Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

jm08

Heroditas wrote: »

Flat backlines shovelling the ball sideways like pass-the-parcel?
Certainly seemed to resemble what Gaffney had been doing for much of the last decade.
However, I always did wonder what he was up to with the Irish set-up. It seemed a strange appointment at the time.

In fairness to Gaffney, the Sexton loop is his move.

Now that you mention Gaffney's appointment - it was only a part time one as he was working with Leinster at the time. Leinster's standout best feature would have been defence (Kurt McQuilken) in that period.

GerM

Heroditas wrote: »

With Leinster? The backlines played awful stuff under him. Absolutely atrocious.
I have difficulty remembering very many innovative set pieces under him.

Yup. Not saying they were regular features in later years but they were still very much there. In his last year at Leinster I'm sure we all remember the back line tries in the HEC against Llanelli and against Brive home and away including the spectacular BOD try where they spun it wide and Shaggy flipped a reverse offload for the BP try.

Teferi

danthefan wrote: »

I don't think that is a set piece as much as it is a moment of understanding and brilliance from two stellar players.

GerM

Teferi wrote: »

I don't think that is a set piece as much as it is a moment of understanding and brilliance from two stellar players.

The reverse pass was a moment of brilliance. BOD being skipped and then looping around to finish, Berne's flat skip, Kearney hitting the line outside, Nacewa running a hard dummy line on the inside and all of it being executed at high speed and flawlessly, that would all be a set move.

Heroditas

GerM wrote: »

Yup. Not saying they were regular features in later years but they were still very much there. In his last year at Leinster I'm sure we all remember the back line tries in the HEC against Llanelli and against Brive home and away including the spectacular BOD try where they spun it wide and Shaggy flipped a reverse offload for the BP try.

True, there were a few nuggets there.
Unfortunately, there were more bad phases than good - whether that was due to the overall coaching strategy or Gaffney is open to debate.
I'd agree that part of it was due to the overall tactics but I would definitely put a large part of it at Gaffney's door - particularly after what BOD said last season.

totallegend

This discussion about Gaffney's time at Leinster overlooks one massive issue; in his first season there Leinster won a Heineken Cup and then got to the semis of the HC and finished top of the league the following year.

No-one would be giving out about Kiss or the absence of a dedicated backs coach if Ireland were winning. The issue is that we're not.

Ireland have been in a downward spiral for a couple of years and the management seem to be intent on compounding the errors, in the hope of being vindicated, rather than biting the bullet and fixing them.

danthefan

As I said on the previous page lads, 19 tries in 6 games in the HEC pools that season under Gaffney. That is a very good strike rate.

leftleg

GerM wrote: »

The reverse pass was a moment of brilliance. BOD being skipped and then looping around to finish, Berne's flat skip, Kearney hitting the line outside, Nacewa running a hard dummy line on the inside and all of it being executed at high speed and flawlessly, that would all be a set move.

Kidney would call it "wisdom"

Mr.Applepie

leftleg wrote: »

Kidney would call it "wisdom"

Kidney would call it a wasted chance to kick the ball into the corner.

Aidric

Just a heads up. Heard on the intro to tonight's Off The Ball that they will be discussing Kidneys future on Wednesday night rugby. Starts after the 8pm news.

Podge_irl

Apparently Ireland are struggling because Kidney is building a new team.

totallegend

Podge_irl wrote: »

Apparently Ireland are struggling because Kidney is building a new team.

Yep, Thornley actually said that. Another beauty was that he wouldn't favour Schmidt coming on board with Ireland because it might upset Kiss.

It would be funny if it was a random internet punter coming out with this.

tolosenc

totallegend wrote: »

It would be funny if it was a random internet punter coming out with this.

I'd like to see a "Is <insert poster here> secretly Gerry Thornley?" thread.

jamiedav2011

Good God, Thornley goes from bad to worse.

He's gone from being possibly Ireland's best rugby journalist to a puppet with an unwavering loyalty to Kidney, and an inability to criticise him. Shocking stuff.

Can listen back here btw: http://media.newstalk.ie/podcast/67471/popup

tolosenc

Listening to it now. Christ.

Gerry doesn't realise that although we scored 13 tries in the 6N, 9 of them were at home against the 2 make weights.

irishbucsfan

Thornley sounds almost personally insulted when someone asks a question about Declan Kidney!

danthefan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Thornley sounds almost personally insulted when someone asks a question about Declan Kidney!

Yeah it was unreal, got very short with the presenter asking him who else was available.

thomond2006

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Thornley sounds almost personally insulted when someone asks a question about Declan Kidney!

Thornley is like the economists (before the crisis hit) that came on Prime Time to defend the actions of banks, whilst being paid by the banks to do it!

.ak

Hmmmmm.....

totallegend

The piece on Newstalk was sort of bizarre in that it was Kidney's former player (Wood) who was being critical of him while the independent journalist defended him to the hilt.

Link to a couple of old Thornley articles during the bad days of Eddie's reign:
http://forum.leinsterfans.com/viewtopic.php?t=7656&p=166447
He really doesn't hold back in his criticism of EOS. You can see that the posters on LF.com hold him in high esteem (there's a similar thread on mf.com with similar admiration for his articles).

Fast-forward five years and we're in a very similar situation; a coach granted a contract extension before the World Cup who then went on to fail at the RWC, a terrible 6N campaign and an increasingly stagnant and insular coaching ticket; yet Thornley won't hear a word against Kidney.

There's something not right here.

profitius

I just listened to it. It highlights everything thats wrong with rugby coverage in this country. The pro 12 hardly got a mention, it was all about Declan Kidney. Come to think of it John Terry has been talked about more lately than anything to do with rugby!

On another forum a poster mentioned being in a bar in France a few years back, with loads of fans for a HEC match. There was a rugby match on Tv that they were all watching except Thornley and another Irish rugby pundit. They were watching Arsenal play some other team.

Thornley probably knows Kidney personally and Kidney is a nice polite person and Thornley is letting that cloud his judgement.

Teferi

Jaysus. Thornley is more deluded than Kidney is.

He was seriously getting aggro at the start of the interview too when the Off The Ball lads where suggesting some people to take over from Kidney.

Kidney definitely has photos of Gerry Thornley in a compromising position. It is the only conclusion I can come to.

Thornley:
"Quite probably the head honchos will want Kidney, Smal and Kiss to turn this around, see real evidence of a recovery, and maybe even renew their contracts"

holy jaysis

Thornley has been blunted!

4 years pulling awkwardly in one direction, followed by 8 months of change would probably only just about excuse Kidney's performances. If we won another GS, playing exciting rugby, Kidney would be entitled to step down with a smug look on his face. But there are absolutely no signs that this is possible, let alone plausible.

http://www.oddschecker.com/rugby-union/internationals/six-nations/grand-slam

12/1 available - giving us a ~ 10% chance. Why spend any breath even talking about this possibility and ignoring the most obvious and likely outcomes?

Lelantos

Kate Harsh Lightning wrote: »

Thornley:
"Quite probably the head honchos will want Kidney, Smal and Kiss to turn this around, see real evidence of a recovery, and maybe even renew their contracts"

holy jaysis

Thornley has been blunted!

4 years pulling awkwardly in one direction, followed by 8 months of change would probably only just about excuse Kidney's performances. If we won another GS, playing exciting rugby, Kidney would be entitled to step down with a smug look on his face. But there are absolutely no signs that this is possible, let alone plausible.

http://www.oddschecker.com/rugby-union/internationals/six-nations/grand-slam

12/1 available - giving us a ~ 10% chance. Why spend any breath even talking about this possibility and ignoring the most obvious and likely outcomes?

So, are we saying its all down to Kidney &not the fact that players are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude?

Lelantos

Lelantos wrote: »

So, are we saying its all down to Kidney &not the fact that players are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude?

Thornley revealed that 46 players represented Ireland in the last 12 months. Are they all in on this?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=576

Foxtrol

Lelantos wrote: »

So, are we saying its all down to Kidney &not the fact that players are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude?

That’s a ridiculous statement. Even if it was true the blame would still be on Kidney for firstly losing the dressing room and secondly continuing to select players who “are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude”.

leftleg

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/irfu-snub-irish-hopefuls-in-hunt-for-scrum-coach-3242146.html

"It is believed that former Italian international and one-time Scotland scrum coach Massimo Cuttita withdrew his acceptance of the position last summer as he felt the role was ill-defined."

irishbucsfan

Lelantos wrote: »

So, are we saying its all down to Kidney &not the fact that players are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude?

You're right, lets keep Kidney and sack all the players!

It's not as if its Kidneys job to demand top performances and attitude from his squad. It's all their fault.

Lelantos

Foxtrol wrote: »

Lelantos wrote: »

So, are we saying its all down to Kidney &not the fact that players are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude?

That’s a ridiculous statement. Even if it was true the blame would still be on Kidney for firstly losing the dressing room and secondly continuing to select players who “are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude”.

Your opinion, but even the most one eyed fan must recognise that certain players haven't performed as well for country as for their clubs in recent years & I really believe that the divide in the dressing room between club players still transfers to the international side. This isn't Kidney losing the dressing room, this is going on for years, any past player will tell you so. I just feel it is something that is glossed over. Perhaps the word cheated is too strong though.

leftleg

Lelantos wrote: »

So, are we saying its all down to Kidney &not the fact that players are cheating him with horrendous performances & attitude?

“I’ll take responsibility for everything that happens,” Kidney said"

http://www.herald.ie/sport/rugby/kidney-ignores-calls-to-bring-in-backs-coach-3241829.html