Article: Government to outline €39.4bn capital plan

Amtmann

Hogzy wrote: »

Seeing as the M20 'seems' to be getting the go-ahead i wonder if we will see any progress on the N/M22 Cork North Ring Road

Last I heard, the NRA wants to progress the M20 southern section in tandem with the NRR.

Sponge Bob

Seeing as all the really big ticket public transport investment is via PPP the expenditure is not Capital but Current. I know that certain aspects of the DU project are neither Current nor Capital .....simply because nobody told us yet.

These would be the Missing Link from Inchicore to Parkwest, Electrification Inchicore to Hazelhatch and the Connolly - Maynooth electrification and the resignalling of all the Dublin area. These are the "associated projects" detailed on page 44 along with the DU PPP tunnel itself.

The 2010 programme is shown as €615m broken down as follows in early June ( see below) , confirmed as €615m on page 44. No change.

PUBLIC TRANSPORT INVESTMENT PROGRAMME

http://debates.oireachtas.ie/DDebate.aspx?F=TRS20100602.XML&Ex=All&Page=2

The €615 million provided this year for investment in public transport will continue the transformation of our public transport system and build on the achievements of recent years. We established the National Transport Authority, NTA, on 1 December 2009. There is now a new structure to subhead C2 from 2010 onwards. Spending will be in the following three areas.

First, public transport projects are managed by my Department and include funding for integrated ticketing, accessibility projects, traffic management outside the greater Dublin area and technical assistance for Transport 21. The provision this year is €59.188 million.

The second area is public transport safety and development and we have allocated €206 million to cover the railway safety programme and bus and rail projects outside the greater Dublin area, such as the western rail corridor and new rolling stock for intercity rail services.

The third area is public transport infrastructure. That provides €349.8 million in capital funding for the National Transport Authority and includes funding for projects in the GDA such as all the Luas and metro projects, bus and rail projects and for traffic management measures.

Intruigingly he said.

Since I addressed the committee on the 2009 Estimates, the Luas extension from Connolly Station to docklands was completed on 8 December 2009. The Kildare rail project was completed in December 2009. Phase 1 of the western rail corridor from Ennis to Athenry was officially opened on 29 March 2010. Significant funds have and will continue to be spent on railway safety works, on accessibility projects, on the Dublin city centre resignalling project and on bus priority measures in Dublin and the regional cities, and we have continued work on a large number of other projects at various stages of progress. During the coming year, the Luas extension from Sandyford to Cherrywood will open as will the Clonsilla-Dunboyne railway line. Next year the Citywest Luas extension is scheduled to be completed with services operating by May 2011.

And there was me thinking that a scatter of track relaying was still ongoing on the KRP :cool:

dermo88

As usual, we see the usual hand wringing beal bocht begrudgery from the "Wesht". Get over it lads, the Famine ended in 1850, and the Dubs have spent enough on the damn place over the years.

Sponge Bob

dermo88 wrote: »

As usual, we see the usual hand wringing beal bocht begrudgery from the "Wesht". Get over it lads, the Famine ended in 1850, and the Dubs have spent enough on the damn place over the years.

What hand wringing exactly ???

dermo88

I quote skelliser...who epitomises the nonsense I have come to expect from the bogs of Mayo and elsewhere over the years.

So the west has been sacrificed in favour of this economic vote generating stimulus for leinster.

shameful.

I suggest that the people in the west say "Thank you" to the people of Dublin for giving them work, accomodation and decent facilities over the years. Not to mention over 1,000 Euro per capita per annum in transfer payments in TAXES in present day terms over the course of my lifetime.

Sponge Bob

dermo88 wrote: »

I quote skelliser...who epitomises the nonsense I have come to expect from the bogs of Mayo and elsewhere over the years.

This would be the dear old self sufficient Dublin that has spent the last century and a half robbing its water from Wicklow. There are other posters in this thread from the west of Ireland who might just tell you to **** off and desalinate your own piss for that comment, not I of course

skelliser

dermo88 wrote: »

I quote skelliser...who epitomises the nonsense I have come to expect from the bogs of Mayo and elsewhere over the years.

So the west has been sacrificed in favour of this economic vote generating stimulus for leinster.

shameful.

I suggest that the people in the west say "Thank you" to the people of Dublin for giving them work, accomodation and decent facilities over the years. Not to mention over 1,000 Euro per capita per annum in transfer payments in TAXES in present day terms over the course of my lifetime.

What a load of bollox!
What taxes are you on about?

And no i wont say thank you, in fact its you who should thank us!
Tell me dermo how many people from dublin are actual dubs and not people who where forced to move to dublin to get work, which in turn has lead to a massive urban sprawl, commuter belts and a major contributor to the property bubble!

Here is my answer, years of vote getting exercises like this instead of generating a proper capital program which would help the whole country, ease pressure on infrastructure, increased and better public transport for all, better enterprise opportunities and most importantly a better quality of life!

But lets not let vision get in the way of narrow minded drivil.

and btw im from galway not mayo.

D.L.R.

skelliser wrote: »

What a load of bollox!
What taxes are you on about?

And no i wont say thank you, in fact its you who should thank us!
Tell me dermo how many people from dublin are actual dubs and not people who where forced to move to dublin to get work, which in turn has lead to a massive urban sprawl, commuter belts and a major contributor to the property bubble!

Here is my answer, years of vote getting exercises like this instead of generating a proper capital program which would help the whole country, ease pressure on infrastructure, increased and better public transport for all, better enterprise opportunities and most importantly a better quality of life!

But lets not let vision get in the way of narrow minded drivil.

and btw im from galway not mayo.

Your logic is pants. Do you work for Anglo?

Sponge Bob

D.L.R. wrote: »

Your logic is pants. Do you work for Anglo?

Anglo did not have any culchies in charge of lending or banking, all S Dub type ....bless.

Not a great analogy for probity , sense, the ability to count or any sort of cop on TBH

Now can we get back to the fiddling of current expenditure wrapped up as capital by the Department of Finance and uploaded to their website today.

Chris_5339762

As for the M20 it wont be completed by 2016.

Current plans AFAIK are to start the Southern Section (without the North Ring Road) in 2012, finishing in 2015 (or slightly before). Late 2015 or early 2016 start for the M20 North (possibly with Adare, this isnt confirmed yet) for a 2018 finish.

However it was specifically said that the Northern Section will NOT be started until AFTER the Southern Section is finished.

skelliser

D.L.R. wrote: »

Your logic is pants. Do you work for Anglo?

Na, my so called betters from south county dublin managed to screw that place up for us all.

Sponge Bob

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

However it was specifically said that the Northern Section will NOT be started until AFTER the Southern Section is finished.

The NRA gave up long ago

http://www.nra.ie/RoadSchemeActivity/CorkCountyCouncil/M20CorktoLimerickNorthernSection/SchemeName,16492,en.html

This project, which forms part of the Letterkenny to Rosslare Atlantic Corridor, consists of approximately 40 km of new motorway commencing north of Mallow in Co Cork and runs to the N20/N21 at Attyflin in Limerick. Estimated Completion Date:June 2010

marmurr1916

skelliser wrote: »

So the west has been sacrificed in favour of this economic vote generating stimulus for leinster.

shameful.

How has the west been sacrificed? The M17/M18 and M20 will be completed.

Those roads will be infinitely more important to the West than a rickety excuse for a railway line between Sligo and Athenry.

Sponge Bob

The M20 will not be completed, the southern section may be but the northen section has been pushed back to start after the southern section is complete according to Chris elsewhere. The only commitment is to complete the MIUs and that is recyling a promise from 1999 when the first NDP promised them by end 2006 and now it is end 2016 ....but it should be done by 2013 maybe 2014 when Newlands and Athlone and the Mire of Gloom should all be done

Whoop de doops .

Wild Bill

Sponge Bob wrote: »

This would be the dear old self sufficient Dublin that has spent the last century and a half robbing its water from Wicklow.

Jaysus Sponge - what tosh. Are British imposed county boundaries some sort of sacred inheritance? Maybe we should just say the GDA is self sufficient? And yeah - we'll take some of yer Shannon flood water .

I read in the report

Given this substantial investment, the enhancement of roads between our main cities (which also facilitates bus-based public transport), and the fall-off in demand, investment until 2016 should focus on maintenance of existing infrastructure, capacity enhancing projects aimed at removing speed restrictions, essential safety-related work and progressing the planning of potential future investment.

That might be good news for the N11 past Bray. So cheer up!

Wild Bill

More from the report......

"Regarding regional and local roads, there has been very significant investment to improve quality and capacity."

Where, exactly? Anyone know? Must be in the West!

Bards

Wild Bill wrote: »

Jaysus Sponge - what tosh. Are British imposed county boundaries some sort of sacred inheritance?

Just ask the Kilkenny folk as to how sacred they are:D

Tech3

Wild Bill wrote: »

Where, exactly? Anyone know? Must be in the West!

Apart from a rural 500m section of the R600 then the answer is no.

Sponge Bob

Wild Bill wrote: »

Where, exactly? Anyone know? Must be in the West!

In Wickila Bill , never even knew there was a "Port" myself .

The biggest regional road projects ever were the R120 and R136 in the Lucan / Clondalkin / Tallaghtfornia areas.

The R125 to the North of Dublin and the Lucan Clonee Ongar road network had a fair few shekels spent too as did Newcastle / Saggart etc and there is the notorious Charlie McCreevey inspired job between Maynooth and the K Club in Straffan and the Celbridge junction on the N4 , they be the R406 and R405 Bill.

Ratrunning outside the M50 is not the scary prospect it was only 10 years ago Bill.

KevR

dermo88 wrote: »

As usual, we see the usual hand wringing beal bocht begrudgery from the "Wesht". Get over it lads, the Famine ended in 1850, and the Dubs have spent enough on the damn place over the years.

I'm from the West of Ireland and I can honestly say that I have only heard the "West" genuinely being pronounced as the "Wesht" maybe 3 or 4 times in my whole entire life. Of course I have heard people pronounce it like that in a non-genuine sense thousands of times.

I find the whole thing very weird.

dubhthach

I'm from Galway city myself, however I live in Dublin. Tbh the infrastructure in Dublin is pants for a city of it's size. I have no problem with money been spent on Metro/Interconnector. If anything it's a pity the money that was wasted on the wrc wasn't spent on something more deserving. (dual track to Athenry, station in oranmore, finishing kildare route project etc.)

With the M17 been built as far as Tuam it will guarantee that the densest populated part of Connacht is within a guaranteed hour and half drive to Shannon airport.

Sponge Bob

The Atlantic road corridor has been abandoned north of Tuam , eg Tuam - Letterkenny/Derry.

We also have an outstanding commitment for UK£400m for the period of this plan if the north upgrade the Monaghan Strabane Derry road and the Larne - Belfast road during that time. So the Strabane - Derry bit may get built after all.

That would be around €476m or nearly one whole years road spending by our exchequer if the UK exchequer does not chop them. The commitment to the 2 NI road schemes was restated in the plan released today.

The contractors have been appointed to both schemes ( Design/Build)

I think I mentioned some months back that this was where the money for the Cork - Limerick scheme had disappeared to, essentially

Wild Bill

Sponge Bob wrote: »

In Wickila Bill , never even knew there was a "Port" myself .

The biggest regional road projects ever were the R120 and R136 in the Lucan / Clondalkin / Tallaghtfornia areas.

The R125 to the North of Dublin and the Lucan Clonee Ongar road network had a fair few shekels spent too as did Newcastle / Saggart etc and there is the notorious Charlie McCreevey inspired job between Maynooth and the K Club in Straffan and the Celbridge junction on the N4 , they be the R406 and R405 Bill.

Ratrunning outside the M50 is not the scary prospect it was only 10 years ago Bill.

Regional roads in name only. They are merely urban arteries in the GDA. I meant Regional roads as in "the Regions"! :cool:

Wild Bill

On Wickla....the Bray/Greystones/Delgany/Newcastle/Rathnew/Wicklow conurbation (de facto a suburb of Dublin) has the same population as Galway City. Does it get the same investment in infrastructure?

Maybe...just about. Maybe not.

spacetweek

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

Current plans AFAIK are to start the Southern Section (without the North Ring Road) in 2012, finishing in 2015 (or slightly before). Late 2015 or early 2016 start for the M20 North (possibly with Adare, this isnt confirmed yet) for a 2018 finish.

This is the first I've heard of it; what's your source? It's not in the PDF.

Sponge Bob wrote: »

We also have an outstanding commitment for UK£400m for the period of this plan if the north upgrade the Monaghan Strabane Derry road and the Larne - Belfast road during that time.

It's interesting to read Wesley's info on those. He sounds optimistic that we'll have the 400M quid when the time comes. I honestly dunno where it's gonna come from; it was promised back when we were swimming in the stuff.

murphaph

Sponge Bob wrote: »

In Wickila Bill , never even knew there was a "Port" myself .

The biggest regional road projects ever were the R120 and R136 in the Lucan / Clondalkin / Tallaghtfornia areas.

The R125 to the North of Dublin and the Lucan Clonee Ongar road network had a fair few shekels spent too as did Newcastle / Saggart etc and there is the notorious Charlie McCreevey inspired job between Maynooth and the K Club in Straffan and the Celbridge junction on the N4 , they be the R406 and R405 Bill.

Ratrunning outside the M50 is not the scary prospect it was only 10 years ago Bill.

What was improved on the R120? apart from a bit of widening, curve straightening and the N4 flyover, it's pretty much as it has always been, including single file humpback bridge over the Grand Canal!

I'd imagine the R710 (if it's still called that) Waterford Ring Road is one of the biggest R road projects ever.

Poster King

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055980178&page=2
I see no mention of Galway Outer Bypass anywhere. Is this because it will be a PPP are is the whole project in serious doubt?

pm1979

skelliser wrote: »

So the west has been sacrificed in favour of this economic vote generating stimulus for leinster.

shameful.

+1

Government spending of hard earned taxes on more things that we wouldn't have agreed to spend it on in the first place and then the cheek to tell us that they are 'making jobs' by doing it.

veryangryman

pm1979 wrote: »

+1

Government spending of hard earned taxes on more things that we wouldn't have agreed to spend it on in the first place and then the cheek to tell us that they are 'making jobs' by doing it.

Yes i do agree that this is complete bull. Announce cuts and then say that there is jobs being created

We already knew of plans for them to create X jobs as per NDP and T21. Yesterday Brian Cowen announced (proud as punch mind you) that there were X/2 jobs being created. The spin they put on this bull is ridiculous.

*Takes happy pill*

Ok to look at this logically, anything that he hasnt mentioned as safe (Newlands a good example) will likley be announced as cut in ~6 months. Why not now you ask? Well i think there is a bit pf psychology going on here. If the IMF/EU see Ireland cutting small constantly rather than one big massive cut, it markets us as being continuously improving our competitiveness.

Thats the only good i see out of such thing.

Lets put it this way. No disrespect to the guy who put the thread there but... here aint gonna be no M55! :rolleyes:

slickmcvic

Wild Bill wrote: »

On Wickla....the Bray/Greystones/Delgany/Newcastle/Rathnew/Wicklow conurbation (de facto a suburb of Dublin) has the same population as Galway City. Does it get the same investment in infrastructure?

Maybe...just about. Maybe not.

....Of course it has,its has gotten way more and for a region of way less regional and national importance.
The 2 areas might have the same population on paper but Galway is a city on a much smaller area.

in the last 10 years wicklow has seen massive infrastructural investment..you've got the
N11/M11 running from dublin to balinamesda by-passing bray,newtown,ashford,rathnew,wicklow, arklow,gorey! The Dart running to bray/greystones regular. TheFarrankelly Dual Carrraigeway into greystones with cyclelanes each side,The folllow-on Kilpeddar interchange,Money being squandered on the €300m Greystones Marina and the €65m wicklow port access relief road.
Classing the region as a "(de facto a suburb of Dublin)" is being ambitious to say the least it more a series of commuter towns into Dublin(where else!).
Galway has got the motorway running into it from Dublin but badly needs a orbital route to get cars into the west. The public transport in the city is a disaster with a couple of busses doing a few routes to the suburbs. Its commuter towns like claregalway are still bottlenecks and there's no real alternatives for cycling or taking a Gluas into town.

I've lived in both regions and am still struck with the disparities between the 2.If the govt is seriouss about developing the regions it sure ain't showing it!!