Love/Hate [** Spoilers **]

paulbok

gadgetman496 wrote: »

Maybe there will be no big happenings in the finale next Sunday? Maybe it will carry on like the previous 5 episodes and just end with a

"To Be Continued" on the screen :P

If that happens I'm not coming back on this forum for a while. Can you imagine the meltdown?:eek:

BuilderPlumber

Bacchus wrote: »

But the RA didn't hire him. Dano did on the quiet. He couldn't go through his normal channels as word could have gotten back to Tony.

As for Nidge, Wayne is perfect for him. Loyal to money, can handle himself in a situation and is a bit of a psycho. Just keep his blood lust and wallet happy and he's got a top 'soldier' there. Hope they keep him in it for next season. Great potential in the character. Decent actor too.

That last episode was a bit of a let down. Loved the first 4, setting things up nicely for the final 2 episodes but this was a filler episode. That'd be fine in a 13 episode season but not when you only have 6 episodes to tell the story. Now it just feels like everything is being crammed into the finale as if all that matters is a shocking ending... cause you know they're going to go all shock and awe in the finale.

That is very true. Dano had to look outside IRA circles for someone to hit Nidge and we are not told how they located Wayne. In the third season, it was always clear that Dano tended to on the quiet arrange to hire criminals rather than IRA to do his jobs (hence, Darren getting hired to eliminate Elmo's cousin the then suspect) because he knew Tony would not approve of using resources on personal vendettas.

I enjoyed Sunday's episode personally. I think there are in this series two finales: episode 4 was one (that was the finale for the Dano/Nidge/Tony storyline and resolved this issue at least for now). And episode 6 will of course be the season finale. There is a lot to fit into the last episode: Tommy, the Fran/Nidge/Linda situation, Noelie Hughes, the cops closing in on Nidge and co, and the travellers. I think some of these will come out into the open this season but others possibly left for next season (I feel the Nidge v travellers feud is only beginning and could be a major theme next season; Noelie Hughes v Fran could also be a bigger issue next time around too; but I think Tommy discovering Nidge hit him and Fran finding out the truth about Linda are going to come out next Sunday somehow, leading to serious trouble for Nidge.

Ash.J.Williams

Sunglasses Ron wrote: »

This is one wee flaw I'm finding. The ra (RIRA, CIRA, whatever faction Lizzie etc are meant to be in) don't hire random hitmen. In real life Wayne is either a sworn or prospective member of the IRA splinters, not a hired gun like has been shown (if I was hiring a gunman I would go better than a 16 year old who poses for FB photos and YT videos of him shooting cats with my illegally held sub machine gun). My mate knew Alan Ryan to say hello to via relatives, for a well known example- he might have taxed drug profits, but as regards actually taking the stuff, or running with the dealers, he despised the whole game. All real republicans do, if they could make such massive profits from any other racket over night they would shut the drug trade down, but they can't, so they tolerate others dealing and using products, even recreational drugs, that they have total disdain for, if they can tax it. I just don't think Nidge would recruit a kid like that.

Alans ryans entire gang were hired guns....as soon as he was killed 3 or 4 of them were knee capped.

Ash.J.Williams

biggebruv wrote: »

next season has to be the last I reckon extend it to 8 episodes aswell

if nidge goes then who else is there 5 seasons is a hell of a run

best closing montage of the series so far for me was the johnny cash-hurt such a great song played beautifully in the show

I don't recall "hurt" being in this series..

Ash.J.Williams

Lisha wrote: »

Found it very funny last night when Garda gaffer guy told Siobhan 'I've 2lsds watching tommy they'll tell me when he comes back' I just got an image of tommy mooning some unsuspecting young WANs with gardai not knowing what to do .

Also Trish is only with nidge for the moola and status. Even at end last nidge when nidge showed up with a marked face she never asked a question only tried to make him forget about it.

On the cocsine thing Jojn boy was the real user but Darren and Tommy put a fair amount away last season too. They both used it yo get through jobs they wanted to forget.

Debbie was a cautionary tale from start to finish of a middle class girl gone bad.
A sadly predictable end for her. She went from being a loved child to john boys toy to drug user to addict to street prostitute.
Tragic waste if anyone's life

One thing I found really upsetting last night was Debbie friend describing not being able to feel sex with nidge as she was still numb after a DnC (presumably after an abortion or miscarriage) . Just callously describes the power of the heroin and prostitution cycle.

jaysus i had to google D&C....awful

stickybookmark

Kenny Logins wrote: »

Best line was from Fran "...I don't want to look like a fúckin' bleedin'... knowarramean.'

I actually thought he was going to say ''like a Roma gypsy'' there but that was left unsaid as RTE would get in trouble for being racist if they had that line in

BuilderPlumber

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Alans ryans entire gang were hired guns....as soon as he was killed 3 or 4 of them were knee capped.

There often is a very fine line between dissident republicanism and normal crime. By its very nature, dissident IRA are splinter groups and have often made enemies of the mainstream IRA. Even mainstream dissidents. They need criminals more often than not to survive.

This situation is portrayed excellently in Love/Hate with the deteriorating relationship between Tony and Dano. Dano started out believing Nidge and using him (with Tony's blessing) as a source of income for them. Later, when Dano found out Nidge was colluding in the hiding of his father's body and protecting the killer, his focus moved towards revenge. His relationship with Tony and other IRA suffered drastically with Tony siding with Nidge in the end who was of more use.

Also, the hypocrisy of the dissident's anti-drugs views are apparent. Dano was seen kneecapping Ado and making a community statement against dealers. Yet, he was glad to get paid up by dealers (Ado was hit by mistake according to Git as he was paying up!) and was more than happy to deal with Nidge when it suited him. Also, Dano was scene a few times taking cocaine in the early part of season 3.

Kenny Logins

stickybookmark wrote: »

I actually thought he was going to say ''like a Roma gypsy'' there but that was left unsaid as RTE would get in trouble for being racist if they had that line in

It was a typical Dub vocabulary malfunction. I used to work with a lad that would whistle for every word that he couldn't reach within the rhythm of the sentence.

(Oddly, he would also look up and to the left when talking directly to you, but I think that's because his da drove a taxi).

stickybookmark

Ravanelli wrote: »

We don't really have many ''ghettos'' though in reality. These gangs in Dublin from places like Blanchardstown, Clondalkin, Ballyfermot etc they aren't exactly ''ghettos''. .

What about the north inner city? Like where the actor that plays Elmo is from in real life.

prospect

Apologies if this has been covered, (haven't read the thread since the last episode finished).

So, who is potentially going against Nidge:

Well Fran obviously.
Then there is Patrick and potentially his traveller pals.
The IRA possibly.
I rekon Aidos girlfriend will f**k up bringing in drugs, and Nidge will act on that, possibly turning Aido against him.
Elmo would take a pot shot at Nidge if given the opportunity, given that his Dads life is being held over him.
Lizzy, if she gets out of Jail (probably not, but I'll park that there).
The Dentist has been cornered off by the Gardai.
Janet hasn't been impressed with how Nidge dealt with the two dead hookers, so she may be on the turn.
I think Nidges Wife would do whatever is required to protect the kids.
Wayne has openly said he only has loyalty to whomever is paying him on the day.

Doesn't leave Nidge with much really, can he possibly turn on the rest of them, do a deal with the Gardai?

Kenny Logins

I'd put a tenner on Nidge gets 'clipped', but we won't know 'whodunnit' until series 5.

stickybookmark

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

.

So far, one character who has never acted out of revenge is Nidge. There has been a lot of scenes showing Nidge's love for his sons and - despite having affairs with Janet and others - he always comes back to Trish (who is the love of his life, the one he will try and protect and the one who can comfort him when he is at his lowest like the time he was forced to take the hit on Darren to try and keep Dano from hitting him, something both Nidge and Tony wanted to avoid).

Does that sentence make sense? If Darren was going to get clipped either way, how was Nidge doing him a favour by clipping him instead of getting the RA to clip him?

Nidge offered Darren up to the RA to save his own ass, not for any other reason. You make it sound like he was somehow doing Darren a favour by having him killed!

BuilderPlumber

prospect wrote: »

Apologies if this has been covered, (haven't read the thread since the last episode finished).

So, who is potentially going against Nidge:

Well Fran obviously.
Then there is Patrick and potentially his traveller pals.
The IRA possibly.
I rekon Aidos girlfriend will f**k up bringing in drugs, and Nidge will act on that, possibly turning Aido against him.
Elmo would take a pot shot at Nidge if given the opportunity, given that his Dads life is being held over him.
Lizzy, if she gets out of Jail (probably not, but I'll park that there).
The Dentist has been cornered off by the Gardai.
Janet hasn't been impressed with how Nidge dealt with the two dead hookers, so she may be on the turn.
I think Nidges Wife would do whatever is required to protect the kids.
Wayne has openly said he only has loyalty to whomever is paying him on the day.

Doesn't leave Nidge with much really, can he possibly turn on the rest of them, do a deal with the Gardai?

Yes, all of these plus Tommy and Siobhan too are/potentially are out to get Nidge. Fran, the travellers, the cops and Tommy/Siobhan are probably the biggest threats for now.

stickybookmark

poundapunnet wrote: »

Aido too, tried to rape Debbie, put Darren up at his house and acted all pally and then turned on a dime and took part in the shooting attempt. It doesn't even seem to phase him.

Not to mention the fact that Darren was the only one to come and visit him in hospital and feed him water after he was shot (when Nidge couldn't be @rsed visiting him). Plus Darren's display of loyalty to him by pipebombing the RA car.

Despite all that he lost more sleep over his budgie's death than Darrens!

....making him one of the most heartless, ruthless scumbags in the show IMO. He just hides it better under his ''shur I'll give ya a lift home'' harmless sound fella routine.
I wouldn't put Elmo in the same bracket as him.

Lovely Bloke

I think Nidge will kill Tommy - or have him killed by Wayne.

BuilderPlumber

Kenny Logins wrote: »

I'd put a tenner on Nidge gets 'clipped', but we won't know 'whodunnit' until series 5.

We could have a 'who shot Nidge' like 'who shot JR' situation with Nidge surviving and then trying to find out who did it. Some of the possibilities if this was to become the situation:

The Obvious:

1. Fran: he finds out about Linda, is angry and wants revenge. Perhaps a little too obvious if this was the storyline.
2. Tommy: Tommy is told by Siobhan, Fran (who wants to seek revenge on Nidge), and the cops that Nidge hit him. And then goes after Nidge on his own or teams up with Fran. Again, maybe a little too obvious for a whodunnit.
3. The cops: The cops shoot Nidge. IMO highly unlikely. If a gang member was to be shot by the cops, it would happen in a shootout and would not be premeditated.
4. The travellers: Like Fran and Tommy, the travellers have a major reason to take Nidge down and unlike Fran and Tommy, the animosity is already out in the open. However, it would again be too obvious.

The Less Obvious

1. Tony/The IRA: Nidge did a deal with Tony twice already and as long as he keeps his deal, Tony will have no interest in trying to kill him. Clearly, if Tony was to become the attempted assassin, there'd have to be a story where the IRA guns are seized and traced to a link between Tony and Nidge. Again, this would make it too obvious.
2. Dano: more interestingly, suppose the major twist is that Dano survived? We assume and the actor Jason Barry has stated Dano is actually dead (there was no mention of him at all in episode 5) but that may be the major twist. A character we assumed was gone is actually alive and plotted a revenge.
3. Lizzie: likewise, Lizzie could perhaps organise a hit from prison. I assume she will be in there for a long time.
4. Noelie Hughes: Hughes could organise a hit on Fran from prison based on some intelligence about Fran meeting someone but Nidge could go in place of Fran to meet someone like the dentist and get hit in place of Fran.
5. Georgina: Dano's girlfriend. She and perhaps Dan's mother too could continue Dano's quest for revenge and organise something and extend it to cover both Tony and Nidge?
6. Ado and Elmo: Perhaps they may see Nidge as vulnerable and go for a hit on him to climb upwards in the gang. With all the attention on Fran to want Nidge's job, we may forget about these two. These two are often overlooked and underrated and as previously mentioned, have done a lot of nasty things and kinda never got noticed. They are cleverer, more ambitious and sneakier than many think they are and are survivors.

The Totally Unlikely

1. Mary: Remember her? Darren's sister. She could see how gangland ruined her life and come back and attempt to kill Nidge. However, this was not ever in her character plus I felt she disowned Darren as being as bad as the others in the end.
2. John Boy's daughter: She would have a motive but it is unlikely she would come back into it so late but who knows? Totally unlikely but remotely possible.
3. Rosie: Darren's girlfriend. Like Mary, she disowned Darren for his role in gangland. Like Mary, I believe her character does not have a murderer in her.
4. Trish: Finds out about Nidge's affair and tries to kill him. Again, unlikely. This is Love/Hate and not Dallas and Nidge is Nidge not JR and Trish is not Sue Ellen!!
5. Janet: ditto with Trish!

So, if it was to be a whodunnit, I'd say it would be someone from the second grouping other than Tony I'd feel.

BuilderPlumber

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

I think Nidge will kill Tommy - or have him killed by Wayne.

Wayne will be the new Darren, doing all kinds of hits for Nidge. Tommy will of course begin to realise bit by bit who hit him and Nidge will need to arrange to kill him to save himself.

Gadgetman496

stickybookmark wrote: »

Does that sentence make sense? If Darren was going to get clipped either way, how was Nidge doing him a favour by clipping him instead of getting the RA to clip him?

Nidge offered Darren up to the RA to save his own ass, not for any other reason. You make it sound like he was somehow doing Darren a favour by having him killed!

I think you misread that? or maybe it was worded misleadingly?

like the time he was forced to take the hit on Darren to try and keep Dano from hitting him

I think what was meant was

like the time he (Nidge) was forced to take the hit on Darren to try and keep Dano from hitting him (Him being Nidge, himself)

BuilderPlumber

stickybookmark wrote: »

Does that sentence make sense? If Darren was going to get clipped either way, how was Nidge doing him a favour by clipping him instead of getting the RA to clip him?

Nidge offered Darren up to the RA to save his own ass, not for any other reason. You make it sound like he was somehow doing Darren a favour by having him killed!

Of course he offered Darren (however reluctantly) to save himself!

In the sentence "like the time he was forced to take the hit on Darren to try and keep Dano from hitting him". That latter him is Nidge NOT Darren. Darren was sacrificed by Nidge to try and appease Dano and as part of his newfound alliance with Tony.

stickybookmark

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

Of course he offered Darren (however reluctantly) to save himself!

In the sentence "like the time he was forced to take the hit on Darren to try and keep Dano from hitting him". That latter him is Nidge NOT Darren. Darren was sacrificed by Nidge to try and appease Dano and as part of his newfound alliance with Tony.

Aha.

But why didn't he offer Tommy as a sacrifical lamb to the IRA instead of Darren? Tommy was a vegetable in a coma at that stage, probably not going to come out of it. Never got that decision by Nidge

thesandeman

Glen (Wayne's friend) is up for <SNIP>

Mod: Can't talk about pending court cases here, sorry.

paulbok

stickybookmark wrote: »

Does that sentence make sense? If Darren was going to get clipped either way, how was Nidge doing him a favour by clipping him instead of getting the RA to clip him?

A couple of quick taps to the head (mind you is was Elmo "who puts the ass in assassin") is preferable to a shotgun blast to the legs and bleeding out over a few hours.

Hitchens

Kenny Logins wrote: »

It was a typical Dub vocabulary malfunction. I used to work with a lad that would whistle for every word that he couldn't reach within the rhythm of the sentence.

(Oddly, he would also look up and to the left when talking directly to you, but I think that's because his da drove a taxi).

Jake Stephens?

paulbok

stickybookmark wrote: »

Aha.

But why didn't he offer Tommy as a sacrifical lamb to the IRA instead of Darren? Tommy was a vegetable in a coma at that stage, probably not going to come out of it. Never got that decision by Nidge

Agree, Nidge had just put Tommy in the coma. It would have made perfect sense to tell the ra that it was him which would have been mostly true, have them finish Tommy off (thus saving him the potential for Tommy recovering and taking revenge) and also (but probably why the writers didn't go down this route) not have to have Darren killed.

Kenny Logins

Hitchens wrote: »

Jake Stephens?

No, but there are some similarities.

kryogen

Quick question

Is clipped the only accepted form of killed allowed in this thread?

Soft Falling Rain

prospect wrote: »

Wayne has openly said he only has loyalty to whomever is paying him on the day.

Which isn't very smart, as there's not much long term value in someone who'll drop you if the price is right.

loveBBhate

kryogen wrote: »

Quick question

Is clipped the only accepted form of killed allowed in this thread?

I'll clip you.

BuilderPlumber

paulbok wrote: »

Agree, Nidge had just put Tommy in the coma. It would have made perfect sense to tell the ra that it was him which would have been mostly true, have them finish Tommy off (thus saving him the potential for Tommy recovering and taking revenge) and also (but probably why the writers didn't go down this route) not have to have Darren killed.

I guess Nidge did not sacrifice Tommy for several reasons: his guilt about what he did to Tommy, Siobhan being his niece, the IRA would find it too convenient that Tommy actually did it, the fact that it actually was Darren who did ultimately kill Git and also the fact that Tommy was already in a coma (and perhaps assumed dead) and yet the IRA were still demanding someone. I'm sure they guessed Tommy would have been involved but Darren was the hitman and had to be involved?

Imhof Tank

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

I guess Nidge did not sacrifice Tommy for several reasons: his guilt about what he did to Tommy, Siobhan being his niece, the IRA would find it too convenient that Tommy actually did it, the fact that it actually was Darren who did ultimately kill Git and also the fact that Tommy was already in a coma (and perhaps assumed dead) and yet the IRA were still demanding someone. I'm sure they guessed Tommy would have been involved but Darren was the hitman and had to be involved?

That whole interrogation of Nidge by Tony was a test.

Tony already knew Darren had shot Paddy, so when Nidge confirmed it was the same guy that did Git, Tony knew it had to be Darren.

If Nidge had tried to hang Tommy he was a gonner. His sixth sense kicked in IMO so he went with the truth.