Luas Cross City (Line BX/D) [now open]

Muahahaha

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

But I mean... that's a design problem as opposed to really a "rules of the road" problem isn't it?

I would say it is both design and rules of the road but as Sam Russell has said above it needs to be solved.There is little point in having shiny new trams to get people around if it means the backbone of public transport Dublin Bus is caused unnecessary delays, its just robbing from Peter to pay Paul

Sierra Oscar

The 55m trams are due to go into service later this week. I hadn't realised they are the longest trams in the world.

Luas to put world’s longest tram into service this week

yabadabado

BoatMad wrote: »

The one thing Im sure of , having travelled on cross city for the first time recently, College green and its approaches needs to be cleared of Busses ( and everything else ) to make Luas work, thats patiently obvious

Taxis and private vehicles would make more sense. Buses are carrying large numbers of people from areas withoutothwr forms of public transport. Even denying access to the few key areas during the day would make a huge difference imo.

yabadabado

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

The 55m trams are due to go into service later this week. I hadn't realised they are the longest trams in the world.

Luas to put world’s longest tram into service this week

It's a pity they can't sort out all the problems with the 40m trams, it could be bedlam with these longer ones.

bk

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

The 55m trams are due to go into service later this week. I hadn't realised they are the longest trams in the world.

Luas to put world’s longest tram into service this week

Actually they aren't, Budapest has 56m trams.

The article title is wrong, the body of the Article says:

The seven new trams will be the longest single unit Citadis- type trams in the world, according to tram maker Alstom.

So yes, they are the longest tram made by Alstom, however not by any manufacturer. The trams in Budapest are made by CAF, but are otherwise very similar to the Luas ones.

Jamie2k9

Actually they aren't, Budapest has 56m trams.

Going to assume in its class or that manufacturer, but correct about Budapest.

Spanish Eyes

Does anyone know if passenger stats were collected prior to introducing the Long Trams to traverse OCB? Are they a must have at this point in the journey? Will passenger numbers validate their use there? I dunno.


OK try it out and see, but if it is causing mayhem and the passenger numbers are small enough, maybe turn the long trams around at SSG or something like that.

But I suppose we have to see what happens. It might be fine....

Muahahaha

yabadabado wrote: »

It's a pity they can't sort out all the problems with the 40m trams, it could be bedlam with these longer ones.

Yeah I would imagine there is going to be some head scratching in DCC going on. I think it was LXFlyer who said that turning back trams at SSG might have to become the norm. If the longer trams cause even more delays for buses then then the turnback at SSG may well turn out to be vital to keep the entire PT network moving.

Idbatterim

Muahahaha wrote: »

Yeah I would imagine there is going to be some head scratching in DCC going on. I think it was LXFlyer who said that turning back trams at SSG might have to become the norm. If the longer trams cause even more delays for buses then then the turnback at SSG may well turn out to be vital to keep the entire PT network moving.

when the new trams come into service. Will that even be enough at peak or can people still see capacity issues?

Nermal

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Those busses are more important because they carry more people from a much wider catchment area.

The buses can go somewhere else, the tram can't. Isn't this obvious?

Sam Russell

Nermal wrote: »

The buses can go somewhere else, the tram can't. Isn't this obvious?

Also, buses hunt in packs but trams come one by one at several minute intervals. They have to pass no matter how long they are delayed and take longer from a standing start. On the other hand, delayed buses can pass as a group.

Taxis and cars should be made go another way.

LeinsterDub

LXFlyer wrote: »

That’s not a very practical suggestion when there are 20 minute gaps in service on the LUAS during the morning peak from Broombridge and 24 minute gaps all day on Sundays.

It would obvously be done in conjuction with a high freqency luas service.

LXFlyer

LeinsterDub wrote: »

It would obvously be done in conjuction with a high freqency luas service.

With respect you didn’t say that in your original post. It’s kind of important to look at the actual timetable before coming up with suggestions like that.

The service levels on the Broombridge branch are fairly awful during the weekday peaks and especially on Sundays (when they should be every 12 mins).

bk

A few things to remember about the city center section being quiet.

The NTA/DB are introducing a local bus service for Finglas from next month to feed into the Luas which should increase numbers.

There is also now talk of extending the Luas into Finglas and building a Park and Ride.

Also in the long term, I'd expect Broombridge Insutrial Estate to be redeveloped into thousands of new apartments. We are early days with all these developments.

wakka12

bk wrote: »

A few things to remember about the city center section being quiet.

The NTA/DB are introducing a local bus service for Finglas from next month to feed into the Luas which should increase numbers.

There is also now talk of extending the Luas into Finglas and building a Park and Ride.

Also in the long term, I'd expect Broombridge Insutrial Estate to be redeveloped into thousands of new apartments. We are early days with all these developments.

Is there any timeline for this?

FreudianSlippers

bk wrote: »

A few things to remember about the city center section being quiet.

The NTA/DB are introducing a local bus service for Finglas from next month to feed into the Luas which should increase numbers.

There is also now talk of extending the Luas into Finglas and building a Park and Ride.

Also in the long term, I'd expect Broombridge Insutrial Estate to be redeveloped into thousands of new apartments. We are early days with all these developments.

I'm shocked there is no P&R at Broombridge. The residents must be fuming with all the cars parked on the streets there.

Idbatterim

Allegedly one of the new longer trams came into service today. Would they not turn these back At Parnell rather than going all the way out to Broombridge? Where as far as I know, there are no capacity issues, unlike the southside

http://www.thejournal.ie/longer-luas-trams-3838114-Feb2018/

LXFlyer

bk wrote: »

A few things to remember about the city center section being quiet.

The NTA/DB are introducing a local bus service for Finglas from next month to feed into the Luas which should increase numbers.

There is also now talk of extending the Luas into Finglas and building a Park and Ride.

Also in the long term, I'd expect Broombridge Insutrial Estate to be redeveloped into thousands of new apartments. We are early days with all these developments.

The Broombridge trams already have decent loadings - I’m not disputing that. However the Parnell terminators don’t.

Where I suggested using the SSG turnback to focus the resources where they are needed most, it was in relation to some of the Parnell terminators during the peak periods.

As for the feeder bus - I seriously doubt that the feeder bus is going to make that much difference if I’m honest based on the proposed frequencies (30 mins Mon-Fri, 40 mins on Saturday and 50 mins on Sunday), the second fare, and the inherent risk of missing a connection at Broombridge.

LXFlyer

BoatMad wrote: »

its irrelevant,

having built cross city, it needs to work effectively , you cant have trams , that cant " get out of the way " stuck behind busses and taxis as they make there way around stephens green

the whole concept of on street trams, is predicated on essentially a traffic free environment, its was why they disappeared in the 50s and 60s. The two modes of transport can not easily intermix and thats the end of that

No point arguing we should " have not started from here at all " , bit late now

I’ve been consistent in my arguments about this all along - I’m not starting now so please don’t accuse me of that.

I’d agree with you with regard to prioritising LUAS to the detriment of all else if there were high capacity rail alternatives available, but there aren’t. There are massive numbers of people for whom the bus is the only option, and penalising them excessively to facilitate a much smaller number of people using the Parnell terminators during the morning peak isn’t in my view the right solution.

Idbatterim

They had a "meet the luas green line manager" on 1st February ...

https://luas.ie/luas-meet-the-manager-feb18/

Winters

LXFlyer wrote: »

Where I suggested using the SSG turnback to focus the resources where they are needed most, it was in relation to some of the Parnell terminators during the peak periods..

Ahem...

LXFlyer

Winters wrote: »

Ahem...

While I was happy to give you credit too, I’ve been suggesting it all along (https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105530304&postcount=3827) both here and with the parties concerned.

But I’m referring to the specifics of my earlier posts on this.

Jamie2k9

Idbatterim wrote: »

They had a "meet the luas green line manager" on 1st February ...

https://luas.ie/luas-meet-the-manager-feb18/

I posted here such a measure would be a good idea and look it happened.

marno21

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I'm shocked there is no P&R at Broombridge. The residents must be fuming with all the cars parked on the streets there.

Other residents would then object to extra traffic on the roads in the area. You can't win.

marno21

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I'm shocked there is no P&R at Broombridge. The residents must be fuming with all the cars parked on the streets there.

Other residents would then object to extra traffic on the roads in the area. You can't win.

MJohnston

marno21 wrote: »

Other residents would then object to extra traffic on the roads in the area. You can't win.

Except it'd be entirely possible to build a Broombridge park and ride which would be only accessed via the Ballyboggan Road, and therefore wouldn't pass through any residential areas.

beauf

It's always been a heavily traffic area as it links a lot of routes.

cgcsb

Don't suppose ABP could, ya know, hurry things on a bit?

Day two, news article about the longer tram not clearing O’Connell bridge.



The cause won’t be a suprise to anyone.

“The tram - which has two extra carriages compared to existing trams - was itself blocked beforehand by a taxi parked in a yellow box.”


https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2018/0208/939243-luas-dublin/

LeinsterDub

cisk wrote: »

“The tram - which has two extra carriages compared to existing trams - was itself blocked beforehand by a taxi parked in a yellow box.”

Perhaps we'll finally seem some enforcement of yellow boxes across the city