Love/Hate [** Spoilers **]

FloatingVoter

DazMarz wrote: »

We all sit here and have a good laugh at the lads; Nidge and Fran, or Tony, Paulie and Silvio. It's all so cool and dangerous. But imagine how terrifying it would be in real life to be a solid citizen, to know lads like this and worst of all, knowing you've attracted their attention...

Couldn't agree more with that point. However, this particular solid citizen did pop around to Nidge's brothel, vomit and crap all over the shop, then produced a sob story when told to pay. Couldn't happen to a nicer wanker.

BuilderPlumber

IvaBigWun wrote: »

Nidge and Fran will still be there in the finale, and I don't think they'll be friends

I'd say so too. I have a feeling that the early casualty will be Wayne (probably killed by Nidge or someone associated with Nidge after a failed attempt to assassinate Nidge). This will lead to a spiral of events where Dano and Lizzie will be in hot water and where Nidge's and Tony's relationship improves bigtime. Dano and Lizzie will probably be the next to be neutralised: whether this will come from Nidge or Tony remains unclear but I do feel the IRA issues will be resolved in series 4.

This resolved, the new emphasis will be on Fran trying to take over from Nidge, the gardai closing in on the gang and possibly Tommy regaining his memory (aided by Siobhan and detective Moynihan) and then shopping Nidge's secrets to both the police and Fran! As well as this, the guy Fran beat up in the pub toilet I'm sure was included for a reason as well and something will develop from that. All that will then set up series 5 nicely.

BuilderPlumber

Interesting relationships at the start of this series 4:

Nidge and Fran: close but there are warning signs.
Nidge and Tony: lukewarm.
Nidge and Dano/Lizzie/Wayne: very poor.
Nidge and Tommy: ???
Fran and Tommy: relatively poor.
Fran and the toilet brawler: very poor.
All the gang/CIRA and the police: very poor.
Tony and Dano: good-ish but sliding.
Dano and Lizzie: close.
Nidge and Elmo/Ado: showing signs of strain.
Fran and Elmo/Ado: showing signs of strain.

By the end, how will these change?

Nidge and Fran will become rivals with both vying for control of the gang. Both will need to be pragmatic as well though and it won't be until the end we really see their friendship completely disintegrate. Tommy could spill Nidge's secrets!

Nidge and Tony will become friends and Tony and Dano/Lizzie/Wayne will become enemies. Nidge will have killed Wayne and report it back to Tony that Dano/Lizzie was behind it, and Tony will be furious with his colleagues. Tony will sort Dano/Lizzie out, continue with Nidge's arrangements, go back to Belfast and not bother Nidge again.

Regarding Dano and Lizzie: they may or may not remain friends. It is important to note that Dano was as guilty as Nidge in the killing of Lizzie's brother Paddy. Neither Nidge nor Dano personally killed him (it was Darren who did, defending Nidge from Dano's outfit that included Paddy) and Lizzie knows Paddy would not be dead if Dano's vendetta against Nidge did not exist! So, it is hard to tell how the relations between this pair pan out and how it fits in with the others.

Nidge and Tommy's relationship will disimprove bigtime while his relationship with Fran will improve a lot. The toilet brawler and/or his associates are going to be back and their views on Fran will remain unchanged. Could team up with Fran's enemies.

Relations with the police will remain very poor with all apart from Tommy.

Elmo could be hit for wrongly accused of being a rat in the very next episode (he has traditionally been the wrong target hasn't he?) but I have a feeling he will survive and be of use to Nidge, Fran or both. Ado will be in a similar position.

hardCopy

biggebruv wrote: »

im the complete opposite i cant stand fran that scene in the station when they were interviewing him and he did the mad dance thing was cringey

im really hoping he dies soon

I like Fran but that scene was awful. I saw it on the ad and thought it would probably be funny and looked forward to seeing the context, but there was no context shown, they just had a hard cut to him dancing then one line of dialogue and cut away.

Ash.J.Williams

the similarities between Nidge and the alleged Mr. Big are astounding! Also shades of the gilligan gang...we just need fran to have one of the wrist in front of a female garda!

BuilderPlumber

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Couldn't agree more with that point. However, this particular solid citizen did pop around to Nidge's brothel, vomit and crap all over the shop, then produced a sob story when told to pay. Couldn't happen to a nicer wanker.

I think the dentist in the first episode was a horrid character with his puking and sh*tting, refusing to pay and followed by his violence towards women. A more timid and respectable version appeared in episode 2. One can only feel whatever Nidge and Fran will get him to do and how it ends was brought on by himself and no one else. He deserves what is coming to him (it was his choice to frequent prostitutes, hit Janet and antagonise Nidge).

Left Back on the Bench

can see Fran and nidge falling out. nidge is getting too paranoid to be in charge but Fran seems to be too gung ho to be in charge.when Fran puts tommy in the van next wk,he'll say something line "nidge shouldve finished you off" and i think it will trigger the fallout of Fran and nidge and jog tommys memory who will tell all to detective moynihan.think this will be only part,as i said the show so far has everyone guessing and they've alot to squeeze into 4 episodes

AnonoBoy

biggebruv wrote: »

so do you think all the real life gangs do be watching saying "gowan fran ya f"""king legend ya":D

Wouldn't surprise me. In the States wiretaps revealed gangsters over there discussing The Sopranos and how much they liked it.

hardCopy wrote: »

I like Fran but that scene was awful. I saw it on the ad and thought it would probably be funny and looked forward to seeing the context, but there was no context shown, they just had a hard cut to him dancing then one line of dialogue and cut away.

It wasn't a hard cut to him dancing at all. He asked whether it was being recorded, then slowly stood up and danced, then leaned in and gave the line about "it's help I need, not hassle."

Definitely not a hard cut.

kryogen

Posy wrote: »

Why is Nidge asking the dentist for money? Is it just blackmail because he was using a brothel or is there something else I missed?

Yes its something you missed

AnonoBoy

Posy wrote: »

Why is Nidge asking the dentist for money? Is it just blackmail because he was using a brothel or is there something else I missed?

It's for puking everywhere in the brothel.

But he knows he doesn't have the money so he's now using that debt owed to force him into importing drugs for them.

BertMark

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Wouldn't surprise me. In the States wiretaps revealed gangsters over there discussing The Sopranos and how much they liked it.

The Godfather was a massive influence on many American criminals. There are several reports of crooks affecting different mannerisms and a more "classy" style after watching Brando's Don Corleone.

The Italian American mob in the film wasn't necessarily accurate to the traditions of the underworld at the time (there weren't many traditions at all really afaik), but soon enough life was imitating art.

FloatingVoter

Frans dance routine is about all they could get away with showing on national TV regarding how your average career gangster behaves when "helping Gardai with their enquiries". One charmer (recently deceased) had a habit of defecating in his hand and placing the result on the interview room table.
The dentist is a happy accident for Nidge...in the real world our dentist pal would probably have wound up contacting a loanshark. From there, Nidge would still be an inevitable destination for him.

walshb

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Frans dance routine is about all they could get away with showing on national TV regarding how your average career gangster behaves when "helping Gardai with their enquiries". One charmer (recently deceased) had a habit of defecating in his hand and placing the result on the interview room table.
m.

You would wonder how Gardia could allow low lifes to get away with doing that.

Gadgetman496

walshb wrote: »

You would wonder how Gardia could allow low lifes to get away with doing that.

The low lifes have more rights than the Guards and are way more versed in law than the state solicitors\barristers.

Ash.J.Williams

walshb wrote: »

You would wonder how Gardia could allow low lifes to get away with doing that.

Brian "tosser" Mehan was named so because he had a pedal and crank in the garda car in front of a female and then mooned her asking would she prefer his arse!

ectoraige

I really like how the first two episodes have set up the rest of the season, the story could pan out in so many ways. Love/hate keeps challenging the characters' loyalties, and Siobhán's are surely going to be tested; it's not clear if she still loves the man Tommy has become. I know Tommy gave Debbie the shove previously but if she's still around she might yet break any loyalty Siobhán has for Tommy, perhaps leading to her giving Nidge a timely warning.

I also don't know if the scenes involving Warren are setting us up for his death, it seems a bit heavy-handed for Carolan. If a child dies, it might be an innocent, or the young scobie himself. I think the writer is clearly testing Nidge's loyalties towards his family. He has said before that all he cares about is himself and his children - even excluding Trish from that. Not only is he paranoid, but he's cowardly too. His instincts in the last season were to run from the 'ra, it wasn't until Darren rescued him from Dano that Nidge really took the problem on, which ultimately took the form of sacrificing Darren. Previously he had Darren take out John Boy, rather than doing it himself.

I don't think Dano's attack will succeed - Lizzie's resolve is already shakey as it is, and should they plan to hit the communion she may fail to carry through. She already killed the man she loved, but that was deeply personal - I don't think she'll be able to do it again, despite her tough-woman act. Nidge's instinctual response on an attack on his family might be to go on the run, especially with the gang falling apart over Elmo. However, his escape could end up hinging on Siobhán's assistance, and by that time it might be a very difficult position for her. She could end up turning against both Tommy and Nidge.

The obvious end to the season will be with Nidge in custody leaving Fran running things. Dano will likely be dead, as will Elmo, with Fran bringing in his own crew to exploit the dentist. Of all the characters in Love/Hate, Fran has been the only one who's ability to make decisions has not been compromised by feeling or loyalties to others. He's the true evil in all of this. He just hasn't had the drive to take over, but at this point I don't think he needs Nidge for anything. I can't see Nidge in prison being able to exert much influence, despite having John Boy's money.

Ash.J.Williams

love hate 5 - The rise of Elmo

Gadgetman496

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

love hate 5 - The rise of Elmo

Don't ya just love a great plot twist

ricero

Id love to see season 5 set in prison and then season 6 would be king nidge living it large in the costa del sol. Be good to get an insight into the irish prison system

Gadgetman496

ricero wrote: »

Be good to get an insight into the irish prison system

Just nip out with your hurley and hold up a cash in transit van

Make sure it's carrying in excess of one million though! That will insure it has an armed escort

FloatingVoter

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Brian "tosser" Mehan was named so because he had a pedal and crank in the garda car in front of a female and then mooned her asking would she prefer his arse!

This is true. The last Evening Herald Star we had who behaved like a TV gangster was The Monk. So called because of the low drink, no drug intake and the ability to stare at a spot on the wall for 48 hours straight.
A bad karaoke routine would be listed as a good way to spend the afternoon for the cops real-life counterparts.

power pants

Season 5 should just be about the women in the brothel, showing them trying out new linergie and techniques on their clients. Fran is the guinea pig and nidge gives marks out of 10

tayto lover

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Frans dance routine is about all they could get away with showing on national TV regarding how your average career gangster behaves when "helping Gardai with their enquiries". One charmer (recently deceased) had a habit of defecating in his hand and placing the result on the interview room table.
The dentist is a happy accident for Nidge...in the real world our dentist pal would probably have wound up contacting a loanshark. From there, Nidge would still be an inevitable destination for him.

If I was a garda and that happened i'd rub his nose in it like the dog he is.
Feckin animal wouldn't do that.

Galwayguy35

Is there going to be a season 5?

FloatingVoter

tayto lover wrote: »

If I was a garda and that happened i'd rub his nose in it like the dog he is.
Feckin animal wouldn't do that.

That's what they look for in a guard. They do the detention, you do the assault and they'll take the compo and your job.
Smiling politely while they perform like apes in the safe knowledge that they'll be gun fodder within a few years is a better approach.

tayto lover

FloatingVoter wrote: »

That's what they look for in a guard. They do the detention, you do the assault and they'll take the compo and your job.
Smiling politely while they perform like apes in the safe knowledge that they'll be gun fodder within a few years is a better approach.

I wouldn't have the temperament for that job.
He'd do that, i'd clock him and probably be sacked.
Takes a special breed for that kind of job. I could only work with the 4 legged animals i'm afraid.

Temaz

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Is there going to be a season 5?

You could probably bet your house that there will be.

Lucy and Harry

So Elmo is basically being set up to be killed because the Gardai are pretending he is a rat and spraying it all over walls etc.
He should be going to jail not be given the death penalty by cops.I would like to see all this Tango squad shot to bits in a blood bath.
If Nidge and Fran die I do not think we will be having a season 5.We already have John Boy and Darren gone any more and it would not be the same.

I also do think Fran and Tommy going for a trip to buy fanta in his van spells out trouble for Tommy.
I think his lovely partner will be crying again.Maybe it will turn her into a rat...

deise08

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Is there going to be a season 5?

From what I remember hearing after last season gettin such a good response, rte commissioned another two seasons for sure. They had to completely cut the drama Raw to be able to fund Love/Hate.couldn't afford to run two prime dramas and our nidgey and the boys won. so there's plenty more to come

BertMark

Lucy and Harry wrote: »

So Elmo is basically being set up to be killed because the Gardai are pretending he is a rat and spraying it all over walls etc.
He should be going to jail not be given the death penalty by cops.I would like to see all this Tango squad shot to bits in a blood bath.
If Nidge and Fran die I do not think we will be having a season 5.We already have John Boy and Darren gone any more and it would not be the same.

I also do think Fran and Tommy going for a trip to buy fanta in his van spells out trouble for Tommy.
I think his lovely partner will be crying again.Maybe it will turn her into a rat...

There's absolutely no way there won't be a season 5. The show is RTE's biggest success for many, many years. They're not going to kill that off before they have to.