Rooney's comments?

Livvie

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Sorry, I don't understand you. Are you saying that if England won the World Cup you would dwell on this and not the 2010 version of this? Or are you talking about the manner in they how they go about winning?

I can't imagine why the former would be a issue at all. It will be soon forgotten if they won the WC. And as for the latter, I wasn't discussing their style. But I would imagine that if England hasn't won the WC since '66, and they have a deep yearning to do so in "It's Coming Home" type of way, then the end justifies the means. I doubt many people, specifically English supporters, would care how they went about it.

I'd love to see England win the World Cup, but if they won it by scraping through, as can happen in a Cup comp. (not likely admittedly) then I wouldn't feel any pride, especially after the euphoria died down. I'd enjoy it when it happened, but I wouldn't feel it was deserved.

I'm sure most fans would enjoy it, but most would also be honest about it in the event of a win coming on the back of performances like last night's.

That link you gave doesn't work for me, but appears to be something about the fan's booing?

Sorry if I'm being obtuse. Late night!

Fanny Cradock

Livvie wrote: »

Sorry if I'm being obtuse. Late night!

I think we are talking about two different things - you are talking about footballing style and I'm talking about Rooney's comments. But no worries.

peejay1986

The English in SA are really stretching the meaning of the word "supporters". Yes they can feel disappointed but what good does booing do? Are the players going to want to up their game for that? No. Best thing for all is if the fans raised the noise even more, got behind the team another 20% and give them some encouragement to do better. The "supporters" were booing them from the start of the second half, that's only going to make the players feel more pressured and more like likely to make mistakes.

I understand people will say, they've got the right to speak their mind - yes they do. But if you go by that opinion then you have to accept that the players have that right also. Whether its the right practice for players to do so or not is another matter, the point is Rooney has the right to air his feelings about the booing.

But yet again the English media have found themselves another individual to use as a target for the WC performance. They'll hoam in on Rooney now, just like they did with Beckham and Ronaldo in previous WC's. Its very sad that they can't just accept that they are not the best in the world. The "supporters" have to remember that Rooney played arguably the biggest role in getting them there but I suspect this will gather pace and become another campaign of hate like Beckham in 2002.

This is the first WC I've experienced while living in UK and personally I find the mentality of the English "supporters" to be disgusting. Easily the most fickle I've ever witnessed. They don't know how good they have it. Top players in every position and if they only stopped pressuring them or tearing them apart and every opportunity, then maybe(!) they'd get the success they so want.

SlickRic

the bottom line for me is this...

if you're willing to take the cheers, you have to have thick enough skin to take the boos, however much the English fans, for the sake of their team, should show support rather than jeers.

but Gerrard and Barry, for instance, handled it exactly how they should have done. they took responsibility and didn't shift any blame onto fans who had paid thousands of pounds to go over.

by the same token Rooney's human, and it was a human reaction to feeling as though you're not being supported. he's also blatantly injured. that wasn't even 15% of the Rooney we've seen all season. his touch was appalling, he had no energy in his legs, and wasn't even snarling or geeing up everyone behind him like he normally would if his Utd teammates took their foot off the gas.

DB10

peejay1986 wrote: »

They don't know how good they have it. Top players in every position and if they only stopped pressuring them or tearing them apart and every opportunity, then maybe(!) they'd get the success they so want.

No way!


Pressure is only part of it.

At the end of the day, they are nowhere near as good as they are made out to be and that is a fact.

Run through the team:

James - Nearly 40, error prone

Cashley - Top class, but doesn't get alot of backing and is better for Chelsea

Terry - Had a below par season

Carragher - Way past it, dire last season

Johnson - RB who can't defend

Lennon - Useful for pace....not much else

Gerrard - Embarrassing season and poor for England

Lampard - Never fits in

Heskey - Joke

Rooney - Top class, he doesn't care about England, nowhere near as good as for Utd



I would say England have two top class players Rooney and Cashley, that is said without bias, as I hate both. Both have underperformed so far as well.

I'm sorry but that team is not good enough in so many aspects it isn't even funny.

wobblyknees

DB10 wrote: »

No way!


Pressure is only part of it.

At the end of the day, they are nowhere near as good as they are made out to be and that is a fact.

Run through the team:

James - Nearly 40, error prone

Cashley - Top class, but doesn't get alot of backing and is better for Chelsea

Terry - Had a below par season

Carragher - Way past it, dire last season

Johnson - RB who can't defend

Lennon - Useful for pace....not much else

Gerrard - Embarrassing season and poor for England

Lampard - Never fits in

Heskey - Joke

Rooney - Top class, he doesn't care about England, nowhere near as good as for Utd



I would say England have two top class players Rooney and Cashley, that is said without bias, as I hate both. Both have underperformed so far as well.

I'm sorry but that team is not good enough in so many aspects it isn't even funny.

I would pretty much agree with what you are saying there as I felt England had one of the worst squads coming into the competition hence the late desperate call ups for Scholes and Carragher. I would argue that Johnson and Lampard had good seasons in general though.

The Muppet

Mr Alan wrote: »

Wat a load of bollox. He's playing with Steven Gerrard, Frank Lampard, Gareth Barry, Aaron Lennon, Wright Phillips. Quality of his team mates is not even nearly an excuse for him.

How many chanced did these quality players create for Rooney last night Al?

Some of them played worse than Rooney last night, Gerrard springs to mind clean through on Goal and not brave enought to take a shot, plays a nothing square ball straight to a defender. Lampard was just as bad, Real quality yeah, how come they are not getting just as much criticism as Rooney for their **** performance?

The Muppet

wobblyknees wrote: »

I would pretty much agree with what you are saying there as I felt England had one of the worst squads coming into the competition hence the late desperate call ups for Scholes and Carragher. I would argue that Johnson and Lampard had good seasons in general though.

Johnson is a rubbish defender which is his primary role, he can be good going forward as he was vs usa , He was totally rubbish both offensively and defensively last night.

Le King

DB10 wrote: »

No way!


Pressure is only part of it.

At the end of the day, they are nowhere near as good as they are made out to be and that is a fact.

Run through the team:

James - Nearly 40, error prone

Cashley - Top class, but doesn't get alot of backing and is better for Chelsea

Terry - Had a below par season

Carragher - Way past it, dire last season

Johnson - RB who can't defend

Lennon - Useful for pace....not much else

Gerrard - Embarrassing season and poor for England

Lampard - Never fits in

Heskey - Joke

Rooney - Top class, he doesn't care about England, nowhere near as good as for Utd



I would say England have two top class players Rooney and Cashley, that is said without bias, as I hate both. Both have underperformed so far as well.

I'm sorry but that team is not good enough in so many aspects it isn't even funny.

I'd agree with that. Carragher and Heskey shouldn't be in the squad..

A. Cole, Lampard and Rooney don't seem to like the system at all. They are way more effective at club level.

Gerrard, who has been poor all season, has to be sacrificed in order to get a working unit together.

SlickRic

Muppet, you seem obsessed with bringing Liverpool players into this. your agenda is obvious.

this is a thread about Rooney's comments.

why did you not pick on Lampard who was also mentioned? no, let's go straight for Johnson, who was not 'rubbish' by the way. England didn't keep the ball well enough to bring him or Cole into the game.

the problem was Lampard has no idea what he's doing in that system, you're not getting the best out of him or Gerrard (who was obviously also poor, but still looked England's most likely by far, but he had to be his ill-disciplined self and cut inside to do it).

you have Rooney whose not fit, and playing well below his best. his touch was frightening last night; Heskey-esque. so he's frustrated. he's not used to this.

Rooney had a right to say what he did, as it was borne out of a human frustration at everything going on around him, incuding his personal performance, but he should have been more professional.

peejay1986

DB10 wrote: »

No way!


Pressure is only part of it.

At the end of the day, they are nowhere near as good as they are made out to be and that is a fact.

Run through the team:

James - Nearly 40, error prone

Cashley - Top class, but doesn't get alot of backing and is better for Chelsea

Terry - Had a below par season

Carragher - Way past it, dire last season

Johnson - RB who can't defend

Lennon - Useful for pace....not much else

Gerrard - Embarrassing season and poor for England

Lampard - Never fits in

Heskey - Joke

Rooney - Top class, he doesn't care about England, nowhere near as good as for Utd



I would say England have two top class players Rooney and Cashley, that is said without bias, as I hate both. Both have underperformed so far as well.

I'm sorry but that team is not good enough in so many aspects it isn't even funny.

Majority of them are match winners for their club so they prove they can do it on big stage. They're just not being played in correct way for England. That couple with different environment, players around them and the fans add up to the failure we're witnessing at the minute.

The Muppet

SlickRic wrote: »

Muppet, you seem obsessed with bringing Liverpool players into this. your agenda is obvious.

this is a thread about Rooney's comments.

why did you not pick on Lampard who was also mentioned? no, let's go straight for Johnson, who was not 'rubbish' by the way. England didn't keep the ball well enough to bring him or Cole into the game.

the problem was Lampard has no idea what he's doing in that system, you're not getting the best out of him or Gerrard (who was obviously also poor, but still looked England's most likely by far, but he had to be his ill-disciplined self and cut inside to do it).

you have Rooney whose not fit, and playing well below his best. his touch was frightening last night; Heskey-esque. so he's frustrated. he's not used to this.

Rooney had a right to say what he did, as it was borne out of a human frustration at everything going on around him, incuding his personal performance, but he should have been more professional.

I did criticise Lampard who had a bad game but not as bad as Gerrard or Johnson who was totally rubbish IMO, I assume he's in the team for his offensive abilities, what did he create last night? I also criticised Rooney as you can see, i just didn't put all the blame for the poor performance on him.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=66481325#post66481325

Livvie

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

I think we are talking about two different things - you are talking about footballing style and I'm talking about Rooney's comments. But no worries.

Sorry. I probably shouldn't have quoted your post, as my comment was only very loosely based on it.

SlickRic

wrong thread for this.

but when did Johnson, or Cole, get put into space by their midfield?

oh wait, punt to Heskey was all England did, unless Gerrard came off his wing and tried to do something. he wasn't good, but he tried more than most to play properly.

Rooney, pretty much any time the ball came near him, lost it. but he's not fit, and the team's not playing to his strengths right now, so i'm happy to give him a slight pass. but there's no getting away from the fact he must have been frustrated with how sh*te he was, which is probably part of the reason for the outburst, which is what the thread's about.

wobblyknees

The Muppet wrote: »

Johnson is a rubbish defender which is his primary role, he can be good going forward as he was vs usa , He was totally rubbish both offensively and defensively last night.

Maybe in primary school he can be described as a 'rubbish defender'. As for last night, he was poor, much like the rest of the team (bar maybe the other three defenders Terry, Carra and Cole) spear headed by the ridiculously inept and petulant Rooney.

_Bella_

England striker Wayne Rooney:

"Last night, on reflection I said things in the heat of the moment that came out of frustration of both our performance and the result. For my part I apologise for any offence caused by my actions at the end of the game."

Thefirestarter

I think its only fair for Rooney to vent a bit of frustration, with the BBC and itv hyping them beyond belief again and the red top rags with there view on the teams in England's group not being worthy of a game. Get behind the team your there to support and that's it.

v3ttel

I really don't understand what booing your own team achieves?

Do the players already know the result was poor? Yes.
Do the players already know the performance was poor? Yes.

The only thing that booing achieves is putting fear into the players, makes them takes less risks.... "If i misplace this pass" kind of thing. Nobody wants to be the scape goat.

Really don't understand how anyone can boo their own team, or how its supposed to help them?

Livvie

Rooney10 wrote: »

I really don't understand what booing your own team achieves?

Do the players already know the result was poor? Yes.
Do the players already know the performance was poor? Yes.

The only thing that booing achieves is putting fear into the players, makes them takes less risks.... "If i misplace this pass" kind of thing. Nobody wants to be the scape goat.

Really don't understand how anyone can boo their own team, or how its supposed to help them?

Maybe just an emotional reaction - or over-reaction. Disappointed fans who want to voice their feelings usually when a team have been particularly bad. After the game I don't see a problem with it. During the game itself would be lunacy, and booing a defeat after a good performance would be disgusting.

DB10

In all fairness if there was ever a game to boo at it, it was last night. I mean that was a disgraceful performance, worst this decade.

People are spending crazy money to go out there and follow the team. The least they expect is for the players to give 100% and surely for England a win against Algeria is not a massive ask.

If they dominated and missed a hatful of chances they might deserve sympathy, but they were an embarrassment. Rooney himself was a joke, he didn't seem to care at all.

briany

What's going on with the Sun headline shot on RTE's analysis? It looks like someone retrieved a torn frontpage from the bin and scanned it into a computer.

Iang87

i thought souness just made a super point about altitude maybe playing a factor.

Also can i just point out apart from lampard no1 else in the english starting lineup yesterday were in form come the end of the season

killwill

DB10 wrote: »

In all fairness if there was ever a game to boo at it, it was last night. I mean that was a disgraceful performance, worst this decade.

People are spending crazy money to go out there and follow the team. The least they expect is for the players to give 100% and surely for England a win against Algeria is not a massive ask.

If they dominated and missed a hatful of chances they might deserve sympathy, but they were an embarrassment. Rooney himself was a joke, he didn't seem to care at all.

I have been to a heck of a lot of ROI international matches and have not booed the team regardless of team or individual performances. It is classless and in no shape or form constructive. The main reason England are so poor is purely to a formation that does not work, I said it before the USA game and many other did too. It was plain to see after the game, so what does Capello do to change it up? Nothing. If England want to beat an average team, let alone a good team in the WC they need to play 4-5-1. He will then get the best out of Rooney, Gerrard and Lampard, who are the main attacking and goal threats.