Pairc Ui Chaoimh re-development

D'Agger

lukin wrote: »

I wouldn't be holding my breath for concerts in the new stadium. The CCB are in for a nasty shock if they think concert promoters will be beating a path to their door with gigs. There are two stadiums in Dublin that both have a bigger capacity than the new PUC and are also more modern. Because we have such a small population two stadiums is more than enough to cater for demand.
Anyway there aren't that many solo artists or bands in the world that fill stadiums these days.
It is also a well known fact that promoters are reluctant to host gigs in PUC because it has poor access and Dublin gigs are easier to sell tickets for because of the larger population in and around Dublin and it has the LUAS,DART, bigger airport , better hotels, nightlife etc.
There won't be a concert in 2017 in PUC more than likely. Unless they squeeze one in in late September or August at short notice.

Promoters really don't give a shít about the infrastructure or how people get to the arenas they book - they care about the bottom line which will show a healthy profit if they manage to get gigs in Cork.

This is Irelands 2nd largest city, with no set venue for hosting gigs - there's a market there for it, that would benefit both PUC, Livenation/Promoters & the people of Cork. With it looking increasingly likely that the Event Centre won't happen for quite some time, the PUC committee should realistically be out there trying to lure some acts down this direction rather than the other way around (waiting for people to come to them).

I take your point that the act would need to be high quality to fill an arena but in the past Summerfest in Killarney has gotten Fitzgerald Stadium filled with acts like Snow Patrol, Westlife etc. - so not completely beyond the realms of rational thought.

I'd be skeptical that Cork will see a big act in 2017 but you never know

Johnnyjump

D'Agger wrote: »

Promoters really don't give a shít about the infrastructure or how people get to the arenas they book - they care about the bottom line which will show a healthy profit if they manage to get gigs in Cork.

This is Irelands 2nd largest city, with no set venue for hosting gigs - there's a market there for it, that would benefit both PUC, Livenation/Promoters & the people of Cork. With it looking increasingly likely that the Event Centre won't happen for quite some time, the PUC committee should realistically be out there trying to lure some acts down this direction rather than the other way around (waiting for people to come to them).

I take your point that the act would need to be high quality to fill an arena but in the past Summerfest in Killarney has gotten Fitzgerald Stadium filled with acts like Snow Patrol, Westlife etc. - so not completely beyond the realms of rational thought.

I'd be skeptical that Cork will see a big act in 2017 but you never know

We live in hope.

pwurple

Ah guys, it's walking distance to the city center.

Live at the marquee is always jammers, it's a just a draughty tent.

sheff the ref

Acts in Cork will be supported because people forget that Cork does not just serve Cork itself, it serves the entire Munster area for a big act.

It is a lot handier for a lot of people to go to Cork than to go to Dublin for an event.

D'Agger wrote: »

Promoters really don't give a shít about the infrastructure or how people get to the arenas they book - they care about the bottom line which will show a healthy profit if they manage to get gigs in Cork.

This is Irelands 2nd largest city, with no set venue for hosting gigs - there's a market there for it, that would benefit both PUC, Livenation/Promoters & the people of Cork. With it looking increasingly likely that the Event Centre won't happen for quite some time, the PUC committee should realistically be out there trying to lure some acts down this direction rather than the other way around (waiting for people to come to them).

I take your point that the act would need to be high quality to fill an arena but in the past Summerfest in Killarney has gotten Fitzgerald Stadium filled with acts like Snow Patrol, Westlife etc. - so not completely beyond the realms of rational thought.

I'd be skeptical that Cork will see a big act in 2017 but you never know

sheff the ref

The first observation I make about Cork is that they get massive crowds for County Finals and this has helped them to stash a lot of cash reserves before this project. They will continue to generate a good bit of income which will help. I presume there were other revenue means such as the draw etc. which will continue

The big issue seems to be like the FAI and the Aviva. Cork County Board will be debt free at some stage, but it might take a little longer than originally expected.

As for big games. The Munster Football Final is there every second year, and Cork and Kerry draw a lot of games so there may be bonus games. Tipperary footballers appear to be throwing a spanner in the works though.

In hurling, there have been a number of years where Cork have got very few games. Must check the history books, but in 2001 every Munster Hurling Championship game played was played in Cork, whereas other years no match was played there. Qualifier games don't draw crowds as such but politics will play a part here and ensure that Cork gets a few Tipperary vs Clare and Limerick vs Waterford games that are generally played elsewhere. They will have home games also as part of home and away agreements

Essentially though Croke Park is still an excellent stadium 20 years after it began. Cork will be an excellent stadium n 20 years time. It wont need to be rebuilt after 40 years. This is a final job. Might as well do it right.

Non GAA events will take place there too. Heineken Cup Semi Finals. European and World Cup Soccer Qualifiers. Concerts. Rugby World Cup. With a stadium of that standard, the world is your oyster.

lukin wrote: »

Even though I am a lifelong Cork GAA supporter, I don't share the general enthusiasm for this project. I recognise that we needed to upgrade the old PUC as it was a dilapidated kip and a safety hazard but the lies that have been peddled by the Cork County Board since the start of the development have been a disgrace:

1. It's within budget. No it isn't. The original budget was €67 million, then it went to €70 million, now it is €80 million.
2. It's going to host 25 'major' matches EVERY year. Ha-ha, good one.
3. The stadium re-build will not affect funding for Cork's inter-county teams. €5 million of the CCB's cash reserves were spent on the stadium. This is separate to the €10 million that the CCB told us they were putting in at the start of the project.

I will probably attend matches at the stadium when it is built because my nephew will want to go but I didn't renew my hurling season ticket as a form of protest. I emailed the CCB the above points but did not receive a reply.

j8wk2feszrnpao

sheff the ref wrote: »

Non GAA events will take place there too. Heineken Cup Semi Finals. European and World Cup Soccer Qualifiers. Concerts. Rugby World Cup. With a stadium of that standard, the world is your oyster.

The rugby semi finals would be played at the Aviva, no reason for the Irish rugby teams to plays in a GAA stadium when they have their own (with similar capacity).
Competitive soccer matches stay in the Aviva as 'capped' matches have to be played there (part of sponsorship deal).
Unless it's a Munster final, any "Tipperary vs Clare and Limerick vs Waterford" games will be played in their own ground (or whatever home/away deal they have).

Pairc Ui Chaoimh didn''t host any of the above events previously, so I don't see how they'd get them now.

sheff the ref

Vienna Rancid Creature wrote: »

The rugby semi finals would be played at the Aviva, no reason for the Irish rugby teams to plays in a GAA stadium when they have their own (with similar capacity).
Competitive soccer matches stay in the Aviva as 'capped' matches have to be played there (part of sponsorship deal).
Unless it's a Munster final, any "Tipperary vs Clare and Limerick vs Waterford" games will be played in their own ground (or whatever home/away deal they have).

Pairc Ui Chaoimh didn''t host any of the above events previously, so I don't see how they'd get them now.

Limerick vs Waterford is a Thurles game
Tipperary vs Clare is a Limerick game
Frank will secure those ties as they materialise as they have been granted to Cork occasionally in the past

Would they take a Munster vs Leicester Heineken Cup Semi Final in Rugby out of Munster and up to the Aviva if special permission was sought and granted?

There is also potential for a 4 team pre-season soccer tournament in July. Liverpool etc.

lukin

sheff the ref wrote:

Non GAA events will take place there too. Heineken Cup Semi Finals. European and World Cup Soccer Qualifiers. Concerts. Rugby World Cup. With a stadium of that standard, the world is your oyster.

sheff the ref wrote: »

Would they take a Munster vs Leicester Heineken Cup Semi Final in Rugby out of Munster and up to the Aviva if special permission was sought and granted?

There is also potential for a 4 team pre-season soccer tournament in July. Liverpool etc.

Not a chance anything like that will happen. The Cork county board will never let "foreign games" be played in PUC or any GAA pitch in Cork county for that matter. Even if they were broke to the ropes and hadn't a cent to their name they wouldn't allow it.
Twelve years ago they voted against the opening of Croke park to soccer and rugby while the Aviva was being built (http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/gaa/cork-votes-down-rule-42-motion-197890.html. They are hardly going to vote yes to it when it's their own stadium.
They still live in the 1960's. Some Cork people still criticise the Cork hurlers for the strikes but this is the kind of attitude they were up against.

j8wk2feszrnpao

sheff the ref wrote: »

Frank will secure those ties as they materialise as they have been granted to Cork occasionally in the past

No guarantees there. Occasional games? Maybe. An obvious fight from other counties who don't want to lose those games.

sheff the ref wrote: »

Would they take a Munster vs Leicester Heineken Cup Semi Final in Rugby out of Munster and up to the Aviva if special permission was sought and granted?

Would who seek the permission? The Provinces are ran/funded by the IRFU, who have their own stadium, so no need to pay out to the GAA to rent one.

sheff the ref wrote: »

There is also potential for a 4 team pre-season soccer tournament in July. Liverpool etc.

These can be expensive to hold if you want to attract wanted teams (who are sought after Worldwide). Plus, in July, it's likely you'd want the stadium free for GAA games. As lukin as pointed out, the anti-foreign game regiment showed it's head during the Aviva build; soccer games during GAA season would most likely ruffle their feathers.

blindsider

lukin wrote: »

Not a chance anything like that will happen. The Cork county board will never let "foreign games" be played in PUC or any GAA pitch in Cork county for that matter. Even if they were broke to the ropes and hadn't a cent to their name they wouldn't allow it.
Twelve years ago they voted against the opening of Croke park to soccer and rugby while the Aviva was being built (http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/gaa/cork-votes-down-rule-42-motion-197890.html. They are hardly going to vote yes to it when it's their own stadium.
They still live in the 1960's. Some Cork people still criticise the Cork hurlers for the strikes but this is the kind of attitude they were up against.

I presume you're not including the RWC in 2023... if Ireland wins the bid. PUC is listed as one of the stadia.

clerk

A Munster vs. non-Irish team Semi/Quarter final is a possible match if it makes financial sense and all parties agree and presuming they think it would be a sellout in Cork. l'd imagine even that scenario would have considerable objections from many in terms of moving the match from Thomond, albeit Munster could do with the money so who knows.

There will not be any 'full' international soccer matches, very unlikely l would say. They should be able to swing a few friendlies, but it would have to be a very attractive one to start getting the stadium full so it's not exactly top of the FAI's agenda I would think. A pre-season tournament, of say something like Liverpool, Celtic etc. is possible but the premiership teams are extremely fought over for such trips so weak teams might be a probability but might still work every 5 Years or so.

l think the ship has sailed on the no foreign games scenario. As quite rightly pointed out the CCB voted against the opening up of Croke park which even 12 Years ago was considered an embarrassment by most Cork GAA fans l know. But 12 Years have passed and even dinosaurs get old and they've already signed up for rugby World cup so it's all a bit of much ado about nothing.

The Cork Kerry football finals in Cork were only bringing in about 30,000. I was only taking to a few buddies would go to matches over Christmas and we were saying you could probably count on your hand the numbers of GAA games that sold out in the Pairc in the last 10, even 15 Years. The 2014 Munster final came to mind. Can't ever remember a football selling out in the Pairc but we're all very much looking forward to getting our hands on tickets for the 10 Year section for the 1st round of the County Championship, we assume these must be included in the announced 25 games a season.

The concerts are the big one for me, no proper stadium concert venue in Munster and the conferencing facilities should do very well as long as they up to stratch. l was talking to a ccb alacado earlier and he mentioned Adele as being a possibility, let the rumours commence.

Shedite27

clerk wrote: »

The concerts are the big one for me, no proper stadium concert venue in Munster and the conferencing facilities should do very well as long as they up to stratch. l was talking to a ccb alacado earlier and he mentioned Adele as being a possibility, let the rumours commence.

Do you really think the only reason Adele hasn't played Cork yet is because the terraces and stands are worn down?

I'm all for this stadium, but can't see how we're going to attract much bigger gigs just because there's corporate boxes.

For games, I'd be surprised if they get a Munster match or a soccer match. For GAA, most munster teams have home and away deals anyway. And Cork league games haven't sold out Pairc Ui Rinn in years.

I'm delighted we're building it, but it's just going to be a nicer place to watch what we already have in Cork, rather than new events.

lukin

blindsider wrote: »

I presume you're not including the RWC in 2023... if Ireland wins the bid. PUC is listed as one of the stadia.

PUC being used for the Rugby World Cup is conditional on us winning the bid and there is no guarantee that we will win the bid. I am sure the CCB will let that happen but only because the government probably made them agree to that in order to get the €30 million they provided to the cost.

Squall Leonhart

Latest image from site, Christmas 2016

pat ticket

sheff the ref wrote: »

Non GAA events will take place there too. Heineken Cup Semi Finals. European and World Cup Soccer Qualifiers. Concerts. Rugby World Cup. With a stadium of that standard, the world is your oyster.

Leaving aside the CCB's hostility to 'foreign games' and the FAI's commitment to the new Lansdowne Road, there is zero chance of the National Team playing competitive games in the redeveloped PUC as it does not meet UEFA's standard for international qualifying games. Likewise if CCFC were ever to make it to the promised land of the group stages of the EL/CL group stages.

lukin

pat ticket wrote: »

Likewise if CCFC were ever to make it to the promised land of the group stages of the EL/CL group stages.

I think it would be up to UEFA standard for Europa League (if they cordoned off the terraces) but I don't know about the Champions League. Even if Cork City qualified for either competition the CCB would not offer them the use of it.

CHealy

lukin wrote: »

I think it would be up to UEFA standard for Europa League (if they cordoned off the terraces) but I don't know about the Champions League. Even if Cork City qualified for either competition the CCB would not offer them the use of it.

It would be ok for both I believe but as you said it would never happen either way. Its a worry, because Turners Cross can only be used so far, should we have beaten Genk in the 3rd Round this year we would not have been able to use TC in the playoff round. Its a fine ground, but UEFA demand so many corporate, parking, and staff facilities its just not upto that standard, Musgrave Park would also be out of the question meaning City would have to bring the game to Thomond Park or Tallaght.

johnnyryan89

clerk wrote: »

A Munster vs. non-Irish team Semi/Quarter final is a possible match if it makes financial sense and all parties agree and presuming they think it would be a sellout in Cork. l'd imagine even that scenario would have considerable objections from many in terms of moving the match from Thomond, albeit Munster could do with the money so

Thomond Park is big enough to host quarter finals but not so sure about semi finals since the redevelopment as both semi finals Munster got to in 09 and 12 were against Irish teams so we're always gonna be played in Dublin.

I'm sure they had the option of using the Gaelic Grounds before the redevelopment but never asked about it so more than likely the IRFU wants them to maybe stick to IRFU stadiums. I'd love for Munster to have home semi finals as actual home semi finals and not travel to Dublin but financially it probably makes more since holding them in Dublin than renting out a GAA stadium.

PTH2009

U2 are touring for the 30th anniversary of the Joshua Tree this year and its looking like its a stadium tour so there is a slight (extremely slight) chance they may be the first music act too play the stadium next july\august. They played the old PUC on the 1987 Joshua Tree tour

I'd say the stadium is going too look great, pity its not here In Waterford, we have out glouris Walsh Park lol

kcb

pat ticket wrote: »

if CCFC were ever to make it to the promised land of the group stages of the EL/CL group stages.

Surely an €80m stadium would be up to CL standard? Surely.

blindsider

lukin wrote: »

PUC being used for the Rugby World Cup is conditional on us winning the bid and there is no guarantee that we will win the bid. I am sure the CCB will let that happen but only because the government probably made them agree to that in order to get the €30 million they provided to the cost.

...so that's a No then ;-)

johnnyryan89

kcb wrote: »

Surely an €80m stadium would be up to CL standard? Surely.

You'd be very surprised, UEFA have a list of requirements that a stadium must meet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_stadium_categories.

pat ticket

kcb wrote: »

Surely an €80m stadium would be up to CL standard? Surely.

Going by the wiki link, only category 4 stadiums can be used for EL/CL group games (though it appears Dundalk got dispensation this season). Perhaps CCFC could use the renovated PUC, though I highly doubt the CCB would have redeveloped it with UEFA guidelines in mind.

If Dawk can get special dispensation for Tallaght to use in EL group stages then City could surely get it for the Cross if they required it for the EL.

Cape Clear

pat ticket wrote: »

Going by the wiki link, only category 4 stadiums can be used for EL/CL group games (though it appears Dundalk got dispensation this season). Perhaps CCFC could use the renovated PUC, though I highly doubt the CCB would have redeveloped it with UEFA guidelines in mind.

If Dawk can get special dispensation for Tallaght to use in EL group stages then City could surely get it for the Cross if they required it for the EL.

I think Tallaght only scraped by on a lot of the criteria.

Cape Clear

sheff the ref wrote: »

The first observation I make about Cork is that they get massive crowds for County Finals and this has helped them to stash a lot of cash reserves before this project. They will continue to generate a good bit of income which will help. I presume there were other revenue means such as the draw etc. which will continue

The big issue seems to be like the FAI and the Aviva. Cork County Board will be debt free at some stage, but it might take a little longer than originally expected.

As for big games. The Munster Football Final is there every second year, and Cork and Kerry draw a lot of games so there may be bonus games. Tipperary footballers appear to be throwing a spanner in the works though.

In hurling, there have been a number of years where Cork have got very few games. Must check the history books, but in 2001 every Munster Hurling Championship game played was played in Cork, whereas other years no match was played there. Qualifier games don't draw crowds as such but politics will play a part here and ensure that Cork gets a few Tipperary vs Clare and Limerick vs Waterford games that are generally played elsewhere. They will have home games also as part of home and away agreements

Essentially though Croke Park is still an excellent stadium 20 years after it began. Cork will be an excellent stadium n 20 years time. It wont need to be rebuilt after 40 years. This is a final job. Might as well do it right.

Non GAA events will take place there too. Heineken Cup Semi Finals. European and World Cup Soccer Qualifiers. Concerts. Rugby World Cup. With a stadium of that standard, the world is your oyster.

Utter bull! Just on the county final attendance rarely break ten thousand.

lukin

I know I am repeating myself here but there is no chance of European Rugby games or Ireland soccer qualifiers being hosted in the new PUC. The combover crew in the county board would rather demolish it with explosives first.
Because this "new" stadium is being built some people (who obviously don't know the mindset of the average Cork county board member) are dreaming up scenarios of all sorts of events being held there. Forget it. IT WILL NOT HAPPEN. It is a GAA stadium for GAA events. End of story.
Some Rugby World Cup games will be hosted there if we win the bid (only cause the government had the CCB over a barrel with regard to the €30 million) but you can bet your bottom dollar Frank Murphy and the boys are praying before they go to bed every night that we don't win the bid so they won't have to follow through on their promise.

D'Agger

Cape Clear wrote: »

Utter bull! Just on the county final attendance rarely break ten thousand.

County Final attendance was closer to 15k this year afaik - bigger than the Kerry County final for Football anyway as I remember looking them up - both on the same day this year while I was abroad

vkid

Have Munster Rugby at any point indicated they would consider using PUC for a game? I haven't heard them do so or even mention it.
Would think they would use the stadiums they have/have easy access to ie. Independent Musgrave Park, Thomond and the Aviva for any games they have. Similarly the FAI.

It will be interesting to see how this works out, Personally I think the design is really poor, considering they flattened most of the old stadium and are over budget. Stadium concerts are becoming less and less as a lot of the acts that could fill them are gone or nearly gone...and where they are getting all the GAA games they are talking about is anyones guess.

RoyalCelt

15k for a county final is excellent. At €15 a head that's €220,000. Add in all the other grades finals, semis and regular championship matches across hurling and football and you're looking at a big intake for the coffers on a yearly business.

They'll not have any problems paying off the stadium.

Shedite27

There's no way it was 15k. Last final I was at was the Nemo one last year and I'd say there was 3k tops.