Gun Club "ban" use of semi-autos & pump actions at club clay shoot

bunny shooter

One of my NARGC affiliated gun clubs following a proposal by it's new safety officer, who is a registered gun dealer, has banned the use of semi-auto & pump action shot guns at a club clay shoot for "safety reasons" :eek:

Any comments, suggestions or possible legal options/implications?

sfakiaman

The only plausable reason I can think of is that someone could load more than two cartriges, but surely any competent RO would check before anyone left the fireing line. Maybe the safety officer needs a bit of training.

elius

Why not just load 2 shells instead of 3

marlin vs

I think you'r safety officer is after losing the run of himself,is his name Gormley by any chance,I shoot a s/a at clay's and just load 2 shot's and keep the breech open when i'm not on a stand.:rolleyes:

tac foley

marlin vs wrote: »

I think you'r safety officer is after losing the run of himself,is his name Gormley by any chance,I shoot a s/a at clay's and just load 2 shot's and keep the breech open when i'm not on a stand.:rolleyes:

In fact, just like 99.999999999999% of CP-shooters are required to do.

Next thing he'll want to do is to hand you each cartridge separately on the stand.

Oh my, I'm giving him ideas now..................... : O

tac

jwshooter

iv never seen a unsafe firearm , just unsafe users .

his time might be better spent educating ,young ,new not so young members in gun safety .

personally i dont like autos at clay shoots ,as the guys that use them are more often game shooters and are not familiar with range etiquette .

Darr

I'd be looking for his actual reason eg on what safety grounds .. looks like the Idontlikethelookofthat are still out there ... oh no its not a ou/sbs ban it quick ..
Dar

Sparks

Legal options? None I can think of. Their club, their rules bunny.

Sparks

jwshooter wrote: »

iv never seen a unsafe firearm

I have Check out a lot of the farming single-barrel shotguns sometime, especially the ones that are being handed in rather than licenced this year. Forget firing them, I'm pretty sure you need a tetanus jab just to pick them up safely...

cavan shooter

He has lost the run of himself Semi autos are used for english sporting (there is an American chap that shoots a berretta 391 who gave Faulds a run for his money I think in 2008. They are used for skeet even trap in the states. 2 shots only, and
sleeve when not in use,
point down range when loading
carry with muzzels pointing up if you are on the squad moving from 5-1 with the breach back and visible for all to see

there is the nuisance element when shooting in squads. Challenge him on it, the semi is fine its the eejit behind it.

A lot of lads shoot semis for field and clays, looks like he wants to stop running shoots. I'd say 60% of our guys have semis and one chap I know since having a car accident got rid of his KEMEN and went back to a Benelli because of the less recoil. I use my beretta 391 for skeet.

€10 says he would still sell them to a lad looking for one....:rolleyes:

J.R.

I have come across this on a few occassions in the past. I have a semi - auto which I shot all the time but went & bought a cheap Bettinsoli o/u to attend club shoots as semis not allowed.

I don't agree with it but, in some instances, I can see where they are coming from.

My friend & I both shoot semis - his is right handed & mine is left handed. We were draw on the same DTL line....he was no. 3 & I was no. 4. There was a grumpy old git between us. When shooting started he was being hit by my friends fired shells on his left, when ejected, & then on his right when I fired. When the shoot finished he was like an anti-christ.:D

I've used a pump action shotgun for years and really liked them & found them very safe. Saying that I 've seen an awful lot of eejits with pumps at flapper shoots.......some seem to think they're rambo. A fellow turned up one day with a remington 870 black pump with pistol grip & infra red light on barrel.

Another day at a flapper shoot a guy with a pump was on the line. We were in the background watching. As he raised the gun, when his clay was approaching, a pigeon passed. He swung & fired THREE shots at it, missing it each time. When we raised the issue nobody else seemed too concerned stating the day was only a bit of craic!!! Needless to say we departed immediately.

I've nothing against pumps or semis ....I've used them all my life.....but one has to admit that when some guys ..a very small minority...buy a pump (especially) it's for the movies image & not the benefits of the gun.

Grizzly 45

My friend & I both shoot semis - his is right handed & mine is left handed. We were draw on the same DTL line....he was no. 3 & I was no. 4. There was a grumpy old git between us. When shooting started he was being hit by my friends fired shells on his left, when ejected, & then on his right when I fired. When the shoot finished he was like an anti-christ.:D

I am always amazed by this one...Wouldnt BASIC Common SENSE suggest to you if you are getting hit by an ejected shell to simply take a step back
OUT OF THE WAY!!!:rolleyes:

I've used a pump action shotgun for years and really liked them & found them very safe. Saying that I 've seen an awful lot of eejits with pumps at flapper shoots.......some seem to think they're rambo. A fellow turned up one day with a remington 870 black pump with pistol grip & infra red light on barrel.

Dont think Rambo ever used a pump action:D.I love showing up with my 1100 all tricked out.But so what ???Did he shoot it safley??Thats the main thing ,not what it looks like.

Another day at a flapper shoot a guy with a pump was on the line. We were in the background watching. As he raised the gun, when his clay was approaching, a pigeon passed. He swung & fired THREE shots at it, missing it each time. When we raised the issue nobody else seemed too concerned stating the day was only a bit of craic!!! Needless to say we departed immediately.

That is a problem at flappers all right,but not the guns fault,more like an overeasy going on safety procedures or etiquette.I've seen somone once blind drunk on the firing line at a flapper.Fortuneatly only once.:eek:
When I mentioned it to the RO,it was a" nuthin I can do about it...He is the local most high Poobah.....":(

As for dealing with the range officer that came up with this.I suggest that you who have semis and pumps call an EGM and state quite clearly that if this goes ahead,you will LEAVE this club and forward your complaints to the NARGC on this point of non saftey issue.As it is affiliated to NARGC they do have some part to play in this.If any of you are landowners or providing a service to the club,state that then your land is now off limits to the club until this issue is sorted,and all your servive is withdrawn from club projects...
Bet you will soon see a change around.Money,membership and land are big things to a club.Chop those and you will get a result.

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

That is a problem at flappers all right ... an overeasy going on safety procedures or etiquette.I've seen somone once blind drunk on the firing line at a flapper.Fortuneatly only once.:eek:
When I mentioned it to the RO,it was a" nuthin I can do about it...He is the local most high Poobah.....":(

As for dealing with the range officer that came up with this.I suggest that you who have semis and pumps call an EGM and state quite clearly that if this goes ahead,you will LEAVE this club and forward your complaints to the NARGC on this point of non saftey issue. ... Bet you will soon see a change around.Money,membership and land are big things to a club.Chop those and you will get a result.

Grizzly, do you not see the irony there?

Grizzly 45

No!

Tackleberrywho

Remington 105CTi. Fires shells at ones feet.

I do find a lot of PURIST shotgunners hate Semi's.

The RO should be able to run a range with Semi's on the line. Just put them at the end, or further apart.;)

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

No!

Grizzly 45

Your opinion...:rolleyes:

Sparks

Grizzly, you went from "gosh, there are serious safety issues at flappers and the ROs do nothing 'cos folks are grand high poobahs" to "call an EGM and discipline this guy for trying to bring in a new safety measure and get the NARGC to pressure the club too - money will ensure success" in the next paragraph. How can you not see the irony here? I mean, if you think the guy's wrong, work with him first to try to change his mind, don't just reach straight over his head to the club finances as a first step! And if you're going to, don't ever again complain that some folks in a club seem to get preferential treatment, or that safety standards are comprimised, because you're part of the problem if you're trying to stomp on people with the NARGC and EGMs as a first step.

Grizzly 45

When you have quite finished slectively reading and opining on my post Sparks and consider dismounting from your moral high horse for a moment.I'll simplyify it for you.
Considering that you missed the point,wether by accident or design, that I made that the most high Poobah was BLIND DRUNK on the firing line,an obvious saftey risk that nothing was been done about,due to social standing or whatever.Also,it was a point being made in sloppiness of certain saftey aspects at flappers.POINT ONE!and totally irrevelant to point two.

POINT TWO
The original OP asked for a solution to a problem.I gave my idea of how it should be done as this is over zealousness on the RO part for no known reason at all.Do YOU know the story going on here??Neither do I.We are working on what we have from the post.Maybe they have,maybe the RO has become a mini Hitler with his power,and wont entertain any discussion on the matter?
And sorry...as I said Money is the only thing that seems to get anyones undivided attention these days.We are forking out enough money these days for this sport without being told now what gun we can or cant use by the PTB,without our own sticking it in as well.So tough titty,if people want membership,be thankful you have members,not do things to discourage them.Personally,if it was me I'd just quit the club and make it known why,and why shouldnt the nARGC be involved ?After all this club is affiliated to them,so they have to play by NARGC standards as well?

Point THREE
Whatever!!

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

the most high Poobah was BLIND DRUNK on the firing line,an obvious saftey risk that nothing was been done about,due to social standing or whatever.

...

this is over zealousness on the RO part for no known reason at all ...as I said Money is the only thing that seems to get anyones undivided attention these days...be thankful you have members,not do things to discourage them.Personally,if it was me I'd just quit the club and make it known why,and why shouldnt the nARGC be involved ?After all this club is affiliated to them,so they have to play by NARGC standards as well?

Seriously Grizzly, just stop.
You can't bemoan standards not being upheld one minute and then demand the club abandon standards to mould itself around members that don't like the rules the next.
And you really can't complain that safety is comprimised because of money, and then the next second state that money's the best tool to use to rein in a club that's doing things you don't like.
That's just... well, I can't think of a polite word for it.

As to the OP, talk to the safety officer about it. For all we know, there's a damn good reason for it, or he's willing to amend the rule.

jwshooter

I WOULD LIKE TO SEE FACEPALMS BANNED .

Grizzly 45

SIGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ok Sparks WHATEVER!! Have the last word..You are right as usual....
.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Vegeta

Bunny can you raise a counter proposal?

Ask around the club first how many semi auto shooters there are and see if they are interested in attending this clay shoot.

If you think you can win a vote, well then, raise a proposal yourself countering the ban on semi autos

Other than that well just boycott the shoot I suppose, vote with your feet and try and get friends of similar thinking to do the same

marlin vs

Vegeta wrote: »

Bunny can you raise a counter proposal?

Ask around the club first how many semi auto shooters there are and see if they are interested in attending this clay shoot.

If you think you can win a vote, well then, raise a proposal yourself countering the ban on semi autos

Other than that well just boycott the shoot I suppose, vote with your feet and try and get friends of similar thinking to do the same

+1. Tell them to stick it.

deerhunter1

bunny shooter wrote: »

One of my NARGC affiliated gun clubs following a proposal by it's new safety officer, who is a registered gun dealer, has banned the use of semi-auto & pump action shot guns at a club clay shoot for "safety reasons" :eek:

Any comments, suggestions or possible legal options/implications?

Is he trying too say the members are not safe? Is he trying to have his own little circle of shooting friends,? is he hoping to drum up buisness and ye all stupidly trade in youre autos and buy U/O's from him,? Have a EGM or AGM and vote him out,get rid of him, he sounds like he is not in touch with the real world. Did he get a majority vote at the meeting to ban autos,? OFF WITH HIS HEAD:mad:

Vegeta

marlin vs wrote: »

+1. Tell them to stick it.

Well my first port of call would be to talk to the chap calmly and see why he wants them banned.

If he is playing silly buggers then try the vote.

Conversation first though

deerhunter1

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Remington 105CTi. Fires shells at ones feet.

I do find a lot of PURIST shotgunners hate Semi's.

The RO should be able to run a range with Semi's on the line. Just put them at the end, or further apart.;)

105CTi ball of s-it

greenpeter

Would it not be in his interest to teach or coach lads using pump action or semis to us them properly, so come shooting season they know how to use them in a safe manner.

bunny shooter

Thanks for all the replies lads

More or less what I expected and knew. Nice to be able to bounce it here though :cool:

There are quite a few semi users in the club, wouldn't be a majority though, most of who could weren't at the AGM.

Hard to know what's behind it tbh. This lad was in the club a few years ago, before my time, and left under a cloud and came back recently. May be some sort of vendetta being played out :rolleyes:

Today I've contacted all the semi users and we are looking for an EGM to be called to sort this.

Will see what happens now

Sparks

bunny shooter wrote: »

Today I've contacted all the semi users and we are looking for an EGM to be called to sort this.

Why not just talk to him before going to that extreme Bunny? I mean, if the guy's just going off on one, that's one thing, but to jump straight to an EGM without even getting on the phone first isn't optimal. Hell, all the shoutiness you've seen on boards over the years has usually been the tail end of years of trying to resolve stuff in private, and failing and winding up at the stage of last resort.

Manic Moran

Oftentimes in Ireland I would use a double-barrel which fired the two cartridges sequentially with subsequent pulls of the single trigger. By definition, it also is a semi-automatic firearm. (Although, granted, not a self-loading one) When taking the survey, please don't forget to count personnel who own such weapons as being affected. (And make sure they know it).

Basically a ban on semi-autos and pumps is one which bans any shotgun except for a single-barreled one with no magazine, or a double-barrelled one with two triggers.

That excludes the vast majority of shotguns used by clay pigeon shooters.

NTM