Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

irishbucsfan

Kilcoyne isn't near Courts level yet. If he gets ahead of him it's yet another example of Declan looking for any excuse to get Munster men into the team.

Lelantos

GerM wrote: »

Quite possibly as DK is a confirmed fan but I wouldn't agree with it at all. Jones has literally just returned from another long term injury. His form before that was quite poor and would have him nowhere near the squad. Hurley has been playing solidly and will be hard done by to be discarded so rapidly.

I'd let the others on the field cover the full back slot and use the 23 jersey for someone with a little more versatility. If Jones isn't in the first 15, I don't think he should be on the bench covering one position only. Zebo offers something unique in a thumping left boot. I'd probably have him in the side and Trimble covering from the bench.

Very happy to see Trimble last night deliver a big performance. He's a guy that really steps up even when his side are under pressure putting in huge hits and opportunistic moments.

But Jones is an actual fullback, streets ahead of Hurley & anyone else in that squad when it comes to fb play. Yes, he's back from injury...again & maybe he will break down again, but if not, he has to be in the squad, and since I'm a huge fan, the team (biased opinion)

RoundBox11

I know a lot of people will disagree but i'd have:

15. Earls (if fit)
14. Bowe
13. Cave
12. BOD
11. Zebo
10 Sexton
9. Reddan

8. Heaslip
7. Henry
6. Ferris
5. POC
4. Ryan
3. Ross
2. Best
1. Healy


Replacements: Strauss, Court, Fitzpatrick, DOC, POM, Murray, Jackson (Not going to happen tho), McFadden

irishbucsfan

I'd have:

Healy, Best, Ross, POC, Ryan, Ferris, Henry, Heaslip;
Reddan, Sexton, Earls, D'Arcy, BOD, Bowe, Jones/Hurley/any 15

Strauss, Court, Fitzpatrick, Tuohy/McCarthy, POM, Murray, ROG, McFadden

We need to use this period to get the side together and start working towards Grand Slam 2013. With Kiss finally getting a chance to give 100% to attack and a new defense coach coming in, I think it's vital to keep as many players in their positions as possible so they can become familiar with whatever their roles will be in February. So you pick the first XV adding Henry for SOB and adding any natural 15 for Kearney as placeholders.

That team is good enough to beat South Africa, and once we do that we can focus on looking at other options against Fiji and Argentina who will both be well below our level.

GerM

Lelantos wrote: »

But Jones is an actual fullback, streets ahead of Hurley & anyone else in that squad when it comes to fb play. Yes, he's back from injury...again & maybe he will break down again, but if not, he has to be in the squad, and since I'm a huge fan, the team (biased opinion)

When he is fit and on form, yes. He hasn't been those things since August 2011. He was generally pretty bad earlier this year for the couple months he was fit and had a bit of a stinker against Ulster. I would certainly go with someone else at 15 until he proves he can still perform. I think it is madness to have a largely unproven and out of form player come straight into the side after 5 months injured.

I wouldn't have him near the bench as it leaves is way too short in terms of cover. There are way more deserving.

irishbucsfan

GerM wrote: »

When he is fit and on form, yes. He hasn't been those things since August 2011. He was generally pretty bad earlier this year for the couple months he was fit and had a bit of a stinker against Ulster. I would certainly go with someone else at 15 until he proves he can still perform. I think it is madness to have a largely unproven and out of form player come straight into the side after 5 months injured.

I wouldn't have him near the bench as it leaves is way too short in terms of cover. There are way more deserving.

I agree with you, but the good thing is they have a week in training to put him through his paces. He may be much fresher now than he was last season. For me, it has to be a natural 15 against South Africa because there'll be a fair bit of kicking.

Fishooks12

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Kilcoyne isn't near Courts level yet. If he gets ahead of him it's yet another example of Declan looking for any excuse to get Munster men into the team.

I don't think he's far off it. Now I forgot about Court in my team and I'd have Court in ahead of him but I think Kilkoyne is developing into a real alternative to Healy

Fireball07

I think Earls is solid enough under the high ball. As of now, I'd have him ahead of Jones at 15 for Munster, and similarly for Ireland.

Jones can maybe play against Fiji.

And Earls is an excellent winger but he hasn't played there for Munster or Ireland in ages.

tolosenc

Healy, Strauss, Ross
Ryan, POC
Ferris, Henry, Heaslip

Reddan, Sexton
Trimble, McFadden, BOD, Bowe
Earls/Jones.

With a bench of: Best, Court, Fitzpatrick, Tuohy, McLoughlin, Murray/Marshall, Madigan, Cave.

If everyone was fit: Cave & Locky out, Earls and Henry to bench, Kearney to FB and SOB to 7.

tolosenc

Fishooks12 wrote: »

I don't think he's far off it. Now I forgot about Court in my team and I'd have Court in ahead of him but I think Kilkoyne is developing into a real alternative to Healy

Alternative to Court, maybe, but he's not on the same planet as Church. Few are.

yimrsg

Fireball07 wrote: »

I think Earls is solid enough under the high ball. As of now, I'd have him ahead of Jones at 15 for Munster, and similarly for Ireland.

Jones can maybe play against Fiji.

And Earls is an excellent winger but he hasn't played there for Munster or Ireland in ages.

Earls played wing in the 60-0. Irelands last match.

Fireball07

yimrsg wrote: »

Earls played wing in the 60-0. Irelands last match.

That doesn't count


why did you remind me of that?

Tbh, I can't even remember who played where, I seem to have blotted most of it out.

irishbucsfan

So frustrating watching Leicester-Gloucester because Murphy looks solid as ever!

Probably a good example that sometimes a player can recover quicker than at other times. Murphy normally is a slow starter but he seems to be straight back to 100% here. If Jones can come straight back to playing at the level he was in 2011 I would have him in the team without a question.

yimrsg

Fireball07 wrote: »

That doesn't count


why did you remind me of that?

Tbh, I can't even remember who played where, I seem to have blotted most of it out.

I find gently massaging shampoo into my eyes helps alleviate my memory of that match.

GerM

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I agree with you, but the good thing is they have a week in training to put him through his paces. He may be much fresher now than he was last season. For me, it has to be a natural 15 against South Africa because there'll be a fair bit of kicking.

There are plenty of back three players that are comfortable under the high ball. I would honestly like to see what Zebo could do from 15. He has been in superb form under the high ball, has a huge boot and is great attacking from deep.

No matter how much fielding of a high ball there may be, I can't see it being so great as to parachute an injury returnee with next to no international experience and hasn't been on form in well over a year into the team. Give him the Fiji game but he can't be anywhere near up to speed for a full test against SA.

For me, it should be Earls at 15 with Zebo assisting with his boot.

desertcircus

Kilcoyne has started six games of professional rugby. Six. Court is the starting loosehead for last year's beaten Heineken Cup finalists and the current form team in the Pro12. Maybe in a few months we can have a serious discussion about this, but at the moment it's a spectacular case of jumping the gun to declare him ahead of Court, much less present him as an alternative to Healy.

Fireball07

desertcircus wrote: »

Kilcoyne has started six games of professional rugby. Six. Court is the starting loosehead for last year's beaten Heineken Cup finalists and the current form team in the Pro12. Maybe in a few months we can have a serious discussion about this, but at the moment it's a spectacular case of jumping the gun to declare him ahead of Court, much less present him as an alternative to Healy.

You're right imo. I'd have Court ahead of Kilcoyne atm.

Although, I do think that people who have Henderson as a replacement for Ferris ahead of POM/McLaughlin are similarly jumping the gun.


But maybe the likes of Kilcoyne and Henderson will benefit from being thrown in? Jackson has improved an awful lot since being trusted by Ulster.

irishbucsfan

Geordan Murphy is having a bit of a stormer for the Tigers, we could write him a nice letter and ask hm to play one last time!

Lelantos

GerM wrote: »

There are plenty of back three players that are comfortable under the high ball. I would honestly like to see what Zebo could do from 15. He has been in superb form under the high ball, has a huge boot and is great attacking from deep.

No matter how much fielding of a high ball there may be, I can't see it being so great as to parachute an injury returnee with next to no international experience and hasn't been on form in well over a year into the team. Give him the Fiji game but he can't be anywhere near up to speed for a full test against SA.

For me, it should be Earls at 15 with Zebo assisting with his boot.

Can we actually go into an international series without an actual fullback in the squad? Earls has played there a handful of times at best. Did ok against England, but they were at a low ebb & never really threatened him. I think we can't afford to leave him out if he's fit.

Cpt_Blackbeard

It'd be depressing to see D'Arcy-BOD line out at 12-13 against SA, but it is probably the best option if Earls is needed at 15. With Kearney out, Zebo's aerial ability and left peg will be needed against the Saffers. I'd like to see:

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Ross
4. POC
5. Ryan: He hasn't been great this year, but he starts as he was Ireland's form player last year.
6. Ferris/POM: POM if Ferris isn't fit.
7. Henry
8. Heaslip
9. Murray: Brainfarts against Racing aside, he has been very good this year. Age and physicality edge it against Reddan.
10. ROG: His kicking and game-management is needed against SA. Nah, Sexton should start.
11. Zebo
12. D'Arcy/BOD
13. BOD/Earls
14. Bowe
15. Earls/A.N.Other

16. Strauss :rolleyes:
17. Kilcoyne: Court is the realistic option, but I'd love to see Killer's youth edge it.
18. Fitzpatrick
19. Tuohy: DOC's physicality would be needed against SA, but the younger Tuohy deserves a shot. McCarthy misses out for similar reasons.
20. POM/McLaughlin
21. Reddan
22. Sexton
23. McFadden: He's the best bench option.

irishbucsfan

wind up merchant!

danthefan

Even more depressing after watching the games this weekend that the likes of Jackson and Madigan can't even make an extended squad.

totallegend

danthefan wrote: »

Even more depressing after watching the games this weekend that the likes of Jackson and Madigan can't even make an extended squad.

I am clinging to the hope that O'Gara's injury is worse than thought and he'll miss the Springboks game.

Quint2010

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

It'd be depressing to see D'Arcy-BOD line out at 12-13 against SA, but it is probably the best option if Earls is needed at 15. With Kearney out, Zebo's aerial ability and left peg will be needed against the Saffers. I'd like to see:

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Ross
4. POC
5. Ryan: He hasn't been great this year, but he starts as he was Ireland's form player last year.
6. Ferris/POM: POM if Ferris isn't fit.
7. Henry
8. Heaslip
9. Murray: Brainfarts against Racing aside, he has been very good this year. Age and physicality edge it against Reddan.
10. ROG: His kicking and game-management is needed against SA. Nah, Sexton should start.
11. Zebo
12. D'Arcy/BOD
13. BOD/Earls
14. Bowe
15. Earls/A.N.Other

16. Strauss :rolleyes:
17. Kilcoyne: Court is the realistic option, but I'd love to see Killer's youth edge it.
18. Fitzpatrick
19. Tuohy: DOC's physicality would be needed against SA, but the younger Tuohy deserves a shot. McCarthy misses out for similar reasons.
20. POM/McLaughlin
21. Reddan
22. Sexton
23. McFadden: He's the best bench option.

Yeah-and surely he is a shoo-in for the Lions starting 10 jersey too. Even though he's injured. And crap.

errlloyd

Healy
Best
Ross

(I'm sure most of us can agree on)

POC
McCarthy

(POC is inspirational, McCarthy is aggressive and on form)

Ferris
Henry
Heaslip

(We'll talk about SOB when he gets back, and Henderson has a little left to prove)

Reddan
Sexton

(Reddan is getting the ball out much quicker than Murray, to me this will always be a scrum halves main mission)

11: Zebo

(Hickie was great under the high ball and a strong tackler with a huge left boot, Hickie was also a great winger. My posts last year showed I wasn't his biggest fan, happy to have been proven wrong.)

12: Bod
13: Cave

(Its a tough one to justify, a friend said recently "Darcy just doens't look like he knows what to do anymore" harsh, but some truth?)

14: Tommy Bowe

(He's excellent)

15: Jones

(This is because its kind of getting towards do or die time for Jones. I think he needs another shot before a competitive Irish start.)

Court
Strauss
Fitzpatrick
Touhy
POM
Murray
ROG
Ferg

Touhy is in great form imo, POM is a brilliant back rower in general and the rest are relatively obvious.

Hagz

> Don't think you can drop Ryan after the form he's showed in green. He was magnificent in New Zealand.

> I can't see BOD being moved from 13, and with regard to D'Arcy, he looked like he knew what he was doing tonight albeit against a rotten Cardiff defence. I think Marshall may be a little raw.

>Jones can't be thrown into it just yet imo.

Fireball07

Disagree with your 2nd row pairing, but if it did happen, I'm sure it would do fine. It's a marginal call really.

Disagree strongly with no Earls, at full-back or centre, he has to play if fit.

irishbucsfan

The only way BOD is going to play 12 is if Earls is playing 13. And I think it's possible we could see that again during the AIs.

thomond2006

*touchwood*

What happens if BOD is out? Earls at 13 and then god knows who at 15?

Fireball07

thomond2006 wrote: »

*touchwood*

What happens if BOD is out? Earls at 13 and then god knows who at 15?

I'd say Cave at 13, Earls at 15.


Kidney might prefer Earls at 13, Jones at 15. We'll see.