Queen Elizabeth II to visit Ireland.

caseyann

Bambi wrote: »

I think we've moved on as a nation and its time to put history behind us, which includes some peoples bizarre obsession with foreign royalty and self loathing.

So thanks but no thanks lizzie, some of us have moved right on and don't need you in our lives anymore.

This confused me a bit You mean you rather she didnt bother and her visit means nothing to Ireland and the government would want to cop on asking her here as if she is something important and has any meaning or standing in Ireland and her royal status may aswell go out to a costume shop and buy her crown cause her visit and her so called place of royalty means about as much as the poop on side of road to the Irish people and we do not recognise royalty .:p

getz

caseyann wrote: »

This confused me a bit You mean you rather she didnt bother and her visit means nothing to Ireland and the government would want to cop on asking her here as if she is something important and has any meaning or standing in Ireland and her royal status may aswell go out to a costume shop and buy her crown cause her visit and her so called place of royalty means about as much as the poop on side of road to the Irish people and we do not recognise royalty .:p

so you speak for the irish people ?

caseyann

getz wrote: »

so you speak for the irish people ?

You didnt comment on the post,why do you love the queen and she is important to you is she?
You see something relevant and important about some old woman who lives in wealth while people suffer everyday and who gained her wealth through slavery and murder for decades not to mention off the back of our country also.As someone important and who is going to make any difference if she did come here.

rovert

It isnt the 70s anymore lads. Time to decommission the Wolf Tones CDs too.

Day to day Ireland and the UK are very close in nearly every way to the degree you cant even pretend that they are not. You can continue your cognitive dissonance and be ridiculed for it or you can try and move on like the rest of us.

Dont see what causing a disruption to her visit will achieve other than that we will show that we primarily define ourselves as "not British" instead of being "Irish."

caseyann wrote: »

we do not recognise royalty .:p

I guess you havent read the thread a lot of Republicans on here have a deep knowledge of her tradition duties and capacities.

monkeypants

As far as I'm concerned, she's as welcome to visit this country as anyone else. If she came round mine, I'd make her some tea, which she'd have to drink out of a plain mug. I'm betting that would be a first.

I've lived in England and I'm never spoken with anyone who would consider themselves a royalist or even a token fan. I have nothing against the English or British as I know that geography is the only reason that they invaded us rather than the Spanish, Dutch, Germans, Italians or French.

caseyann

monkeypants wrote: »

As far as I'm concerned, she's as welcome to visit this country as anyone else. If she came round mine, I'd make her some tea, which she'd have to drink out of a plain mug. I'm betting that would be a first.

I've lived in England and I'm never spoken with anyone who would consider themselves a royalist or even a token fan. I have nothing against the English or British as I know that geography is the only reason that they invaded us rather than the Spanish, Dutch, Germans, Italians or French.

And again as i said let come as a tourist no extras and no treating her royal as she is not royal in the eyes of this country and her and any other royals status is nothing more than a farce.

karma_

The real irony of course is all those who say that anyone who are not in favour of the visit are living in the past and need to come into the present totally ignore the fact that the monarchy is built upon tradition and history.

I have no issues at all with any elected official, from any country from coming to Ireland on a state visit. David Cameron? more than welcome. As for unelected and archaic monarchies from anywhere, then I will not be in favour.

junder

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/northern_ireland_politics/10421223.stm

By Jim Fitzpatrick
BBC NI Politics Show presenter
The Orange Order in Ireland says members should not welcome the Pope to the UK
Danny Morrison has been chatting amiably to Prince Charles at Glastonbury.
Ian Paisley has paid a respectful visit to the resting place of Irish republican heroes at Glasnevin Cemetery in the company of Bertie Ahern.
The Queen is making an official visit to Ireland and the Pope is en route to England.
Why should any of the above surprise us? The year is 2010 after all. Should grievances from previous centuries rule behaviour in this one?
For some, the answer to that question is a defiant "yes", because they argue that those grievances - though stemming from a previous century - have relevance today.
Theological objections
The Orange Order in Ireland has said members should not welcome the Pope to the UK because of theological objections.
"Anyone welcoming Pope Benedict is in danger of appearing to acknowledge his primacy and universal supremacy as vicar of Christ on earth," they argue.
So, it's about the order's belief that the Pope sees himself as God's man on earth with dominion over all before him. They reject his apparent claim to supremacy.
Sinn Fein has said it will oppose the visit of the Queen to the Republic scheduled for next year, the first by a British monarch since partition in 1921.
Commander-in-chief
"Sinn Fein opposes the proposed state visit of the Queen of England, commander-in-chief of the British armed forces," said TD Caoimhghin O Caolain.
"Until there is complete withdrawal of the British military and the British administration from Ireland, and until there is justice and truth for victims of collusion, no official welcome should be accorded to any officer of the British armed forces of any rank," he continued.
So, like the Orange Order, the objection is one about perceived claims of dominion. She's not our boss, say Sinn Fein, and he's not ours say the Order.
Of course, the Northern Ireland-born president of the Republic has no problem greeting the UK's head of state.
Mary McAleese has been to Buckingham Palace on behalf of the nation and greeted the Queen at a number of events marking the sacrifices of tens of thousands of Irishmen who died in the trenches of the First World War as members of the same armed forces.
And the supreme governor of the Church of England, Elizabeth II, has no problem meeting popes, despite the rather bitter nature of the row between her 12th Great Grand Uncle, Henry VIII, and Pope Clement VII in the 16th century.
On Sunday's Politics Show we'll examine the political etiquette of dealing with these issues and Yvette reports on one area of education where cuts are already biting hard.
Jim
PS - Politicians here may live by ancient values, but age isn't always prized. Youthful new DUP MLA Paul Givan, 28, was hoping to take the title of Youngest MLA. Unfortunately for him Daithi McKay, 28, of Sinn Fein retains the title with a few months to spare.

caseyann

rovert wrote: »

It isnt the 70s anymore lads. Time to decommission the Wolf Tones CDs too.

Day to day Ireland and the UK are very close in nearly every way to the degree you cant even pretend that they are not. You can continue your cognitive dissonance and be ridiculed for it or you can try and move on like the rest of us.

Dont see what causing a disruption to her visit will achieve other than that we will show that we primarily define ourselves as "not British" instead of being "Irish."



I guess you havent read the thread a lot of Republicans on here have a deep knowledge of her tradition duties and capacities.

I knew a woman like that Irish she used to weep when she saw her on tv lmao
I know alot about her traditions and duties and capacities also,still to me she is someone who means nothing and sits in them big houses with all that money and wealth and handed everything on a platter while the country is in recession and she does nothing to earn anything just waves.
I wish the English would cop on they are been taken for mugs.Give her one house and sell off all the stuff in the palace one holiday a year and that's the end of it,at least the men in them families and princess Diana actually do something in life.

Judgement Day

A lot of posters here would need to step back a bit and consider what they are saying. How the British people do or don't choose their Head of State is none of our business - the fact remains that the Queen of England is the Head of State of the UK (and Canada, Australia and New Zealand) and until such time as she is not deserves the same treatment given to any other visiting Head of State. Don't worry I won't bother posting on this thread again as the debate (if that's what it is) is farcical.

rovert

monkeypants wrote: »

As far as I'm concerned, she's as welcome to visit this country as anyone else. If she came round mine, I'd make her some tea, which she'd have to drink out of a plain mug. I'm betting that would be a first.

I've lived in England and I'm never spoken with anyone who would consider themselves a royalist or even a token fan. I have nothing against the English or British as I know that geography is the only reason that they invaded us rather than the Spanish, Dutch, Germans, Italians or French.

caseyann wrote: »

And again as i said let come as a tourist no extras and no treating her royal as she is not royal in the eyes of this country and her and any other royals status is nothing more than a farce.

In 2010 I agree some what but a lot of Republicans elevate her status in terms of her influence and status. They are living in a time warp and in a roundabout way give her more respect than a lot of British people..

getz

caseyann wrote: »

And again as i said let come as a tourist no extras and no treating her royal as she is not royal in the eyes of this country and her and any other royals status is nothing more than a farce.

brilliant ,the queen comes to ireland,crowds on the street chanting anti-british slogans, british tourists stop coming to ireland because of a few idiots, tourism in ireland would collapse as 70% of it is from the UK,people in the UK stop buying goods and trade relations suffer,50% of irish trade is with the UK ,all because caseyann wants to live in a different era,i take it the pope will recieve the same greeting,

IrishTonyO

caseyann wrote: »

And again as i said let come as a tourist no extras and no treating her royal as she is not royal in the eyes of this country and her and any other royals status is nothing more than a farce.

She will be treated with the respect any head of state deserves, and probably a bit more, as the trade between the UK and Ireland last year was valued at €26 billion, the same value as trade between the UK and China, and just in case you need it pointed out Ireland has a population of under 5 million and China's is 1.5 billion.

junder

I wonder how those republicans who oppose her vist to the republic of Ireland would feel if the uk refused to allow the RoI head of state to vist the uk. Now doubt they would bitching about that to

Dyr

junder wrote: »

I wonder how those republicans who oppose her vist to the republic of Ireland would feel if the uk refused to allow the RoI head of state to vist the uk. Now doubt they would bitching about that to

What "republicans"? We live in a republic, do you have some fundamental issue with our form of government?

rovert

Bambi wrote: »

What "republicans"? We live in a republic, do you have some fundamental issue with our form of government?

Dont be silly you know what he is referring to

dlofnep

junder wrote: »

I wonder how those republicans who oppose her vist to the republic of Ireland would feel if the uk refused to allow the RoI head of state to vist the uk. Now doubt they would bitching about that to

Has our head of state honoured one of our generals for murdering 14 British civilians? Hardly comparable.

getz

i dont think a lot of the posts are about the queens visit,there more about posting their ant-brit sickness.

dlofnep

getz wrote: »

i dont think a lot of the posts are about the queens visit,there more about posting their ant-brit sickness.

Which posts are these?

caseyann

getz wrote: »

brilliant ,the queen comes to ireland,crowds on the street chanting anti-british slogans, british tourists stop coming to ireland because of a few idiots, tourism in ireland would collapse as 70% of it is from the UK,people in the UK stop buying goods and trade relations suffer,50% of irish trade is with the UK ,all because caseyann wants to live in a different era,i take it the pope will recieve the same greeting,

Over reaction just a tad with your comment.

.DarDarBinks

Shes more then welcome to visit when 26+6=1

IrishTonyO

.DarDarBinks wrote: »

Shes more then welcome to visit when 26+6=1

Wow! we have to change our mathematical system first?

sensibleken

.DarDarBinks wrote: »

Shes more then welcome to visit when 26+6=1

Two questions.

1. Why do you actually want the 6 counties?
2. Why stop there?

OhNoYouDidn't

Judgement Day wrote: »

A lot of posters here would need to step back a bit and consider what they are saying. How the British people do or don't choose their Head of State is none of our business - the fact remains that the Queen of England is the Head of State of the UK (and Canada, Australia and New Zealand) and until such time as she is not deserves the same treatment given to any other visiting Head of State. Don't worry I won't bother posting on this thread again as the debate (if that's what it is) is farcical.

But thats the whole point, innit. She isn't 'just another head of state'. She is the head of state of a country that is occupying part of ours, is the CoC of an army that recently were exposed as committing an unprovoked massacre and are blocking an investigation into others.

OhNoYouDidn't

getz wrote: »

i dont think a lot of the posts are about the queens visit,there more about posting their ant-brit sickness.

Grow up. if you have nothing to contribute etc.

OhNoYouDidn't

junder wrote: »

I wonder how those republicans who oppose her vist to the republic of Ireland would feel if the uk refused to allow the RoI head of state to vist the uk. Now doubt they would bitching about that to

If they had good reason, if we occupied part of Britain, if she awarded honours to an Irish soldier who massacred British citizens, if Irish military personell bombed British cities and then covered it up, yes, I would expect the Irish President to get a tough time.

And rightfully so.

sensibleken

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But thats the whole point, innit. She isn't 'just another head of state'. She is the head of state of a country that is occupying part of ours, is the CoC of an army that recently were exposed as committing an unprovoked massacre and are blocking an investigation into others.

Its not ours.

Elmo

ultain wrote: »

hinault wrote: »

I'm indifferent to her visit.
That's one of the major problems with this country.... "indifference"

I agree with hinault I am also indifferent.

I think the best way to show our maturity is to show that this visit is no different to any visit by any other monarch to a republic or any other visiting delegate representing their country.

What annoys me about Irish media is their obsession with the British. We continually look at Britain when describing what is going on, rather than other countries. Our papers were filled with details of the British Election but nothing about the polish or Netherlander's elections, why? is it because we are still so immature that we have to ask Mammy for help?

This visit is nothing, it is a visit by a British Monarch which should be treated in the same way as a visit by any other European Monarch, with out a hullaballu.

OhNoYouDidn't

sensibleken wrote: »

Its not ours.

I think you will find that is disputed....

livingtargets

Good god.

Why do people here assume other people have "anti-brit sickness" because they oppose the visit of an unelected toff with no mandate from the people of Britain?

And then they say those who oppose are living in the past?Because they DON'T like the idea of a monarchy in the 21st century?Whaaaaa?

I have a problem with the queen coming here.Not just because of history;but because of the present:There are British soldiers dying in Iraq and Afghanistan with her blessing,children in Iraq and Afghanistan being killed with her blessing,and plenty of people in Britain living in substandard council flats with never enough to eat while the queen and her inbred family live in palaces and castles.

Palaces and castles.In the 21st century.**** sake.

And no,I'm not a "Shinner",I just want to live in a world where everyone is free to decide their own determination,without an unelected blast from the middle-ages leering over them.
The queen's not better than me simply because of her family.The queen has no right to stand as a head of state(since the 50s,without a single election!)without the mandate of her subjects(ugh).

Denerick

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I think you will find that is disputed....

If you really really cared about the North you'd welcome the Queen to Ireland. A majority of people there are Unionists and consider the Queen to be their head of state. A slimmer minority consider her to be just another woman, and by and large pledge allegiance to Ireland. How on earth can Northern Ireland ever merge with the south if people will not even show the most basic level of respect for the loyal tribe up north? Ireland will never be unified as long as self righteous Republicans force an historical narrative down their throat. The same thing goes for the love Ulster march, when natives of this island were prevented from marching down the capital city of this island by a bunch of inner city thugs.

IrishTonyO

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I think you will find that is disputed....

Not by the majority who voted in the referendum regarding articles 2 and 3, and as we live in a democracy, the will of the majority is what goes.

junder

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

If they had good reason, if we occupied part of Britain, if she awarded honours to an Irish soldier who massacred British citizens, if Irish military personell bombed British cities and then covered it up, yes, I would expect the Irish President to get a tough time.

And rightfully so.

Past irish governments helped and supported the IRA would that be reason enough, or maybe we should move on and see this as nothing more then one head of state visiting s neighbouring nation state after your head if state gad no problem meeting our head of state before even visiting buck palace itself

Denerick

livingtargets wrote: »

Good god.

Why do people here assume other people have "anti-brit sickness" because they oppose the visit of an unelected toff with no mandate from the people of Britain?

And then they say those who oppose are living in the past?Because they DON'T like the idea of a monarchy in the 21st century?Whaaaaa?

I have a problem with the queen coming here.Not just because of history;but because of the present:There are British soldiers dying in Iraq and Afghanistan with her blessing,children in Iraq and Afghanistan being killed with her blessing,and plenty of people in Britain living in substandard council flats with never enough to eat while the queen and her inbred family live in palaces and castles.

Palaces and castles.In the 21st century.**** sake.

And no,I'm not a "Shinner",I just want to live in a world where everyone is free to decide their own determination,without an unelected blast from the middle-ages leering over them.
The queen's not better than me simply because of her family.The queen has no right to stand as a head of state(since the 50s,without a single election!)without the mandate of her subjects(ugh).

The Queen is a ceremonial role. Get off your high horse. If we really followed your insane dogmatic approach to foreign relations Ireland would be an obscure, disadvantaged, politically 'pure' backwater. Oh wait...

dlofnep

Denerick wrote: »

The Queen is a ceremonial role.

So she would have no problem in ceremoniously removing the title of OBE from Derek Wilford, once would imagine.

Denerick

dlofnep wrote: »

So she would have no problem in ceremoniously removing the title of OBE from Derek Wilford, once would imagine.

Well I hope she does. Considering the Saville enquiry incriminated its own troops and State, it does make the Republican absurdium that all Brits are evil Catholic eating monsters look rather silly.

FTA69

junder wrote: »

Past irish governments helped and supported the IRA

In a Unionist fantasy land perhaps.

dlofnep

Denerick wrote: »

Well I hope she does. Considering the Saville enquiry incriminated its own troops and State, it does make the Republican absurdium that all Brits are evil Catholic eating monsters look rather silly.

I don't even remember hearing such a claim.

I think that it's perfectly valid to delay any visit by the Queen, until she removes honours from her soldiers for any murder of Irish civilians. I don't feel that there is anything wrong with asking for her to do so. It doesn't make one a Brit-hater. I believe that respect must be mutual between the two states in order for this process to work. To step foot on Irish soil, while honouring her soldiers for murdering Irish civilians does not demonstrate mutual respect. Is that not a fair point to make, without being accused of being a 'brit-hater'?

getz

livingtargets wrote: »

Good god.

Why do people here assume other people have "anti-brit sickness" because they oppose the visit of an unelected toff with no mandate from the people of Britain?

And then they say those who oppose are living in the past?Because they DON'T like the idea of a monarchy in the 21st century?Whaaaaa?

I have a problem with the queen coming here.Not just because of history;but because of the present:There are British soldiers dying in Iraq and Afghanistan with her blessing,children in Iraq and Afghanistan being killed with her blessing,and plenty of people in Britain living in substandard council flats with never enough to eat while the queen and her inbred family live in palaces and castles.

Palaces and castles.In the 21st century.**** sake.

And no,I'm not a "Shinner",I just want to live in a world where everyone is free to decide their own determination,without an unelected blast from the middle-ages leering over them.
The queen's not better than me simply because of her family.The queen has no right to stand as a head of state(since the 50s,without a single election!)without the mandate of her subjects(ugh).

your not ant-brit, but you say the queen and her family are inbred ?

dlofnep

getz wrote: »

your not ant-brit, but you say the queen and her family are inbred ?

Maybe he is anti-monarch? I'm not sure how you derive a personal (and possibly childish) attack on the Royal family, as an attack on the British people as a whole.

junder

FTA69 wrote: »

In a Unionist fantasy land perhaps.

So the Charles haughey gun running was pure fantasy then?

getz

dlofnep wrote: »

Maybe he is anti-monarch? I'm not sure how you derive a personal (and possibly childish) attack on the Royal family, as an attack on the British people as a whole.

most british and commonwealth citizens ,may well say its a attack on the british ,also on one hand you cannot say the queen and her honours list meen nothing we do not recognize her,then on the other hand say she should take back her awards,i can assure you if the queen comes to ireland,all the celebs,and politicians will be stabbing each other in the back to get to meet her,i myself being english off irish stock would find that a little over the top.

livingtargets

getz wrote: »

your not ant-brit, but you say the queen and her family are inbred ?

Yes.

Her family and social group are socially inbred in that they live in an isolated ruling class fantasy where unelected monarchies are acceptable.Is that clear?

And if I was "anti-Brit",why would I have mentioned the "British lads dying in Iraq/Afghanistan with her blessing" and the british people living in "substandard council flats with never enough to eat..."?

I have absolutely no problem with Brits,I have problem with snobs who believe they have a birthright to rule a people with out their mandate.

sensibleken

livingtargets wrote: »

Yes.


I have absolutely no problem with Brits,I have problem with snobs who believe they have a birthright to rule a people with out their mandate.

I also have a problem with monarchy. I think it is the dumbest institution I have ever heard of and am glad we don't have one.

However its none of my buisness that the UK has one.If she's coming over as a representative of our nearest neighbour then id welcome her. Yes our countries have had their troubles but we're getting past that. To snub her and them would set us back not bring us forward.

OhNoYouDidn't

IrishTonyO wrote: »

Not by the majority who voted in the referendum regarding articles 2 and 3, and as we live in a democracy, the will of the majority is what goes.

I voted for the GFA specifically as it had mechanisms to bring about a United Ireland through consent.

Don't assume that your reasons for voting yes was the same as the rest of ours. SF signed it, are you saying that they don't want a UI?

OhNoYouDidn't

Denerick wrote: »

If you really really cared about the North you'd welcome the Queen to Ireland. A majority of people there are Unionists and consider the Queen to be their head of state. A slimmer minority consider her to be just another woman, and by and large pledge allegiance to Ireland. How on earth can Northern Ireland ever merge with the south if people will not even show the most basic level of respect for the loyal tribe up north? Ireland will never be unified as long as self righteous Republicans force an historical narrative down their throat. The same thing goes for the love Ulster march, when natives of this island were prevented from marching down the capital city of this island by a bunch of inner city thugs.[/QUOTE]

Please. They were a shower of bigots and cranks with links to terrorism who are banned from marching in the 6 counties. It was an idiotic idea to allow them to march in Dublin full stop and wasn't an attack on the 'loyal tribe'. If it was an Orange march there wouldn't have been half the fuss.

But I do take your broad point that Mrs Windsor getting hit with an egg or whathave you will not go down well with the loyalist community.

getz

livingtargets wrote: »

Yes.

Her family and social group are socially inbred in that they live in an isolated ruling class fantasy where unelected monarchies are acceptable.Is that clear?

And if I was "anti-Brit",why would I have mentioned the "British lads dying in Iraq/Afghanistan with her blessing" and the british people living in "substandard council flats with never enough to eat..."?

I have absolutely no problem with Brits,I have problem with snobs who believe they have a birthright to rule a people with out their mandate.

if the people of the UK did not want a royal family they would have removed it, they did it once before,or they would have voted for the republican party[yes there is one] so she has a mandate,the queen did not send people to afg/iraq,but in the case of afghanistan the irish goverment voted in the UN for them to go.

IrishTonyO

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I voted for the GFA specifically as it had mechanisms to bring about a United Ireland through consent.

Don't assume that your reasons for voting yes was the same as the rest of ours. SF signed it, are you saying that they don't want a UI?

It makes no difference what your reasons for voting were, if you voted yes like the majority, you voted to get rid of our claim to the North.

OhNoYouDidn't

IrishTonyO wrote: »

It makes no difference what your reasons for voting were, if you voted yes like the majority, you voted to get rid of our claim to the North.

No, I voted to AMEND our claim to the 6 counties.

You are oozing arrogance here and I'm not quite sure why

Dublin_Gunner

Personally, I couldn't give a flying shyte that she visits here. Just like any other head of state that visits.

Whats annoying me is the fact that apparently, our government (i.e our tax money) is funding her trip.

If that really is the case, she may go and politely fcuk off. I'm sure she could afford a Ryanair flight and a taxi. Possibly even a B&B if she wanted :rolleyes: