social welfare officer calling out to home

The Big Red Button

mercer wrote: »

i did say to her that it was unfair for me to submit his things... but she said if the rent were 50/50 this wouldn't happen.

That sounds completely bizarre, there are many reasons why rent mightn't be split 50:50! Is there a reason you could use to explain to her why you pay less, e.g. do you have a smaller room, or does your housemate have use of a parking space, etc? I really don't see how his income is anything to do with you when you're not in a relationship, maybe call into the SW office and try to get talking to someone else in there?

edellc

i agree with caterpillar go to SW office and ask to speak to someone about it i know you dont want your payment held up and thats understandable but if you are due full JSA and only get part of it due to your flatmates means due to officer being a nosey so and so then its not fair
i would be seeking a second option regarding this matter

mercer

mercer wrote: »

i did say to her that it was unfair for me to submit his things... but she said if the rent were 50/50 this wouldn't happen. took all my strength not to tell her where to go.

I lived in a house share where I paid €325 a month... was sharing with an Irish couple and a South African guy. After determining that it was a 3 bedroom house (without looking around, but in the sitting room) and on my word that I was not in a relationship with the South African guy, the amount of rent I paid, or they paid, was never brought into question. In fact I didn't even know the full rent on the house until a year later. I just paid the share I had agreed on when I moved in.

What they are trying to do to you is not ethical - you are not cohabiting as a couple. I have had a few different people call to my various houses over the years to do the means test - some of them are very understanding. Some are very much not. One woman wrote down as income the €10 my grandad gave me every Tuesday as a gift when I visited and cooked dinner for him. She kept saying "No offense, but no one lives on €50 a week". I've lived on a third of that, actually. Has she never heard of pasta? Baked beans?

I would suggest you contact your SW office and ask to see somebody senior in regards to this. As you are not a couple the SW have no right to his private information such as payslips or bank statements. I think it is a breach of his privacy rights too.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

I have lived in many houses where the tenants all paid different rent depending on the room they rented. That's crazy logic they are using. Is what the inspector says the final word? How do they come to these conclusions? Do they have guidelines or do they just do what they feel like? It's quite irritating to find some uneducated, biased ignorant bigots playing judge and jury and making rediculous decisions that will directly effect you in quite a bad way. It's unbelieveable, I mean how is the OP supposed to live on 60 quid a week? That's impossible. In cases where the tenants are depending on each other, if one is given little money and decides to move out, it also effects other people in the house. It's a complete joke, and with this kind of mentality, I have a perfect understanding of why the crime rate would go up, and why people would turn to crime in order to provide for themselves when the state fails them.

Balagan

Operational Guidelines for SW on cohabitation


http://www.welfare.ie/EN/OperationalGuidelines/pages/cohabit.aspx

poppyseed321

To add to other people's experiences; I had a social worker call this morning.

She was very pleasant, but very business-like, which is fair enough.

She sat in the living room, asked questions about the property, about rent, about the other people living in the house, about income and a few other questions about the forms I'd filled in (work history, education, etc.).

She did not look around the house at all. She stayed for less than 10 mins!

I found this thread because I didn't know what to expect, so for anyone doing the same, don't be worried. Just be honest and friendly!!

bridest

When are Irish people going to start standing up for themselves? When are we going to educate ourselves? Tell uneducated civil servants that we know our rights?

Stark

bridest wrote: »

When are Irish people going to start standing up for themselves? When are we going to educate ourselves? Tell uneducated civil servants that we know our rights?

Same time as they get a job.

cee_jay

bridest wrote: »

When are Irish people going to start standing up for themselves? When are we going to educate ourselves? Tell uneducated civil servants that we know our rights?

Banned for a week - please read the forum charter.

TristanPeter

The other morning two community welfare officers called to my house. I generally don't answer the door to people unless I know in advance if they will be calling but because it was 9:15am and they rang it twice I thought I better open it just in case there was something wrong. Also, they parked down the road so that I couldn't see their car (even though there was lots of spaces right in front of my house). When I opened the door they told me they were CWOs and could they come in. I still wasn't dressed properly as I was about to jump in the shower. I told them this and they immediately said "So, you are not letting us in" and proceeded to raise their clipboard to write something. I told them that's not what I said but could I have a minute to get changed; which I did. Anyway they made me bring them through the whole house and requested me to open every single door. They didn't look in drawers or wardrobes but I do feel that my privacy was somewhat violated.

I'm sure the Social Welfare Officers will want to do the same thing but what I'd like to know is are they allowed legally to do an even more in-depth search? I don't really mind them checking the rooms but can they go through my stuff or am I within my rights to tell them no, you can't go through my personal things?

Chaotic_Forces

Two things: the inspector is to ring you (or you are to be told in advance what day he will call out). Secondly, no. They can't say "open your press up". It's moreso for things like a large screen plasma or if you have an xbox and a PS3 or something out. They're just really there to see if you're sort of well off, so to speak.

TBH, the bloke that did mine, rang me at like 9:15am, my alarm didn't wake me and I was very apologetic, he said don't worry about it and I was told he didn't need to have a look around.

If they didn't ring or you didn't get a letter/told when they'd be there, then you might want to lodge a complaint since I am 100% sure (if it's just for when you get the dole and they do a means test) they have to let you know in advance.

TristanPeter

Thanks for the info. Chaotic Forces. It does bother me though that the Community Welfare Officers didn't give me any warning and I'm sure they have similar operational procedures as the Social Welfare officers. I was told earlier today by my local Citizen's Information Centre that the two bodies are going to be amalgamated soon. About time too because two groups doing the same job is such a waste. If there was proper communication between them it should suffice for the community welfare officers to contact the social welfare officers and tell them that they already did a house call.

Funnily enough, the Citizen's Advice were unable to tell me if the welfare officers were entitled to go through one's personal stuff or not.

ricman

The main reason they call is to verify that you are living at that adress, therefore there s no point in them saying ,ill be there at ten am on monday.I,VE never heard of any welfare officer going thru anyones stuff, but they can take note of things they see ,if the building is below standard ,no ventilation, lack of storage space ,they could tell you to find a new flat, or arrange an inspection by the corporation.
There has to be some procedure,against fraud,eg people claiming false adress ,s and the welfare officer is only there a few minutes, maybe 5minutes.ITS not a big deal.She may ask basic questions,eg how many people live there ,in the building, have you acess to a bath or shower .
The welfare officer is there to help you, he, or she is not your enemy.
i dont think they have to let you know the exact time they call out,in advance, they might see 6 people in one day.

Chaotic_Forces

ricman wrote: »

The main reason they call is to verify that you are living at that adress, therefore there s no point in them saying ,ill be there at ten am on monday.I,VE never heard of any welfare officer going thru anyones stuff, but they can take note of things they see ,if the building is below standard ,no ventilation, lack of storage space ,they could tell you to find a new flat, or arrange an inspection by the corporation.
There has to be some procedure,against fraud,eg people claiming false adress ,s and the welfare officer is only there a few minutes, maybe 5minutes.ITS not a big deal.She may ask basic questions,eg how many people live there ,in the building, have you acess to a bath or shower .
The welfare officer is there to help you, he, or she is not your enemy.
i dont think they have to let you know the exact time they call out,in advance, they might see 6 people in one day.

If it's the actual inspection I'm positive they have to. I made sure I'd get a call so I knew to be there since I wouldn't be there from 9-5 mon-fri.

AnnyHallsal

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

If it's the actual inspection I'm positive they have to. I made sure I'd get a call so I knew to be there since I wouldn't be there from 9-5 mon-fri.

I wasn't given a time and no-one rang. They just showed up a few days after I'd been at the office and rang the doorbell.

Chaotic_Forces

AnnyHallsal wrote: »

I wasn't given a time and no-one rang. They just showed up a few days after I'd been at the office and rang the doorbell.

If they demanded to come in and whatnot, I'm sure they have to give you a time. I'd ring up about it.

Balagan

Social Welfare Inspectors do not have to give advance notice of visits and usually don't.

http://www.welfare.ie/EN/OperationalGuidelines/Pages/swi_powers.aspx

Chaotic_Forces

Balagan wrote: »

Social Welfare Inspectors do not have to give advance notice of visits and usually don't.

http://www.welfare.ie/EN/OperationalGuidelines/Pages/swi_powers.aspx

You don't think it's courtesy to let you know in advance to be at home on a certain day?
Also, (maybe I'm honestly blind) but it didn't say they don't have to give you notice.

Squirm

I would think that most people would welcome more stringent policing of the welfare system. I would have no issue with receiving an unannounced inspection of any kind, if it ultimately means that there is less system fraud. It is hugely frustrating the number of people making fraudulant claims, claiming not to be cohabiting when they are, paying rent allowance to their partners etc, when there are so many other people being honest and open in the appeals and being left waiting months with no income and/or being rejected because they are all but a few euro over the income limits.
If the system was policed better and only genuine claims were financed, it would be a more efficient system with more money available to those in need. If this means weeding out the fraudsters with surprise home inspections, then I'm all for it. I made a very honest and genuine claim and, subsequently, receive nothing. If I had lied about cohabiting, I would be in receipt of something more substantial than monthly child benefit. I understand the necessity of the cut off points and I understand that that is "just my hard luck", but it doesn't stop it being irritating to know that my family needs to struggle because we were honest, while others are profiting from their lies.
Just my two cents... and a little off topic I know!!

Balagan

The operational guidelines state that in certain aspects of their work related to employer's records etc., they do not have to give advance notice. It also doesn't state that they have to give advance notice to individual claimants.

What I, as an individual, think of the practice really doesn't count on this forum, which is, if I understand it correctly, for sharing what we know of the Social Welfare system as it operates now. We may well have issues with it and those issues can be raised elsewhere on boards.ie and you may find that many people share your objections and frustrations with the way the social welfare system operates.

But, for now, the practice is that, usually, SW inspectors arrive unannounced following applications for social assistance payments. That is the norm and unless there is a directive that can be shared that such a practice is now changing, it is best that people asking for info know what to expect. Phoning the SW office to ask for advance notice of the inspector's visit may well ring alarm bells about someone's particular application.

Chaotic_Forces

Balagan wrote: »

The operational guidelines state that in certain aspects of their work related to employer's records etc., they do not have to give advance notice. It also doesn't state that they have to give advance notice to individual claimants.

What I, as an individual, think of the practice really doesn't count on this forum, which is, if I understand it correctly, for sharing what we know of the Social Welfare system as it operates now. We may well have issues with it and those issues can be raised elsewhere on boards.ie and you may find that many people share your objections and frustrations with the way the social welfare system operates.

But, for now, the practice is that, usually, SW inspectors arrive unannounced following applications for social assistance payments. That is the norm and unless there is a directive that can be shared that such a practice is now changing, it is best that people asking for info know what to expect. Phoning the SW office to ask for advance notice of the inspector's visit may well ring alarm bells about someone's particular application.

Meh, each to their own I guess. I made it clear I was out looking for jobs when I applied and I would need to be told at least an hour or two ahead of time.

yabadabado

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Meh, each to their own I guess. I made it clear I was out looking for jobs when I applied and I would need to be told at least an hour or two ahead of time.

the inspector still didn't have to notify you in advance.depending on the scheme they wont want to notify you in advance but the majority of cases ,the applicant will get a letter/phone call in advance.btw if you were applying for JB/JA you are supposed to be seeking work anyway.