TDF: Stage 3 thread - spoil away! :)

IM0

here it is the thread you have all been looking for
some serious shennagins going on today. Should the GC have been blown open..discuss

Cancellara did right for him [and the team] worked out perfectly for tham all..except himself loosing the yellow jer of course

take one for the team!

jamsieboy86

The protest was very strange indeed, why didn't they just race, crashes happen.

IM0

Yeah that was pretty strange, what were they protesting about!
and cancellara of all people..He's a classics rider ffs! :rolleyes:

Junior

Not sure why they didn't drive on after the schlecks got back on ..

IM0

Junior wrote: »

Not sure why they didn't drive on after the schlecks got back on ..

they would have gone straight out the back :pac:

chavennel was only 1 min dowm, how long was left when the schlecks got back on? - not enough time to recover for a few km, get a chase together and catch him inside of 1 min I would think.

ednwireland

should be no green jersey points at least imo

actually chvanel was the only one who got points - fair enough

Cancellara later spoke with Tour official Jean-Francois Pescheux and agreed not contest the sprint due to the dangerous racing conditions. Finish-line points were only awarded to Chavanel, who took the green jersey along with the yellow.
“It was the right thing to do to wait, so everybody comes together to the finish line together,” Cancellara later explained. “When you have everybody on the ground and people five minutes behind because they can’t find their bike then it’s only normal. I think fairness comes before being selfish. That was the reason why I spoke with Pescheux.”

The agreement cost Cancellara the yellow jersey as Chavanel hung on to win the stage.

Pescheux said officials agreed that if the bunch was neutralizing the sprint finish that there should not be points awarded at the finish.

“Cancellara came to see me to tell me there had been enough injuries in the peloton today,” Pescheux said on French TV. “(He said) there were (potential) leaders stuck behind and that no one wanted to sprint for second place. It was a tacit agreement.”

http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/rider-protest-splits-tour-de-france-peloton-as-green-jersey-fight-heats-up_125965

what they gonna do aon the cobbles tomorrow

NickDrake

Great idea for the thread. The other one was just crazy. you couldnt write a thing on it without it been covered over with the spolier alert thing. Like come on just don't go on to the thread if you don't want to know what happened.

Some people being a bit too nerdy on here.

Pherekydes

Pfffft!

I was hoping for the result to tomorrow's stage. I was just about ready to bet my last euro down at Paddy Power's.

Misleading thread title. :mad:

franglan

Would love to know what was going through Cancellara's head when he heard the Schleck's were in trouble. Hushovd was a bit cheeky pushing on at the end too. Tomorrow will be eventful, thats for sure.

papac

Hushovd was a bit cheeky pushing on at the end too.

In fairness though-Hushovd was probably the big loser today. The stage was made for him to score points and Cav was spat out the back cause of the lumpiness.

I think they should have got it all back together and raced on.If it rains on the cobbles tomorrow will they neutralize again?? Bit sissy if you ask me.

jwshooter

i have to agree with sean kelly , they should have raced . LA and AC might regret not racing .

if the shoe was on the other foot would saxobank team sat up for the two

franglan

I agree wit you papac but If he wanted the points he should of said flip this, and sprinted not just gone along the route of "Oh I didn't even noticed I pushed on 20 metres before the line there, sorry about that". Surprised nobody sprinted or formed a break-away earlier when the peleton was pretty much back together. As Chris Boardman said you would of being fairly pissed if you were at the stage finish. Roll on tomorrow.

abcdggs

Havent heard anything about todays stage, any chance of a quick synopsis?

uberwolf

abcdggs wrote: »

Havent heard anything about todays stage, any chance of a quick synopsis?

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/05072010/58/tour-de-france-chavanel-claims-yellow-riders-protest.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/8789953.stm

text commentary - http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/8788532.stm

Junior

me@ucd wrote: »

they would have gone straight out the back :pac:

chavennel was only 1 min dowm, how long was left when the schlecks got back on? - not enough time to recover for a few km, get a chase together and catch him inside of 1 min I would think.

There was at least 20km left when they regroupped, so I'd say there was deffo time to catch him if they got organised.

ROK ON

jwshooter wrote: »

i have to agree with sean kelly , they should have raced . LA and AC might regret not racing .

if the shoe was on the other foot would saxobank team sat up for the two

Agree. They should have raced once everyone was back on.
I can't see what was to be gained by not sprinting for 2nd 3rd etc. These are hardly minorplacings.

While it was sporting to sit up and wait for the group to come together, they didn't wait for all of the group, only some.
Farrar and CVV were not given the courtesy of being allowed to get back on.

Hushovd can't complain however. The race director didn't want this. So if Hushobd sprinted who knows what would have been the outcome.
He should have damned FC and sprinted.

BTW there has been an allegation of oil on the road by riders, has this in fact been confirmed by the authorities, or is it conjecture.

Ligget accused the riders of panicking when they saw the initial crash and this lead to further pileups.

If as was suggested that 'no one' could stay upright, then howcome Chavenal and Monfort made it thru unscathed.
Cancellera didn't fall. Lots of guys crashed, lots didn't.

A poster on twitter posted sarcasticall last night, 'will the GC riders sit up in the Pyrenees to allow the sprinters to get back on'.

IMO. Crash - Panic - more crashes - sporting gesture - complete overreaction.

Junior

ROK ON wrote: »

Agree. They should have raced once everyone was back on.
I can't see what was to be gained by not sprinting for 2nd 3rd etc. These are hardly minorplacings.

While it was sporting to sit up and wait for the group to come together, they didn't wait for all of the group, only some.
Farrar and CVV were not given the courtesy of being allowed to get back on.

Hushovd can't complain however. The race director didn't want this. So if Hushobd sprinted who knows what would have been the outcome.
He should have damned FC and sprinted.

BTW there has been an allegation of oil on the road by riders, has this in fact been confirmed by the authorities, or is it conjecture.

Ligget accused the riders of panicking when they saw the initial crash and this lead to further pileups.

If as was suggested that 'no one' could stay upright, then howcome Chavenal and Monfort made it thru unscathed.
Cancellera didn't fall. Lots of guys crashed, lots didn't.

A poster on twitter posted sarcasticall last night, 'will the GC riders sit up in the Pyrenees to allow the sprinters to get back on'.

IMO. Crash - Panic - more crashes - sporting gesture - complete overreaction.

I believe listening to the ITV Podcast that it was confirmed there was oil on the road, it brought down one of the TV Motorbikes as well.

Funkyzeit

Interesting to see Nick Roche's take on it.

I agree on the principle of making some kind of gesture about the dangerous route for the opening stages, but the way it was done today wasn't right. If we have to wait every time a couple of team leaders crash and have a protest, then we'd never race.

Some guys think they're the big boss, they open their mouth and you obey them. Nobody waited for me the other day when I crashed, so what's the big deal about waiting for the Schleck brothers and the other leaders?

Okay, I want to beat these guys and if we hadn't waited today, I could have taken some time on some guys who will probably finish higher than me on GC. That's not the ideal way to do it, but crashes happen every day in cycling. It's part of the race. The next time I crash, they're not going to wait for me.

I don't know why Cancellara and the others wouldn't let anyone sprint at the finish. My team-mate Maxime Bouet told them, "okay you can protest but I'm going to get second," and he edged ahead on the line.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/cycling-lsquoit-was-as-if-someone-had-thrown-a-grenade-into-the-pelotonrsquo-2247232.html

For what it's worth I agree with him - I think it made a sham of the finish. Whatever about waiting up for Schleck group, not contesting the sprint was a load of boll*cks - Imagine being in the (huge) crowd and waiting for some fireworks only to see that?

abcdggs

uberwolf wrote: »

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/05072010/58/tour-de-france-chavanel-claims-yellow-riders-protest.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/8789953.stm

text commentary - http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/8788532.stm

thanks for those links.

SCANDALOUS! :eek:

ednwireland

ROK ON wrote: »

Agree. They should have raced once everyone was back on.

BTW there has been an allegation of oil on the road by riders, has this in fact been confirmed by the authorities, or is it conjecture.

totally agree, ROK ON
as to oil more like forested, lightly used road, shower of rain, riders tanking at full speed downhill (and the guy that fell off and left his bike in the middle of the road while the peleton was bearing down on it - or didnt i see that)

ANYWAY LET THE FUN BEGIN STAGE 3
no roadside bike changes allowed
from cycling news
Cobbles in store for Tour peloton

After a nod to Liège-Bastogne-Liège yesterday, Tour organisers ASO pay homage to another race in their portfolio by taking the field over several of the cobbled sections from Paris-Roubaix.

There are 13.2km of pavé hell for the riders to deal with in seven separate sections. The last four are in France and particularly nasty, the final one just 10km from the finish.

It’s been six years since the Tour last encountered the cobbles. Back in 2004 the hopes of principal Spanish contender Iban Mayo were blown away in the dust. The sylph-like Alberto Contador will be hoping he doesn’t suffer the same fate. The finish is at the entrance to Roubaix’s infamous Arenberg Forest

Chips Lovell

I really hate these patron type stunts where half the peloton is bullied into some gesture. If a bunch of nobodies crashed, they would have been sprinting yesterday.

titan18

It seems there was oil on the road caused by Gavazzi crashing in the breakaway, and a TV motorcycle crashing trying to avoid him.So Chavanal managed to avoid it but by the time the group came through,there was chaos.

http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/the-stockeau-massacre-damage-assessment-after-the-tour-de-frances-second-stage_125976


It's been reported on a few other sites too like eurosport etc.

mcgratheoin

titan18 wrote: »

It seems there was oil on the road caused by Gavazzi crashing in the breakaway, and a TV motorcycle crashing trying to avoid him.So Chavanal managed to avoid it but by the time the group came through,there was chaos.

It's been reported on a few other sites too like eurosport etc.

Eh wtf is race radio for so? peloton slows down for the 1km or so that there's oil on the road and then speeds up again.
Bullying tactics by Cancellara and Saxo Bank imo, wasn't about a protest at all, just letting the Shlecks back on the end of the peloton.
Anybody still feeling it today can say bye bye to their GC chances over the cobbles

bbosco

It seems to have been Cancellara's big idea to have the go-slow and most of the others seem to have been against it. So, I'm not sure why they didn't simply tell Cancellara to shag off. Crashes, punctures, mechanicals, getting stuck at level-crossings - all of these have decided big races over the years. It's part of road-racing. The people who stood for hours in the lashing rain in Spa deserved more. I can't see why they didn't race the final km's once the precious Schlecks were back in the peleton.
Anyway, I'm delighted for Chavanel. I've lost track of the amount of times I've seen him working his ass off in ultimately doomed breakaways.

ednwireland

titan18 wrote: »

It seems there was oil on the road caused by Gavazzi crashing in the breakaway, and a TV motorcycle crashing trying to avoid him.So Chavanal managed to avoid it but by the time the group came through,there was chaos.

http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/the-stockeau-massacre-damage-assessment-after-the-tour-de-frances-second-stage_125976


It's been reported on a few other sites too like eurosport etc.

so freak motorbike accident causing oil spill - riders nuetralise race due to dangerous route - dont see much logic there
as roche said "they wouldnt wait for me if i crashed"
brilliant move by cancellara saved the schlecks race (and if anyone thinks he was doing it for any other reason- well)
if the hammer would have gone down after the regroup they would have prob got droppped
didnt wait for farrar or vande velde (he's out btw broken ribs - shame)

nitrogen

Follow Team HTC - Columbia on Google Maps

TinyExplosions

I think that Spartacus was very sporting in slowing down to let the peloton get back together, albeit with the ulterior motive of getting the Schlecks back on -speaking of that, did you see how Jens was burying himself to help them out -what a classy rider.

Having said that, once everyone was back on, I think they shouldn't have neutralised the end... if you didn't want to be in the mix, just hang back a bit -even talk to the GC contendors and say "hey, we don't wanna get hurt so lets form a grupetto a few seconds down, so they guys that want to sprint can have a go, and if they crash, we;ll be far enough away to avoid it"

Hushovd was the big loser today, and if it comes down to a few points in it like last year and he loses out, he'd have every right to be pissed off

dom17

dont know about you guys but what happened yesterday seems like race fixing to me,i wonder if contador crashes later will saxo bank wait for him

bbosco

I'm not sure how Cancellara's actions could be viewed as sporting. It's a pretty huge ulterior motive. His team leaders were about to crash out of GC contention. He always new he'd lose the yellow jersey after a day or two anyway. He'd achieved his personal objective of winning the prologue and it was always going to be the Schlecks that took priority after that. In fact, Saxo bank probably wouldn't have wasted any effort defending Cancellara's yellow anyway.

ThisRegard

Funkyzeit wrote: »

I don't know why Cancellara and the others wouldn't let anyone sprint at the finish. My team-mate Maxime Bouet told them, "okay you can protest but I'm going to get second," and he edged ahead on the line. [/I]

And it looks like Cancellara wasn't happy about that at all, you could see him throwing his hands in the air and giving out when the guy on the far left, as you looked at the riders coming towards you, jumped ahead just on the line.

TinyExplosions

bbosco wrote: »

I'm not sure how Cancellara's actions could be viewed as sporting. It's a pretty huge ulterior motive. His team leaders were about to crash out of GC contention. He always new he'd lose the yellow jersey after a day or two anyway. He'd achieved his personal objective of winning the prologue and it was always going to be the Schlecks that took priority after that. In fact, Saxo bank probably wouldn't have wasted any effort defending Cancellara's yellow anyway.

It wasn't just the schelcks that had got shelled out, but Contador (I think), Wiggins and Armstrong were also a minute or so behind the peloton, so there was an element of waiting for your team, there was also a large sporting element to it too imo.

bbosco

TinyExplosions wrote: »

It wasn't just the schelcks that had got shelled out, but Contador (I think), Wiggins and Armstrong were also a minute or so behind the peloton, so there was an element of waiting for your team, there was also a large sporting element to it too imo.

Contador, Wiggins, Armstrong etc. were in a good-sized group that was only ever about a minute down and always had a good chance of getting back in touch even if the front group had raced. They didn't take long to get back onto the peleton. The Schleck's were in a much smaller group with about half of the Saxo Bank team who were 4 minutes down. Most of the sitting up was done for the Schleck's and not the other GC contenders. Sorry, maybe I'm being too cynical but I can't see past self-interest by Saxo Bank.

el tel

I think the whole thing by Cancellara was horse ****. It was all about Saxobank, nothing else. Roche is right, and Sean Kelly's comments were too. Pity radio communications weren't banned on this stage, it could have changed things around and made for some decent racing later with the big contenders having to fight for the win. While I'm at it I'd like to add that the presence of the Schlecks bores the **** out of me - having these two brothers on the same team is such a bollocks, it just stifles everything.

ThisRegard

Cancellara said he felt that the sprinters wanted a sprint at the end but he thought they shouldn't which is why he spoke to the director, he's insisting he done the right thing and he thought they'd only loose more if there was a sprint, Jeremy Hunt from Cervello and Thor somebody are not happy at all about it. Don't want to see Cancellara do well anymore, motor or no motor

Roche is not impressed with the explanation at all and thinks the whole race has now changed as a result.

There's still claims that there was diesel or something on the road and that yesterday was something out of the ordinary.

ROK ON

The real danger for Saxo was not the sprint but the fact that if the race was on then the likes of AC LA CS BW may have stayed out front for safety. The danger here is the the Schlecks could have been shelled out the back.

I wonder if it was AC that crashed badly would LA and the Schlecks have waited. Draw your own conclusions.

Harrybelafonte

I'm wondering if Cancellera was following orders from Riis?

Harrybelafonte

Surely as a domestique Cancellera was doing his job by slowing the peleton to allow Schleck to rejoin it? Am asking, not stateing so open to correction.

ednwireland

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Surely as a domestique Cancellera was doing his job by slowing the peleton to allow Schleck to rejoin it? Am asking, not stateing so open to correction.

he wasnt slowing the peton he went to the race director to get the stage neutralised like i said great tactics from saaxobank

from the cycling weekly feed

Bradley Wiggins has commented on yesterday's stage to Gregor Brown:

"I think it was just bulls**t, to be honest. That's bike racing. No one waited for me when I crashed at the Giro. If it is a dangerous time trial prologue, Fabian ain't going to slow down and wait for everyone else."

kennyb3

Surprised nobody has said it:

But surely it wasnt just cancellara as if AC, LA et al had of wanted to attack/up the pace - cancellara is only one man and cant block the road so they would of.

Cancellara extended them the courtesy of slowing up to let them on and to me the GC boys then extended the courtesy to the schleks. So tbh i dont see it as all saxo bank.

If they were all so unhappy about it why didnt they do something about it rather than whinging the next day. I like Bradley but he likes a good whinge

TinyExplosions

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Surely as a domestique Cancellera was doing his job by slowing the peleton to allow Schleck to rejoin it? Am asking, not stateing so open to correction.

I reckon you might not be far off there.... he was acting as a Saxobank rider who happened to be in Yellow, therefore there was double clout for him...

Am a little surprised the race directors agreed to neutralize it though, at the end of the day it falls into their hands, not Fabians

mcgratheoin

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Surely as a domestique Cancellera was doing his job by slowing the peleton to allow Schleck to rejoin it? Am asking, not stateing so open to correction.

Up to the point that the Shlecks regained contact with the peloton. It's not his job to decide that the sprint will be neutralised and I'm a bit surprised that he managed it. I think with so many teams unhappy with it, if the same thing happens today he'll be told to go stuff himself. Cancellara did his job, but what people are annoyed with is his attempt to paint his actions as for the good of the peloton when they were solely for SaxoBank.
Definitely Cervelo and AG2R (probably Katusha plus a few others) would have been happy to race on - don't think Armstrong would have lost any sleep over it either
"But these hills around here and the Ardennes are legendary, it's part of cycling."

mcgratheoin

kennyb3 wrote: »

Surprised nobody has said it:

But surely it wasnt just cancellara as if AC, LA et al had of wanted to attack/up the pace - cancellara is only one man and cant block the road so they would of.

Yeah - reckon in the heat of the moment Cancellara had everyone who wanted to race convinced that they were the only ones who did. Nobody wanted to go for it in case they were shunned by the peloton later.
FWIW if I'd been Hushovd I'd have given Spartacus the finger and sent the team up to the front for the last 10km.

kennyb3

To me it was everybody being gentlemanly and realising it could of been them who was tailed off (through pure bad luck) and hence allowing them back on.

I dont see how guys above can say it was all cancellara and saxo, im fair sure if Lance, alberto and few others had of wanted to race their teams would have flew past Cancellara. There is obviously one or two who werent too happy but the majority must have been in favour of it

Harrybelafonte

Ok, so he was doing it as he should have up until the neutralisation, which happened quite a short distance from the end, yeah?

I can understand so many being annoyed, but Cav, Wiggins and Roche complaining that no-one would wait for them or have not waited for them previously seems a little childish.

I can understand Hushovd being annoyed, cos with Cav in the back he had a better chance at getting Green Jersey.

joker77

Reading about the mentality of the peloton, there is always a 'patrón' - today it would be AC but LA would be a very close second. I think once they caught up with Cancellara, it was decided between the 3 of them to wait - that's just my opinion.

When you look at today's stage, which has the potential to be far worse in terms of falls - I think that kind of explains what happened yesterday, none of them know yet if they'll be in the same situation. I'd say LA and AC are sh*tting themselves over the cobbles today.

kennyb3

joker77 wrote: »

Reading about the mentality of the peloton, there is always a 'patrón' - today it would be AC but LA would be a very close second. I think once they caught up with Cancellara, it was decided between the 3 of them to wait - that's just my opinion.

When you look at today's stage, which has the potential to be far worse in terms of falls - I think that kind of explains what happened yesterday, none of them know yet if they'll be in the same situation. I'd say LA and AC are sh*tting themselves over the cobbles today.

Agree with the first part, not sure about the 2nd part tho - today will be a free for all

el tel

mcgratheoin wrote: »

Yeah - reckon in the heat of the moment Cancellara had everyone who wanted to race convinced that they were the only ones who did. Nobody wanted to go for it in case they were shunned by the peloton later.
FWIW if I'd been Hushovd I'd have given Spartacus the finger and sent the team up to the front for the last 10km.

In all the confusion, this ^.

The peer pressure in the peleton must be immense. Everyone is wary of spitting in the soup.

Harrybelafonte

Heard somewhere that AC took some special training on the Paris Roubaix route from someone a few weeks ago

joker77

Yea it's just hard to know which way it'll go until you see who falls

Malari

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Heard somewhere that AC took some special training on the Paris Roubaix route from someone a few weeks ago

Van Petegem, no less! And apparently he wasn't too shabby on the cobbles after his lessons.

joker77

Malari wrote: »

Van Petegem, no less! And apparently he wasn't too shabby on the cobbles after his lessons.

He's still being cautious - they showed his bike setup on eurosport and said it was very Roubaix. Roche said on his twitter he was taking a chance on Reynolds carbon wheels and 24" tyres. Carbon wheels over cobbles sure sounds risky to me. Then again - what do I know?