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Luas Cross City (Line BX/D) [now open]
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Now, that I do agree with - this car bashing ideology is just a cop out IMO…<snip>
There solution to the problem seems to be create a scenario where the problem cannot occur rather than fix the problem itself.
It'd be like the solution to a broken clock being "Don't let anybody look at this clock to tell the time" as opposed to actually fixing the clock.
...well banning cars in the absence of credible alternatives like rail based transport solutions (complete with proper Park'n'Ride facilities) will not work. Also as you said, cars are not the only things to travel along regular roads. Indeed, anti-road ideology could also be viewed as anti-bus, anti-truck and anti-service vehicles including the emergency services. In fact, we do have an anti-commuter car motorway - it's the section of M50 that lies beneath Dublin's Northside - this road is used by both bus and freight vehicles while motorists pay a very high premium for its use during the rush.Banning cars from the quays will not work, the traffic has to go somewhere. It's not just going to disappear.
You can't ban Taxis from the tracks. They will strike and cause chaos.
You cannot close college green either, the route is effectively closed to everyone except buses, taxis and bikes as it is.
I only walked by there yesterday, the place is "A Wash" with Dublin Bus Yellow. Must have been at least 15 to 20 Buses in the area. No cars, very very few taxi’s.
Well what I can’t understand is why there’s so little attempt to get on with extending the Luas Cross City line towards Finglas and beyond to a major park’n’ride site - perhaps, the M2 Parkway near Coldwinters.The Luas can carry more people than a Dublin Bus can length for length btw
Ultimately I am glad the Luas Green Line was extended. The City does need it. But the traffic issues that exist in the city are not going to just "Go Away" by banning cars from certain roads or imposing congestion charges.
Well, we simply can't accommodate the massive volume of cars that would be travelling into the city centre - there just isn’t the space. That said, what annoys me is that it’s all stick and no carrot for the motorists who pay very dearly for their cars - the billions in contributions (directly and indirectly) that motorists make to the state coffers - well it’s high time for the state to cough up and get the Metro North, DART Inter-Connector and DART expansion programme (complete with massive park’n’ride facilities) built.If we know one thing, it's that Dubs (Irish People) like driving their cars and most would avoid public transport if possible. Imposing restrictions/levies on people for driving something that costs a fortune to run as it is, is wrong.
We pay tax to use the roads, we should be allowed to use the roads of the capital
Well car trips for shopping and touring purposes must still be accommodated.If you're bringing 2 or more small kids into town, public transport is a nightmare. I've been there/done that/bought the T-Shirt.
Now, the following is where we diverge by way of opinion…
They did that in England and it didn’t work - Birmingham is a clear example…Ultimately if DCC really wanted to fix the traffic problem they need to do the following:
1: Starting knocking buildings to widen the roads.
Don’t you touch our railway!2: Knock the railway bridge between Pearse and Connolly Stations and rebuild. The supports for that bridge acts as choke points around town.
Seriously though, you would need to close that railway entirely so carry out such work. There was a proposal in the 1990s to completely realign the railway from Grand Canal Dock via a large new rail terminal at Spencer Dock to East Wall where the Northern and Western lines diverge - that path however is now built on.
In terms of potamology, narrowing the Liffey would be like narrowing the M50. In fact, it is national policy to widen/deepen rivers (even some bridges need to be knocked) in light of climate change (whether natural or man made). The max volume of water that the Liffey is likely to handle is going to be increasingly larger as the decades roll by - there's also the slightly higher tides with the very gradual but sure increase in sea levels.3: Narrow the Liffey and add additional Lanes.
One way systems help to lessen conflicts between crossing traffic streams at any given location - for example, an intersection of two two-way streets will require four signal phases to handle just the traffic (pedestrians may need their own phase) - an intersection of two one-way streets will require 3 phases at most (pedestrians included).4: Remove the one way system nonsense around town.
That IMO would be rather drastic - in fact, there was a plan in the 1960’s and 70’s that went even further - to fill in the canals and build motorways in their place - I’m quite glad that didn’t happen and I say that as a motorway enthusiast. However, your idea for knocking all of the canal bridges would remove so much urban character - I guess you envisage stone faced arch replacements, but even those would be largely concrete (otherwise, the cost and disruption would be too great) - particularly the undersides.5: Knock all the canal Bridges and widen them.
There are already a lot of multi-storey car parks built to accommodate shoppers and visitors to the city centre - perhaps one or two more are needed. For commuting however, huge carparks should be built just outside the M50 where there are high quality transit links - a clear example is the Luas P+R at the Red Cow Interchange - all major train stations should also include P+R facilities.6: Build huge multi story car parks just past the canals.
Agreed! For what the East Link is, it is ridiculous to expect motorists to pay a toll to cross a 2 lane bridge of around 150m in length. It is also annoying to pay for the tunnel (OK, nothing wrong with €3 for a 4.5km tunnel) but then to have to pay for the East Link thereafter when crossing the city - what a rip-off IMO!7: Remove the toll from the east link bridge and allow cars to turn right off the Sam Beckett bridge
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Well Im glad you're not on the planning board anyway. Its people with opinions like yours that ruined europes beautiful cities, knock down historic roads and widen them for the oh so convenient car which will be extinct in the relatively near future.I think the congestion charge is coming, I would not be at all surprised if it was proposed/introduced AFTER the next General Election.
In Relation to B I think DCC wants no cars in Dublin City centre period.
There solution to the problem seems to be create a scenario where the problem cannot occur rather than fix the problem itself.
It'd be like the solution to a broken clock being "Don't let anybody look at this clock to tell the time" as opposed to actually fixing the clock.
Banning cars from the quays will not work, the traffic has to go somewhere. It's not just going to disappear.
You can't ban Taxis from the tracks. They will strike and cause chaos.
You cannot close college green either, the route is effectively closed to everyone except buses, taxis and bikes as it is.
I only walked by there yesterday, the place is "A Wash" with Dublin Bus Yellow. Must have been at least 15 to 20 Buses in the area. No cars, very very few taxi's.
The Luas can carry more people than a Dublin Bus can length for length btw
Ultimately I am glad the Luas Green Line was extended. The City does need it. But the traffic issues that exist in the city are not going to just "Go Away" by banning cars from certain roads or imposing congestion charges.
If we know one thing, it's that Dubs (Irish People) like driving their cars and most would avoid public transport if possible. Imposing restrictions/levies on people for driving something that costs a fortune to run as it is, is wrong.
We pay tax to use the roads, we should be allowed to use the roads of the capital
If you're bringing 2 or more small kids into town, public transport is a nightmare. I've been there/done that/bought the T-Shirt.
Ultimately if DCC really wanted to fix the traffic problem they need to do the following:
1: Starting knocking buildings to widen the roads.
2: Knock the railway bridge between Pearse and Connolly Stations and rebuild. The supports for that bridge acts as choke points around town.
3: Narrow the Liffey and add additional Lanes.
4: Remove the one way system nonsense around town.
5: Knock all the canal Bridges and widen them.
6: Build huge multi story car parks just past the canals.
7: Remove the toll from the east link bridge and allow cars to turn right off the Sam Beckett bridge
8: Connect Heuston to Connolly/Tara/Pearse via Dart Underground
I get it that the cost of the above would be absolutely colossal, and given this is Ireland they'd probably f*ck a lot of it up.
But they above is the only real solution. It particular knocking buildings to widen the roads.
No future major city development plan should revolve around cars in any shape or form, PT is the future, not cars.
And plenty of roads were widened in Dublin before and it was not for the betterment of the city.
Cuff Street old
Cuff Street 'new and improved' under your kind of planning style
https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.3376753,-6.2645036,3a,75y,198.77h,90.46t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sVHUdgPmVIEgRG20UwkZxcw!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DVHUdgPmVIEgRG20UwkZxcw%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D185.80844%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656
And plenty of other old Dublin streets no longer exist due to widening for the beautiful automobile0 -
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