Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

Monty Burnz

Foxtrol wrote: »

Going by that logic POM and Earls (and possibly soon Zebo) shouldnt be starting due to them being shuffled around in different positions due to their versatility, in order to get the teams best players on the pitch. McFadden deserves a shot in his best position but I wouldn't begrudge either of the others starting.

FMcF isn't moved around because of his versatility, he's moved around because he hasn't managed to displace the starting centres or wingers* at his club. That's a bit different to being a starter who is moved around to fill gaps left by injuries or for strategic reasons.

*Although he may be a starting winger now in the absence of Luke Fitz?

.ak

Monty Burnz wrote: »

FMcF isn't moved around because of his versatility, he's moved around because he hasn't managed to displace the starting centres or wingers* at his club. That's a bit different to being a starter who is moved around to fill gaps left by injuries or for strategic reasons.

*Although he may be a starting winger now in the absence of Luke Fitz?

Going back to my point, he's behind the two best centres in Ireland, and he's not a winger.... so not exactly a fair comparison.

jacothelad

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Cian Healy just posted a photo of the inside of a hospital on twitter. Feck

Don't worry lads, sure don't we have Kilcoyne now?

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I wonder if we drop to 9th will Kidney go immediately?

Or will they just put out a press release saying they're advertising for a new coach and stall until the end of the 6 Nations?

No. The press conference will go something along these lines.

" Look, the way I see it there's no point in running around like a headless kitten. The players definitely haven't forgotten how to play, they're still confident in what they're trying to do though it's not my fault that they are crap; it's just a frustration. The ball is in their car park now. Just a real frustration don't you know and there we have it. It's just white and black only a different colour when you look at it like that. And I know they're going to click. I think there's a bit of a hooley tonight and we'll all go and have a bit of an oul jig." Kidney said. "We'll just relax because we know the lads are just the best there is with a few others. Yes. if we don't we'll see the chickens coming home to rust for we all know you can't change a tigers spots.

We have had ourselves in some a lot of situations like this in the past and but we just have to stick with it because we know that's just what we do g'wan, g'wan. This one is small so why does that one over there look the same size? You might well ask. If something's hard to do sure it's not worth doing on a Monday. That's washing day.


It's a learning process, a tough one but like I've said before, I've been down this road and I know how it twists. Unfortunately, and this is the terrible thing, they've taken the road in again and a big boy stole my sat nav.


This is a good group of players to work with, they're totally different to the ones from 2008 apart from the ones who are the same. If only we had all those guys back. Are they fit, does anyone know? Marcus? Anto? No? It's a chicken and hen situation. We've just got to cross a few 'i's and dot a few t''s.

They're full of confidence that we can get back up from 10th 8th in the rankings. They go to training on the bus now as we now can't afford to pay them. They have been a joy to work with for two weeks. Even those bastards blow ins from Ulster and Connacht. Inside in the dressing room after the game we had a lot of crack because they knew I had let one go but the air con. soon cleared it, but they're on the right road. Only it's a dead end according to Wikipedia and this old copy of The Art of Coarse Rugby. the AA Book of the Road.



We'll look at the video and using State of the Ark technology, we'll learn from it and move on. We don't want to cut our throats with one hand while crying for mercy with the other. That would just set the cat among the kittens. You can learn plenty of lessons from defeat and there’s plenty we can learn from today as we've been defeated more than any team in Irish professional rugby history and that’s it, a sledgehammer in a nutshell. This is something of which I'm proud. No Irish team has ever done this before so we've set a new skid mark to aim for. We’ll take it all on board, keep our ears to the grindstone and act as quickly as we can. We've got to get our finger in. Rome wasn't burnt in a day. You should be standing here in my trousers and changing them just for the sake of it would be just like being a big fish in a small wheel. That would open up a real barrel of woodpeckers. You know as we say down in Cark, 'You can lead a gift horse to the water but you can't make it look you in the eye.'

Foxtrol

Monty Burnz wrote: »

FMcF isn't moved around because of his versatility, he's moved around because he hasn't managed to displace the starting centres or wingers* at his club. That's a bit different to being a starter who is moved around to fill gaps left by injuries or for strategic reasons.

*Although he may be a starting winger now in the absence of Luke Fitz?

He’s moved around to get the best players on the pitch. Whether some like it or not Darcy is still the best 12 in the country so it would be like BOD coming back and saying Earls should be dropped to the bench rather than moved to the wing as it is some sort of slight that he is unable to displace BOD.

Tox56

Monty Burnz wrote: »

FMcF isn't moved around because of his versatility, he's moved around because he hasn't managed to displace the starting centres or wingers* at his club. That's a bit different to being a starter who is moved around to fill gaps left by injuries or for strategic reasons.

*Although he may be a starting winger now in the absence of Luke Fitz?

The two are related, you can't treat them each in isolation. One of the reasons why Ferg hasn't displaced D'Arcy is because most of the time he is starting on the same team as him, due to his versatility and injuries.

Last season BOD was injured and Ferg filled in at 13 (beside D'Arcy) for some H Cup games, and in other H Cup games he played 12 while EOM played 13.

Then for the latter part of last season and the early part of this season (in the H Cup and Rabo) he has filled in on the wing for Fitz/D Kearney/Nacewa, who have all been injured at some stage, and he still had a few starts at 12 (again, in both the H Cup and the Rabo).

If he was a 12 and nothing else, he may have displaced D'Arcy by now, who knows. But because of his versatility, he isn't getting a run of games at 12, and realistically that's what he needs if he is going to take the shirt.

molloyjh

d-gal wrote: »

I'd prefer Marshall or McSharry. Both have consistently played well at 12 and McFadden cannot nail down a spot at his province for God knows how many years. Marshall and McSharry oth have the potential to be much better than him. McFadden is a good squad player but I cannot seehim as a starter

Given that McFadden is on the Player Welfare Programme his availability is limited. But he started at 12 for Leinster against Munster and Exeter and did well in both games. He was then moved to the wing to cover for injuries there against the Scarlets.

Marshall on the other hand is behind Wallace at Ulster and didn't start either of their HEC games. In fact I think he's only started 3 games for Ulster to Fergs 6 games for Leinster despite greater availability.

Now as I said I'd be happy with any of the 3 options put forward, but to exclude McFadden on the basis of being behind Darcy means you'd have to exclude Marshall as well.

Quint2010

Devin Toner and Roger Wilson called up.

JF100

Glass half full: some positives to take from the SA game:
McCarthy/Zebo/Ryan/Henry played well. Murray improved.
Grit shown. A lot of good effort shown; though very little genuine penetration. Harsh yellow.

Glass half empty: Bench and its management needs to be reviewed and amended.
Backline looked light & the bench looked lighter still.
The entire Front Row Bench to come on after 60 mins.

Fiji: Give ALL the Youngsters a go ... Nothing to lose!

Foxtrol

Just heard an interview there with Bent on the radio:

• He's had an Irish passport for years now
• Always intended to move over here
• Has a sister who has lived here for the last 5 years
• Sang Danny Boy for his first cap song (not that it makes much difference)

After hearing that I feel sorry for the abuse he's taken since he's arrived. He seems to be taking it in his stride though

CatFromHue

Foxtrol wrote: »

Just heard an interview there with Bent on the radio:

• He's had an Irish passport for years now
• Always intended to move over here
• Has a sister who has lived here for the last 5 years
• Sang Danny Boy for his first cap song (not that it makes much difference)

After hearing that if feel sorry for the abuse he's taken since he's arrived. He seems to be taking it in his stride though

He hasn't taken any abuse though.

Most commentators have been irritated that his first game outside of NZ was for the Ireland national team.

Foxtrol

CatFromHue wrote: »

He hasn't taken any abuse though.

Most commentators have been irritated that his first game outside of NZ was for the Ireland national team.

There's been plenty stating he's been "poached", equating us to stealing islanders like NZ (which in itself is both lazy and wrong) or insinuation that he's not really Irish.

totallegend

TBH I think most of the abuse has been directed at IRFU, not for going out looking for IQ props around the world, but for parachuting him in ahead of other guys who've paid their dues. It was unfortunate that it happened at the same time Strauss was making his debut as well.

I wonder is that the reason Court got the bullet last week? DK didn't want an Aussie, a Saffer and a Kiwi making up an "Irish" front row?

petebricquette

totallegend wrote: »

TBH I think most of the abuse has been directed at IRFU, not for going out looking for IQ props around the world, but for parachuting him in ahead of other guys who've paid their dues. It was unfortunate that it happened at the same time Strauss was making his debut as well.

I wonder is that the reason Court got the bullet last week? DK didn't want an Aussie, a Saffer and a Kiwi making up an "Irish" front row?

Court hasn't been playing to an adequate standard when called up. I'd say that's why he was dropped.

CatFromHue

Foxtrol wrote: »

There's been plenty stating he's been "poached", equating us to stealing islanders like NZ (which in itself is both lazy and wrong) or insinuation that he's not really Irish.

As TotalLegend said I don't think much of this was actually directed at Bent but more at the IRFU instead.

goreyguy

Marshall, Toner and Wilson added to squad.

POC and Ferris confirmed out until after Nov Internationals.

CatFromHue

It's Paul Marshall who's been called up in case anyone else was a bit confused like I was.

"Leinster scrum-half Eoin Reddan is also in doubt for Saturday's non-cap clash with Fiji and will see a specialist this week after bruising an ankle."

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_8245000,00.html

goreyguy

Sheahan and Wallace being pretty complimentary of the performance on TodayFM. Both named McCarthy as a standout.

Sheahan encouraging more O'Gara, Bowe to 13, Earls at 15 and Zebo on the wing. POM should be at 7 he is saying it will be his best position and putting Ryan at 6, with DOC in at 5. Not carried away with Bent, thinks too early to say if he is any good. Saying some players should be rewarded if playing well for Fiji. Says performance indicated progress and Kidney was under pressure after 6N and that he is encouraged by the SA game. Says he think Kidney is changing citing bringing McCarthy etc. Says it isnt typical of Kidney to start a player like McCarthy. Evades the question about what happens to Kidney if we drop out of top 8.

Wallace saying O'Gara should not have came on, needed a running 10. Not impressed with sexton's running game for the last 12 months, that he doesn't run enough and threat the line for Ireland. Critical of Murray's kicking, said Reddan was more of a threat. Wants Reddan to get a run of games, citing quicker game and reddan being more suited to it. POC not missed because Ryan and McCarthy, POC not a certain starter anymore. He was impressed with Bent. Critical that we have a backup for Ross, said Ross cant play every game without a rest late in matches.

Glass Prison 1214

CatFromHue wrote: »

It's Paul Marshall who's been called up in case anyone else was a bit confused like I was.

"Leinster scrum-half Eoin Reddan is also in doubt for Saturday's non-cap clash with Fiji and will see a specialist this week after bruising an ankle."

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_8245000,00.html

i thought he was already in the squad?

Hagz

Sheahan chose Strauss as his MOM.

bilston

goreyguy wrote: »

Sheahan and Wallace being pretty complimentary of the performance on TodayFM. Both named McCarthy as a standout.

Sheahan encouraging more O'Gara, Bowe to 13, Earls at 15 and Zebo on the wing. POM should be at 7 he is saying it will be his best position and putting Ryan at 6, with DOC in at 5. Not carried away with Bent, thinks too early to say if he is any good. Saying some players should be rewarded if playing well for Fiji. Says performance indicated progress and Kidney was under pressure after 6N and that he is encouraged by the SA game. Says he think Kidney is changing citing bringing McCarthy etc. Says it isnt typical of Kidney to start a player like McCarthy. Evades the question about what happens to Kidney if we drop out of top 8.

I'm so glad Frankie isn't picking the Irish team.

thomond2006

Sheahan publicly masturbates over his clients on a regular basis (calling for Archer to be on the bench for Ireland a year ago, repeatedly giving undeserving Munster players MOTM awards) and doesn't have much integrity from what I see. I'd take Hook over Sheahan any day tbh.

I hope for his sake that he doesn't believe what he's saying. He was a great servant for Munster but I have no time for him when he is in a pundit role. Either he is blindly supporting the Munster old boys or he is hailing his clients. He knows a heck more rugby than I'll ever know but it's a shame what's he become.

His link: http://frontrow.ie/index.php/sport-management/

JRant

bilston wrote: »

I'm so glad Frankie isn't picking the Irish team.

I wonder how many of the players named come from his "stable"?

duckysauce

bilston wrote: »

I'm so glad Frankie isn't picking the Irish team.

he would have Kidney on it :pac::pac:

goreyguy

Just seen the end of Against the Head, Jackman, Quinlan and Costello were advocating as strong as team as possible for Fiji. As much as 2/3rds of last weeks team so we can build "momentum" and combinations can become more accustomed to each other.

Exile_22

goreyguy wrote: »

Just seen the end of Against the Head, Jackman, Quinlan and Costello were advocating as strong as team as possible for Fiji. As much as 2/3rds of last weeks team so we can build "momentum" and combinations can become more accustomed to each other.

And we all know that won't help at all. But it'll probably be true, Kidney to name a selection of experienced internationals with other experienced internationals filling in for those out. This game is crying out for new blood. It's not win or die and there's so much talent out there that's been overlooked. Any coach should know exactly what to do with this.

Cpt_Blackbeard

goreyguy wrote: »

Just seen the end of Against the Head, Jackman, Quinlan and Costello were advocating as strong as team as possible for Fiji. As much as 2/3rds of last weeks team so we can build "momentum" and combinations can become more accustomed to each other.

I'd pretty much agree with that. We're in no place to be sending out a hugely experimental team. Considering the loss, the game needs to be spent giving more gametime to certain players and trying out some new lads that will be needed against Argentina. Wholesale changes aren't a realistic possibility.

I'm not near fully decided in a lot of positions, but I'd like to see something along the lines of:
1. Kilcoyne
2. Cronin/Strauss - Strauss probably needs a rest, but I'd prefer him start and get more international experience.
3. Bent
4. Ryan
5. Tuohy - McCarthy has earned a rest.
6. Henderson
7. Henry - He's still an inexperienced international.
8. POM - Maybe Heaslip will be needed as captain, but he shouldn't be.
9. P.Marshall - Reddan injured and Marshall should be his longterm replacement in the squad.
10. Sexton - I don't think we should be giving both Marshall and Jackson their first caps together so this is a toss-up really. Jackson really deserves a shot, but the 9/10/12 axis would be very green and we mightn't learn much from it as a result. If Reddan's fit, start him beside Jackson.
11. McFadden
12. L.Marshall - Hopefully he shows well. We badly need a 12 coming though. McSharry would be a good call, but he is unlikely to feature.
13. Earls - Cave is very unlucky, but Earls still has some rustiness to shake off and he should run-riot for 50min against Fiji.
14. Gilroy
15. Zebo - I'd like to see Jones, but it's probably too early.

goreyguy

I would consider that a very experimental side for Kidney.

They were asking for a very similar team, with max 5 changes for some guys who had knocks. Same half backs and back row, same second row pairing etc.

thomond2006

Kilcoyne, Strauss, Bent, Ryan, McCarthy, Henderson, Henry, Heaslip;
Marshall, Jackson, O'Halloran, Marshall, Cave, Gilroy, Zebo

danthefan

thomond2006 wrote: »

Kilcoyne, Strauss, Bent, Ryan, McCarthy, Henderson, Henry, Heaslip;
Marshall, Jackson, O'Halloran, Marshall, Cave, Gilroy, Zebo

I like it. Maybe give Touhy a game.

totallegend

thomond2006 wrote: »

Kilcoyne, Strauss, Bent, Ryan, McCarthy, Henderson, Henry, Heaslip;
Marshall, Jackson, O'Halloran, Marshall, Cave, Gilroy, Zebo

Yeah, that's pretty much what I'd go for.