OUTRAGED AT PISTOL PHOTO'S

cursai

Sparks wrote: »

Well, chef's knives are now controlled, to an extent. And if you can licence samurai swords, you can licence slash hooks.

Come on now. you can only have a samurai sword for collectors reasons. a slash hook doesn't at long range either. although they have been known to be thrown rather well. Along with the hatchet...Goodnight

It wasn't me!

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Although we are catching up

We will have the second longest range in Europe soon

No, we're not. Not even close. We're so far behind that the possibility of us catching up is bleak. And for the matter of it, the length of ranges is absolutely meaningless. I'm referring to the ISSF rifle sports, which as far as I'm concerned are the pinnacle of rifle marksmanship. In countries like Germany which dominate it, children are trained on air rifles from about eight on, start smallbore at twelve or thirteen, would be our national champions in everything, by a long way, by fourteen or fifteen, and are shooting at international levels in their early twenties. That is what is required, no less, and we don't have it. It would take astronomical endeavour on the part of our athletes evebnn to be mediocre against that background.

Sparks

cursai wrote: »

Come on now. you can only have a samurai sword for collectors reasons

Or iaido...

Tackleberrywho

It wasn't me! wrote: »

No, we're not. Not even close. We're so far behind that the possibility of us catching up is bleak. And for the matter of it, the length of ranges is absolutely meaningless. I'm referring to the ISSF rifle sports, which as far as I'm concerned are the pinnacle of rifle marksmanship. In countries like Germany which dominate it, children are trained on air rifles from about eight on, start smallbore at twelve or thirteen, would be our national champions in everything, by a long way, by fourteen or fifteen, and are shooting at international levels in their early twenties. That is what is required, no less, and we don't have it. It would take astronomical endeavour on the part of our athletes evebnn to be mediocre against that background.

Do we not have bronze Medals though, and a gold?
Training cert at 14 is a start.

if we can practice at up to 1200 yards on a daily basis we could catch up

Sparks

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Do we not have bronze Medals though, and a gold?

Yes - in shotgun, held by people who started at very early ages themselves, which we're not allowed to do today.

Sparks

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

if we can practice at up to 1200 yards on a daily basis we could catch up

1200 yard ranges are a great asset to have; they're just not so useful for 10m air rifle or 50m smallbore rifle or 300m ISSF fullbore.

We've got the courses for the horses; our problem is we don't have the horses for the courses, because the laws obstruct anyone trying to get into the sport.

Tackleberrywho

Sparks wrote: »

Yes - in shotgun, held by people who started at very early ages themselves, which we're not allowed to do today.

I thought our F-Class Team won several medals?
And Nick Flood Gold all them years ago.

When I was a kid there was no ranges (near me anyway or that I knew about)

I now see great work going on at ranges all over the country.
When I was a boy the dreams of a .308 seemed out of reach. Now i have one.

Don't give up hope lads, it's all we have!

It wasn't me!

Again, I mean our ISSF stuff, for the reasons I've already specified. And again, 1200 yard ranges, while very nice for other stuff, are completely useless for those. Hope is boring and pointless. Work is all we have, and until we can start training children in at the points other countries do, with the support infrastructure and facilities to keep them in the sport and help them progress, we have a lot more work.

congress3

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

The average Bill/slash hook is just as lethal. I was using them since I was able to swing one cutting hedges, yet why do people who live in halting sites need them ???

Are you really trying to say that slash hooks need to be regulated as much as guns?
And in fairness guns are created for the sole purpose of killing whereas slash hooks are used for cutting hedges and bushes.

Tackleberrywho

When I was a kid i saw my dad killed rabbits in front of me. I understood that .
When the neighbors bled a pig hanging out of the front loader, and made black pudding. i understood that too

Don't underestimate 7 year olds
I would not however post it on facebook OR boards

Sparks

congress3 wrote: »

guns are created for the sole purpose of killing

Mine aren't.

Tackleberrywho

congress3 wrote: »

Are you really trying to say that slash hooks need to be regulated as much as guns?
And in fairness guns are created for the sole purpose of killing whereas slash hooks are used for cutting hedges and bushes.

You are very wrong there Sir.

I have many friends that only kill paper.

My pointy is, lots of things can be dangerous in the wrong hands.
No Target rifle was ever designed to kill.
Hunting rifles and military yes.

A plinker, No

A slash hook has killed many a man in ireland by the hands of another.
Yet anyone can buy one.

Sparks

congress3 wrote: »

Are you really trying to say that slash hooks need to be regulated as much as guns?

I think we should have the swiss approach to that here. Car accidents kill thousands every year, so speeding and other traffic offences are serious offences there. Speeding fines aren't fixed - they're percentages of your annual salary, and are cumulative. Random checkpoints will have dozens of police there so that noone gets waved on. Some things we don't even think at (eg. not clearing all the ice off your windscreen) will get your licence pulled. And so on.
Firearms, on the other hand, rarely kill anyone, so they don't worry so much about them. (We, on the other hand, have draconian firearms legislation for the shooting sports, and not enough gardai for gun crime or traffic control. )

So take the number of injuries a year for slash hooks and compare it to the number of injuries a year for firearms, and that should really be the measure of how much we invest in regulating them.

patsat

How many seven year olds and younger in this country have toy handguns and rifles that they go around the house aiming at people and pretending to shoot them?? Its what alot of children love to do!!

I think it is very responsible for a child to be aware of the dangers of guns from a young age otherwise what would stop the child picking up that handguns to play with?? Not that the owner would ever let that happen.

I have a 4 year old nephew who is constantly going around pretending to shoot with his toy guns, however if he ever sees one of our guns he won't go near it as he knows it is dangerous.

Once he is older he may learn more but for now it is important he distinguishes between his toys and ours!!:D

CliffT

I think the answer to that question is obvious. I'm an ex soldier and we used to have a saying "Empty weapons kill". Believe me when I tell you, I was training 17 - 25 year old recruits, intelligent well balanced young men whom would constantly need to be reminded of gun safety... I appreciate you want to share your passion for guns with your boy, but what IF...!!!!
The consequence of a mishap with guns and children is not worth it.. Children and Guns don't mix.....

Time enough when he's older and alive!!

congress3

Sparks wrote: »

So take the number of injuries a year for slash hooks and compare it to the number of injuries a year for firearms, and that should really be the measure of how much we invest in regulating them.

Please show me these stats.

How many people do you think are killed/injured every year by slash hooks??

In 2008 21 people were murdered with firearms, in comparison, 12 were murdered with knives

Tackleberrywho

congress3 wrote: »

Please show me these stats.

How many people do you think are killed/injured every year by slash hooks??

In 2008 21 people were murdered with firearms, in comparison, 12 were murdered with knives

You must have been outside Mullingar court house last summer!

Or in athlone several feuds resulted in folks been slashed

Gun crime in Ireland is illegal firearms brought in with illegal drugs.

We are going way off topic here though

Thread is about FB/7 year olds/firearms.

FB pics are public domain.
I would not post pics of kids on mine in provocative scenarios like holding a firearm.

The Internet can have a major downsides and that is one of them.
http://www.azhire.ie/equipment.hire.products.dublin.ireland.php?sectionnumber=125&number=506
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/slashhook-attacker-begs-families-to-stop-futile-feud-88889.html

Spunk84

Whats a 7 year old even doing on Facebook??? LOL

Plus IMHO there is nothing wrong with "educating" your son with firearms and being safe, but to take pictures and let them be put online of him with a Firearm and a pistol a that is bad very very bad .

<MOD SNIP>

tac foley

It wasn't me! wrote: »

No, we're not. Not even close. We're so far behind that the possibility of us catching up is bleak. And for the matter of it, the length of ranges is absolutely meaningless. I'm referring to the ISSF rifle sports, which as far as I'm concerned are the pinnacle of rifle marksmanship. In countries like Germany which dominate it, children are trained on air rifles from about eight on, start smallbore at twelve or thirteen, would be our national champions in everything, by a long way, by fourteen or fifteen, and are shooting at international levels in their early twenties. That is what is required, no less, and we don't have it. It would take astronomical endeavour on the part of our athletes evebnn to be mediocre against that background.

A slight amendment, sir - '...start three-position small-bore...'

tac
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund

deeksofdoom

tac foley wrote: »

A slight amendment, sir - '...start three-position small-bore...'

Not to be slighting in any way, but how big IS the Irish F-Class shooting team?

With at least two thousand [even] good F-Class shooters in the UK alone - a country with 67 million in it -the RoI doesn't have the population to draw on begin with. Do the best you can, and that makes what you do all the more remarkable.

Sadly, until F-Class loses the 'elitist' tag in the RoI - here and everywhere else F-Class is seen as just another facet of rifle shooting - it will seem to be beyond the average good shot.

After all, from what I've been reading in the last few weeks, most of you think little or nothing of coughing up prodigious amounts of money for more mundane rifles.

My $0.02.

tac
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund

Stay on topic or close the thread I think its run its course anyway!

tac foley

deeksofdoom wrote: »

Stay on topic or close the thread I think its run its course anyway!

Sir - are you telling me or advising me?

tac

Sparks

deeksofdoom wrote: »

Stay on topic or close the thread I think its run its course anyway!

Ease up on the back-seat modding there please deeks. If the thread wanders productively, there's little harm in that.

rrpc

Purely looking at this from a legal standpoint, it's highly likely that the OP is sailing very close to a breach of the frearms acts by allowing an unlicensed person carry (cleaning a firearm would be classed as carrying) a firearm. Posting photos of this on facebook would be the equivalent of posting a photo of himself swigging from a bottle of vodka whilst driving :eek:

In other words, not a great idea.

The argument about whether or not we should be training youngsters to shoot at an earlier age is not really germane because as the law currently stands; we can't.

Bending the law 'just a little bit' is what gets new law drafted real quick and does no service whatsoever to the wider shooting community.

On a side note, it's good to see a non-shooting member of An GS on here taking part in this discussion. I hope it proves to be a positive learning experience for all.

And just for clarification, the 'w' word is a very touchy subject here because its use implies an intent not associated with the shooting sports; we refer to them as firearms.

congress3

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

http://www.azhire.ie/equipment.hire.products.dublin.ireland.php?sectionnumber=125&number=506
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/slashhook-attacker-begs-families-to-stop-futile-feud-88889.html

I agree it's getting off topic but because you put those two links at the end I had to respond.
I don't understand why are showing me where I can buy a slash hook, and that newspaper article is four years old. I could bring up numerous examples of gun crime in this year alone, whereas all you can do is show me one piece of crime that had a slash hook in it from four years ago.

rrpc

congress3 wrote: »

I agree it's getting off topic but because you put those two links at the end I had to respond.
I don't understand why are showing me where I can buy a slash hook, and that newspaper article is four years old. I could bring up numerous examples of gun crime in this year alone, whereas all you can do is show me one piece of crime that had a slash hook in it from four years ago.

Bringing up crime of any sort on this forum is at best off charter and at worst inflammatory.

Does any sport deserve to be compared to crime because someone decides to use its equipment as a weapon?

Ash.J.Williams

One would have to be very naive to think they can put a pic of their kid in the presence of guns on a public social site and not get complaints, yeah bla bla i'm up for gun safety and awareness, but facebook???? what do you expect

fiattech

Thanks guys i have taken on board what you all have said and i have changed the way i will be doing things from now on. i will be the only one to hold my firearm from now on lesson learned.

Hibrion

People are what people are. I think there will always be some who are like that. I occasionally shoot a few clays with a bunch of lads and one day a guy from the local paper asked to take a few pictures; local interest piece and promotion of the sport and all that. My younger brother was there with me and another young lad, I think they were both about thirteen at the time. Both of them were holding shotguns (safely) int he very front of a group shot, no one said a word and the lads felt important and included.

Some people are just stupid. As some have already said, if I had kids I would hesitate to put pictures ot them up rather than them with the guns.

With regards to your friend who deleted you and the wife, I would personally delete them from your life. There is no need for such petty, small minded folk in your life. You can be guaranteed that your young lad will grow up showing the proper respect to firearms and know well how to treat one by the time he is old enough, and that can only be a good thing.

Norwayviking

fiattech wrote: »

Hi can I have your thought's, opinions and views on this one.

After a day of shooting my seven year old son love's nothing more than to help me clean the gun. We always clean it in my bedroom and i have lots of rules regarding safety, for example we call the wall where my wardrobe is "Down Range" and the muzzle always points in that direction, I always lock away any rounds i have before i even open the box containing my pistol and I check the firearm itself for safety then my son insists on checking himself. Last sunday after I used my pistol it was time to clean it and after safety checking was done i handed it to my son along with a cloth. While he was cleaning it i took some photo's and posted them on my Facebook wall "not such a good idea" to say some people got a bit upset is an under statment. I got comment's like "This is wrong wrong wrong" and " All i see is a seven year old with a gun accidents happen" To which i replied "This is not wrong, kids outside head shops at 4am is wrong, kids in stolen cars is wrong and kids downing a full bottle of vodka and mugging some old deer is wrong" After which my "friend" deleted me and my wife from her list of friends Boo Hoo. My question to you is Do you think i was wrong to let my boy hold my pistol ?
Your thoughts on this one please.

Thanks

I cant see nothing wrong with teaching your son how to clean the pistol and teaching him the safety rules of using of a firearm.
I started shooting when i was 7 in Norway,and was hunting with my grandfather when i was 10.
I shot my first sika at 12,had my own gunlisence at 16(limited),and was in the army when i was 18-20.
And are shooting and hunting on occation and going on army exercises in Norway when required by the defence forces.
A boy age of seven is much better thought how to handle a firearm than finding it out himself.
Cause he will out of curiosity try and find out how it works,and then accidents happens.
And my brother have pictures on facebook of my son age 5 holding his glock 17.
He didnt loose any friends over it!!!!!!!
I think its a bit much "gunhysteria" here in ireland,but all in a good way i guess.
I have attached a few pictures from my brothers gunclub in Norway.

ivanthehunter

rrpc wrote: »

Purely looking at this from a legal standpoint, it's highly likely that the OP is sailing very close to a breach of the firearms acts by allowing an unlicensed person carry (cleaning a firearm would be classed as carrying) a firearm.

I think you wrong one that point rrpc
IIRC there are several exemptions as to when a firearms licence is not required by the individual holding the gun and this is one such instance.

IIRC the law allows someone other than the licensed holder of the firearm, to fetch the gun to them under the licence holder direct instruction... it also allows for the licenced holder of the firearm to instruct an individual to stow the gun..

Yep the master of the house or the lord of the Estate would instruct his man, Alfred to fetch the DBSG in double quick time old chap...