Beginning Racing

Bullmastiff · 10-06-2010 11:36am #1

Any advice on how to get into racing? such as: avg speeds/ training hrs per week/ also are there age catagories?
Toying with the idea of at least finishing one

if I can get the weight down/speeds up.
As an indicator, according to the cateye my last spin was 51K, Avg spd-31.1kph,-undulating roads, no wind.
I'm putting in @200K per week 50/50/100 and wouldnt mind giving a race a go if I thought I could hang on at the back of the bunch:)

godihatedehills · 10-06-2010 12:02pm

There are not many advantages to being a woman in this game but this is definitely one of them. It's much easier to get into racing if ur a chick. I'm presuming you're not though so the best thing would be to join a club and do their club league. TTs are probably the easiest first race to do if you want to ease yourself in.

Other than that I think you could get a one day licence at an open race which has a specific A4 only race. Others will have to advise you more on this but IMO this would be getting in at the deep end, a club league would be gentler

sy · 10-06-2010 12:02pm

31 kpm average over undulating 50km course should indicate that you would "hang on" in an A4 race. However the biggest problem tends to be coping with riding in a big bunch at speed. Have you ridden in a group at speed, are you a competent bike handler etc are all important factors aswell as speed and distance. I would recommend you join a club and get some experience by riding in their club races. You will get lots of advice from members and its always more fun when you know a group. Lots of posts here by people who have taken up racing this year or last and I would highly recommend reading their posts. Lumen, Dirkvoodoo niceonetom shaungil El Tonto Beasty etc just to name a few (apologies to those I have left out). In case you are a girl, Caroline.ie and GodIHateTheHills of course!

DirkVoodoo · 10-06-2010 12:04pm

I think Quigs Snr said it best: average speeds don't really matter, it's coping with changes in speed that really matter.

Try and work some interval training into your spins.

EDIT: What sy says too. I would wait until club training spins start up again at the end of the year, you will learn how to ride in a group, proper etiquette, etc. Trying to learn this in the middle of a race in the middle of the season is probably not good for you or those around you. Don't be put off though!

Planet X · 10-06-2010 12:12pm

^^
Yeah, you'd need to be able to hammer up a hill in the big ring for a couple of minutes, this is where alot of people are caught out. Max. heart rate, sustained for a few minutes, then it seems to slow down a tad until the next feature, corner / hill etc.

Bullmastiff · 10-06-2010 12:20pm

Cheers all, I'll be searching old threads for info & joining the nearest club I think!
Thanks for the advice!

DirkVoodoo · 10-06-2010 12:24pm

Where are you based?

Bullmastiff · 10-06-2010 12:28pm

Dublin 15, Lucan has the nearest club to me I think.

DirkVoodoo · 10-06-2010 12:39pm

Ah excellent, good club too as far as I know, plus they race in the league with Orwell/Usher/UCD/Tiernans, well supported and plenty of boardsies.

Beasty · 10-06-2010 12:50pm

Club League is definitely the way to go - I started my racing career this year with Swords, at the age of 49, and am loving every minute of it. If you want to check out our experiences check out some of the training logs - there are a number of us who only started racing this year.

The club races cater for quite a broad range of abilities, and will help you initially get to understand a bit more about racing tactics. They will also allow you to benchmark yourself against others - this will give you a better idea of whether you could hold your own in open races. Club races also tend to have smaller groups and it's a much safer environment for a novice to get to understand the basics of racing.

EDIT - on the age category point there are junior categories, and also vets racing (run by the IVCA (35+ for ladies, 40+ for men)

Bullmastiff · 10-06-2010 1:00pm

Beasty wrote: »

I started my racing career this year with Swords, at the age of 49,

Happy days! I'm 36yr old male and thought I would be pushing on a bit for the racing lark! 49, well done indeed!;)

Beasty · 10-06-2010 1:10pm

Bullmastiff wrote: »

Happy days! I'm 36yr old male and thought I would be pushing on a bit for the racing lark! 49, well done indeed!;)

Don't be misled by the preponderence of young whippersnappers on the boards cycling forum - there are lots of top riders still racing into their 60s, and quite lot in the Swords league also do vets racing - the main issue is we tend to struggle with keyboards due to the onset of arthritis:D

ROK ON · 10-06-2010 1:12pm

Question.
If a person wanted to get a race or two in before the season ended, is it too late to join say Orwell/Lucan etc or Swords in order to get access to a club league race.
Thinking I want to try a club league race. By end of August I will have a reasonable amount of disciplined group rides in 100+ group done.

sy · 10-06-2010 1:35pm

ROK ON wrote: »

Question.
If a person wanted to get a race or two in before the season ended, is it too late to join say Orwell/Lucan etc or Swords in order to get access to a club league race.
Thinking I want to try a club league race. By end of August I will have a reasonable amount of disciplined group rides in 100+ group done.

Talk about trying to sneak in the back door

Not unless you give full details o "ate and drank anything" in the last decade

On a serious note looking forward to your post after first race and good luck with the Raid

Diarmuid · 10-06-2010 1:48pm

31kph solo for 50km is pretty respectable, fitness wise you'll be fine. The harder part is getting used to riding in a bunch. The only way to learn that is to join a club and/or race.

Beasty · 10-06-2010 2:03pm

ROK ON wrote: »

Question.
If a person wanted to get a race or two in before the season ended, is it too late to join say Orwell/Lucan etc or Swords in order to get access to a club league race.
Thinking I want to try a club league race. By end of August I will have a reasonable amount of disciplined group rides in 100+ group done.

If you're interested in Swords drop 07lapierre a PM, as he deals with membership - I am sure there would be no problem joining - check out their website also for club info.

The club league runs to the end of August, but once you've signed up and paid you Club league fee (I think you can pay this on a race by race basis) there's nothing to stop you taking part in the races. I presume it would be the same for the other clubs (and there are plenty around here who can advise you on that)

shaungil · 10-06-2010 3:12pm

Just do it and no prevarication, you won;t know till you try and there's a big disparity in levles esp in the club league. Club league I reckon is the way to go. Don't waste the summer getting fit to race. Race and the fitness and confidence will come much quicker.

Fredo · 10-06-2010 3:21pm

Can riders over 35 (for ladies) or 40 (for men) still race in A1/2/3/4 groups or do they have have to go the ICVA group once they are over 35 or 40?

ROK ON · 10-06-2010 3:22pm

shaungil wrote: »

Just do it and no prevarication, you won;t know till you try and there's a bis diparity in levles esp in the club league. Club league I reckon is the way to go. Don't waste the summer getting fit to race. Race and the fitness and confidence will come much quicker.

Not worried about being fit. I would expect to be dropped. This would be an exercise in seeing how long I could just hang on before dropping a wheel. Wouldn't bother me.
I would be more concerned about lack of experience in group riding. Something I am doing in Aug should at least greatly increase my experience in that regard.

Are most of the Swords races on in North Dublin. Are they all on Wednesdays (Wed suits).
Can ye throw up a few maps of regular circuits used if not too much trouble.
Thanks.

DirkVoodoo · 10-06-2010 3:27pm

I doubt you would get dropped in a club league ROK ON, if my own experiences are anything to go by, hanging in there is easy.

Raam · 10-06-2010 3:31pm

ROK ON wrote: »

Not worried about being fit. I would expect to be dropped. This would be an exercise in seeing how long I could just hang on before dropping a wheel. Wouldn't bother me.
I would be more concerned about lack of experience in group riding. Something I am doing in Aug should at least greatly increase my experience in that regard.

Are most of the Swords races on in North Dublin. Are they all on Wednesdays (Wed suits).
Can ye throw up a few maps of regular circuits used if not too much trouble.
Thanks.

They are all on around Oldtown or Ballyboughal or close enough.
Once upon a time, I mapped all the routes. Let me dig em out.

ROK ON · 10-06-2010 3:32pm

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

I doubt you would get dropped in a club league ROK ON, if my own experiences are anything to go by, hanging in there is easy.

It wouldn't worry me if I did. But I have practically no experience of large group riding. That would worry me. I am a coward and prefer not to get hurt. Plus I am unbelievable squeamish. I could easily pass out at the sight of blood.. Not joking.

Raam · 10-06-2010 3:38pm

Garristown - Ardcath

Ballyboughal This might have a different name on the Swords race list. Might be called Nags Head.

Bog of the Ring

Clonalvey

Corduff

Oldtown

Beasty · 10-06-2010 3:42pm

ROK ON wrote: »

Not worried about being fit. I would expect to be dropped. This would be an exercise in seeing how long I could just hang on before dropping a wheel. Wouldn't bother me.
I would be more concerned about lack of experience in group riding. Something I am doing in Aug should at least greatly increase my experience in that regard.

Are most of the Swords races on in North Dublin. Are they all on Wednesdays (Wed suits).
Can ye throw up a few maps of regular circuits used if not too much trouble.
Thanks.

I had done virtually no group riding before the league this season - just one Saturday club spin - you've done boards spins and sportives, so are used to riding in groups, and you'll soon get the knack of racing in groups

The main circuits are linked from here

Wednesdays for Swords races

Beasty · 10-06-2010 3:46pm

Raam wrote: »

Garristown - Ardcath

Ballyboughal This might have a different name on the Swords race list. Might be called Nags Head.

Bog of the Ring

Clonalvey

Corduff

Oldtown

I don't think they're using the Ballyboughal of Oldtown circuits this year

ROK ON · 10-06-2010 3:48pm

Thanks folks. Will be a few weeks before I get my act together.
The Batterstown circuit used by Orwell is very close to where I live, but Wednesdays suit me so much better.

godihatedehills · 10-06-2010 3:49pm

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

I doubt you would get dropped in a club league ROK ON, if my own experiences are anything to go by, hanging in there is easy.

:eek:

Esroh · 10-06-2010 3:59pm

Its the hardest thing for a 1st timer to accept but the hardest place apart from the front for you to be is 'Hanging on at the Back'.. I was so afraid of the group and making mistakes that I thought that I'd stay safely on the back. About 3miles in out of 35 I was safely on my own 'OUT' the Back.
Now I can hold my place in the bottom half and atleast get some enjoyment out of it after I have done my bit of work early on

tawfeeredux · 10-06-2010 4:58pm

Esroh wrote: »

Now I can hold my place in the bottom half and atleast get some enjoyment out of it after I have done my bit of work early on

Say you're in a group (at A4 level for instance), would everyone be expected to put a stint in at the front? And once you're there & you're tying up with the effort, do you just have to wait until the next guy takes over? I presume if you suddenly blow up and start slowing dramatically, you'll have the ear chewed off ya.

Lumen · 10-06-2010 5:06pm

tawfeeredux wrote: »

Say you're in a group (at A4 level for instance), would everyone be expected to put a stint in at the front? And once you're there & you're tying up with the effort, do you just have to wait until the next guy takes over? I presume if you suddenly blow up and start slowing dramatically, you'll have the ear chewed off ya.

In a single cat race it is in no ones interest to put any effort in, but some people have to or else the race wouldn't move off the starting line.

In a handicap race it is in everyone's interest to put the effort in to stay away from those behind and catch the group in front. Still, the effort is rarely balanced because most of the group believe they will be caught, so do as little as possible in the vain hope that they will have enough in reserve when the faster people come by.

In either case the objective is to do the least work possible.

All of the above assumes that there are no breakaways, in which case things get more interesting.

My personal strategy is to never to be on the front of a group unless there is a photographer present.

shaungil · 11-06-2010 10:39am

last night we had 2 mins on the A3 group who apparently did not work. all the Swords lads two Naas lads and a few others worked and we stayed away (albeit with thew winner who bridged) I don't get sitting on unless you have a sprint. I cycle to keep fitr and so I can eat more can't do that unless you work.

If you don't work at all you're unlikely to get into a breakaway and unless you have a good kick you're unlikely to win a sprint. It's much more fun to race than sit on and as far as I remember fun is one reason why we do this?

come on A4's man up and start attacking. I'll go for it too.

PS yet again last night the great instance of lads shouting to follow wheels when they have done nothing but sit on for the entire race. You have to love that attitude. Instead of shouting use that energy to chase yourself:mad:

mc2000 · 11-06-2010 11:02am

In answer to the original topic of the thread, to me, there's no question that club league is the best way to get started.

As has been said before, there's a big variety/spread in levels of ability in club league, and it's that way by design, and it's that way because the whole idea of club league is to be developmental, and to act as an intake for people who can do a sportive, group ride, or whatever, at a bit of a pace, and would like to have a go to see what it's like racing.

The club leagues (two great ones are already mentioned here) give you a chance to race at a level that matches your ability. With this, you're at a level that matches your ability, you get to finish the race with your group (or stay away with your group) from the chasers as long as you can - and from this you gain confidence, and you ENJOY the experience.

Because you enjoy it, you come back for more, you get fitter, your ability improves, you move up the groups, and you keep enjoying it. And this helps you get fit, stay fit, get stronger, and stay in the sport, and this helps the leagues, and helps the sport grow.

It takes some lads and lassies years (from a few, to many) to get up to the standard in open races - and some enjoy the club leagues as their end goal, it keeps them fit, its at their level of ability, and it keeps them coming back, which I think is a major plus.

And you never know until you try - the point is, if you've done a bit already, don't wait (and waste) all summer getting "fitter" - start now - the races themselves will push you much more than you ever will yourself, and you'll get fitter faster, and you'll enjoy it, and you'll be back for more.

Beasty · 11-06-2010 11:56am

Fredo wrote: »

Can riders over 35 (for ladies) or 40 (for men) still race in A1/2/3/4 groups or do they have have to go the ICVA group once they are over 35 or 40?

Yes - when over 35/40 you can apply for your racing licence either through Cycling Ireland (ie the same as under 35/40) or the IVCA -each licence allows you to race in both open (A1, A2, A3, A4) and vets races

LeoD · 11-06-2010 12:54pm

shaungil wrote: »

last night we had 2 mins on the A3 group who apparently did not work. all the Swords lads two Naas lads and a few others worked and we stayed away (albeit with thew winner who bridged) I don't get sitting on unless you have a sprint. I cycle to keep fitr and so I can eat more can't do that unless you work.

If you don't work at all you're unlikely to get into a breakaway and unless you have a good kick you're unlikely to win a sprint. It's much more fun to race than sit on and as far as I remember fun is one reason why we do this?

come on A4's man up and start attacking. I'll go for it too.

I agree with you 100%. I cannot understand guys that chase down any break and just sit on. I'm always good for a 200m solo break in our league races before my engine blows and I'm back in the pack again

. It doesn't bother me though as I'm in it for the craic so will have another pathetic dig again as soon as I get my breath back. We need more kamikazes (sp?) in league racing though to make breaks stick a bit longer and fewer cute hoors.

Esroh · 11-06-2010 1:42pm

I am part of Captain's 'Beer and Pizza' leisure group in our league(though I not a typical build for it:D) and our whole aim is to work as hard as possible so the 'I think I'm a racing heads'and the real 'Racing Heads' have to work alot harder than they might want to to catch us.
We average 10 riders each night in group and we ride as a much as a team as we know how. We have suceeded twice in getting a 'True Leisure rider Win' :cool:
The other groups know what we try to do so they just have to get their act together.
The Handicap is pretty well worked out now and most of us know our ability to be involved in the business end of a race is limited when it all comes together so the fun is making them suffer as much as possible(especially those who have moved up a level) while getting in a good hard spin

Beginning Racing

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