Another Dealer Gone **No garages named without linking to a source**

bryaner

-Chris- wrote: »

+1 - please don't post hearsay as fact, provide links or sources please

Ill talk to the liquidator when I'm down there next Thursday.

Drummerboy08

bryaner wrote: »

Maybe but I'm a firm believer in looking after one or two brands well as opposed to shoddy service on five.

Not saying thats how your company works but in my experience over the years thats what I have found.

I do see your point. However, I think if the 5 brands are spread out over 10 branches, the problem of shoddy service isnt too bad, as each branch is run on its own merits, not like a multi dealer on one site.

I know this isnt the case with McKeowns, but i'm just pointing out that it is possible.

Is it a trend with dealers who had more than 2 brands under the one roof? Belgard Motors, McKeowns, Cashel Motor works are just a few that come into my head

bryaner

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

I do see your point. However, I think if the 5 brands are spread out over 10 branches, the problem of shoddy service isnt too bad, as each branch is run on its own merits, not like a multi dealer on one site.

I know this isnt the case with McKeowns, but i'm just pointing out that it is possible.

Is it a trend with dealers who had more than 2 brands under the one roof? Belgard Motors, McKeowns, Cashel Motor works are just a few that come into my head

Certainly looking that way, and your setup looks the right way to run a multi franchise with each one running on it's own merits.

Drummerboy08

bryaner wrote: »

Certainly looking that way, and your setup looks the right way to run a multi franchise with each one running on it's own merits.

Maybe its to do with lack of competitive pricing between the different brands under the one roof. If salesman X is selling a Ford at such a price, you can bet salesman Y selling the Mazda across the way knows exactly what he's giving on the trade in, and knows the cost to change.

Where as a multi-site, mulit-franchise dealer wont know what site 1 is giving compared to site 2, if you get me.

bryaner

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

Maybe its to do with lack of competitive pricing between the different brands under the one roof. If salesman X is selling a Ford at such a price, you can bet salesman Y selling the Mazda across the way knows exactly what he's giving on the trade in, and knows the cost to change.

Where as a multi-site, mulit-franchise dealer wont know what site 1 is giving compared to site 2, if you get me.

Yes indeed that makes perfect sense.

TomMc

bryaner wrote: »

He had a good steady dealership years ago, then took on too many franchises and then got involved in property.

Most people would call that greed. How much money do some people want/need.

Well from my experience getting involved in property meant he took his eye off the ball where his motor business was concerned. When a dealer principal is so preoccupied with other things (bigger things), staff can undermine the goodwill of a business when they are not properly managed and supervised. It may go relatively unnoticed in the boom years, but sales drop off a cliff when things get tough. MMcK is a nice chap and put a lot of his own cash in the business (not all borrowings) hoping to ride out the recession. But alas expanded too quickly and at the tail end of the celtic tiger.

Many dealers become multi-franchisees as they know that one or two prestige marques will not sustain their business. And so need to take on more mass market brands. It also stops a local competitor from doing so. They have the economies of scale if they own their own property, but at some point these marques can crossover. So in effect a dealers different showrooms are competing against each other for the same sale from their own client base. Rather than adding to it and bringing in a much higher proportion of new customers.

Lord Nikon

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I thaught that this thread was about someone getting shot.

A business gone down the drain, 50 people out of jobs, and you make a little joke. Nice. This is the Motors forum, not AH. Duh.

opinion guy

-Chris- wrote: »

+1 - please don't post hearsay as fact, provide links or sources please

Fair enough. But just to say this was in the OP's post, I was just commenting on it.

Bigus

Alo Kavanaghs mercedes Dealer sandyford gone &

and Sean Behan Arklow landrover liqudation auction on sat 8th

Any more dealers gone lately ? I here of another one in wicklow town but awaiting confirmation.

R.O.R

Bigus wrote: »

Alo Kavanaghs mercedes Dealer sandyford gone

Any official confirmation on this? Heard the same on Friday on the grapevine, but nothing official yet.

Bigus

Yeah dealer friend had to collect a pre ordered E-class through another outlet.

Big Nasty

Bigus wrote: »

Alo Kavanaghs mercedes Dealer sandyford gone &

and Sean Behan Arklow landrover liqudation auction on sat 8th

Any more dealers gone lately ? I here of another one in wicklow town but awaiting confirmation.

I knew Behans were gone but didn't hear of Alo Kavanahgh's! Anything in writing on that?

Edit: Nevermind re above! Sory to hear it.

VolvoMan

Bigus wrote: »

Alo Kavanaghs mercedes Dealer sandyford gone

I'm really surprised to hear that.

unkel

That's shocking, any confirmation anywhere on Alo Kavanaghs?

Big Nasty

unkel wrote: »

That's shocking, any confirmation anywhere on Alo Kavanaghs?

Made a point of driving past on my way home today. All empty bar what looked like four customers cars outside waiting to be collected. Up until quite recently I worked for an advertising company connected to the trade and they hadn't an extra penny to spend at any stage this year (who does I suppose?). They were good customers of mine prior to that and nice lads to boot. Sad too see them go, especially since they founded in '83, bang in the middle of the last recession.

R.O.R

unkel wrote: »

That's shocking, any confirmation anywhere on Alo Kavanaghs?

The guys we use for Bodywork told me on Friday - they did the bodywork for Alo's.


PITA as we've a C class for service which will now have to go to either Pottery Road (please God NO!), or TR in Harolds Cross.

unkel

In the papers today:

Article

Major Mercedes dealership is latest victim of recession

ONE of the country's best-known Mercedes Benz dealerships, Alo Kavanagh Cars, has become the latest motor casualty of the recession after going into receivership.

The business, based in the Sandyford Industrial Estate in Dublin, specialised in new and quality used Mercedes as well as offering customers after-sales service.

But the recession has seen demand for top-end cars plummet and the business, which has 17 employees, is to be sold as a going concern.

Last night receiver Liam Dowdall at Smith and Williamson Freaney confirmed the process began on Monday and that he had already been made aware of interest from a number of franchises.

"We will be advertising the business for sale as a going concern. It is a prime location with very good showrooms," he said.

The most recent records at the Companies Office for the 27-year-old enterprise, dated October of last year, showed Alo Kavanagh Cars owed short-term creditors almost €1.8m and long-term creditors almost €1.9m.

The company suffered losses of almost €680,000 last year and over €800,000 in 2008 while the two directors, Mr Kavanagh and Derek Kelly, were paid salaries totalling €275,000 between them in 2009.

At the time the records were filed, the company had almost €500,000 worth of cars on its forecourts, considerably down on the same figure for 2008 when it was holding €1.2m worth of cars.

Challenging

The directors' report noted that "the current economic environment is challenging" and that "the outlook over the next year presents significant challenges in terms of car sales volumes and pricing.

"Whilst the directors have instituted measures to preserve cash and secure additional finance, these circumstances create material uncertainties over future trading results and cash flows."

-Chris-

I'm really sorry to hear that. Derek, Caimin and the rest were always great to deal with in my experience.

Big Nasty

-Chris- wrote: »

I'm really sorry to hear that. Derek, Caimin and the rest were always great to deal with in my experience.

I always thought Derek was the sales manager, didn't realise he was one of the directors.

MidlandsM

Sorry to hear this - feck, its tough on the staff and I'm sure the owners to loose what they built up.

conor678

My mate was a mechanic in Ainsley Motors Ballybough in the north inner city Dublin and that dealership closed a couple of weeks ago. Specialized in Mercs and VW. He said the place was dead for about 6 months. He said in the boom they were raking it in and scandalously over charging for merc services.

Shame because it was a long established business in Dublin. Just wonder did the owner get himself burned in the property bubble.

R.O.R

MidlandsM wrote: »

Sorry to hear this - feck, its tough on the staff and I'm sure the owners to loose what they built up.

Unfortunately I don't think this will be the last one this year either

MidlandsM

R.O.R wrote: »

Unfortunately I don't think this will be the last one this year either

nope - another -

http://www.insolvencyjournal.ie/more_details/10-10-13/Niall_Harmon_Motor_Co_Limited.aspx

R.O.R

MidlandsM wrote: »

nope - another -

http://www.insolvencyjournal.ie/more_details/10-10-13/Niall_Harmon_Motor_Co_Limited.aspx

That's a creditor meeting, which doesn't mean they are going out of business. Just means they owe a few people a bit of cash.

-Chris-

I was over in Sandyford Industrial Estate today and it was depressing to see the doors closed and the lights off in Alo's.

I know we've been through tough times and I've seen a lot of my friends and colleagues made redundant, but for some reason I had it in my head that we were through the worst of it. Alo's would be a landmark dealership in the Sandyford "Motor Mall" and were at the start of the change from industrial estate to retail & residential park.

Today I'm a sad panda .

Big Nasty

-Chris- wrote: »

I was over in Sandyford Industrial Estate today and it was depressing to see the doors closed and the lights off in Alo's.

I know we've been through tough times and I've seen a lot of my friends and colleagues made redundant, but for some reason I had it in my head that we were through the worst of it. Alo's would be a landmark dealership in the Sandyford "Motor Mall" and were at the start of the change from industrial estate to retail & residential park.

Today I'm a sad panda .

I always presumed you worked in the dealership next door Chris, i.e. ex-Audi dealership that still holds thw VW franchise.

In relation to the 'Niall Harmon' post I never heard of him as a dealer - indy mechanic / bodyshop?

EDIT: I thought it was over too man.

-Chris-

I've been many things to many people, and I'll never give away my real identity :P:D

Big Nasty

-Chris- wrote: »

I've been many things to many people, and I'll never give away my real identity :P:D

I've worked in the advertising section of the trade for the last few years but have moved on to a different industry now but never mentioned the company I worked for at the time for similar reasons. Always strived to keep my opinions impartial as a few on here know.

R.O.R

-Chris- wrote: »

I've been many things to many people, and I'll never give away my real identity :P:D

We all know you are the Batman :cool:

shaywest

-Chris- wrote: »

I was over in Sandyford Industrial Estate today and it was depressing to see the doors closed and the lights off in Alo's.

I know we've been through tough times and I've seen a lot of my friends and colleagues made redundant, but for some reason I had it in my head that we were through the worst of it. Alo's would be a landmark dealership in the Sandyford "Motor Mall" and were at the start of the change from industrial estate to retail & residential park.

Today I'm a sad panda .

what's the betting they'll be back open in six months under a similar name (and a clean slate)

-Chris-

As I understand the dealership is being sold as a going concern, so you will see another dealership there but it probably won't be a Merc dealer and won't be owned/run by the same people.

R.O.R

shaywest wrote: »

what's the betting they'll be back open in six months under a similar name (and a clean slate)

Doubt it.

If they weren't making money now, how will they make money in a few months time?

MidlandsM

R.O.R wrote: »

That's a creditor meeting, which doesn't mean they are going out of business. Just means they owe a few people a bit of cash.

It means the inevitable.

-Chris-

Let's not speculate on it though, it's not fair to pre-judge.

-Corkie-

Its a sad state of affairs to see a dealer like this go. They were actually very nice people to deal with. I didnt think we would see any more casualties this year..

bryaner

MidlandsM wrote: »

It means the inevitable.

I have to agree.

-Chris-

We don't speculate on the future of garages/garage closures unless you can provide a link to a source.

MidlandsM

-Chris- wrote: »

We don't speculate on the future of garages/garage closures unless you can provide a link to a source.

Alan Nolan, Director General of the Society of the Irish Motor Industry (SIMI), is a man who likes to accentuate the positive.


“We need to encourage a return to normal life and stop concentrating on how bad things are,” he says. “If you try and incentivise a return to normal life and people go back to more normal patterns that it actually carries through and there are positive results from it.”

He’s also cautiously upbeat about the current state of the Irish motor industry. “There’s a sense of confidence that wasn’t there last year,” he says, before warning, “but you have to put a rider on it to say it’s actually kind of fragile.”

It’s been a good year for Irish motoring, with new car registrations up significantly on last year’s figures, the scrappage scheme announced in last year’s budget having a major positive effect, and even the possibility of job gains.

The recovery has come from a particularly low starting point, though. Nolan took over his position in early 2008, and even he struggles to put a positive spin on the plight of the motoring industry from July of that year, when motor tax was linked to emissions. This hit dealers hard, he says, writing a third off the value of used stock.

Then the global economic downturn happened.

“It was almost like a perfect storm,” he recalls. “If you add to [the new tax regime] the fact of the international financial crisis hitting in 2008; difficulties for dealers and obtaining and retaining funding for their own businesses, in getting finance for customers wanting to buy cars; consumers worrying about their futures; people just stopping buying cars. You had so many things, and any one of them happening would have been terrible.”

The industry’s difficulties continued in 2009, when around 100 businesses and 11,000 jobs were lost – “we were hemorrhaging jobs” – and the prospects for 2010 were just as bleak. “We were likely to looking at another five, six, seven or eight thousand jobs going this year.”

So, SIMI lobbied Government for the introduction of a scrappage scheme, which has been more successful than even SIMI imagined. Speaking to insolvencyjournal.ie earlier this year, Nolan anticipated new car sales somewhere around 70,000 (the 2009 figure was just 57,000); he says sales are already at approximately 85,000 this year, and expects them to end up somewhere near 88,000.

The scrappage scheme has had two major benefits, he believes. Firstly, “people who are in the business of buying a scrappage scheme car have to have a 10-year-old car, so they’re not people who are normally in the business of buying a new car.

“So you are trying to generate extra business. This is business that doesn’t require the State to give away money to people who would normally buy a car, as a giveaway.”

“The Government has probably taken an extra €100 million in VRT and VAT on the new cars sold.”

Secondly, it has acted as a catalyst for others to buy cars, and to recognise that buying a new car is a normal, acceptable thing do. He believes that there may have been a group of people who believed that it was inappropriate to buy a new car while their businesses were down-sizing and jobs were being lost. The scrappage was a useful antidote to this mindset.


“The message ‘scrappage’ has given people is that it’s actually okay to change your car, there’s nothing wrong with driving a car with ‘10’ on registration number,” he says. “It’s like priming a pump.”

The scheme has also changed the profile of cars being purchased. “We’re seeing certainly a very strong move towards lower emitting vehicles. It doesn’t necessarily mean that people are buying smaller cars.”

“Manufacturers have been working very hard to produce cars across their whole ranges that are lower in CO2 emissions. You will find some quite substantial vehicles in the A or B categories, which nobody would have expected a number of years ago.”

This statement is borne out by figures released this week by the CSO, which showed that while the number of private cars registered in September 2010 was double that of September 2009 (4,683 and 2,272, respectively), the rises were in the lower-emissions A (525 in September 2009, 2,081 last month) and B (1,528 to 3,034) bands, while there were reductions in the higher-emissions D (926 dropping to 586), E (545 to 287), and F (276 to 171) bands.

But the recovery is fragile, and there are signs everywhere of the industry’s precarious position. This week a receiver was appointed to Alo Kavanagh Mercedes Dealership in Dublin. Nolan says that some 40 companies have gone under this year. A creditors meeting is due to be held later this month for Niall Harmon Motor Co. Limited.

Nolan says that SIMI is grateful to the Government for the introduction of the scrappage scheme, and that it would like to see it extended in the forthcoming budget. SIMI does not want it extended indefinitely, however.

“We would say it say it makes eminent sense to look for a continuation of it even for the first number of months next year,” he says. He believes that ending the scheme at the end of this year would be huge risk for the Government to take, as it would lead to a flurry of late purchasing, and might have significant negative effects on the industry’s peak selling period early next year.

The risk is, he says, that “you can’t recover from a bad start. If January, February and March don’t produce good levels of sales, that’s bad news for us, but it’s atrocious news for the Government because there’s no way back in gaining VAT and VRT.”

He accepts that registration tax is on the agenda for what is going to be a tough budget but says that flat euro increases rather than percentage increases would be a fairer change to “what is a very skewed system at the minute”.

He also warns against increasing VRT excessively. “Continuing the scrappage scheme gives the impetus to sell more cars, the more cars sold, the more VRT and VAT that will be collected. [But] If they took the other view, of looking to increase VRT, there’s a real danger that what they’ll do is slow down the sales of cars.”

A man who clearly delights in the process of buying and selling cars - “It’s about selling excitement, a dream”, he says – Nolan is positive, overall, about the future for the motor industry.

If the recovery can continue, and sales rise above 100,000 next year, “there are great reasons for people to be confident,” he says, “and when you look longer down the road, and you say, no matter what happens, there is a requirement to replace cars, for companies and people.”

Grimreaper666

He should read the Secret or maybe he already has. But meanwhile in the real world people just aren't spending money and have no intention of until at least after the budget, the worst possible time for retail too to have a budget in December.
It gives you an insight as to how out of touch the government is when it comes to business in general.

-Chris-

This isn't difficult MidlandsM & Bryaner.

Niall Harmon Motor Co. Limited have called a creditors meeting. This neither means that they are going bust or that their going bust is inevitable.

The results of the meeting will dictate their future.

If/when you can provide a link to the closure of the dealership, you can comment on it here. Otherwise you can't

If you continue with this line of discussion you will be banned from Motors for a week.

shaywest

R.O.R wrote: »

Doubt it.

If they weren't making money now, how will they make money in a few months time?

Mooneys ?

MidlandsM

-Chris- wrote: »

This isn't difficult MidlandsM & Bryaner.

no, but maybe you can be? :rolleyes:

http://www.vision-net.ie/barometerRWMeetingsByWeek.jsp?t=1

The creditors meeting is to appoint a liquidator - it's game over unfortunately.

Its a pity...

-Chris-

MidlandsM wrote: »

no, but maybe you can be? :rolleyes:

Drop the attitude please, it's not appreciated. I'm just trying to keep the rules consistently applied.

MidlandsM wrote: »

http://www.vision-net.ie/barometerRWMeetingsByWeek.jsp?t=1

The creditors meeting is to appoint a liquidator - it's game over unfortunately.

Its a pity...

Perfect, thanks for the link and I wish you had posted it earlier. Feel free to discuss this then.

MidlandsM

-Chris- wrote: »

Drop the attitude please, it's not appreciated.

nor is your's in the first instance. It cuts both ways. Bad hair day?;)

-Chris-

MidlandsM wrote: »

nor is your's in the first instance. It cuts both ways. Bad hair day?;)

MidlandsM banned for a week for arguing with mod instruction on-thread.

neilster

shaywest wrote: »

what's the betting they'll be back open in six months under a similar name (and a clean slate)

Looking for advice on this in regards to Alo Kavanagh , the premises is now for sale through the reciever

The staff are now laid off and full accounts are available for interested parties

In situations like this where the garage is being sold as a going concern (that is the recievers words not mine)has Mercedes ended the arrangement entirely with the garage what usually occurs ?

only people with pertinent facts on this , a nice chat about is all and well but not that informative , also some views on the location? all fine and well when economy is flying but a backwater when every passerby is worried about their job

as to my motives i have spoken to the reciever and thats all im saying

cheers

Bigus

Notwithstanding that it is being sold as a going concern, and currently has the benifit of being a mercedes dealership, you would be advised to do due diligence and talk directly to mercedes to see what the current situation is. (I'm sure the receiver would say the same ) My personal opinion is that all bets would be off with Mercedes except for the fact the there is the historical situation with that site and branding, so they may look more favourably at this than an untested site.

-Chris-

Bigus is correct - you need to talk to Mercedes Ireland.

Neither the receiver nor anyone here will be able to confirm for you whether the Merc franchise will stay with the premises.

The information that I have is that it will no longer be a Mercedes dealer, but that is not based on any verifiable information.

It certainly wouldn't automatically remain a Merc dealer - Merc will want to ensure that whoever purchases the dealership will operate to their standards and play ball with their way of doing things. New contracts will need to be signed etc. You can't just inherit a Mercedes dealership by purchasing the building.

Call Mercedes Ireland if you're really serious about this.

kimi01

neilster wrote: »

Looking for advice on this in regards to Alo Kavanagh , the premises is now for sale through the reciever

The staff are now laid off and full accounts are available for interested parties

In situations like this where the garage is being sold as a going concern (that is the recievers words not mine)has Mercedes ended the arrangement entirely with the garage what usually occurs ?

only people with pertinent facts on this , a nice chat about is all and well but not that informative , also some views on the location? all fine and well when economy is flying but a backwater when every passerby is worried about their job

The Mercedes franchise goes with Mr Kavanagh, he has to be main shareholder to keep it. I gather the recievers are talking to other franchise options, Citroen being talked with heavily!

crosstownk

kimi01 wrote: »

I gather the recievers are talking to other franchise options, Citroen being talked with heavily!

Are you saying that the receivers are going to go into business and take on a franchise and run it?