M9 Motorway Could face Additional toll

shedweller

Joey leBlanc wrote: »

You are always gonna get skinflints no matter what the economic climate is. Miserable bitter ol' sods would rather put themselves thru the misery of driving an extra 15miles & add an extra 30mins on their journeys just to avoid paying a 1.80euro toll;

As somebody else pointed out, it's 1.90. If i were to use it daily to get to work i would pay 950 per year, excluding two weeks where i may not due to holidays etc.
Thats some pay cut.

I laugh when i hear this nonsense about turning off the standby on various electrical appliances to save a few euro per year. Or when i'm told to shop around for car insurance to save (admittedly more) euro. But it's never much is it? Well, it's not 950 euro anyway!
And here we are being bullied into throwing up to a grand per year to this crowd. I'll not have a part of it.
Put a much smaller levy onto the fuel and we will ALL pay for the roads.
I thought we were anyway but it turns out we weren't paying for the roads at all!:rolleyes:
This thing of "if you can afford....." etc. is pure bull.

When does it stop?

When we are on our knees? I nearly am as it is.

Cabaal

shedweller wrote: »

I laugh when i hear this nonsense about turning off the standby on various electrical appliances to save a few euro per year.
<SNIP> But it's never much is it?

hmm I don't know now,
If I have my PC and all the additions to it plugged in but not switched on it costs 30e a year just to have them plugged in. Thats just my PC, the likes of TV, Microwave etc also obviously cost money.

So yes it does add up to a fair bit, I guess its a case of penny wise £ foolish

Benimar

Cabaal wrote: »

Ironic that people on this forum have been complaining about Waterford not having a M&S yet other citys do, so now we have a city with a nice new motorway that actually has no toll on it.
All other motorways to citys have them so why not Waterford

I used the word 'I'. I never claimed we should have a M&S just because other cities do. Others have made that argument, I haven't and I was expressing my opinion about something.

Cabaal wrote: »

Fair enough, but thats a different discussion

It's not a different discussion. If you remove the toll on the Galway road, then the argument for one on the M9 disappears with it.

Cabaal wrote: »

Could Galway people not argue the same for the road from Dublin to Galway, or Cork people to argue the same for Dublin to Cork

Having driven the Waterford-Dublin and Galway-Dublin routes using the old roads there is no comparison. The N9 is actually a disgrace.

gbee

fricatus wrote: »

Tolls are a stupid idea. All they do is discourage use of the tolled road.
but it seems completely stupid to discourage people from using a safer, less congested, high quality road..

I hate M-Ways. Apart from the novelty of a bit of speed, or the necessity to make a deadline .... they are boring and mind numbing and IMO are in fact MORE dangerous because we still can go from 130KM to 100KM to 50KM and I find I'm speeding even more than ever.

I like the older more scenic routes, traffic and all ~ obviously it can get excessive at times too, but generally its a nicer dive.

On my last Dublin trip I deliberately avoided all M roads as much as I could and deliberately went through the towns and villages ... stopping for coffee and dinner ... lovely actually.

Now, I know I have the M-Ways to thanks for that as there is a lot of people using them and by-passing everything ...

Minstrel27

gbee wrote: »

I hate M-Ways. Apart from the novelty of a bit of speed, or the necessity to make a deadline .... they are boring and mind numbing and IMO are in fact MORE dangerous because we still can go from 130KM to 100KM to 50KM and I find I'm speeding even more than ever.

I like the older more scenic routes, traffic and all ~ obviously it can get excessive at times too, but generally its a nicer dive.

On my last Dublin trip I deliberately avoided all M roads as much as I could and deliberately went through the towns and villages ... stopping for coffee and dinner ... lovely actually.

Now, I know I have the M-Ways to thanks for that as there is a lot of people using them and by-passing everything ...

I wish they would put a motorway between my house and the shop. They are a God send. Driving on narrow twisting N roads is not my idea of a nice drive.

Joey leBlanc

Benimar wrote: »

I object to tolls.
I have NEVER brought drink into a pub
I pay my bin charges and do not dump illegally

Oh, and the toll is €1.90..each way..for a car. Sounds like you don't use it too often?

What's an extra 10 cent gotta do with it? €1.80/€1.90 Who Cares??
No, I don't use it too often coz I don't need to. But I happily toss my
coins into the basket when I have too.
I can't understand why people object to paying tolls on roads. Roads
across Europe are heavilly tolled (try driving from the North of France right down to the South & then u will realise how cheap Irish tolls are in comparison).
If u object to the tolls stick to the ol national regional bohereen's that criss-cross & wind thru the land. I'll be at Dublin Airport in under 2 hrs whilst u are stuck behind some tractor in Co. Kilkenny!

Joey leBlanc

fricatus wrote: »

I work in Kilkenny and use the M9.

Approximately 20 working days in a month...
That makes 240 in a year.
Travelling to and fro, that makes 480 trips.
Assuming a toll of €1.90, that makes €912 a year. Skinflint, you say?

Before you ask, public transport doesn't serve my workplace, unless you consider a 25-minute walk acceptable.
In any event, I often start before the first Waterford-KK train gets to KK, and at other times I finish after the last train leaves.

And like Benimar, I have NEVER brought drink into a pub, I pay my bin charges and do not dump illegally.

In monetary terms if you were to purchase a Trip Card you receive a 10% discount on all tolls which reduces your figure of €912 by €91.12 to €820.80 p/a. Savings can be made if you do your research!

Further, if you are working in Kilkenny, I estimate that you are spending at least €65.00 per week on petrol which equates to €3,200.00 per annum when you deduct 4wks for annual leave. If your travel expenses are at that level what's a extra €3.41(€1.70 each way) per day for a bit of comfort? Yes, it may not matter in the summer months when the schools are out but in deepest winter driving a high quality road in priceless!

Benimar

Joey leBlanc wrote: »

In monetary terms if you were to purchase a Trip Card you receive a 10% discount on all tolls which reduces your figure of €912 by €91.12 to €820.80 p/a. Savings can be made if you do your research!

Further, if you are working in Kilkenny, I estimate that you are spending at least €65.00 per week on petrol which equates to €3,200.00 per annum when you deduct 4wks for annual leave. If your travel expenses are at that level what's a extra €3.41(€1.70 each way) per day for a bit of comfort? Yes, it may not matter in the summer months when the schools are out but in deepest winter driving a high quality road in priceless!

An increase in yearly transport charges of €820.80 if hardly a saving unless we follow the Dougal Maguire principal that if you expect a kick in the you-know-whats but get a slap in the face its a victory! Yes, its less than €912 but its a hell of a lot more than the current cost of €0.

Also, €820.80 is a 26% increase in travel costs based on your assumptions, which is significant in the best of times but with the other forms of taxes we already pay (direct and stealth), and throw in the inevitable Property Tax we will have to pay after the budget, it could really cause financial difficulties for some.

It's not the one charge in itself that causes difficulties, its the combined effect of all the charges. Say, for example, that the proposed toll is 'only' €1.70, and Motor Tax might 'only' go up €10 and duty might 'only' increase by 5c in the budget, but add it all together and it would come to a very large increase. It's easy to see every increase as a small amount, but add them all up and it looks completely different.

Also, in the current climate of wage cuts (for those lucky enough to work), to pay €820.80 would require you to earn a gross of close to €1,600.

fricatus

gbee wrote: »

I hate M-Ways. Apart from the novelty of a bit of speed, or the necessity to make a deadline .... they are boring and mind numbing and IMO are in fact MORE dangerous because we still can go from 130KM to 100KM to 50KM and I find I'm speeding even more than ever.

I like the older more scenic routes, traffic and all ~ obviously it can get excessive at times too, but generally its a nicer dive.

On my last Dublin trip I deliberately avoided all M roads as much as I could and deliberately went through the towns and villages ... stopping for coffee and dinner ... lovely actually.

Now, I know I have the M-Ways to thanks for that as there is a lot of people using them and by-passing everything ...

You're entitled to your preferences of course, and more power to you if you want to take your time and stop to enjoy the view.

One thing I will take issue with is your contention that motorways are more dangerous than the old national roads. I read somewhere that the M1 has one-seventh the accident rate (or death? injury? rate - sorry since I don't have the link to hand) of the old N1 road, and that's not taking account of the increase in traffic that has occurred since the M1 started being built.

I'm sure there are plenty more statistics to back up this point, because I've read enough of them. If you have a look at any NRA or Transport21 report, you'll probably see this mentioned there.

wellbutty

Joey leBlanc wrote: »

What's an extra 10 cent gotta do with it? €1.80/€1.90 Who Cares??
No, I don't use it too often coz I don't need to. But I happily toss my
coins into the basket when I have too.
I can't understand why people object to paying tolls on roads. Roads
across Europe are heavilly tolled (try driving from the North of France right down to the South & then u will realise how cheap Irish tolls are in comparison).
If u object to the tolls stick to the ol national regional bohereen's that criss-cross & wind thru the land. I'll be at Dublin Airport in under 2 hrs whilst u are stuck behind some tractor in Co. Kilkenny!

Some bridges in the UK are almost €10 to cross, one way, as are some bridges in France. In France I've paid €18 upwards, one way, to cover the distance of Waterford to Dublin. Yes we have high motor tax here but we now have amazing roads for a such a small country, €1.90 is not too much to ask to use them.

fricatus

Joey leBlanc wrote: »

In monetary terms if you were to purchase a Trip Card you receive a 10% discount on all tolls which reduces your figure of €912 by €91.12 to €820.80 p/a. Savings can be made if you do your research!

Don't patronise me with this Eddie Hobbs rubbish. I'm well aware of the trip card. Believe me I would buy one if I had to use a tolled road on a regular basis. It's still eight hundred and twenty bloody quid though! Nearly a whole mortgage payment!

Joey leBlanc wrote: »

Further, if you are working in Kilkenny, I estimate that you are spending at least €65.00 per week on petrol which equates to €3,200.00 per annum when you deduct 4wks for annual leave. If your travel expenses are at that level what's a extra €3.41(€1.70 each way) per day for a bit of comfort? Yes, it may not matter in the summer months when the schools are out but in deepest winter driving a high quality road in priceless!

I spend €50 p/w on diesel, and yes, I would probably be well able to afford another €17 p/w in tolls, but you're ignoring my argument, which is not what it costs me or any other guy, but the cumulative effect of tolls pushing motorists off the good, new, safe! roads and on to the crappy tractor boreens of yore.

What do you think the good people of Thomastown or Mullinavat would think about the M9 being tolled, just as they're getting their villages back after many years of HGV traffic?

Bards

its not goint to happen - the M9 was built using taxpayuers and EU money. We are not going to end up paying twice for something we (Taxpayers) have already paid

'tis about time this Govt were kicked out of office for pure incompetance of the highest order and then sued by the taxpayer for blowing €22bn down the dark bog of Anglo without asking for our permission/REFERENDUM

Cabaal

Bards wrote: »

its not goint to happen - the M9 was built using taxpayuers and EU money.

I could be wrong but many many roads throughout the EU have been built with EU funds and have tolls

wellboytoo

Just for a bit of perspective... If you drive a forty foot reefer from here Waterford to Milan , tolls on motorways/tunnels= €1195.00 , get over it