Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

thomond2006

Kidney is now four years in the job, time to get a new man in.

Cpt_Blackbeard

leftleg wrote: »

The captain said that its pretty pathetic that people want dk out no matter how we do in later games.

I've alot of time for you fishhooks but from previous posts you just never know what was meant by the captains original post other than what it says. Judging the post by its words comes no where near what you have pointed out.

You might need to work on your reading comprehension so...

leftleg wrote: »

For what its worth I agree with alot of your post but I'm afraid I'll never forgive dk for the 60-0. It's permanently broken as far as I am concerned.

Do you forgive the players who pulled on the 22 Irish jerseys, walked out on the pitch in Hamilton, bent over, and without a whimper, allowed the All Blacks to have their way with them?

What about captain BOD? Will you ever forgive him for guiding Ireland to (possibly) their worst ever loss?

The bad days won't be forgotten, but whats done is done. If Kidney and Co can turn this sinking ship around - they most likely won't - every level headed person should be able to stand up and acknowledge that they have earned a shot at being considered for a contract extension.

Can you see a difference between wanting Kidney out regardless of what happens next, and wanting a fresh voice/input regardless of how the current management perform over the coming months.

Fishooks12

wprathead wrote: »

We lost to France and Wales
And scraped wins against Italy and Scotland
We were awful in that 6 Nations

Think we lost to Scotland too If I recall

Podge_irl

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

The bad days won't be forgotten, but whats done is done. If Kidney and Co can turn this sinking ship around - they most likely won't - every level headed person should be able to stand up and acknowledge that they have earned a shot at being considered for a contract extension.

Bull****.

No more then I didn't judge Kidney on the back of a few bad results, I am not about to forgive him on the back of a few good ones. I gave him the benefit of the doubt again and again, all the way up to the last RWC. I was willing to acknowledge I might be wrong after the pool stages and then realised I was completely right following the gigantic tactical screw up in the QF. The last 2 6N have been pathetic.

EOS never went more then 1 6N with <4 wins, Kidney has had three in a row. At the same time as the provincial teams are enjoying their greatest ever success. Ireland could win every game this season 70-0 and I'd still want him gone.

leftleg

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Do you forgive the players who pulled on the 22 Irish jerseys, walked out on the pitch in Hamilton, bent over, and without a whimper, allowed the All Blacks to have their way with them?

What about captain BOD? Will you ever forgive him for guiding Ireland to (possibly) their worst ever loss?

The bad days won't be forgotten, but whats done is done. If Kidney and Co can turn this sinking ship around - they most likely won't - every level headed person should be able to stand up and acknowledge that they have earned a shot at being considered for a contract extension.

Forget my reading comprehension, you have lost all your marbles.

half of a defence coach and half of an attack coach, a crocked 7 and a couple of very new faces all over the pitch done us in.

Your blind kidney faith has got to all new wum levels at this stage. He picked the team and he devised the tactics.

Every level headed person has had enough of "we can turn it around next year"

Next please

Fireball07

Podge_irl wrote: »

Bull****.

No more then I didn't judge Kidney on the back of a few bad results, I am not about to forgive him on the back of a few good ones. I gave him the benefit of the doubt again and again, all the way up to the last RWC. I was willing to acknowledge I might be wrong after the pool stages and then realised I was completely right following the gigantic tactical screw up in the QF. The last 2 6N have been pathetic.

EOS never went more then 1 6N with <4 wins, Kidney has had three in a row. At the same time as the provincial teams are enjoying their greatest ever success. Ireland could win every game this season 70-0 and I'd still want him gone.

Ah now...


I think he should go...but if we got a grand slam, playing good rugby and convincingly winning games (doesn't have to be 70-0) then I think he deserves an extension. It's quite unlikely though.



He really should have been sacked after the World Cup or the 2012 6N. The loss to England...

Kidney has done some good things for Ireland, winning the grand slam was excellent (I don't buy into the thing where he was lucky and won it off EOS's team....the fact is he did win it) but that's almost 4 years ago now, and we need some fresh blood.

leftleg

Fireball07 wrote: »

Kidney has done some good things for Ireland, winning the grand slam was excellent (I don't buy into the thing where he was lucky and won it off EOS's team....the fact is he did win it) but that's almost 4 years ago now, and we need some fresh blood.

Absolutely Fireball facts are facts, he won the grand slam. Let nobody take that away from the man.

irishbucsfan

Fireball07 wrote: »

He really should have been sacked after the World Cup or the 2012 6N. The loss to England...

Oh no we couldn't sack him then. We needed to beat New Zealand for World Rankings poins remember? Thank god we kept him around.

thomond2006

leftleg wrote: »

Absolutely Fireball facts are facts, he won the grand slam. Let nobody take that away from the man.

The Grand Slam was a great achievement but Kidney's reign has run its course. Only extremely successful international coaches like Gatland, Woodward and Henry have had long tenures. The rest haven't lasted too long.

Would Kidney come under "extremely successful"? Nope.

If the AIs struggle to get bums on seats, there will be action for change. It's not the nicest thing to say, but the greatest power supporters have is to boycott matches and hurt the IRFU where it hurts most.

Hagz

Obviously if Ireland played attractive rugby and went unbeaten you wouldn't lose the head if his contract was renewed. Nevertheless, even the hypothetical situation of Kidney staying on has my stomach in knots.

Podge_irl

Fireball07 wrote: »

Ah now...


I think he should go...but if we got a grand slam, playing good rugby and convincingly winning games (doesn't have to be 70-0) then I think he deserves an extension. It's quite unlikely though.

Fair enough, I was being melodramatic. I stand by what I said - under no circumstances would I want an extension. If he achieved a comprehensive GS then I would not bemoan a 1 year rolling contract to make sure it wasn't a complete fluke, but would have issues with anything else (I am also aware that that is a complete fantasy that no coach would agree to).

Kidney will be remembered fondly in years to come for the GS and rightly so. However, nothing will convince me that EOS would not have won one if BOD had been fit for that France game in 07 or that Kidney would have failed to achieve one without BOD for the Wales or England games. But such is life and he should be lauded for his accomplishments. But equally he needs to accept responsibility for Ireland's worst run in the 6N since the start of the millenium. I didn't want the extension before the RWC and every single game since then except the Aus RWC game has reinforced that opinion.

If coaches shouldn't be hounded for one bad season (and they shouldn't), then equally they shouldn't be saved by one good one when they're desperate.

Fishooks12

Fup

IRELAND AND Leinster have been dealt a decidedly ill-timed blow with the news that Rob Kearney is to undergo an operation on his troublesome back and will be sidelined for around 10 weeks, and to compound this, Leinster will also be without Isa Nacewa for an estimated four to six weeks after he sustained a broken hand in their win over the Scarlets last Saturday.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1024/1224325625948.html

errlloyd

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1024/1224325627708.html

The 26-year-old Bloemfontein-born converted flanker and Under-19 World Cup winner with South Africa becomes eligible to play for Ireland under the three-year residency rule at the beginning of November and thus is in line to make his debut, most likely off the bench, against his native country on November 10th.

Anyone else beginning to wonder if Declan Kidney is actually Thornley's ghost writer. Like how can Thornley possibly be so confident of this?

Fishooks12

errlloyd wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1024/1224325627708.html




Anyone else beginning to wonder if Declan Kidney is actually Thornley's ghost writer. Like how can Thornley possibly be so confident of this?

Well, tbh it's fairly obvious that Strauss is going to make the squad seeing as he's trained with the team before. The considering he's much better than Cronin it's not that much of a leap of faith to suggest that he'll be on the bench for the SA game. I'd expect him to be anyway

Podge_irl

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Fup



http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1024/1224325625948.html

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

leftleg

errlloyd wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1024/1224325627708.html




Anyone else beginning to wonder if Declan Kidney is actually Thornley's ghost writer. Like how can Thornley possibly be so confident of this?

Thorno sold his journalistic soul years ago for that elusive early team sheet, simple as.

errlloyd

Ah crap, just saw the article about Rob.

Fullback options, Felix, Madigan, Keatley and Earls? I wouldn't even say no to Henshaw.

irishbucsfan

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Fup



http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1024/1224325625948.html

I guess Earls at 15 may be the only option.

Zebo on the wing then?

Cpt_Blackbeard

leftleg wrote: »

Forget my reading comprehension, you have lost all your marbles.

half of a defence coach and half of an attack coach, a crocked 7 and a couple of very new faces all over the pitch done us in.

Your blind kidney faith has got to all new wum levels at this stage. He picked the team and he devised the tactics.

Every level headed person has had enough of "we can turn it around next year"

Next please

Nice of you to completely ignore the points raised and result to insults.

Please explain my "blind kidney faith" (Sic)? As far as I was aware, I've been calling for a new coach for a while now. Just because I don't lower myself to actively hating Kidney doesn't change that.

Currently, we badly need some fresh ideas and new coaches, but if Kidney was to guide us to success over the next season, he deserves as good a shot as anyone else of being our next coach..

Fishooks12

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I guess Earls at 15 may be the only option.

Zebo on the wing then?

Seems the logical step.

Podge_irl

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Well, tbh it's fairly obvious that Strauss is going to make the squad seeing as he's trained with the team before. The considering he's much better than Cronin it's not that much of a leap of faith to suggest that he'll be on the bench for the SA game. I'd expect him to be anyway

Strauss is comfortably the second best hooker available to Ireland. The merits of project players are a whole different issue (one we discuss in Talking Rugby this week /end blatant promo). The IRFU are clearly on board with the idea seeing as it is enshrined in their 4+1 NIQ limit. There is no way a qualified Strauss isn't going to get a cap this Autumn.

Cpt_Blackbeard

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I guess Earls at 15 may be the only option.

Zebo on the wing then?

I'd imagine that Kidney hasn't given up on a Earls-BOD axis in midfield yet. If Earls doesn't play 15, I wouldn't be surprised to see Felix lumped straight back in as Kidney is a fan of his. Otherwise, the only other realistic options are Madigan, Hurley and Keatley; none of whom inspire any confidence.

leftleg

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Nice of you to completely ignore the points raised and result to insults.

Please explain my "blind kidney faith" (Sic)? As far as I was aware, I've been calling for a new coach for a while now. Just because I don't lower myself to actively hating Kidney doesn't change that.

Currently, we badly need some fresh ideas and new coaches, but if Kidney was to guide us to success over the next season, he deserves as good a shot as anyone else of being our next coach..

Wht would i hate DK. He had a game plan that worked for a while and then failed miserably. You however seem quite happy to give him another shot when its clear we need a new coach and FRESHER ideas.

You call people pathetic for asking for him to resign before the upcoming games and have just admitted that success this season would paper over 3 years of awful turgid game play and rotten results.

That's your blind Kidney faith.

Where is these "insults" you mentioned. I have questioned the posts not the posters.

Podge_irl

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I guess Earls at 15 may be the only option.

Zebo on the wing then?

I would think Earls would be the obvious choice if he was getting time there for Munster, but he isn't. He has shown before that he (understandably) has difficulties constantly shifting position in the backline. I would probably prefer Henshaw - his form deserves a call up given the current dearth of real options.

Zebo has really impressed me on the wing this year though - I would be happy with either 11. Zebo 15. Earls or 11. Earls 15. Henshaw. I just hope Hurley isn't dropped in as Henshaw is currently about equal and has far more potential.

Fishooks12

It's interesting that Zebo hasn't played much for Munster at 15. Has the complete skill set for the position.

Fireball07

If Earls is fit, then he has to be 15 really. Wouldn't trust anyone else.


I think Zebo could be a great 15, he's got the aerial ability, kicking game and counter-attacking ability but the fact is that he hasn't played there yet and I'd be worried about his positional sense at international level if thrown in.

Tomtom364

Zebo in attack would be a great 15. But Defensivly he just would not have the knowhow. Besides, Its again a problem of taking a player out of a position that he is excelling in and trying to mould him into a different postition.

Id rather Zebo was let to concentrate on perfecting his wing game as there is no demand for another 15 at Munster (or Ireland more then short term) where as Munster need him on the wing.

errlloyd

It'd be absolutely **** to be Gavin Duffy is Henshaw played FB for Ireland.

Podge_irl

Zebo was dodgy in defence and not great at coming infield to get the ball last season. He's improved immeasurably in both areas this season so far - it would seem silly to move him from his position at this point. Its irrelevant in this discussion anyway, he would have to be tried there for Munster first.

It's Hurley, Henshaw or Earls.

thomond2006

Healy, Best, Ross, Tuohy, POC, Ferris, Henry, Heaslip;
Reddan, Sexton, Zebo, D'Arcy, BOD, Bowe, Earls

Bench: Cronin, Kilcoyne, Loughney, Ryan, POM, Murray, Jackson, McFadden/Trimble

If Healy got injured tomorrow (touchwood!), I would start Court.

I wouldn't be in favour of throwing in too many young players against the Boks. That's what the Fiji game is for and therefore must be used correctly.