Enniscorthy

paulaa

I'm sitting in my car near the post office atm. The traffic is unbelievable from all directions. Where is it all coming from in a town with little or no industry, shops closed etc ?

Cantona's Collars

paulaa wrote: »

I'm sitting in my car near the post office atm. The traffic is unbelievable from all directions. Where is it all coming from in a town with little or no industry, shops closed etc ?

Takes very little for traffic to grind to a halt in the town,however there was something going on at the Old Bridge around 3pm,Gardai were there & talking to someone in a car.

Ian7

mccarte2 wrote: »

On a positive note, I visited the Enniscorthy Inn / Shenanigans / Square Bar / MAD last night and was positively surprised. .

Yeah it's nice, had a bit of lunch there the other day, there's a different vibe to it than when it was shenanigans. Will definitely be going back again.

Cantona's Collars

Ian7 wrote: »

Yeah it's nice, had a bit of lunch there the other day, there's a different vibe to it than when it was shenanigans. Will definitely be going back again.

The 8oz Burger is yum!! Massive 'proper' chips with it too. At €10 it won't break the bank either.

haron

was reading that enniscorthy is celebrating a 100 years since Corbett Williams became the first man to fly from Britain to Ireland. there is a fly over and stuff happening does any one have any info on where be a good viewing spot?

Cantona's Collars

Nice to see the boy racers having free reign to re-enact the Grand Prix on the streets of the town.They pulled out in front of cars last night and proceeded to weave all over the road and drive like lunatics through the town from the L&N to Lidl's car park where no doubt they had a great laugh over the 'craic' they had.If anyone along Bellfield or Weafer Street had stepped onto the road,they wouldn't have had a chance.
If any of our local gardai are reading this,the ringleader was driving a silver Peugot 206 with a nice new L plate on the back.

davef1000

Judgement Day wrote: »

Back in 2009 as I sat in an empty meeting room minutes before a well attended inaugural meeting to save the Athenaeum, the urge to contribute beat strongly inside me - instead, after years of serving on different committees I decided to keep my head down and watch instead.

You did well to keep schtum. I was at the initial meeting in the hall of St. Aidan's Primary School in Oct 2008 and I actually spoke at it. I think I was the only one there who said that reopening/refurbishing the Athenaeum was a bad idea. Everyone else was on a big 'but it's part of our history/heritage' trip. Problem was, most of the town don't give a crap, and didn't even when the building was still in use by the Musical and Drama socs. (And it was falling apart for a good 20years before this meeting took place, anyway. Nobody was too concerned about history/heritage during that time, either.)

klong

davef1000 wrote: »

You did well to keep schtum. I was at the initial meeting in the hall of St. Aidan's Primary School in Oct 2008 and I actually spoke at it. I think I was the only one there who said that reopening/refurbishing the Athenaeum was a bad idea. Everyone else was on a big 'but it's part of our history/heritage' trip. Problem was, most of the town don't give a crap, and didn't even when the building was still in use by the Musical and Drama socs. (And it was falling apart for a good 20years before this meeting took place, anyway. Nobody was too concerned about history/heritage during that time, either.)

I think, personally, perhaps part of the problem has been too many people on the committee- too many opinions and therefore a lack of decisions being made. Lowest common denominator perhaps? Looking at the story in the past, it looks like there were something like 15 or 16 people involved.

From the local papers it would seem as though there's €50,000 or so in the bank. How much is required to get the place sorted out? I guessing a fairly high six-figure sum

I think, dave, you may well have had the right idea- would you prefer a new build structure? In the same location or outside of town? Any other opinions?

davef1000

klong wrote: »

I think, dave, you may well have had the right idea- would you prefer a new build structure? In the same location or outside of town? Any other opinions?

Well at the time, the mood in the room seemed to be for a full-on refurbishment of the premises, which would have seen the theatre remain on the first floor, with the same awful dressing room sizes and facilities. That's a terrible idea. That's what I was mostly opposed to. I understand that there is now a new design for a remodeled building within the current structure which would seem like a better option, in some ways.

However I think the biggest problem is the lack of support for the arts in Enniscorthy. What good is a theatre (costing several hundred thousand at least) if the audience is too small to sustain it? There doesn't seem to me to be a sufficient appetite for theatre/musicals/live music within the town to make either a new venue or a remodeled Athanaeum viable.

This was a problem long before the Athanaeum closed. The Enniscorthy Musical Society has been struggling for years to find new members. Attendances at both drama and musical shows were not consistent or large enough to guarantee a profit, with one result being that there was no money available for routine maintenance of the building (not that the societies themselves would have been directly financially responsible for everything - since the building is owned by the parish, the town itself, i.e, the people, has responsibility for the upkeep of the building, but societies would have had to contribute in some way, too).

This is one of the reasons I left Enniscorthy a year ago. I'm a professional musician and I found it extremely difficult to get work, throughout the county as a whole. There are very few musicians, therefore few venues, therefore fewer people see live music on a regular basis, therefore fewer people are encouraged to take up music as a hobby, therefore fewer musicians, and on and on. I'd be interested to hear other people's take on this, too. I now live in Sligo, where there is a very healthy local music scene, and I know a community of full-time musicians who live and work locally. (I didn't know anybody in Enniscorthy/Wexford who made their living solely from playing/teaching music.) Is it really as bad as I found it?

Cantona's Collars

The Bailey tried live gigs but that seems to have died a death,just a few pubs with some music at weekends is all we have,if someone had to make a living from it in the town they'd starve.
Wexford town seems to have a healthier live music scene but it's just a reflection of the higher population down there.

However,I would like to see the Atheneum restored properly and it used for gigs,live standup etc.Any time I want to see the likes of Tommy Tiernan for example,I have to travel to Wexford,our alternative is Brendan Grace once a year in The Riverside (The Bailey did have some decent standup etc. but not for a while now)

Perhaps The Strawberry Fest will pique peoples interest in live music in the town but I won't hold my breath as we live in the Capital Of Apathy.

klong

Good replys, guys. A few thoughts...

I'd agree that part of the problem is low population density. Including the town itself, 40,000 people live within a 20 minute drive of the town. Probably not high enough to keep a good- quality arts centre running on a full-time basis.

It's a strange paradox. You have people saying that the town is rubbish for whatever reasons (and this is not a dig at anybody in particular!), but there is then either (a) an unwillingness to provide decent, well- thought out alternatives, (b) an unwillingness to engage with facilities put in place, or (c) the "grass is greener" syndrome. Dave's comments show there is a vicious circle there- few willing to pay to see bands/music, therefore few who will make the effort, few venues etc

Wexford town has a very healthy arts scene in general from what I can see. If Enniscorthy was to somehow develop an arts scene outside of bands playing in a pub to five people, year- round, would that damage the arts scene in Wexford town? Could be a danger of having two weak arts scenes instead of a strong one.

I do know a very few people who are engaged in music teaching fulltime, but that's all.

R3al

klong wrote: »

(a) an unwillingness to provide decent, well- thought out alternatives, .

Be interested to hear your own ideas, if the council were to allow larger retail parks/ shopping centre or a sports facility decent cinema etc to be developed (probably too late now to do these now) this would encourage more people to travel into Enniscorthy, unfortunately living 20 minutes from enniscorthy also means they live within driving distance of Arklow, Gorey or Wexford all of which have better things to offer

Ian7

davef1000 wrote: »

This is one of the reasons I left Enniscorthy a year ago. I'm a professional musician and I found it extremely difficult to get work, throughout the county as a whole. There are very few musicians, therefore few venues, therefore fewer people see live music on a regular basis, therefore fewer people are encouraged to take up music as a hobby, therefore fewer musicians, and on and on. I'd be interested to hear other people's take on this, too. I now live in Sligo, where there is a very healthy local music scene, and I know a community of full-time musicians who live and work locally. (I didn't know anybody in Enniscorthy/Wexford who made their living solely from playing/teaching music.) Is it really as bad as I found it?

Kind of, but it seems to be cyclical. We had a very vibrant music scene up until maybe two years ago. The amount of "originals" bands coming out of Enniscorthy at that time was amazing and we had some good venues around the county too to back it up. That's where the buzz was at that time. There was a decent covers circuit going at the time too for smaller bands. The problem you see is that the population of Enniscorthy combined with the current strain on peoples pockets means that we find it hard to sustain more than two or three weekend venues (i.e. Wilsons, Dbar and Benedicts).

I know there is currently a bit of a problem with gaining community support for Arts etc. but perhaps the opening of the Arts centre coupled with the eventual (hopefully) opening of the Athenaeum will bring about some positive changes and, we can only succeed if we have people with a strong vision. Maybe you will lend your experience or ideas once again to the town in the near future?

Also, I hear the recent "Music Man" show was a bit of a success.

By the way, I really do think the current argument over "control" of the athenaeum is pathetic. I'm sure a lot of people feel this too. It doesn't bode well for the future of the building if the people running it are busy clashing hand bags with each other.

Ian7

R3al wrote: »

Be interested to hear your own ideas, if the council were to allow larger retail parks/ shopping centre or a sports facility decent cinema etc to be developed (probably too late now to do these now) this would encourage more people to travel into Enniscorthy, unfortunately living 20 minutes from enniscorthy also means they live within driving distance of Arklow, Gorey or Wexford all of which have better things to offer

The lack of any form of cinema in the town is proving disastrous to say the least. Most of my friends regularly go to the cinema but obviously either travel to Gorey or Wexford. And it ain't cheap either when you put the price of fuel on top of the tickets and food.

I think a new cinema in the town would work if it was run properly, unlike the last place. Enniscorthy has a vast hinterland from which to feed it too. If only someone would bite the bullet and develop it.

sundula

Enniscorthy has fallen to far behind Gorey and Wexford for the opening of a new Cinema to turn around the local economy.

Gorey and Wexford are roughly 25 minutes either side of the town, have vastly superior shops, retail parks and leisure activities. Were the proposed bypass of Enniscorthy to go ahead the town would probably turn into some form of a ghost town.

Ian7

sorry, i didn't mean that the opening of a cinema would solve all of our problems. I was only suggesting an idea to get the town back on the right track.

Yes, they may have better retail etc. but most people attend the cinema during the evening when the shops are closed. Most people just drive there and come home again.

Allowing people to attend a more local cinema would mean that they could maybe go for a drink or two afterwards.

ICCM

A Cinema in itself wouldnt make a hugh difference but as part of an overall development strategy for the town would be a move in the right direction IMHO

klong

R3al wrote: »

Be interested to hear your own ideas, if the council were to allow larger retail parks/ shopping centre or a sports facility decent cinema etc to be developed (probably too late now to do these now) this would encourage more people to travel into Enniscorthy, unfortunately living 20 minutes from enniscorthy also means they live within driving distance of Arklow, Gorey or Wexford all of which have better things to offer

I would be of the opinion that building large retail parks would be a bad idea for the town.

The likelihood is that if any were to be built, they'd be outside the remit of the Town Council = no rates. While shoppers would be happy, the Town Council would not benefit. Secondly, the likes of Tesco would put local retailers under serious pressure, leading to a loss of business in retailers in town and ultimately closure. Again, the Town Council ends up losing rates income. Next there is the tourism issue. Ireland's biggest tourist market is the UK. Building large retail parks and filling them with (mainly) British stores creates a "Main Street, UK" effect. A large number of towns in Ireland have several UK-based chains. Walk through Dundrum Town Centre or Blanchardstown and you'll see what I mean. When people go on holidays they (generally) want a different experience to what they get at home. Turn Ireland into a wetter version of the UK with funny accents (ok, some might argue we're already there) isn't going to encourage British tourists to visit.

As has been mentioned, even opening a cinema in the town would be a benefit. I was trying to think earlier today what people could do after five or six o'clock and I couldn't think of a whole lot!

As for other ideas...how about something like this: http://www.glasgowcanal.co.uk/regeneration-projects/paddlesports-centre Have seen kayakers on the river plenty of times. Some sort of Ballyhoura- like bike trail within easy reach of the town would be good too- from memory there's no easily-accessible, abandoned railway line nearby though maybe JD knows??? Both of these would require accomodation, in between hotels and B & Bs - a hostel. How about marketing the town as a gateway for adventure sports (or suchlike) for the region? I think I need to come back to this again later...

There is, by the way, a meeting on on May 2nd in the Riverside in relation to Enniscorthy and tourism development and open to the public too!

jpb1974

We had a cinema and it shut down a number of months back... probably due to lack of patronage... but I did hear say that it wasn't well kept inside too.

Point being... why open another cinema when the previous one wasn't well enough utilized?

Ian7

jpb1974 wrote: »

We had a cinema and it shut down a number of months back... probably due to lack of patronage... but I did hear say that it wasn't well kept inside too.

Point being... why open another cinema when the previous one wasn't well enough utilized?

Well with the price of petrol now going astronomical wouldn't it be great to have a cinema close by?
it wasn't well enough utilized because it wasn't properly managed. Crowds of people only interested in social activities once inside made for a very un-cinema like atmosphere.

kneemos

Ian7 wrote: »

The lack of any form of cinema in the town is proving disastrous to say the least. Most of my friends regularly go to the cinema but obviously either travel to Gorey or Wexford. And it ain't cheap either when you put the price of fuel on top of the tickets and food.

I think a new cinema in the town would work if it was run properly, unlike the last place. Enniscorthy has a vast hinterland from which to feed it too. If only someone would bite the bullet and develop it.

Perhaps a cinema/stage in the Athenaeum might be an idea

kneemos

Anybody any ideas on what to do with the old st.john's hospital

Ian7

kneemos wrote: »

Anybody any ideas on what to do with the old st.john's hospital

Unfortunately due to its size it would probably take a sheik or a "fortunate" property developer millions to get it back into any decent sort of shape. Unless one section of it was restored but then the rest of it would probably be unsightly and dangerous. It's a shame but thats the reality now and we're likely to see similar buildings all around the country fall into disrepair. St. Senan's could be another future "ruin" too, now that the HSE are clearing out of it.

kneemos

Ian7 wrote: »

Unfortunately due to its size it would probably take a sheik or a "fortunate" property developer millions to get it back into any decent sort of shape. Unless one section of it was restored but then the rest of it would probably be unsightly and dangerous. It's a shame but thats the reality now and we're likely to see similar buildings all around the country fall into disrepair. St. Senan's could be another future "ruin" too, now that the HSE are clearing out of it.

There may be structural or beaurocratic problems.But i was thinking free industrial units for a year or two for new companys

the GALL

davef1000 wrote: »

Well at the time, the mood in the room seemed to be for a full-on refurbishment of the premises, which would have seen the theatre remain on the first floor, with the same awful dressing room sizes and facilities. That's a terrible idea. That's what I was mostly opposed to. I understand that there is now a new design for a remodeled building within the current structure which would seem like a better option, in some ways.

However I think the biggest problem is the lack of support for the arts in Enniscorthy. What good is a theatre (costing several hundred thousand at least) if the audience is too small to sustain it? There doesn't seem to me to be a sufficient appetite for theatre/musicals/live music within the town to make either a new venue or a remodeled Athanaeum viable.

This was a problem long before the Athanaeum closed. The Enniscorthy Musical Society has been struggling for years to find new members. Attendances at both drama and musical shows were not consistent or large enough to guarantee a profit, with one result being that there was no money available for routine maintenance of the building (not that the societies themselves would have been directly financially responsible for everything - since the building is owned by the parish, the town itself, i.e, the people, has responsibility for the upkeep of the building, but societies would have had to contribute in some way, too).

This is one of the reasons I left Enniscorthy a year ago. I'm a professional musician and I found it extremely difficult to get work, throughout the county as a whole. There are very few musicians, therefore few venues, therefore fewer people see live music on a regular basis, therefore fewer people are encouraged to take up music as a hobby, therefore fewer musicians, and on and on. I'd be interested to hear other people's take on this, too. I now live in Sligo, where there is a very healthy local music scene, and I know a community of full-time musicians who live and work locally. (I didn't know anybody in Enniscorthy/Wexford who made their living solely from playing/teaching music.) Is it really as bad as I found it?

Well put Dave, Venues don't want to pay the money for professionals they would rather pay cheap and get cheap muso's then wonder why their pub is empty and they are closing down.

Ian7

the GALL wrote: »

Well put Dave, Venues don't want to pay the money for professionals they would rather pay cheap and get cheap muso's then wonder why their pub is empty and they are closing down.

I don't know if you are taking a swipe at small bands there or what but you can't put blame on not having professional music in a pub for it closing down. There are many pubs not employing big name bands and they still seem to be doing ok. By the way, what actually constitutes a professional band? and what is the limit before a venue has to put a cover charge on the door?
Something which often turns people off a venue.

the GALL

Go Easy there Ian, I'm not taking a swipe at bands big or small I run a music agency and have done for a number of years. What I'm saying is venues don't treat (some) muso's with respect. In my experience I have come across venues cancelling gigs with no notice, arguing with musicians about fee's after gigs/work being completed to name a few.
I'll put it another way, If you were a builder and carried out work for someone to contract and they didn't want to pay or argued the fees after the work was carried out or worse again cancelled the job on the day it was to start would you recommend that person to your other builder buddies.
It works the same way for musicians, I've had venues ring me asking for acts to play and Muso's refusing to play there because of the way them or other muso's have been treated.
A professional Muso to me would be a Muso that charges be that a solo artist that can cover a pub gig or a full band that can play the point/vicker st, a venue can do what they want regarding cover charge, that's their own business and is sorted before the gig goes ahead.
To run a successful music venue regular good acts need to be employed, and they cost money by successful I don't just mean the tills are flowing every night. There's a difference between asking a muso to play in your venue and a muso asking can they play in your venue. A lot of venue's don't realize that
Venue's should treat muso's as they would any other employee rather than try to squeeze an extra couple of euro out of(and sometimes that's what is argued over). What makes my company successful is I'm fair, I respect the Muso/Venue, I do what I say I'm going to do and I don't take the piss.
It works for me, the venues I work with and the Muso's that I employ.

Ian7 wrote: »

I don't know if you are taking a swipe at small bands there or what but you can't put blame on not having professional music in a pub for it closing down. There are many pubs not employing big name bands and they still seem to be doing ok. By the way, what actually constitutes a professional band? and what is the limit before a venue has to put a cover charge on the door?
Something which often turns people off a venue.

Cantona's Collars

2 more shops closing in the town on Cathedral Street,not surprised considering they are women's boutiques and the town is flooded with them.
Also a liquidation stock men's store open where Hi-Def City used to be,not sure what the stuff is like in it but might give it a gander over the weekend.

klong

zerks wrote: »

2 more shops closing in the town on Cathedral Street,not surprised considering they are women's boutiques and the town is flooded with them.
Also a liquidation stock men's store open where Hi-Def City used to be,not sure what the stuff is like in it but might give it a gander over the weekend.

Was a fair few people in there when I passed by. Think it's one of those pop-up shops, won't be around for long.

TheChevron

I wonder if people do any kind of research before opening shops.

I noticed that airsoft shop on Weafer St was closed there this evening..was that ever going to make a profit?