music minor melody

bubblz

hey just wondering if anyone can help me
lots some of my notes for the minor melody.. can't remember if in the 7th & 8th bar do you sharpen the 7th note (se) in these 2 bars or do you sharpen it throughout the piece.. minor melody writing is my weakest piece so any help would be appreciated.!

Behind you Joey

Hey think it's only for bars 7/8, tbh cannot really remember that well, but think it's just dem two?!:pac:

Enid.

K the only way I can really describe it is to go through the whole thing.
You find the key of the piece, get the relative minor then the Ti and the Doh are what you use to do your modulation, if you're doing one.
You sharpen/natural sign the Ti depending on whether it's a sharp or a flat, and that becomes Te. You use Te at the end of Bar 7 and Doh in Bar 8. Every time you use Te after that you must keep the sharp/natural sign on it, and it can only come after or be followed by a Soh, high Doh or high Re.

Agh I hope that's right, they're a difficult beast to tame, them minor melodies...

bubblz

Enid. wrote: »

K the only way I can really describe it is to go through the whole thing.
You find the key of the piece, get the relative minor then the Ti and the Doh are what you use to do your modulation, if you're doing one.
You sharpen/natural sign the Ti depending on whether it's a sharp or a flat, and that becomes Te. You use Te at the end of Bar 7 and Doh in Bar 8. Every time you use Te after that you must keep the sharp/natural sign on it, and it can only come after or be followed by a Soh, high Doh or high Re.

Agh I hope that's right, they're a difficult beast to tame, them minor melodies...

think we do it a different way but thanks anyway...!

Enid.

Aww I'm sorry...It's amazing how different teachers teach the same things in completely different ways!

DGRulz

Could be wrong but Im almost sure that for the minor you use your shape/flat everywhere but 7 and 8 i think you go back to your original tonic and its fifth for the modualation. Its the only place there shouldnt be a sharp/flat. I'll let you know 5 mins before the exam as my teachers giving us a refresher class an hour before the exam :P

leg

In a minor melody you raise the leading note up a semitone for the entire melody otherwise it wont be in the minor key.

You only dont raise the leading note if your modulating to the rel. major and you dont even have to do this for a minor melody

ceol18

you don't have to modulate in a minor melody, it'll never say it in the question, but you always have to approach and leave the accidental from or to soh, doh, or reh (and i think, fah?) god i hope one of these doesn't come up i just avoid writing accidentals as much as possible to reduce the risk of mistakes =P

Joe_Dull

Alright lads, I've just had a bit of a panic attack about these. In a minor key - A minor for example - are these your chords?

(capitals are major, small letters minor)

i - ii(dim) - III - iv - V - vi -VII

Am i right in saying the dominant chord is the only useful chord that's major in a minor key?

DGRulz

Joe_Dull wrote: »

Alright lads, I've just had a bit of a panic attack about these. In a minor key - A minor for example - are these your chords?

(capitals are major, small letters minor)

i - ii(dim) - III - iv - V - vi -VII

Am i right in saying the dominant chord is the only useful chord that's major in a minor key?

Yea Ive never used III or VII

frser32

for the minor melodies..the note after 6 and 7 determines if it is going to be sharpened or not...if the note after 6 and 7 is higher than the note is to be sharpened, ie natural.. however you do nothing if the next note is lower than 6 or 7 ..hope this is clear..once again there is no modulation..i think they are nicer than the major ones..:)

dan_d

DGRulz wrote: »

Yea Ive never used III or VII

I don't think you use III or VII at LC level, the rules around them are a bit more complicated.

If the whole piece is in a minor key, sharpen your 7th and 8th everywhere...otherwise it's not minor.

Bubblz I think you're mixing that up with pieces that begin in a major key and modulate to a minor in the middle.

ldxo15wus6fpgm

dan_d wrote: »

I don't think you use III or VII at LC level, the rules around them are a bit more complicated.

If the whole piece is in a minor key, sharpen your 7th and 8th everywhere...otherwise it's not minor.

Bubblz I think you're mixing that up with pieces that begin in a major key and modulate to a minor in the middle.

I'm pretty confused now... my teacher has never mentioned anything like this... she said you need to raise the 6th and 7th in an ascending scale run, and lower them again in a descending run.

Maybe you're referring to the key signature? Because if you had to put sharps on every single 7th and 8th that would be in the key sig. and if you didn't put it there the piece would be covered in sharps.

dididrama

You don't have to modulate for a minor melody, only a major one

In minor melodiies the 7th note of the scale must be raised for the whole melody. This will be a sharp in a minor (C major key sig), e minor(G major), b minor (D major), f# minor (A major), c# minor(E major), d minor (F major) and g minor (Bb major) and a natural for c minor (Eb major), f minor (Ab major). For example c minor has three flats - Bb, Eb and Ab - and the 7th note must be raised whick makes it a B nautral

I'm a music teacher. PM me for my website address if you want more info/notes

bubblz

dan_d wrote: »

I don't think you use III or VII at LC level, the rules around them are a bit more complicated.

If the whole piece is in a minor key, sharpen your 7th and 8th everywhere...otherwise it's not minor.

Bubblz I think you're mixing that up with pieces that begin in a major key and modulate to a minor in the middle.

Yes I think I was too..! these minor melodies really confuse me..!
Another Quick question while we're on the topic of minor chords... in a minor chord question is it only ib or IIb you use instead of the chord of i or II?

piptypibe

Another Quick question while we're on the topic of minor chords... in a minor chord question is it only ib or IIb you use instead of the chord of i or II?[/QUOTE]

Presume you are refering to Q5 on the Composition Paper.
In a Minor Key, you NEVER use chord ii, ONLY iib.
e.g. A minor
i, iib, iv, V, V7, VI is your choice of chords in Roman Numerals.
Am (a,c,e) B/D dim (d, f, b)(remember D is your bass note here!) ,
Dm (d,f,a) , E (e, g#, b), E7 (e, g#, b, d) F(f,a c) are the chords symbols and notes of the chords.
In a minor key the raised 7th goes in as an accidental. So e.g. in Am g# will go in as an accidental not as the key signature.
You can use ib or ic, ivb, vb.
Also, Make sure you know your 4 cadences!
Best of luck!

ldxo15wus6fpgm

I have a question to do with raising the 7th note in a minor melody. Is this absolutely everywhere except in a descending scale or is it only in certain places?

Also, if I had for example a 5th then a 6th and then a 7th note, would I raise the 6th as its in an ascending scale, or does the scale need to carry on past the 7th note?

frser32

Stetson Wonderful Poetess wrote: »

I have a question do do with raising the 7th note in a minor melody. Is this absolutely everywhere except in a descending scale or is it only in certain places?

Also, if I had for example a 5th then a 6th and then a 7th note, would I raise the 6th as its in an ascending scale, or does the scale need to carry on past the 7th note?

you sharpen the 6th and 7th if the note afterwards is higher, it all depends on the next note..so yes you would raise the 6th if its an ascending, no it dosent need to carry on past the 7th, in that case the 7th would not be raised, if the note afterwards was lower

ldxo15wus6fpgm

frser32 wrote: »

you sharpen the 6th and 7th if the note afterwards is higher, it all depends on the next note..so yes you would raise the 6th if its an ascending, no it dosent need to carry on past the 7th, in that case the 7th would not be raised, if the note afterwards was lower

But there's loads of people on here saying the 7th has to be raised everywhere?

frser32

Stetson Wonderful Poetess wrote: »

But there's loads of people on here saying the 7th has to be raised everywhere?

in the harmonic minor scale, 6 and 7 are raised when ascending, and they are flattened again when descending. therefore if your next note is ascending its going to be sharpened, likewise if its descending its going to be flat. so as far as i know you only sharpen 6 and 7 when your next note is ascending..

leg

frser32 wrote: »

in the harmonic minor scale, 6 and 7 are raised when ascending, and they are flattened again when descending. therefore if your next note is ascending its going to be sharpened, likewise if its descending its going to be flat. so as far as i know you only sharpen 6 and 7 when your next note is ascending..

Where are you pulling this stuff out of??

minor melody rules:

• Raise the leading note (7th) throughout the entire piece

NB Except the only time the leading note is not raised is when it is a passing note

• The 6th is only raised as a passing note otherwise it is left as it is in the key signature
• You do not have to modulate but yo can if you wish
• Approach the 7th by step from above otherwise you'll get awkward intervals

ldxo15wus6fpgm

It's the melodic minor scale... the scale changes when it is ascending compared to when its descending. I'm just a little confused about this "raise the 7th everywhere" business.
What I mean is if I had a 5th, a 6th and a 7th note ascending run, would I have both the 6th and 7th raised? Because the 6th should definitely be raised there, but I'm not sure if this "raise the 7th everywhere" thing comes in to play there.

Cormac2791

What happens in a minor melody then??

ldxo15wus6fpgm

That's what I want to know

Cormac2791

cormacharraghy wrote: »

What happens in a minor melody then??

*edit, minor harmony!!

ldxo15wus6fpgm

Well I asked my teacher about that and she told me that as the harmony questions are just 2 melodies, you use the same rules as in the melody. I just wish I knew exactly what they were :pac:

Cormac2791

Stetson Wonderful Poetess wrote: »

Well I asked my teacher about that and she told me that as the harmony questions are just 2 melodies, you use the same rules as in the melody. I just wish I knew exactly what they were :pac:

Ahh ok!!

highlydebased

What is meant by "raise the 7th"? Sorry if its a stupid question

Cormac2791

Neon-Circles wrote: »

What is meant by "raise the 7th"? Sorry if its a stupid question

if it's in g minor say, you'd sharpen the f

ldxo15wus6fpgm

if it's a flat, you make it a natural. if it's a natural, you make it a sharp. Basically you 'raise' it by 1 semitone.