Eirgrid in Rush - Mod Warning in Post #1

Corsendonk

True there has been a Community Council A.G.M. for a number of years but in all those years what have been the major achivements in Rush by that council. Christmas lights in the main street? In affective lobbying to FCC?

I am gratified to know from your post that F.C.C will have responsibility from any monies from Eirgrid and hope that your mention of new people getting involved in community affairs will ensure that FCC invest that money within the Rush area in sensible projects to benefit all the community.

I think that you may have undersold your own role within the Rush Community as for many years you have been major supporter/helper of the local GAA which we all know in our Irish history is a piller or should that be POST within Irish town/village life.

History is about learning from past mistakes and moving on, I hope that the current active debate on Eirgrid motivates people to get involved in the Rush local community and stay involved for the benefit of the community and not any potential political ambitions that they may harbour.

Alan Farrell

LeoB wrote: »

I was suprised there were not more public reps there.

Not that its important at this stage, but I wasn't asked.

Corsendonk

Well to be honest I had to look you up myself to figure out who you were! Maybe you should try to start speaking out against the party head to get a bit more media profile. It's done the lovely Lucinda media profile great!

Do you know if your local party colleague Dr O'Reilly TD was invited to attend? As he would be generally be more associated with representing this part of the county.

Sorry Mod from getting away from the subject.

Eoineo

To be fair a public, well advertised, community meeting shouldn't require a specific invitation for public representatives. At a recent public community meeting in Balbriggan 1 town councillor and 1 senator (not from the town but for the area) turned up. Off the top of my head that means that all the 5 county councillors for the area, 8 odd town councillors and all the area TDs didn't show.

Alan, isn't Rush outside your ward? How on earth would you be expected to be aware of the meeting if that's the case? It's a pity the same can't be said for your colleagues.

Alan Farrell

The reason for my late remark was that a comment was made regarding public reps not being in attendance and the general observation that public reps didn't bother to turn up. I was highlighting that I wasn't invited and although Rush isn't in my electoral area, its not in Daly's electoral area either.

Corsendonk, I'm a Councillor, not a TD so I don't have access to the national microphone as easily as some. That being said, your local five Councillors are those who you should know. The other ten (Swords & Malahide) in your immediate area can be of use from time to time, such as zoning matters, etc etc.

Corsendonk

Ohh right. So do you know why local FG elected representatives werent present at the meeting? I presume you work very closely with your party colleagues in the area so would have spoken about this topic already. Where they invited by Eirgrid or not?

The Hill Billy

It is unreasonable to expect a politician to know which party colleague is attending what meeting and if not, why not.

I'm sure that they have enough on their plates keeping track of their own schedules. I know I do, and that's just in a private capacity.

Corsendonk

Sorry I assumed that party colleagues work as a team to lighten there workload inorder to work effectively for the people they represent. I presummed that party colleagues would have reader access at least to each others diaries and would have regular meetings within council offices concerning upcoming local concerns that they could support each other on.

LeoB

Corsendonk wrote: »

True there has been a Community Council A.G.M. for a number of years but in all those years what have been the major achivements in Rush by that council. Christmas lights in the main street? In affective lobbying to FCC?

I am gratified to know from your post that F.C.C will have responsibility from any monies from Eirgrid and hope that your mention of new people getting involved in community affairs will ensure that FCC invest that money within the Rush area in sensible projects to benefit all the community.

I think that you may have undersold your own role within the Rush Community as for many years you have been major supporter/helper of the local GAA which we all know in our Irish history is a piller or should that be POST within Irish town/village life.

History is about learning from past mistakes and moving on, I hope that the current active debate on Eirgrid motivates people to get involved in the Rush local community and stay involved for the benefit of the community and not any potential political ambitions that they may harbour.

Agree with you here especially last paragraph. I think we may have learned from past mistakes and people are responding in a positive way. Where do you start in Rush with putting a shape on thins??? Well lets be positive and just say a start has been made.

From what I read Eirgrid will be good for everyone but lets no cod ourselves they will make huge profits and should be forced to invest some money in facilities especially for the youth.
As for my own role. I am to long running around pitchs and helping around the G.A.A club but people can become complacent and stand back and say "ah sure he or she will do that". Now thats a big problem in Rush and further afield. But I really like any role I have in Maurs and now I am off to Finglas to an U/12 Hurling match and I used to think Hurls were for clipping nasty dogs!!!

B.T.W you make good posts here so dont forget to come back:)

LeoB

Rush Against Eirgrid

Got a text today inviting me to a public meeting this Thursday night in Rush N.S.

The meeting has been organised by "Rush Against Eirgrid". I have asked for an agenda to be emailed to me and when it is I will post it here.

The text said it was a Q & A session and when out walking tonight I got stopped by a few people who were canvassing for people to go.

So put it your Diary

• Thursday August 12th
• Rush N.S
• 8 p.m.

THIS IS NOT A PUBLIC MEETING.

As promised I said I would update and after speaking to an organiser the public meeting will place probably next week.

Sorry for any inconvienence caused
LeoB

A.Partridge

Anybody got solid reasons why Rush should be against Eirgrid?

The Hill Billy

Leo & A.Partridge's posts merged with this thread.

A.Partridge - take a look at the previous posts for some sort of answer to your question.

HB

Alan Farrell

LeoB wrote: »

Rush Against Eirgrid

Got a text today inviting me to a public meeting this Thursday night in Rush N.S.

The meeting has been organised by "Rush Against Eirgrid". I have asked for an agenda to be emailed to me and when it is I will post it here.

The text said it was a Q & A session and when out walking tonight I got stopped by a few people who were canvassing for people to go.

So put it your Diary

• Thursday August 12th
• Rush N.S
• 8 p.m.

Who's organising it Leo?

Martron

A.Partridge wrote: »

Anybody got solid reasons why Rush should be against Eirgrid?

disruption, lack of consultation and compensation seem to be the main reasons.

After that i think its a lot of not in my backyard.

I personally am not against it. These things need to happen to keep ireland in a modern state of technology.

Corsendonk

A.Partridge wrote: »

Anybody got solid reasons why Rush should be against Eirgrid?

Well the main objection by the Rush Community Council at the oral hearing earlier this year was the Precautionary Principle defence. Which was adopted in the Treaty of Maastrict in 1992 to protect consumers and the environment where insufficient scientific information exists.

Quote from the EU 2002 on the principle "The precautionary principle applies where scientific evidence is insufficient, inconclusive or uncertain and preliminary scientific evaluation indicates that there are reasonable grounds for concern that the potentially dangerous effects on the environment, human, animal or plant health may be inconsistent with the high level of protection chosen by the EU".

So the Principle is there to fill the vacuum of scientific uncertainty, it should be only used in the context if best scientific advice points at a problem but as yet can't prove it due to very complex environmental factors to replicate in experiment, so you use "the better be safe than sorry" principle. But the health effects of magnetic currents is very sketchy at best with recent studies reporting inconclusive results or no health impact found. Remember that these studies inflict higher than normal levels of exposure on test subjects to accelerate effects but as yet they haven't proven a health link between magnetic fields from power lines and cancer.

It is as I said before a matter of risk perception, so I thought I would dig out some stats from the states as they are a little more advanced in the science of risk perception. The following activities increase probability of dying in any year by one chance in a million. Notice the cigarettes stats compared to the nuclear plants stats



Activity Cause of Death
Smoking 1.4 cigarettes cancer, heart disease
Drinking .5 liter of wine cirrhosis of the liver
Spending 1 hour in a coal mine black lung disease
Spending 3 hours in a coal mine accident
Living 2 days in New York or Boston air pollution
Traveling 6 minutes by canoe accident
Traveling 10 miles by bicycle accident
Traveling 300 miles by car accident
Flying 1,000 miles by jet accident
Flying 6,000 miles by jet cancer caused by cosmic radiation
Living 2 months in Denver cancer caused by cosmic radiation
Living 2 months in average stone or brick building cancer caused by natural radioactivity
One chest X ray taken in a good hospital cancer caused by radiation
Living 2 months with a cigarette smoker cancer, heart disease
Eating 40 tablespoons of peanut butter liver cancer caused by aflatoxin B
Drinking 30 12 oz cans of diet soda cancer caused by saccharin
Living 5 years at site boundary of a typical nuclear power plant cancer caused by radiation
Drinking 1,000 24-oz soft drinks from plastic bottles cancer from acrylonitrile monomer
Living 150 years within 20 miles of a nuclear power plant cancer caused by radiation
Living 50 years within 5 miles of a nuclear power plant cancer caused by radiation

Yet people get more emotive about the possibility of nuclear power plant in Ireland than been in the presence of smokers which carries a greater risk to there health. If we applied the Precautionary Principle in the context that Rush Community Council wishes to apply it and use the above scientific proven stats from above, you would have no Eirgrid in Rush, nor cars and our poor friend the smoker would be an extinct species in the EU.

A.Partridge

Thanks for that Corsendonk.

So really, there are no solid reasons established for the people of Rush to be concerned about from the Eirgrid installation bar the temporary disruption to traffic flow, dust noise etc?

Corsendonk

Not really, but I noticed one poster mentioned Eirgrid in Rush in the same context as the Shell to Sea Campaign which I thought was a little extreme. Hey at least the police presence in Rush will improve if that posters statement comes through, property prices might take a tumble do........

As other posters have said it seems to be "we are all for progress but not in my back garden" or "what compensation can we get"

Does anyone know who is behind the meeting this coming Thursday? Is it the Rush Community Council?

LeoB

I put up post about public meeting but got details confirmed this morning by an organiser and its not a public meeting.

The person who sent me the original text did so in good faith.
The meeting on Thursday is between an action group which has been formed and a local B.O.M committee and parents reps.

I had a brief chat with 1 organiser and felt the concerns raised were valid. No cast iron guarentee was given as to the safety of proposed cable and the excuse of not using Rogerstown esturay as it is an S.A.C does not hold water, (no pun intended) Did you see the mess its in now with diggers and cranes working away in it.... There is an alternative to ripping up the roads and that is use the estuary.

Some people feel we are being railroaded again and you can quote any E.U law or stats people have fears and are entitled to be listened to.
I would not be against progress but if there is an alternative which makes people feel a bit safer why not use it?

LeoB

A.Partridge wrote: »

Thanks for that Corsendonk.

So really, there are no solid reasons established for the people of Rush to be concerned about from the Eirgrid installation bar the temporary disruption to traffic flow, dust noise etc?

They have safety concerns about the depth of the cable and IIRC the type of cable and the fact it goes past the front door of a school with 700 students.

Corsendonk

Well research found that magnetic fields from powerlines can interfered with birds internal navigation and Rogerstown is a major area for migrating birds. Sadly we dont have that talent thats why we have Garmin:)

But as I pointed out its risk perception and kids are a very emotive trigger. Nothing is a 100% safe so no company or organisation is going to give a cast iron gurantee especially in litigation mad Ireland.

Martron

well perhaps we will get more birds to rogerstown so.

you are totally right about risk perseption.

what do people think is going to happen. The cable is going to be going through rush but they need to just spell out the risk. no matter how slight it may be so people can have a better understanding.

its possibly peoples ignorance on the matter that has them so worried.

a simple chart comparing the emmissions form the table compared to something we can relate to would put a lot of people minds at ease.

Corsendonk

Afraid Science is a dirty word with some people. They hear about the risks from others and don't read and do research themselves even if you placed the information in a chart form in front of them. The fear of the great unknown of the power line while there happy to live with the risk of spray drift from farmers spraying crops in fields around there houses in Rush but there so use to that sight they dont question it.

Its like the road safety tv add with kid playing in the garden and the car comes tumbling over the hedge. They did followup research to assess its impact on the tv audience, you know what they found when they questioned a sample audience? A reduction in people willing to drink and drive or reduction in speed? Nope, they actually found that mothers wouldn't allow there kids play in the garden if there was a busy road outside. So even when you try to educate people with a specific risk they can get a different message.

dan_d

Unbelievable!
I did see a small piece in today's Indo, relating to the Rush/Eirgrid situation. Who told the media?

Martron

you are totally right.

i cant wrap my head around it myself. i find it mind boggling that once people get an idea in their head that no information will sort it.

i remeber when we got a microwave first we were not allowed to go near it when it was on. now everyone has one and its not an issue.

A.Partridge

dan_d wrote: »

Unbelievable!
I did see a small piece in today's Indo, relating to the Rush/Eirgrid situation. Who told the media?

I received an email (the blanket variety) from Michael Kennedy TD about it.

So I'd say some one of the many hundreds who received it sent it on to the Indo?

The Hill Billy

dan_d wrote: »

Who told the media?

The hacks trawl boards for stories regularly.

* waves to Ken *

Alan Farrell

I spoke to a couple of people from Rush about this today and while I understand people have a legitimate concern regarding this matter, what I cannot accept is where certain individuals have claimed lack of public consultation as a reason why this matter should be stopped.

Martron

I know i said it in a recent post. but i personally have no problem with eirgrid but there was a problem when people never even heard about the initial meeting. That was the point i was making/

Corsendonk

Martron wrote: »

I know i said it in a recent post. but i personally have no problem with eirgrid but there was a problem when people never even heard about the initial meeting. That was the point i was making/

Well is it Eirgrid fault or people's own fault that they did not know about the interconnector route through Rush and then the subsequent oral hearing and public meeting? It seems some people think that this story popped out of thin air to ensure Eirgrid got the power lines through Rush by stealth as it was too late for them to object. The original planning application was in 2008 and 601 million euro projects do get peoples attention in the media so I went digging around the media sites to see when Eirgrid Interconnector and Rush popped up in articles.

Irish Indo
2008 Three stories
2009 One Story
2010 One Story

Fingal Indo
2008 Two stories in Jan/Feb
2009 Three stories throughtout year
2010 Thirteen stories since June

RTE Online
2009 One story
2010 One story reporting on opening of Oral hearing

Breaking News2009 One story including that the work provides 100 jobs.

BBC News Online
2009 Two stories
2010 One story

Rush Community Council Blog
2010 13 stories Eirgrid
5 Fingal County Council
1 Garda

I also remember at least one flyer from Eirgrid in my door and seen the notices for the public meeting. I am not on any local politician email distribution lists( I get enough spam already:) ). So I ask my question again was it Eirgrid fault or people's own fault that they did not know about the interconnector route through Rush and then the subsequent oral hearing and public meeting?

Martron

i think it was a bit of both eirgrid and peoples fault.

but i for one dont buy the paper or read online news. that knocks 90% of your list off.

as for leaflet in the door. i have a no junk mail sticker on my box.

i personally did not hear about the public meeting initially. when i did hear about the works i researched it myself and was happy enough what was going on.

i think if people were worried about it they could have looked into themselves and they would have found a vast source of information and also a 2nd public meeting which i believe was packed. so much in fact they needed to restrict entry into it.

so maybe the release of informaion was not coordinated to provide as much information to as many people.

the fact that it was such a length of time away at the start no body paid to much attention to it.but are worried now witht the start imminent