VRT conundrum

Ambassador11

Good Afternoon folks, I have a bit of a puzzler here for anyone with experience of all things VRT.

History: I am employed by an Irish company since July 2007, Lived in Dublin until September 2009 (Sept 2009 by tax records but actually left in Oct 2008), moved back to Belfast since Sept 2009/Oct 2008 and I will have to move south again for another period of 12 months or maybe more.

I have my car since Jan 2009. Will I have to pay VRT? If so can I get a change of residence?

My secondment may only last for 9 months depending on the 'recession'???

Any advice?

ardmacha

A lot might depend on your date of moving the North. If this appears to be Sept 2009 by tax records then you wouldn't have been away for a complete year and you might not be considered to have ever achieved normal residence outside the State.

Were you originally living in North or South or elsewhere (before 2007)?

Ambassador11

I lived in Bel Feirste for 32 years (All my life) prior to that.

Ambassador11

How long legally could I drive about before I would be forced to pay VRT? I can still leave all addresses etc as Belfast until then!

ardmacha

I lived in Bel Feirste for 32 years (All my life) prior to that.

Then you have never had normal residence in the South. You worked for a period in Dublin before and are now working for a period in Dublin but your personal ties remained in Belfast throughout.

My secondment may only last for 9 months depending on the 'recession'???

So you keep the NI car for the moment. If the Dublin job turns into something more permanent then you may wish to "move" to the Republic and transfer your residence.

There is no time limit on how long you can do this, if your personal ties remained in Belfast and you visited there regularly then you are a form of long distance commuter. However as time went on it would be better to transfer your residence, especially if you want to buy a house or the like.

If you need to use your car for work it can be hard to sort the insurance.

Ambassador11

Obviously I will have to move down for the job, so what do I do if the local Gard calls to the door asking questions or I get stopped by customs?

I've been stopped before by customs and got the all-clear, however, as I have been employed since July 2007 and paying Tax etc in the South since that date will it not raise eyebrows, even though I am listed as living back in Belfast?

The more I think about it the more I get a headache!!!

Ambassador11

Good man yerself, didn't se the rest of your reply. I appreciate your help on the matter. Ard Macha Abu!!!

ardmacha

Obviously I will have to move down for the job, so what do I do if the local Gard calls to the door asking questions or I get stopped by customs?

Write to the Customs and get the leaflet, keep this in the car and just state that you comply with the rules. If they call to your house it might be wise to visit Belfast the following weekend. Get a toll tag so that you can show you pass up the M1 from time to time and buy things in Belfast with a credit card.
Unfortunately there are so many chancers and outright liars on this matter that those for whom the rules are intended get hassle as well.

Ambassador11

Write to the Customs and get the leaflet, ???

What leaflet is that?

ardmacha

What leaflet is that?

this one
http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/vrt/leaflets/vrt2.html

Ambassador11

In the leaflet in Paragraph 2 it says: 'The 12 months time limit will not apply where a person is on a task of definite duration in the State.'

Does that mean that if I am there for 9 months the time limit is superceded?

Trying to read any Govt. literature is like trying to read Chinese the morning after a session.

oohlala

sorry to hijack! A friend of mine lives in newry but owns a property in dublin which is usually rented but vacant at the moment. He works in drogheda aand has a northern reg car. The car was taken off him by customs last week and he was told he has to pay vrt to get it back? Am i missing something or why does he have to pay vrt when he lives in newry? he showed them his bills and letters to newry and even his uk voting card

Ambassador11

Sounds a tad unfair to me too. Is he from the North or South?

kildare.17hmr

When re registering a car which you have owned for more than 6 months outside the state you do not have to pay the vrt but this is sometimes very hard to prove like in your case since you have been working in the south. They look for bills, pay slips, rent/mortgage reciepts, bank statments ect for the last 6 months and if they are not 100% satisfied you could be asked to pay the VRT. I sell cars for a living and import from the north and abroad so have dealings with revenue for VRT on a weekly basis nearly and iv seen alot of people in similar situations who have ether had to pay the tax or sell the car. i would advise going into the VRT office closest to your job and speak to them as they are best equipped to tell you exactly where you stand. Most helpful office i find is Tallaght

Kev

kildare.17hmr

Also forgot to add if any1 has a forgen registered car insured with an irish insurance company they will be reported to customes and there car could be siezed. Alot of people getting letters from insurance companys stating they have already been reported

Kev

oohlala

originally he is from louth but lived in london for a decade. he doesn't have a current lease to show its rented. seems pretty unfair to me too. how can they just take a car when a person doesn't live in ireland? he brought in bills and his electorate card and they said no pay up the vrt. he had to take a huge paycut in work and can't afford to pay it if he was made to but why should he when he's living in n.ireland? i guess i'm missing something not being a driver but seems crazy

opinion guy

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

Also forgot to add if any1 has a forgen registered car insured with an irish insurance company they will be reported to customes and there car could be siezed. Alot of people getting letters from insurance companys stating they have already been reported

Kev

Is this not a breach of data protection act ?

Ambassador11

No probs with the insurance Kev, I'll be covered by Admiral before I move down. Do they honestly expect you to produce that much info? Diabolical. I'll maybe give the office a call and see what they have to say.

However, why should I have to pay the bloody VRT if I'm only going to be there for 12 months if I'm lucky?

Ambassador11

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

They look for bills, pay slips, rent/mortgage reciepts, bank statments ect for the last 6 months and if they are not 100% satisfied you could be asked to pay the VRT.

Kev

Let's say that I move down for a period of 10 months and then it is decided that I will have to stay for a few years. How at that stage can I show all of the above info as I will have lived there for nearly a year??? Or will they require info further back than the 6 month period?

kildare.17hmr

opinion guy wrote: »

Is this not a breach of data protection act ?

I wouldnt say so because by law if you import a car into the state you must report to your local vrt office within 24 hrs,(not always possable so they tend to give you a few days) thats the law. so the insurance company could maybe find themselves in trouble for not reporting it.. this could be wrong but thats whats going on lately! Ill try get my hands on a letter and put it up

Kev

kildare.17hmr

Ambassador11 wrote: »

No probs with the insurance Kev, I'll be covered by Admiral before I move down. Do they honestly expect you to produce that much info? Diabolical. I'll maybe give the office a call and see what they have to say.

However, why should I have to pay the bloody VRT if I'm only going to be there for 12 months if I'm lucky?

leave it insured up north, you can bring your car here for 12 months if you are working or living as you may decide to go back up north, but in this case if your not sure you are alowed the 12 months. Oh yeah they want all that info because if you cant supply it they get the money!

Ambassador11 wrote: »

Let's say that I move down for a period of 10 months and then it is decided that I will have to stay for a few years. How at that stage can I show all of the above info as I will have lived there for nearly a year??? Or will they require info further back than the 6 month period?

they will look for the 6 months prior to moving down

Ambassador11

Alright, it's making sense to me now. Thanks Lads, If I have any more niggles I'll give ye a holler!

ardmacha

Let's say that I move down for a period of 10 months and then it is decided that I will have to stay for a few years. How at that stage can I show all of the above info as I will have lived there for nearly a year???

Transferring your normal residence is not a casual thing, it is a significant move which is why you are allowed import your car VRT free. Ambassador11, you have normal residence in the North until you take a definite step to change it. No doubt you have bank accounts and the like for years, the only issue of contention is the one where you visit regularly, which you should pay attention to. Other people posting here are the other way around, they started off in the South and are seeking to show that they left. The Revenue are always suspicious in these cases whether someone really moved their normal residence outside the State.

You may want to wait a few months and then decide that you are going to stay in Dublin, because the job is working out. Then it should not be a problem to import the car as a change of residence, especially if you have had the same car since you worked in the North.

Ambassador11

Once again, words of wisdom Ard Mhacha, Appreciate all the sound advice and counsel. Owe you big time!

ArphaRima

I have another similar situation. I have 1 year living in the UK and I have just bought a car. I am shortly moving to the far east permanently and will hopefully keep this car in Ireland for use during my trips home.

1st of all do I need to register it in Ireland and second of all if I do am I VRT-liable?

It is a high value car so will be looked at closely.

Motorcheck

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

Ill try get my hands on a letter and put it up

Kev

Hi Kev, I'd be interested in seeing one of those letters! The only exception to the data protection act that I could think this might qualify under is one normally reserved for the Garda which allows information to be disclosed when it's used for the investigation / prevention of a crime.

Is not paying your VRT a crime?

CaraFawn

Additional advice here:

Keep a copy of your work contract in your car. The fact that you are working here temporally is fine and would not require you to register the car here, but if you want to avoid going back home by foot one evening/morning, you must the relevant documentation with you, they do ask on the side of the road.

They see too many chancers all day long, don't take any chance with them.

opinion guy

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

I wouldnt say so because by law if you import a car into the state you must report to your local vrt office within 24 hrs,(not always possable so they tend to give you a few days) thats the law. so the insurance company could maybe find themselves in trouble for not reporting it.. this could be wrong but thats whats going on lately! Ill try get my hands on a letter and put it up

Kev

Eh doubt its that simple. One law does not just negate another. For another thing insurance companies are not state bodies. They can't just fork over customer data in breach of the data protection act unless there i some regulatory exemptions.

galwaytt

Data Protection or no, they're doing it. I insured my car in March, and my ins co told me on the phone, at the start, that they are obliged by law to notify Revenue of any non-Irish reg cars they have on cover.

kildare.17hmr

Motorcheck wrote: »

Hi Kev, I'd be interested in seeing one of those letters! The only exception to the data protection act that I could think this might qualify under is one normally reserved for the Garda which allows information to be disclosed when it's used for the investigation / prevention of a crime.

Is not paying your VRT a crime?

Hi Motorcheck, Im no legal expert but I would imagine the gards or customs official that stopped you would regard it as breaking the law as they have the power to take the car off you for not paying it. My brother in law got one last week ill try get it off him tonight and put a copy up tomorrow if i can!

galwaytt wrote: »

Data Protection or no, they're doing it. I insured my car in March, and my ins co told me on the phone, at the start, that they are obliged by law to notify Revenue of any non-Irish reg cars they have on cover.

didnt no it was happenin that long ago!! only 2 years ago i had a uk reg car for over a year insured with quinn no problem, no problem from the gards ether always waved through at check points and such!! differant time now i think, they need the money!