Traveller's surnames

WindSock

aDeener wrote: »

there's more jesus' than christ ya know....


comparing the tinkers to aborigines and maoris..... what planet are you on?

Uhm, the same one as them?

I don't think you got my post. In relation to the OPs question, he/she reckoned the travellers aren't a separate ethnic group from the settled population due to having the same surnames as us. Therefore any other population with the same surname would surely be from the same group as us

aDeener

WindSock wrote: »

Uhm, the same one as them?

I don't think you got my post. In relation to the OPs question, he/she reckoned the travellers aren't a separate ethnic group from the settled population due to having the same surnames as us. Therefore any other population with the same surname would surely be from the same group as us

you are correct, i did not get your post.

apologies

rossie1977

Ozil wrote: »

Does anyone know someone with the last name "Joyce" who isn't a traveller ?

loads, what about Pádraic joyce the galway gaa player

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nz-mCcJGdSo

billy the squid

krudler wrote: »

Why are they all called John-Paul and Kathleen anyway?

Don't know about Kathleen, but John Paul may have something to do with the previous pope. John Paul II, reflecting the strong religeous beliefs within the community.

prinz

billy the squid wrote: »

Also, it is worth point out that many of the residents of Monserat have Irish surnames, even though most of them are black. Names change and are pretty much bastardised over the centuries. One possibility , and as what happened in Ellis Island in the 1800s, names were changed by the authorities to ones which were easier to pronounce. It is possible that English occupiers gave local Irish English sounding names.

This is simple. The first white occupiers in Monserrat were Irish, not English. This is also why the towns on the Island are named after irish towns such as Kinsale. The Irish settlers moved to Monserrat after being treated as second class landlords/political infighting with their English neighbours elsewhere in the Carribean. The traditional practice IIRC was to give slaves / plantation workers the surname of the landlord.

fontanalis

Lifestlye/way of life is probably a better description than ethnicity.

fontanalis

WindSock wrote: »

No I don't think I mentioned Jesus. Is Christ an Irish surname too?

You never seen The Passion of the Ward?

trad

Cash, Nash and Conners all played Wimbledon one year.

Seoige is the Irish for Joyce, there's some nice looking Seoige's around.

billy the squid

trad wrote: »

Cash, Nash and Conners all played Wimbledon one year.

Seoige is the Irish for Joyce, there's some nice looking Seoige's around.

But is Seoige the Irish for Joyce, or is Joyce the English for Seoige?

trad

Sin ceist maith

SIX PACK

Ozil wrote: »

Does anyone know someone with the last name "Joyce" who isn't a traveller ?

Their is lots of ppl . . . James Joyce of the 1916 Uprising... Padraig Joyce Galway Footballer... to name but a few

Terry

Degsy wrote: »

I thought you said you were a nurse!

No,i said i was a ward sister!

Brilliant.

billy the squid wrote: »

Also, it is worth point out that many of the residents of Monserat have Irish surnames, even though most of them are black.

Names change and are pretty much bastardised over the centuries. One possibility , and as what happened in Ellis Island in the 1800s, names were changed by the authorities to ones which were easier to pronounce. It is possible that English occupiers gave local Irish English sounding names.

The Irish in Montserrat were actually slaves.
They were treated worse than the African slaves because they were much cheaper to buy.
You would often have slave owners kill an Irish slave in front of the African ones to set an example. His head would then be placed on a pike as a reminder.

The reason many of them are black is because of attempts to create super slaves by forcing African males to procreate with Irish women.

http://www.africaresource.com/rasta/sesostris-the-great-the-egyptian-hercules/the-irish-slave-trade-forgotten-white-slaves/

There's plenty of reading on it, if you're bothered looking. Just a pity were aren't taught this in school.

jpb1974 wrote: »

I found 'After Hours' today and after 36 years of living I've never seen so much racism in one place.

Good luck... I'm done here.

I laughed.

prinz wrote: »

This is simple. The first white occupiers in Monserrat were Irish, not English. This is also why the towns on the Island are named after irish towns such as Kinsale. The Irish settlers moved to Monserrat after being treated as second class landlords/political infighting with their English neighbours elsewhere in the Carribean. The traditional practice IIRC was to give slaves / plantation workers the surname of the landlord.

See above.

jpb1974

Mod: Pro Wrestling

I laughed too.

jpb1974

jpb1974 wrote: »

I laughed too.

Probably a bit harder too

John C

WalterMitty wrote: »

Why do they have irish surnames if they are a different ethnic group?

Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Traveller#Origins

Irish Travellers are recognised in British law as an ethnic group.[7] Ireland, however, does not recognise them as an ethnic group; rather, their legal status is that of a "social group".[8] An ethnic group is defined as one whose members identify with each other, usually on the basis of a presumed common genealogy or ancestry. Ethnic identity is also marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness and by common cultural, linguistic, religious, behavioural or biological traits.

Notes and references
7.^ Commission for Racial Equality: Gypsies and Irish Travellers: The facts
8.^ Irish Travellers Movement: Traveller Legal Resource Pack 2 - Traveller Culture
Both web sites are currently offline or cannot be found.

Wikipedia is not the most reliable source of information in the world.

My standpoint
Travellers are Irish citizens in their own social group. That they have Irish names is no astonishment. If we could trace back into history long enough, we could find that any posters here with an Irish surname and member of the travelling community have a common ancestor. This great, great.....grandparent could have lived (many) hundreds of years ago.

This ancestor tracing is hypothetical, but used to bring out a point. I know little about Genetics and DNA analysis.

sligopark

John C wrote: »

Travellers are Irish citizens in their own social group.

social by choice - perhaps they could create a new ethnic group by way of a new soical surname

and be better able to recognise the golden hoops leading to the local set down point

McTraveller






McLoving them somewhere else other than near you...

grenache

Ozil wrote: »

Does anyone know someone with the last name "Joyce" who isn't a traveller ?

There are plenty of travellers who don't actually live in Tuam you know.

Jordan Berbatov

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
A traveller if ever iv seen one, shlippery head on the lad.

Anyway travellers and roman gypsys are deservedly the lowest of the low, they do themselves no favours.

sligopark

Jordan Berbatov wrote: »

Anyway travellers and roman gypsys are deservedly the lowest of the low, they do themselves no favours.

Ah gaysus - surely you don't mean begging, robbing and embezzzlement?

Jordan Berbatov

sligopark wrote: »

Ah gaysus - surely you don't mean begging, robbing and embezzzlement?

Add fighting, intimidation, and their general negative contribution to society and we're in business

sligopark

Jordan Berbatov wrote: »

Add fighting, intimidation, and their general negative contribution to society and we're in business

OMG its Saturday nite and its traveller bashing

ottostreet

jpb1974 wrote: »

Probably a bit harder too

I think you need to lighten up. In AH, its almost obligatory to be pricks about everything.

Catari Jaguar

LOL @ Christ being Jesus' surname :rolleyes:

sligopark

grenache wrote: »

There are plenty of travellers who don't actually live in Tuam you know.

unfortunately we all know

robbie_998

jpb1974 wrote: »

I found 'After Hours' today and after 36 years of living I've never seen so much racism in one place.

Good luck... I'm done here.

well if thats not your kinda thing then there's quite a bit of sexism going on over in Motors :pac:

sligopark

jpb1974 wrote: »

I found 'After Hours' today and after 36 years of living I've never seen so much racism in one place.

Good luck... I'm done here.

racism? travellers? lol

bye

kielmanator

sligopark wrote: »

OMG its Saturday morning and its traveller bashing

FYP:D

Pittens

In relation to the OPs question, he/she reckoned the travellers aren't a separate ethnic group from the settled population due to having the same surnames as us. Therefore any other population with the same surname would surely be from the same group as us

Not really. People who are not Irish with Irish names elsewhere are either

1) Of part irish descent.
2) In the case of slaves in the US may have taken a master's name. ( Although that doesnt rule out 1) either )

So 1) specifically does not prove the rule.

If travellers have Gaelic surnames that is because they are us.

Pittens

By the way - anybody notice the complete about turn the politically correct mind is taught to think as regards race in general and travellers specifically.

For everybody else, for people who have exisited on the other side of the world and who look different in skin colour, eye shape etc. the PC chant is "There is no difference:race is a social construct".


For travellers the racist thing is to say it is a social construct

orourkeda

bluewolf wrote: »

Are they decent? Who knows!

They're daycent

Mike 1972

Pittens wrote: »

the complete about turn the politically correct mind is taught to think as regards race in general and travellers specifically.

You were saying something about constructs...................

Fozzie Bear

Ozil wrote: »

Does anyone know someone with the last name "Joyce" who isn't a traveller?

Maybe this would have been a better question?

Does anyone know someone with the last name "Mongan" who isn't a traveller?

I have never come across this surname being anything but an exclusively traveller one. I know a load of Joyce, Ward/Warde, McDonagh, Barrett families who are not traveller releated. But it would seem Mongan is a traditional traveller family name. Open to correction on this

Our man in Havana

Connors is another very common surname for travellers. Remember Blackie Connors from Glenroe?

billy the squid

Pittens wrote: »

By the way - anybody notice the complete about turn the politically correct mind is taught to think as regards race in general and travellers specifically.

For everybody else, for people who have exisited on the other side of the world and who look different in skin colour, eye shape etc. the PC chant is "There is no difference:race is a social construct".


For travellers the racist thing is to say it is a social construct

There is a diference between race and ethnicity.

billy the squid

Fozzie Bear wrote: »

Maybe this would have been a better question?

Does anyone know someone with the last name "Mongan" who isn't a traveller?

I have never come across this surname being anything but an exclusively traveller one. I know a load of Joyce, Ward/Warde, McDonagh, Barrett families who are not traveller releated. But it would seem Mongan is a traditional traveller family name. Open to correction on this

Mongan is an english translation of the name O Mongain

As in http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/worldcup2007/qtcolmomongain.html

sligopark

billy the squid wrote: »

There is a diference between race and ethnicity.

from wiki:

Race describes biological descent. Ethnicity describes cultural heritage.

Ethnicity is learned, race is inherited.

Gaysus I could have a field day with this

I_AmThe_Walrus

"Travelers" aren't real.

They are fictions of your subconscious.

They were made up to scare little children.

WIZE

What is the Biggest Traveller Clan ( if thats what you call it ) in Ireland ?

sligopark

why?

WIZE

sligopark wrote: »

why?

I wanna know :rolleyes:

DB10

Someone make a list of them. There isn't that many.

Yakult

MARY ELLEN THREASA McCARTY C'MERE I WANTCHAAAA

Big Nasty

Most of them are Mc-somethings, e.g. McDonagh, McDermott, McMullen, etc.

Yes, they're all Mackers!

longshanks

MCMLXXV wrote: »

Most of them are Mc-somethings, e.g. McDonagh, McDermott, McMullen, etc.

Yes, they're all Mackers!

Apart from the Quilligans, Burkes, Mulrooneys, O Reillys.........

CorkMan

I heard "Bill O' Reilly" robbed many a bank in his heyday.

DB10

longshanks wrote: »

Mulrooneys,

Dan Rooney??? Never heard many rooneys or mulrooneys.

Star Bingo

i've encountered many a McDonagh

ejmaztec

Thomas Cook

baldbear

McDonagh, Joyce, Stokes, Nevin, Mongon, McGinley, Power are all traveller names i heard of. They were all decent people too Boss.

Traveller quote, "Thanks be to God and his blessed mother that no one is going to prison and it will learn people to respect and get on with one another, that's the most important thing and it's a good thing,"

WallyGUFC

Mongan :rolleyes: