Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

bamboozle

Quint2010 wrote: »

If the next Irish coach is not from Ireland these threads will be empty..

alternative wording to the above:

if the next Irish coach is not biased towards players from a certain province these threads will be empty...

Lelantos

Quint2010 wrote: »

If the next Irish coach is not from Ireland these threads will be empty..

I don't know, big names require big money. Michael Bradley will in all likelihood be available at the seasons end.

Sinbad_NI

Would be great to be discussing a coach who picks players on form (in position).

Loosing interest in all things Ireland like many others due to the selections and tactics.

leftleg

Lelantos wrote: »

I don't know, big names require big money. Michael Bradley will in all likelihood be available at the seasons end.

He certainly wont be at Edinburgh next season by the looks of it

[Jackass]

Just noticed that Madigan is not involved in Irish squad at all and Paddy Jackson has been drafted in. Lol. Ohhh Declan, you don't even care to be subtle any more.

irishbucsfan

[Jackass] wrote: »

Just noticed that Madigan is not involved in Irish squad at all and Paddy Jackson has been drafted in. Lol. Ohhh Declan, you don't even care to be subtle any more.

Why would Madigan be ahead of Paddy Jackson? Have you seen Paddy Jackson recently? It was easily the correct decision.

Fireball07

[Jackass] wrote: »

Just noticed that Madigan is not involved in Irish squad at all and Paddy Jackson has been drafted in. Lol. Ohhh Declan, you don't even care to be subtle any more.

You can hardly call that Munster bias??

Unless Jackson is about to sign for us? (Yes please!)

[Jackass]

Nothing to do with Munster.

Yes, Jackson has had 3 or 4 good games, Madigan has been excellent for over a year...

Jackson only a few months ago, in his his first international quality match, the Heineken Cup final, looked like a schoolboy in a senior international. He was so bad people felt sorry for him, fans and journos alike...

No disrespect to Jackson, but why not Madigan - Either to New Zealand before Jackson had a few very good games, or at any point. Madigan excellet = ignored. Jackson has some good games (after some absolute howlers) = international squad.

GerM

[Jackass] wrote: »

Jackson only a few months ago, in his his first international quality match, the Heineken Cup final, looked like a schoolboy in a senior international. He was so bad people felt sorry for him, fans and journos alike...

And we'll see how Madigan gets on when he's actually trusted to play a game of the same magnitude which won't be anytime soon barring an emergency.

Fireball07

I reckon Jackson is better than Madigan...better all-round game as of now. Form-wise it's not entirely Madigan's fault, he's been at full-back while Jackson has been at 10 and of Ulster's best players.

I actually don't have a problem with any of Kidney's selections really...I'd have added Marshall and McSharry but they're minor issues really. It's the team selection that's most interesting.


(And even then, I tend to agree with them a lot...picking the right team doesn't guarantee a performance).

[Jackass]

GerM wrote: »

And we'll see how Madigan gets on when he's actually trusted to play a game of the same magnitude which won't be anytime soon barring an emergency.

He's played in two Heineken Cup finals and multiple big games, such as Thomond Park, when he came on to a close game and through his moving of backline and drop goal, was the talisman to win us the game.

Played multiple Heineken Cup and never put a foot wrong...Excelled with Ireland A's also...not sure Jackson has been in an A squad before.

irishbucsfan

And yet this season he has looked fantastic for the unbeaten Ulster team. He has played tough opposition and he has displayed the ability to control games that Madigan hasn't as well as showing a lot if flair and kicking at 80%. Madigan has barely played 10 but when he did he played in some very poor performances (Llanelli!).

What exactly is Kidney not attempting to hide? Is it an Ulster bias now? Jackson should definitely be ahead of Madigan as a 10 based on form.

él statutorio

JRant wrote: »

Never said it was black or white, more red or nothing.
There is no consistency in what your saying. Murray plays well so he's a class act, Marshall plays well and its because he has a kushty time behind a dominant pack!!!!! Also O'Leary? Are you for real or just taking the Michael now. Marshall and Reddan are similar players. Murray is similar to Boss/TOL

Yeah worked out well for Leamy in the long run!! Stupid to risk a players career for a summer tour, a WC is a different kettle of fish. It wasn't a shoulder injury that caused his retirement. it was a hip injury IIRC

POM may provide some cover across the backrow but has yet to excel in one position as others had to do to get called up. Until such time as the IRB allow a full replacement back row on the bench we'll be sticking with POM

ROG is a busted flush at this stage and i'm sorry i brought it up. We'll just have to wait for Deccie to go before he hangs up the "above international standard" boots. This series will most likely be ROG's swansong.

The IRFU are the paymasters so they call the tune, the provinces may ask for a player to be left behind but if DK wanted them there they would have travelled.

They wouldn't let Paddy Wallace travel due to budget constraints so I don't know what Deccie was to do here, have them buy their own ticket?

tolosenc

It's not Madigan v Jackson. They should both be there, and ROG should be benching at Munster for Hanrahan next month.

CIARAN_BOYLE

irishbucsfan wrote: »

What exactly is Kidney not attempting to hide? Is it an Ulster bias now? Jackson should definitely be ahead of Madigan as a 10 based on form.

Personally I think its a disgrace that the top goal kicker in the RDPro12 has been left out of Declan Kidney's squad;)

They are both good young players and to be honest I think there isn't much between them.

ssaye

They need to start beating teams ranked higher than them in the next two years.

Four Wins in the 6N minimum. Break that 3 game loss to Wales too, feckers.

Only twice since Nov 2010 have they beaten someone ranked 1-6 if I read it correctly in 26 or so games.

Eng 1 out of 3
Australia 1 out of 1

NZ 4/4
SA 1/1
France 1 Draw 3 Losses
Wales 3 Losses
England 1/3
Lost to all of them consistently.

[Jackass]

So all of a sudden recent form matters to Kidney? Then why will Murray be starting? Madigan has played nearly all of his circa 60 caps for Leinster at 10 by the way...

Couldn't disagree more about Jackson. Yes he's been good this season, but then he's looked amazing against Castres, Connacht, Dragons, Glasgow and Cardiff....hmmm, I dunno.

tolosenc

él statutorio wrote: »

Until such time as the IRB allow a full replacement back row on the bench we'll be sticking with POM

Why? Surely Ferris, SOB, Heaslip and Henry is better quartet? SOB can play across the back row, so if any one of the starters goes, Henry comes in at 7 and SOB moves (or comes off). POM doesn't offer anything like the quality at 7 that Henry does.

CIARAN_BOYLE

tolosenc wrote: »

Why? Surely Ferris, SOB, Heaslip and Henry is better quartet? SOB can play across the back row, so if any one of the starters goes, Henry comes in at 7 and SOB moves (or comes off). POM doesn't offer anything like the quality at 7 that Henry does.

Henry is also perfectly capable of playing across the backrow

Its only in the last year and a bit that he has been seen as a 7 before that he was seen as a 6 and originally as an 8

Remember the fuss about poor Chris Henry being forced to play out of position (at 7) by the evil foreigners in Ulster rugby Diack and Wannenberg

[Jackass]

Anyway, my point is why is Jackson immediately rewarded for a handful of good performances (even on the back of a Heineken Cup final where he didn't look nearly ready for that level) and Madigan for over a year, playing in big games, place kicking excellent, has looked superb, has played and coped well all the way up to Heineken Cup and Ireland A level and can't get near the squad. Isn't that interesting?

Fireball07

[Jackass] wrote: »

So all of a sudden recent form matters to Kidney? Then why will Murray be starting? Madigan has played nearly all of his circa 60 caps for Leinster at 10 by the way...

Couldn't disagree more about Jackson. Yes he's been good this season, but then he's looked amazing against Castres, Connacht, Dragons, Glasgow and Cardiff....hmmm, I dunno.

He was excellent against Munster too, if that makes any difference.

And Murray's form has actually been okay, Racing aside.

Fishooks12

[Jackass] wrote: »

So all of a sudden recent form matters to Kidney? Then why will Murray be starting? Madigan has played nearly all of his circa 60 caps for Leinster at 10 by the way...

Couldn't disagree more about Jackson. Yes he's been good this season, but then he's looked amazing against Castres, Connacht, Dragons, Glasgow and Cardiff....hmmm, I dunno.

tbh I really don't think you've seen Jackson play this year the way you're going on.

In my book he's the in form ten right now in Ireland. Madigan's been decent if not spectacular at 15 but his lack of time at 10 this year has definitely seen him slip below Jackson in the "who deserves to be picked stakes"

And tbh I think Jackson is already becoming a more rounded 10. Which is a big statement considering I think Madigan is the most exciting ten we've produced in years

Fishooks12

Fireball07 wrote: »

He was excellent against Munster too, if that makes any difference.

And Murray's form has actually been okay, Racing aside.

This, Murray's been pretty decent this year bar the Racing game. His service has definitely improved. But I guess that won't stop people delving into hyperbole.

bilston

Podge_irl wrote: »

That what you want or what you expect?

I struggle to see Kidney dropping Murray (however deserved).

What I'd go with

GerM

[Jackass] wrote: »

He's played in two Heineken Cup finals and multiple big games, such as Thomond Park, when he came on to a close game and through his moving of backline and drop goal, was the talisman to win us the game.

Played multiple Heineken Cup and never put a foot wrong...Excelled with Ireland A's also...not sure Jackson has been in an A squad before.

Stretching the truth somewhat. He got 10 minutes in his two HEC finals combined. Both games were done and dusted. He got the last 20 minutes of a Pro12 game against Munster when his side were in front and Sexton was taken off as a precaution due to a tight calf.

He has one cap as a sub for the Wolfhounds and I'm not sure he excelled either. Jackson of course has never been in an A squad. He was captaining his country at U20 level the last time there were A games on. Madigan put a few feet wrong against Montpellier last season in his one ever start at 10 in the HEC but it's a learning curve and he's better for it. Just as Jackson is far, far better for his excursions last season and has been excellent this season leading the side home and away in the HEC.

Paddy Jackson was called up by DK because he's better at running a game, is playing top level rugby regularly and has shown more all round ability. It's not because of any conspiracy.

GerM

[Jackass] wrote: »

Couldn't disagree more about Jackson. Yes he's been good this season, but then he's looked amazing against Castres, Connacht, Dragons, Glasgow and Cardiff....hmmm, I dunno.

Who on earth has Madigan looked good against?! Clemont, Toulouse and Sarries?

él statutorio

tolosenc wrote: »

Why? Surely Ferris, SOB, Heaslip and Henry is better quartet? SOB can play across the back row, so if any one of the starters goes, Henry comes in at 7 and SOB moves (or comes off). POM doesn't offer anything like the quality at 7 that Henry does.

SOB is injured. Ferris Heaslip and Henry with POM to cover all 3, where's the problem with that?

leftleg

Want a bigger shovel Jackass.... come on DK has made the right choice with Jackson. Unfortunately its for the wrong reasons .... holding tackle bags. Sexton to start and the old man as understudy on the bench

Cpt_Blackbeard

ed7890 wrote: »

The whole Kidney/Munster bias thing is getting out of hand.

Last year, a few Munster players got called up to the squad, page and pages on the forum were spent talking about the Munster bias.

This year, some good Ulster players get called up to the squad. Pages and pages on the forum are being spent talking about the Munster bias in last years call ups.

Oh ya, and some pages talking about how Kilcoyne got called up ahead of of Buckley.

Just thought I'd quote this for added emphasis.

By the looks of things we've a lot of moon-landing deniers on this thread. Hopefully they are wearing their tin-foil hats to protect them from all those harmful emf's from overhead power lines.

JRant

él statutorio wrote: »

[COLOR="red"]They wouldn't let Paddy Wallace travel due to budget constraints so I don't know what Deccie was to do here, have them buy their own ticket?[/COLOR]

I think Leamy retired because his body just couldn't take the punishment anymore and playing in a mickey mouse summer tour certainly didn't help him.

POM is here to stay but the same criteria that saw him start games for us doesn't apply to others is my main argument, not the player.

Barring injury I'd say the 6N's will be ROG's swansong.

Wallace was told to go on holiday and then called up at the last minute. If the IRFU wanted him there they could have dipped into the kitty to bring him.