Meteor; Change of billpay terms; get out of contract?

Covey

adrian522 wrote: »

ok, can someone answer this, according to the reg, all you have to do is confirm to meteor in writing that you are not happy with the new T&C's and that you wish to be released from your contract.

Now Meteor are saying that you must return the phone but surely once youve sent this letter they are obliged to release you from the contract and the ownership of the phone is a separate(but related) issue which they must pursue separately. They cant hold you to the contract one youve indicated that you are not happy with the new T&C's after august 22nd.

Secondly what would meteor do if you had lost your phone since you signed up? Do you have to buy a new one(unsubsidised) in order to get out of your contract.

The phone does not become your property on cancelling your contract, for legitimate reasons as here, as far as I can see.

Yes if you lose your phone and have no insurance it's up to you to buy/source a new one! Again I don't know how they'd enforce this !

evolutionqy7

why does every one keep going on about returning the phones?

i canceled my contract and no one mentioned anything about me being required to bring back the phone...same for alot of ppl here...

SteM

evolutionqy7 wrote: »

why does every one keep going on about returning the phones?

i canceled my contract and no one mentioned anything about me being required to bring back the phone...same for alot of ppl here...

A lot of peope have contacted them and they have been told the will have to return the phone on cancellation of the contract. That's the only reason this is being discussed.

NothingMan

SallyCooper wrote: »

Hey Guys
Does anybody know if you have to give your billpay phone back if you decide to get out of contract due to it being void??

How about you just read the last few pages of the thread for yourself?

SallyCooper

Hey Guys

I called meteor yesterday and they said it is perfectly fine to get out of contract but i must return my phone, i am searching everywhere in there contract to see if this is so, if anyone could enlighten me I would much appreciate it!

cormie

I just rang up there anyway and it was fine to get me out of contract but as far as I was aware, I'd be able to stay on the same deal I signed up to (but just not be in contract), ie, 200min/200texts a month for 25eur and then the data add on of 10gb for 15eur.

I was told I wouldn't be able to stay on this and would have to either go to PAYG or sign up to bill pay lite

If this is the case, what package/deal would be closest to the one I'm on while still keeping out of contract would anyone know?

Posted that yesterday but still don't know what the story is. I thought I'd be able to stay on the same package?

jbwan

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Would I be correct in reading these terms as meaning "Meteor own the phone for 12/18 months after connection to the network"? Nowhere is the Minimum Period defined as being related to the actual contract. (Not taking "Meteor's side" BTW...)

They only have a tie to it for the duration of the initial contract 12/18 months. Any break in this by them, releases the handset.

cojomo2

cormie wrote: »

Posted that yesterday but still don't know what the story is. I thought I'd be able to stay on the same package?

Have a look at the sim only plans( bill pay lite) on their website, 30 day contract.

NothingMan

I have just emailed o2 asking, from their experiences, why they did or could not demand the subsidised handsets back when many of their customers left last month when they were in the exact same situation.

I obviously didn't ask them to discuss Meteors situation just their own, in hopes they shed some light on the legality of meteors handset return policy.

They lost several customers due to their changes and with the release of iPhone 4 i'm sure they would love to see the only carrier not selling the iPhone releasing cistomers from contracts in hopes they shift to o2 for the iPhone.

Don't know if they'll respond but worth a try. When I shifted to Meteor with the iPhone they asked if I was getting out of contract (I wasn't) and were more than happy to take o2's customers with their subsidised iPhones in tow. Now the tables have turned I am not surprised to see Meteor attempt to stem the hemmorhage of customers by any means neccessary.

SallyCooper

I'm not too sure of the formalities surrounding contract law but just from my own perspective if a contract is broke by either party all terms are void. Although I have called them and have been told the same as you Guys its just a waiting game to see who bites the bullet and goes ahead with the cancellation.. maybe you would be kind enough to let us all know the consequence

cojomo2

SallyCooper wrote: »

I'm not too sure of the formalities surrounding contract law but just from my own perspective if a contract is broke by either party all terms are void. Although I have called them and have been told the same as you Guys its just a waiting game to see who bites the bullet and goes ahead with the cancellation.. maybe you would be kind enough to let us all know the consequence

Not sure if that's correct. If that's the case, say I sign a 12 month contract, and break one of their terms such as paying a bill way too late, now that I have broken one of the terms, that's hardly going to make all the other terms void, which I could then use to my advantage?

SallyCooper

cojomo2 wrote: »

Not sure if that's correct. If that's the case, say I sign a 12 month contract, and break one of their terms such as paying a bill way too late, now that I have broken one of the terms, that's hardly going to make all the other terms void, which I could then use to my advantage?

But I am not changing the terms of a contract by just not paying my bill, the terms are still staying the same hence a monthly payment will still be due each month and then I will be in arrears but by Meteor changing the price plan on there internet charges they are in breach of contract. As I said already I am not a pro surrounding contract Law so if my view is completely wrong it is just a suggestion.

Covey

SallyCooper wrote: »

But I am not changing the terms of a contract by just not paying my bill, the terms are still staying the same hence a monthly payment will still be due each month and then I will be in arrears but by Meteor changing the price plan on there internet charges they are in breach of contract. As I said already I am not a pro surrounding contract Law so if my view is completely wrong it is just a suggestion.

Altering the terms of a contract does not automatically make the contract void. It does give you a right to exit the contract without penalty though.

If you don't exit the contract the original contract remains with an altered condition (s) .

hobochris

Covey wrote: »

Altering the terms of a contract does not automatically make the contract void. It does give you a right to exit the contract without penalty though.

If you don't exit the contract the original contract remains with an altered condition (s) .

No it doesn't, providing both parties agree to the revised terms, which in this case they do not.

Just to clear something up, You are not exiting the contract, Meteor are revising the terms of the contract, to differ to those agree'd to by both parties, Meteor are the ones not honouring the agreed terms for contract.

The new terms are irrelevant as you don't have to agree to them, the issue is meteor not honouring the mutually agreed terms as per the beginning of the contract, hence voiding the contract.

Meteor are not giving the option to continue with the original contract with the original terms, so they are the ones breaching the contract and making all terms and conditions of the contract null and void.

Covey

hobochris wrote: »

they are the ones breaching the contract and making all terms and conditions of the contract null and void.

simply not true.

If that was the case everyone that agrees to stay with Meteor would be issued with a new contract and that won't be happening.

Contract Law doesn't work like that.

cojomo2

What it boils down to is this:

We are able to leave our contracts, no one is questioning that, the issues surrounds the handsets, and whether or not we have to surrender them to Meteor without being refunded for them.

I believe we do not. Think about it, say for example meteor launched the iphone4, and thousands signed up to one of their plans and paid 299 euro for the handset. If what Meteor is claiming is true, they could then alter their terms,and say charge 2euro/min for out of bundle calls(extreme example). In this case, customers that have just signed up would of course opt out, saying they don't agree and wish to be removed from contract.Do you think meteor could then say " oh ok, just give us your 300 euro iPhone back and off you go, no refund for that", of course not, so why do they think they can do it now?They surely cannot.

hobochris

Covey wrote: »

simply not true.

If that was the case everyone that agrees to stay with Meteor would be issued with a new contract and that won't be happening.

Contract Law doesn't work like that.

No they wouldn't be issued a new contract, they are simply agreeing to the amended terms of the current contract, so in effect the other unamended terms such as minimum term and start date remain the same, but the amended contract must be agreed to, the same as a new contract would need to be.

The original contract has provisions for these amendments to take place providing all parties agree to the amendments.

If all parties do not agree to the amendments and either party refuses to honour the original agreement that constitutes a breech in contract, making the contract null and void at the discretion of the non breaching party. It is only at the discretion of the non breeching party that the amended contract may continue.

Should they decide they do not wish to continue it is still the other party(Meteor) that has breeched the contract.

Covey

hobochris wrote: »

No they wouldn't be issued a new contract, they are simply agreeing to the amended terms of the current contract, so in effect the other unamended terms such as minimum term and start date remain the same, but the amended contract must be agreed to, the same as a new contract would need to be.

The original contract has provisions for these amendments to take place providing all parties agree to the amendments.

If all parties do not agree to the amendments and either party refuses to honour the original agreement that constitutes a breech in contract, making the contract null and void at the discretion of the non breaching party. It is only at the discretion of the non breeching party that the amended contract may continue.

Should they decide they do not wish to continue it is still the other party(Meteor) that has breeched the contract.

Gald to see you've come around to my way of thinking from your previous "they are the ones breaching the contract and making all terms and conditions of the contract null and void"

Covey

cojomo2 wrote: »

What it boils down to is this:

We are able to leave our contracts, no one is questioning that, the issues surrounds the handsets, and whether or not we have to surrender them to Meteor without being refunded for them.

I believe we do not. Think about it, say for example meteor launched the iphone4, and thousands signed up to one of their plans and paid 299 euro for the handset. If what Meteor is claiming is true, they could then alter their terms,and say charge 2euro/min for out of bundle calls(extreme example). In this case, customers that have just signed up would of course opt out, saying they don't agree and wish to be removed from contract.Do you think meteor could then say " oh ok, just give us your 300 euro iPhone back and off you go, no refund for that", of course not, so why do they think they can do it now?They surely cannot.

If it's in the contract of course they can do it

cojomo2

Covey wrote: »

If it's in the contract of course they can do it

All it says in the contract is that meteor own the handset until the minimum period is up.

So if they change the terms of the contract I signed , and I don't agree and as a result meteor set me free from the contract well then and that point surely I am not bound by any terms and conditions of any contract?

Covey

cojomo2 wrote: »

All it says in the contract is that meteor own the handset until the minimum period is up.

So if they change the terms of the contract I signed , and I don't agree and as a result meteor set me free from the contract well then and that point surely I am not bound by any terms and conditions of any contract?

The contract is over and you must give back the phone as the minimum period in the contract was not fullfilled.

hobochris

Covey wrote: »

Gald to see you've come around to my way of thinking from your previous "they are the ones breaching the contract and making all terms and conditions of the contract null and void"

This is still the case.

If one change in terms is not agree'd to, then the whole contract(as it was) is void.

the original contract and the proposed amended contract are separate although related(providing the terms are agreed to) entities.

Covey wrote: »

The contract is over and you must give back the phone as the minimum period in the contract was not fullfilled.

This condition is defined within the contract therefore is void when meteor breech the contract, when meteor void the contract the customer is released from all terms of the contract, including the minimum period, therefore ownership of the phone transfers to the customer on contract breech by meteor.

cojomo2

Covey wrote: »

The contract is over and you must give back the phone as the minimum period in the contract was not fullfilled.

The contract is over,and none of it's conditions were broken by the customer.Once it is over, it doesn't matter what's the terms state, as it's an old,completed contract, and with none of the terms having been breached by the customer.

Covey

hobochris wrote: »

This is still the case.

If one change in terms is not agree'd to, then the whole contract(as it was) is void.

If a change is not agreed to you can cancel the contract as many have done. No penalties.

However the provisions relating to cancelling the contract early, for whatever reason still are effective. If one of those conditions is you give the phone back, then you must give the phone back.

partyatmygaff

Has anyone managed to get out of contract without needing to surrender their phone?

Covey

cojomo2 wrote: »

The contract is over,and none of it's conditions were broken by the customer.Once it is over, it doesn't matter what's the terms state, as it's an old,completed contract, and with none of the terms having been breached by the customer.

Regardless of who ends the contract the conditions set out for such an eventuality are still in force, where they are still legal.

hobochris

Covey wrote: »

Regardless of who ends the contract the conditions set out for such an eventuality are still in force, where they are still legal.

when the contract is void, all terms and conditions are no longer applicable.

Covey

hobochris wrote: »

This condition is defined within the contract therefore is void when meteor breech the contract, when meteor void the contract the customer is released from all terms of the contract, including the minimum period, therefore ownership of the phone transfers to the customer on contract breech by meteor.

I wish that were true but it's not. That scenario is specifically outlined in the contract.

Covey

hobochris wrote: »

when the contract is void, all terms and conditions are no longer applicable.

We'll agree to differ. Do let me know how you get on though

Davd

Just a quick question - I signed up to a contract and since got a 250MB data add on. Am I also entitled to leave the contract or is it only for those that have a data plan included in their original contract?