and evening too, if parents could drive into the school yards to drop off pick up their kids they would.

Even if people are as lazy as you are suggesting, the only change will be that instead of people driving from city square in the city centre to TKMaxx in Butlerstown, they now only have to drive from city square to railway sq., which is a shorter drive. And I really do think that if people have paid for parking in city square or railway sq., then a proportion will undertake the perilous journey on foot.

The fact that many people shop in Dublin city centre, which is spread over a much wider area, and where parking is presumably more expensive, proves that people will walk to cover the ground.

Psychedelic

One thing being assumed in this thread is that everyone has a car and so TK Maxx in Butlerstown is accessible to everybody. Well I don't drive a car, along with thousands of other people, so I have never been to TK Maxx. I will now be able to visit their store if they open in the city centre.

Aquos76 wrote: »

I agree with what you are saying in regards to pedestrianisation, I actually think this is great for our city centre and I would hate to see JR square reopened to traffic, however I think you are underestimating how lazy some people can be. You only need to look at the car park out in tesco Ardkeen for example, there is a set down area which is always full of parked cars, as is the end of every row of parking spaces where there is not even a parking space.

My point is that say for example if someone was to park in City Square, they will not be inclined to walk down as far as railway square to TK Max, and like wise, they will not be inclined to walk from millers marsh up in to JR Square. Maybe I am wrong but I spend a lot of time in around our CC and the amount of people that drive around all day looking for a parking space as close to City Square as possible is crazy. People in general are just lazy. You should check out any of the local schools in the mornings and evening too, if parents could drive into the school yards to drop off pick up their kids they would.

You're dead right about laziness. It's amazing that at the same time people will drive all the way to Cork and Dublin to shop, pay more for parking than in Waterford, and have to walk a larger area to find all the shops, yet they would be too lazy to walk from the Quay car park to a shop in Railway Square.


By the way, average parking prices:

• Galway: €2.60 per hour
• Cork: €2.20 per hour
• Limerick: €2.00 per hour
• Waterford: €1.80 per hour
• Dublin: don't know, presumably the most expensive

THall04

Quote:
Originally Posted by ex_infantry man
what killed the city centre is pedestrianisation, it killed a very good pub trade down that area and its killing the retail trade now that and the lack of good parking!!!!! you could say just bad planning as a whole!!!!!!!

Cabaal wrote: »

Your kidding me?

How exactly did pedestrianisation kill the pub trade?

Did it stop people driving to the pub having a drink and driving home?

Egans had a taxi rank on its doorstep , very handy for getting home after pints/shopping on a Friday/Saturday afternoon...or dropping back in there later on.

Since Egans closed /the old road and taxi rank gone ,John Roberts Square is a lonely dead area after 6pm

rayc

THall04 wrote: »

Quote:
Originally Posted by ex_infantry man
what killed the city centre is pedestrianisation, it killed a very good pub trade down that area and its killing the retail trade now that and the lack of good parking!!!!! you could say just bad planning as a whole!!!!!!!



Egans had a taxi rank on its doorstep , very handy for getting home after pints/shopping on a Friday/Saturday afternoon...or dropping back in there later on.

Since Egans closed /the old road and taxi rank gone ,John Roberts Square is a lonely dead area after 6pm

But there's now a taxi rank about 100m from where Egans was, I think it's more the lack of a pub on the square that makes it dead after 6pm.

JohnC.

THall04 wrote: »

Egans had a taxi rank on its doorstep , very handy for getting home after pints/shopping on a Friday/Saturday afternoon...or dropping back in there later on.

Since Egans closed /the old road and taxi rank gone ,John Roberts Square is a lonely dead area after 6pm

There's a taxi rank outside Kellys/AIB on the Quay and outside Dunnes on Peter Street. Both a stonesthrow from the square. You would have to be pretty damn lazy to use lack of taxi rank as an excuse. Then again, as has been said earlier, people are too lazy to park in the Tesco car park to shop in Tesco.

ex_infantry man

Cabaal wrote: »

Your kidding me?

How exactly did pedestrianisation kill the pub trade?

Did it stop people driving to the pub having a drink and driving home?

no it stopped people from being able to get a taxi into say egans(when it was open for example) and as a result of lazy ass people that could,nt be bothered to walk because they could,nt get a taxi to the front door!!! it would,nt surprise me in the slightest if someone got a taxi from johns street to harveys just so they would,nt have to walk, the old stand suffered also because of this fact!!! because people just could,nt be arsed to walk a few hundred metres

JohnC.

So why are T&H's still open? Expanded after pedestrianisation, even.

comeraghs

What the city needs is more pedestrianisation rather than less ... makes the city centre a far more pleasant place. plenty parking on the quay,

Max Powers

The city needs NEWGATE CENTRE to be built, this would open up wide floor spaces up to market where companies like TK Maxx, M&S, Zara and Brown Thomas could set-up easy. Most of these companies and others indicated that they would like to set up in Waterford City but floor space they require is not available. Places like Old Stand premises are not suitable for a few of the big names that would attract people to city and spin-off things would open up to take over smaller floor spaces. Thanks to McCann't et al, we dont have it being built. Also, if it was being built, there would be about 500-600 builders working in the city, buying stuff in shops, pubs and restaurants on a daily basis for a couple of years, help during this recession.

gscully

ex_infantry man wrote: »

no it stopped people from being able to get a taxi into say egans(when it was open for example) and as a result of lazy ass people that could,nt be bothered to walk because they could,nt get a taxi to the front door!!! it would,nt surprise me in the slightest if someone got a taxi from johns street to harveys just so they would,nt have to walk, the old stand suffered also because of this fact!!! because people just could,nt be arsed to walk a few hundred metres

I would've assumed the demise of Egans came about when the spotlight focused on John St. Before Muldoons, Rubys, Club LA and Preachers started to take all the punters in, Egans served as a good spot for people to drink before heading to The Bridge and Roxys. There's way too much concentration of nightlife in that one area now.

ex_infantry man

gscully wrote: »

I would've assumed the demise of Egans came about when the spotlight focused on John St. Before Muldoons, Rubys, Club LA and Preachers started to take all the punters in, Egans served as a good spot for people to drink before heading to The Bridge and Roxys. There's way too much concentration of nightlife in that one area now.

Yeah johns street just seems to just be the spot shame really the likes of egans and the old stand were good spots to the start of a good nite out. I suppose we,ll all just have to wait and see what tk maxx do

Bards

gscully wrote: »

I would've assumed the demise of Egans came about when the spotlight focused on John St. Before Muldoons, Rubys, Club LA and Preachers started to take all the punters in, Egans served as a good spot for people to drink before heading to The Bridge and Roxys. There's way too much concentration of nightlife in that one area now.

Reid wanted to sell it (Egans) so he could concentrate on setting up his hotel (The belfry) - nothing to do with pedestrianisation or John st. etc

merlante

Bards wrote: »

Reid wanted to sell it (Egans) so he could concentrate on setting up his hotel (The belfry) - nothing to do with pedestrianisation or John st. etc

Egans was doing fine, and was doing fine into the pedestrianised era iirc. Why do people assume that just because the business closed that it was because there were no customers?

Waterford people's laziness is being heralded as the main reason why pedestrianisation can't work and why out of town shopping is popular. But people are pretty tight too, if you want to talk about stereotypes. No way another is getting a taxi from John st to city square, or whatever. In fact, until 5-10 years ago, you'd be laughed at for getting a taxi. Out of town shopping hits people in the pocket. They just don't realise it.

There also seems to be some perception that you have to bring people into town for pubs. But some of us do actually live in the city centre! There's probably 15-20,000 people within 15 mins of the centre.

tc2010

I just noticed a sign on the cork road advertising the Lisduggan shopping centre. I never seen it before but it only has 3 shops advertised on it

heatons tesco and Morris`s

is this new or am i blind?

Cabaal

tc2010 wrote: »

I just noticed a sign on the cork road advertising the Lisduggan shopping centre. I never seen it before but it only has 3 shops advertised on it

That signs there for many many many months, nothing new

In relation to people getting Taxi's, I've seen people get Taxi's from the apple market to poleberry....thats a 5min walk ffs!

mayordenis

Cabaal wrote: »

That signs there for many many many months, nothing new

In relation to people getting Taxi's, I've seen people get Taxi's from the apple market to poleberry....thats a 5min walk ffs!

They should be shot.

Leo Demidov

I have nothing on topic to add

merlante

Cabaal wrote: »

n relation to people getting Taxi's, I've seen people get Taxi's from the apple market to poleberry....thats a 5min walk ffs!

And I thought there was a recession on. Good for local business I suppose. Doubt these sort of people are the majority though, unless they bought some heavy goods.

Also, one of the points I made was that, if people are indeed that lazy and getting taxis over short distances, then they would very quickly suffer if they were getting taxis too and from out of town centres.

As it is, having to drive between the city centre, Next Ardkeen and TkMaxx makes shopping for clothes a far more convoluted and costly exercise than if they were all in one place.

dayshah

merlante wrote: »

For those of you who though Railway sq. was not viable, you could be about to be proved wrong.

Railway square is more than just retail space, its flats too. They could have put something their, with plenty of space for TK Maxx without being mug ugly.

dayshah

gscully wrote: »

I would've assumed the demise of Egans came about when the spotlight focused on John St. Before Muldoons, Rubys, Club LA and Preachers started to take all the punters in, Egans served as a good spot for people to drink before heading to The Bridge and Roxys. There's way too much concentration of nightlife in that one area now.

The reason Egan's closed is because they hired someone who's job it was to stand at the door, look tough, and prevent well mannered people in their mid-twenties from entering.

Needless to say it didn't help their trade.

d_j

I do not agree with this poxy rule that TK Maxx are not allowed to sell clothes where they currently are & must move into the city centre, to a considerably smaller premises with no parking facilities. FFS!

JohnC.

There is parking at Railway Square, it's just not free. One car park under the building and another large one beside it. Or a free Tesco car park across the road if you want to take your chances there.

rasper

For what its worth from the eyes of someone not from waterford originally, I think its madness trying to control where a business sets up by banning its trade everywhere but a certain spot.
It seems like a turnoff for businesses to locate here and hence job loss, if the cc has problems sort them out but not by banning jobs elsewhere , sounds like a Irish Union attitute protecting the few at the expense of the majority.
Has this worked in other urban centres in Ireland, or is this attitute possibly a reason that Waterford missed out on the investment it should have attracted duuring the bubble

merlante

rasper wrote: »

For what its worth from the eyes of someone not from waterford originally, I think its madness trying to control where a business sets up by banning its trade everywhere but a certain spot.
It seems like a turnoff for businesses to locate here and hence job loss, if the cc has problems sort them out but not by banning jobs elsewhere , sounds like a Irish Union attitute protecting the few at the expense of the majority.
Has this worked in other urban centres in Ireland, or is this attitute possibly a reason that Waterford missed out on the investment it should have attracted duuring the bubble

Waterford lost out on investment primarily because of objections in the inner city coupled with a correct policy of banning certain types of out of town shopping (comparison retail such as clothes, DVDs, etc.) in order to maintain the primacy of the city centre. The city council are not saying you have to set up in any particular unit, they are confining certain businesses to the city centre.

Dublin city has been held up as an example of how not to plan a city Europe-wide because of lax planning. Cork, and particularly Limerick, city centres are under pressure from out of town shopping. The risk is the creation of US-style donut cities, where the centre is hollowed out, and where all residents end up being car bound and have to drive to access facilities in the suburbs. Poor people end up effectively trapped in their homes and you get plenty of social problems. Waterford's city centre is not particularly strong to begin with, so any amount of out of town shopping whatsoever could spell disaster.

M&S were trying to set up on the outskirts of the city. We could have had a situation where all of the premier 'high st.' shops coming to Waterford, that don't want to have to bother about tricky planning permission, set up at different locations around the outer ring road, which would have been hardly accessible by public transport. Even if a particular shopping centre was on a bus route, the fact that it was in the suburbs means that 2 buses or a walk plus a bus would be required in order to get out there for those that do not drive. The city centre, on the other hand, is accessed by 6 or 7 bus routes and is within walking distance of most of the population.

dayshah

rasper wrote: »

For what its worth from the eyes of someone not from waterford originally, I think its madness trying to control where a business sets up by banning its trade everywhere but a certain spot.
It seems like a turnoff for businesses to locate here and hence job loss, if the cc has problems sort them out but not by banning jobs elsewhere , sounds like a Irish Union attitute protecting the few at the expense of the majority.
Has this worked in other urban centres in Ireland, or is this attitute possibly a reason that Waterford missed out on the investment it should have attracted duuring the bubble

And I thought the main reasons for the property bust are well understood. What do you think will come of the thing in Ferrybank

Silverado

dayshah wrote: »

And I thought the main reasons for the property bust are well understood. What do you think will come of the thing in Ferrybank

Which one? They have two empty shopping centres in Ferrybank. One at Belmont and one near Rathculliheen.

cowhands

I heard now its only a rumour that they might be moving into the Old Byrnes World of Wonder shop beside Superquinn.

Yes Boss

cowhands wrote: »

I heard now its only a rumour that they might be moving into the Old Byrnes World of Wonder shop beside Superquinn.

They cannot do that either as it would be a similar site to the one they already occupy!